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Exposing the role that Islamic jihad theology and ideology play in the modern global conflicts

London Muslim mayor’s veiled threat: “Trump’s ignorant view of Islam could make both of our countries less safe”

May 11, 2016 10:11 am By Robert Spencer

Well, that didn’t take long. London elects a Muslim who opposes “extremism” as mayor, and almost immediately he issues a veiled threat: Trump must drop his “ignorant view of Islam,” i.e., he must change his stance regarding Muslim immigration, or else the U.S. and the U.K. will be less safe. So a temporary moratorium on Muslim immigration in order to try to prevent jihad terror attacks in the U.S. will only lead to jihad terror attacks in the U.S. Khan is in effect saying “Let Muslims in — or else.” Yet letting in Muslim immigrants, in light of the fact that there is no way to distinguish jihadis from peaceful Muslims, will also lead to jihad terror attacks.

Also, what “ignorant view of Islam” has Donald Trump ever expressed? He has simply made the quite sensible and true observation that there is no way to keep jihadis out while letting Muslims in. Can Sadiq Khan dispute that? Would he even care to? What an interesting statement, in any case: for Khan, ignorance of Islam is unsafe. One must have “knowledge” of Islam, that is, one must adhere to the politically correct Islam-Is-Peace and Muslims-Are-Victims line in order to be safe. The implications of this are far-reaching. Presumably then to point out that Islam has doctrines mandating warfare against unbelievers and their subjugation renders one unsafe — and unsafe in what way? Why, it makes you liable to be attacked by Muslims who are enraged because you don’t believe Islam is peaceful. So for Khan, one must believe that Islam is a Religion of Peace, or risk being attacked by violent Muslims.

Sadiq-Khan2

“London’s New Mayor Warns Trump: Let In Muslims Or They Will Attack America,” by Blake Neff, Daily Caller, May 10, 2016 (thanks to Pamela Geller):

…“Donald Trump’s ignorant view of Islam could make both of our countries less safe – it risks alienating mainstream Muslims around the world and plays into the hands of extremists,” he said. “Donald Trump and those around him think that Western liberal values are incompatible with mainstream Islam – London has proved him wrong.”

While Khan touted the liberal values of British Muslims, some polls have found worrying indicators that their assimilation is incomplete. A poll in April, for instance, found that two-thirds of British Muslims would not tell the government if a friend or family member became involved with extremists. Half of them said homosexuality should be illegal and over 20 percent supported establishing sharia in the U.K.

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Filed Under: Featured, immigration, United Kingdom Tagged With: Donald Trump, Sadiq Khan


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Comments

  1. Jay Boo says

    May 11, 2016 at 10:20 am

    Trump
    “… he must change his stance regarding Muslim immigration, or else the U.S. and the U.K. will be less safe.”

    Typical Muslim veiled threat
    This mayor needs a good Whomping of peaceful coexistence.

    OH joy,
    A new (Muslim) multi-cultural mayor brings hopes to keep the wolfs of Islam away while ushering in peace to bring us all together in harmony.

    • Polk1970 says

      May 12, 2016 at 10:03 am

      Aawww,he doesn’t like Trump
      GOOD!
      Khan not liking Trump is one more PROOF that Trump must win

  2. ich says

    May 11, 2016 at 10:21 am

    listen to this lying sack !

    hes the only one of the two with REAL islamist ties

    man oh man

    lying idiot

    • hmmm says

      May 13, 2016 at 12:17 am

      indeed, one should take a look at how compatible muslim islamists are with Londoners:
      http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/653979/Terror-warning-British-ISIS-jihadis-recruiting-suicide-bombers-London-attacks

  3. linnte says

    May 11, 2016 at 10:21 am

    Yeah, just keep strutting your stuff, Mr. Mayor. Show the British people who you really are!

    • mortimer says

      May 11, 2016 at 11:05 am

      Agree with linnte. Khan made a career of keeping terrorists out of jail. Now he is justifying Islamic vigilantism.

      He’s laying his supremacist cards on the table.

      • Gungadin says

        May 12, 2016 at 8:56 am

        I have to assume that Londoners are just as dim witted as Americans are on this side of the pond…..Electing Obama was a HUGE mistake and then the dummies REELECTED the horses arse and he’s done further damage with his “executive orders”..

        Hopefully Trump will win in 2016 and he can do some house cleaning…

    • DFD says

      May 11, 2016 at 3:34 pm

      Hi Linnte,

      The British people (the real ones) know who he really is. Below an email sent by “Britain First” to its members and supporters. Consider that this was BF’s *first* election campaign, and that every Penny was *donated* by British people.

      Well, read below, and may be have a look at the website……

      Dear (DFD) {obviously changed 🙂 }

      Now that the dust has settled on the London elections we can provide a brief analysis of the results.

      Firstly, we must bear in mind that this was our first major election effort as a growing movement, so we were not expecting to romp home to victory on all fronts.

      We said from day one that the primary objective in this campaign was to use the elections to reach millions of new people across South East England, that we achieved that many times over.

      Secondly, there is no point gauging our performance by looking at our vote in multicultural, heavily Muslim areas because there are hardly any Britons left in those areas.

      We must examine our performance in areas where the majority of the population is overwhelmingly British to see how well we polled – and to give an indication of how well we would poll in other British areas.

      Lastly, as became blatantly obvious with the election of Labour’s Islamist mayor, there is an increasingly shrinking number of Britons left in the capital overall and far too many Muslims.

      Britons make up less than 45% of the capital and at least half of those who remain will be the “trendy” leftwing chattering class types, the gormless liberals and bigoted white socialists in areas such as Camden, Islington etc.

      With such a small and rapidