“We must know what is preached there. We cannot stay indifferent. We need to bring into view more on what is developing there. We need to move fast. It must also be clear who and from what country comes to Germany as Imam. This scene must not remain unwatched and uncontrolled.”
Common sense. But a huge “Islamophobia” outcry will be raised and it will almost certainly not happen.
“‘We have to know what happens there’: German govt wants to watch mosques & imams,” RT, May 20, 2016 (thanks to Lookmann):
Mosques and Islamic communities across Germany should be monitored to know “what is preached there” and prevent incoming refugees from radicalization, a senior German law enforcement official said in an interview.
The German government still lacks adequate knowledge on “what is happening” in mosques all across the country, Emily Haber, the state secretary at the German Ministry of the Interior, told Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung on Friday. “We must know what is preached there. We cannot stay indifferent.”
There is a risk that young, predominantly male refugees will radicalize in Germany, whereas Muslim communities and mosques serve as reference point for many newcomers, she added. Mosques should be “especially highlighted,” as Germany has seen a rapid immigration increase over the past years.
“We need to bring into view more on what is developing there. We need to move fast,” Haber stressed. “It must also be clear who and from what country comes to Germany as Imam. This scene must not remain unwatched and uncontrolled.”
Haber has also criticized “gaps and shortcomings” in security cooperation between European countries, specifically mentioning France, the Netherlands and Belgium. Intelligence data should be shared “under similar criteria” and potential perpetrators have to be tackled “in a comparable way.”
The top official emphasized, however, that “quite a large group” among more than 8,000 Salafists in Germany rejects violence. Failure to distinguish between this group and the proponents of violence could lead to a growing “solidarity within Salafist structures,” Haber added.
Successful integration of the Muslim community is a hot topic in Germany, and will likely remain so in future. Many supporters of far-right groups stir up simplistic stereotypes, saying that Islam is not part of German society, and drawing no distinction between radical Islamism and moderate teachings.
Ruling parties, in turn, suggest that German Muslims cultivate their own sort of Islam that could absorb Germany’s “core values” and abide by the idea of secular state.
In April, Andreas Scheuer, General Secretary of the Christian Social Union (CSU) – the Bavarian sister party of Angela Merkel’s governing CDU – said in an interview with Die Welt that all services in local mosques should be conducted exclusively in German and imams be trained in Germany.
However, Volker Kauder, CDU member and head of the conservatives’ parliamentary group in the Bundestag, called this initiative a “spurious” argument.
“For Italians the Holy Mass is offered in Italian. In the synagogues they pray in Hebrew. This is to be accepted,” Kauder said.
Just as Germany, given its bitter past, bears responsibility to counter neo-Nazi leanings and ensure that it never returns to fascism, so should Muslims stand firm against radicalization and terrorism, Kauder said….

nicu says
They only want to be elected again next year .
Monitoring does not help a thing : they kill people in public places in front of cameras – they don’t care !
Custos Custodum says
Au contraire – they do care: they want to make a splash, the more cameras the better.
umbra says
Yes they do want to be re-elected, but angela merkel is truly messing it up for them, gigantically. In any case, the likely outcome of the next election would be another cdu/spd led coalition, though with reduced majority. AfD will be isolated in the end, as in was in recent state elections.
jihad3tracker says
Yes, the reactions will be a verbal equivalent of those avalanche video clips we see on “biggest fails of all time” websites.
خَليفة says
It’s about time. Wake up Germany.
mortimer says
Closing the door after the horse has left the stable.
There is no controlling millions of Muslims who will learn jihad on the internet and in private study groups and by passing videos from hand to hand.
Satellite dishes emit non-stop Islamic propaganda from dozens of countries and hundreds of fiery Islamic preachers. Muslims are SUPPOSED to hate the dirty kufaar.
German elites have no idea about Islamic doctrines, but preposterously make policy about it.
Jay Boo says
Obama and NSA monitor the German government phones.
Yet Obo says we should not spy on — dirty filthy Muslims.
Mirren10 says
Mortimer says:
”Closing the door after the horse has left the stable.
There is no controlling millions of Muslims who will learn jihad on the internet and in private study groups and by passing videos from hand to hand.”
Certainly this is true, Mortimer. But one must start somewhere. Monitoring mosques, and the hatred that is preached there, is an excellent idea. Even better, if it was *random* monitoring, so they don’t get a chance to tidy away jihadist literature, and produce kuthbas which non-mohammedans want to hear.
But as Robert notes, this will most probably *not* happen, and will be denounced as ‘islamophobic’.
Anke L. says
When it comes to teaching…there is no moderate Islam, only
moderate Moslems.
mortimer says
Moderate Muslims are only moderately Muslim.
Demsci says
Probably Emily Haber is from a party that feels the pressure of up and coming AfD.
Yes, there will be the usual outcry of “Islamophobia”, but in Western Europe, what are described as “far-right parties” are growing rapidly, sometimes even in polls being the biggest party (in Holland) or the party that could deliver the president (in France).
Perhaps as compromise the now still political correct parties could experiment with avoiding “Painting all Muslims with the same brush” and focus more on details, nuances.
For instance, one very particular tenet of Islam that is clearly anti-democratic is deathpenalty for apostasy. There is evidence enough of both the global interconnectedness of Muslims and of the surveys that hundreds of millions of Muslims in the world are in favor of the deathpenalty for apostasy and they are most of them followers of some mosque or other.
So, the experiment could be done, if need be only in some municipalities at first, as long as it is tried out, that migrants (including marriagepartners) may not immigrate in or stay when they support deathpenalty for apostasy
And that the mosques where they came from and go to are examined on this particular tenet. And that penalties, if possible of deportation, can be carried out if mosques do not openly endorse the opposite of this Islamic tenet, the opposite being: Complete freedom to change religion for all Muslims.
The authorities, under pressure from “the right” can proceed with ever more tenets and their opposites; like; It is permitted that Mohammed is criticized, as EVERY political and spiritual leader,past and present, can be criticized.
If the Islam-apologists are so dug in on their stand that “Muslims may not be painted with a broad brush”, then we or authorities, and a president like Trump can respond;
“OK! we will monitor Mosques and DIVIDE Muslims into categories, tenet by tenet. So that you Islam-apologists, like Mayor Sadiq Khan does, cannot do the opposite; namely
“painting all Muslims with the same brush, only a white brush of their innocence and compatibility with all major democratic laws, tenets and values.”
No more generalizations, stereotyping etc from both sides, tenet for tenet seeking reasonable distinctions among Muslims, that can do something to assuage the concerns of the Western Citizens, in experimental steps. Failure to do so will result in massive wins of the “far-right’. Of course it is small unreliable stuff at first, but at least it is a start, an experiment to get data to analyse from.
billybob says
I really appreciated your thoughts and ideas. Thanks
Demsci says
Thanks, this should not just be a reactionary policy only. But coming from enthousiastic idealism with love for Constitutions, laws, tenets, values of democracy and in the pursuit of happiness. To which at least a part of Islam and Muslims is antagonistic and even a lethal threat.
The idea is not to diminish Islam but to protect and promote real Democratic Idealism, spiritually enhanced by the pursuit of happiness. This is our initial idea. We then can act the modern way, by experimentally moving forward with small steps, analysing the responses, consequences asap and adapting to them.
It will create tension, but with encroaching Islam tension is unavoidable anyway.
Polk1970 says
You know the answer without the experiment.
Linde Barrera says
Please send Emily Haber an email to show support of monitoring mosques in Germany, provided you are anti-jihad and want to do a good deed today! Thank you.
linnte says
I saw your post while looking for her email address, in my search! Weird eh? I guess that means the stuff we say is posted in Google under certain catch words.
Linde Barrera says
To linnte- As per your post of May 21, 2016 @ 5:18 pm, I really appreciate the tip! Thank you.
linnte says
So basically, we are all “outted” here. That’s kinda scary in a way.
DFD says
Yes they do. The database engines are also cross referenced. Even partial words are found by something called “euristic searches” – or similar word.
linnte says
Staying “connected” has its downfalls!
somehistory says
Are you aware that if you have your hands in the wrong places, the search can still go through and your goal be reached….just try it with a well-known name or phrase. Move one or both hands one key over and try it.
linnte says
I use a Nexus for internet so, I don’t understand what you mean. Sorry!
Angemon says
I *think* somehistory means that if you misspell something in a search engine the engine will “correct” and search for the “right” word.
For example, if I type “raining cats and dpgs” in Google, the results page will say “Presenting search results for raining cats and dogs” and “Search for raining cats and dpgs instead”
linnte says
Oh! Well that makes sense now. Thanks!
Jan says
Monitoring does not make any difference. The Imam is still going to preach the Quran.
In Egypt, the state monitored closely most of the mosques, ever since the rule of Sadat and Mubarak. They even persecuted them, forbad islamic movements, executed very large number of terrorists (imams, religious individuals, all kinds of religious perpetrators against the secular elite) for as long as 50 years. Eventualy It did not prevent the Muslim Brotherhood to take power for a while. Afterwards being eliminated back from power only with iron fist on the mainland.
Demsci says
Fair enough, good information. This Egyptian experience is precious for good analysis.
Often great big plans fail but we can still experiment with small steps, analysing the data and adapting, it is the modern “iterative” way.
Also; we are not in it in a anti-Islam-way, but in a pro-democracy-happiness-way; there is a difference.
We can augment the monitoring with the imposition of certain democratic tenets, in direct opposition to Islamic tenets on the same topic; Islam says deathpenalty for apostasy. Absolutely unacceptable for true democrats; so; either a monitored mosque complies and will pronounce freedom to apostasize or authorities respond with penalties.
The experiment will deliver almost certainly good material to proceed, one way or the other, depending on the reactions of mosques and Muslims around the world.
And remember, we, but the authorities also, are at our wit’s end, and it is time for something new.
Jan says
The experiments, analyses with small or big steps is what Europ is paing the price right now if you ask me.
We are not dealing with some kind of yesterday born ideology but a one with 1400 years of experience and knowledge, ups and downs, Islam is a huge institution with solid and multi trilion reach budget. Believe it or not they have answeres for eveything you wish to experiment and they are laughing at us for our immature stand.
About preaching in German language, it has the good and the bad side of it. Today the poisen is being preached in Arabic only… do we wish it to be preached also in the native language? I think it is more of a bad idea then a good one.
The initiative of focusing on deathpenalty for apostasy is a good one but it will not solve the problem as they will earase the picture on the puzzel and drow a different picture where it leads to the same idea without using the particular words.
I don’t think the democratic system is going to condemned the imam who preaches that the west lost its way or being gay is a terrible desease which must be cured or the democracy is wrong and that the sharia low is a much better way for a healty society for everyone who cares about his children and the list can go on forever… slowly bringing the ideology into the peaples mind. After all this is how indoctirination starts creeping into the potentian jihadists.
Another very important point is that we must never allow the loud speakers to be hang on the top of the minarets not for any reason. They will start first as once a week call for prayer then it will become twice and slowley will be creeping to everyday practice untill they chase most of the non muslims from the nighberhood of the mosque as I don’t think anybody will like that depressing (horrifying for little children) cry 5 times a day. This must not only not allow in western countries but olso we must be making campaign to not allow in majority islamic countries where also big percentage of non muslims live, as they do not have any obligation, desire or wish to be called 5 times a day for prayers against their will.
After all this, any try man will do to stop progressing of islam, will be considered for muslims being persecuted, being rubbed from their freedom of precticing their religion and therefor being given the right for jihad. This is way it has never been easy to deal with islam and against all our goodwill wishes I am afraid it will never be no metter how smart we think we are from the rest.
Angemon says
I agree with you, Jan, that preaching islam in German won’t change the minds of those who believe in it. It will, however, make it easier for non-muslim, non-arabic speaking Germans to know what’s being taught in mosques.
Jan says
Angemon; Read my comment above yours.
Angemon says
Well, duh! This is basic common sense.
I don’t see many Italians or Hebrews committing acts of terror and justifying them with their religion. In fact, I don’t see any at all. Do you, Mr. Kauder?
Mark Swan says
No He Does Not
Wellington says
German government officials today are arguably even more clueless than were many German government officials during the Weimar period. And things didn’t end well, now did they, for Weimar Germany?
Kepha says
Dunno. It’s probably testing the wind to see if they can get away with monitoring churches and jailing every Christian preacher who says that abortion and homosexuality are sins.
Let the mullahs rave. Let those Muslims who have learned to respect Western culture grow alienated and leave. Let Hollywood continue to spew its blasphemous, patronizing filth whenever it tries to deal with Christianity; and let me exercise my right to save my money and refuse to watch. Let some imam declare me an idolator and the Jews kin of apes and pigs. Let me retort that Muhammad ibn Abdallah ibn whoever is a d–ned blasphemer rather than “the Prophet” (Aaaaarrrrrgghhhhh! How I hate it when some sanctimonious Leftist pronounces “the prophet” in hushed tones when talking of Moe). And if some Muslim wants to act on his Mullah’s call for jihad, allow the rest of us the right of self-defense and firearm ownership. And let’s accept that a murderer deserves the death penalty, while a non-criminal alien is deportable.
Too much in post-modern Western law is an exercise in protecting fools from their own folly, and filling the world with fools as a consequence. I am as suspicious of these anti-liberty European “solutions” as I am of Islam.
Custos Custodum says
Dear Ms. Haber,
Just read about your plan to monitor preachers in mosques. Here is a better suggestion: for only $1,000,000 per year, I can provide you with access to daily, updates on Islamic propaganda and criminal actions worldwide along with expert analysis.
Materials will be provided in the English language. German and Arabic translations for use in outreach activities are available at reasonable rates. Call 1-800-ISLAMSECRET NOW.
Lizzy says
Germany has, and still is, in the throes of ‘self-harming’. It is a dreadful medical condition, swiftly diagnosed when performed by individuals and medical treatment given, but difficult to treat when foisted on an entire nation.
Concerned German citizens are forced to suffer the effects of this ‘self-harming’. It is cruelty beyond measure to force an entire nation to endure such a medical condition where there are not enough doctors to alleviate the effects.
The whole of the German Government need to be sectioned, not only for their own safety, but for the safety of every German citizen.
Unfortunately this ‘self-harming’ is contagious and has spread rapidly to other European nations. We are like lemmings, throwing ourselves off the cliff without a murmur. It has to stop now before we are all smashed to pieces and dead.
steve says
At least we see that Germany will never be a threat to any other country in the future. It is now a nation of spineless, liberal, jelly-men. Exact opposites of the old fashioned ‘Hunazis’. Perhaps Germany deserves to submit to Islam . Trouble is that Britain too will submit because its men are even weaker snivel merchants. Is it now time for our children to learn the filthy,degrading, lobotomy-r-us dialect called Arabic ??
R Cole says
This whole thing with Islamic immigration involves giving away control – then pretending you still have it!!
For years the German government has been talking about the need for a Europe Islam – one where the Imams are trained in a German schools. What happened to those past initiatives?
Merkel’s has stated that – Germany will do a ‘better job’ with integration this time – than they did with the Muslims they currently have!!
::
See wonderfully ‘integrated’ Turkish Muslim school kids speak of their love for Germans in this video:
Interesting went the girl is asked what is the meaning of ‘integration’ she actually gives the correct answer. It is the same with the term ‘inclusion’ it means get rid of the crosses and all the things that might offend Islam. Where in actual fact it means ‘exclusion’. A few years ago there was talk of getting rid of the British flag – because its cross might offend. But just the other day there was a news report video – of an Asian-American guy who was asked to remove the flag from his balcony in a housing complex – the reason given was that it might offend the Muslim residents. First its the cross – now its the stars and stripes that might offend. The young girl in this video is right – the real meaning of ‘integration’ is ‘exclusion’. Essentially this is what is being carried out in practice.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jD6CN6uGZs
Free Food – Daily Ekmek!
When these children come of age – they will be taken back to Turkey – a husband will be selected for them. And the newly married couple will return to Germany and likely live off the state [tune of 80%]. And when their children grow up they will do the same for them. Integrate into what?
UNCLE VLADDI says
WAIT – WHAT?!
I thought the “German government” was ANGELA MERKEL – and she certainly wouldn’t stand for such blatantly obvious “islamophobia” from any of her slaves!
somehistory says
Sometime before September 11, 2001, there were some moslims in an apartment in Germany and they were doing what moslims do….plotting and planning to kill in the name and cause of their false god, their idol stone, their beast from satan.
And then they left Germany and flew to the U.S. where they met up with others who had been plotting and planning the same thing in other places in other apartments. And they rented apartments, paying cash for several months rent and visited bars and pretended to be just ordinary people. And although they didn’t look anything like Mary Tyler Moore or Robert Redford or the kid…Robbie, I forgot his last name…they hid in plain sight. Most likely, they went to the local barracks and heard what they had been hearing in Germany in the barracks there and and the other countries where they had been *preying.*
And they plotted and planned some more until they were done and ready to fly planes into buildings in N.Y.C. and Washington, D.C.
And then investigators in Germany found out about the apartment where these moslims had done their plotting and planning before 9/11.
And now, some in the government say they want to monitor…now that the country is overrun and women are being raped by members of the beast, and little kids are being raped by the beasts and it’s against the law to make fun of moslims like the ruler in Turkey.
And even she is saying that the ones not given to *violence* won’t like it….and what will they do to express their dislike?…if barracks are monitored. Might they resort to violence?
“””however, that “quite a large group” among more than 8,000 Salafists in Germany rejects violence. Failure to distinguish between this group and the proponents of violence could lead to a growing “solidarity within Salafist structures,” “””
It will be a tremendous day of real peace when satan and his beast no longer exist. (Revelation 21)
Baucent says
The Germans will learn they cannot control Islam. During World War Two, the Nazi’s had a fascination with Islam. The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem was a pal of many high Nazis, including Himmler who opened two training schools for Imams, one was in Dresden I believe.
Georg says
So all they have to do is separate the good from bad Salafists while preventing “solidarity within Salafist structures”.
What in the hell is that supposed to mean/entail and who comes up with this vomitous lunacy and who looks at what they’ve come up with and approves it as something worthy of forwarding to the press? Good-night.
We’re now worried about offending Salafists. That might take the cake for most absurd and offensive policy suggestion I’ve seen from a Westerner. Bravo with the progressivism, Germany… this is a level beyond hip. It will be especially groovy when lots of people are blown to bits and mosques with Salafists who “reject violence” take their queue to spread forth. Expect carnage. And expect people to become pissed the _ _ _ _ off. Idiots.
Georg says
They will defend Salafism before they criticize Islam.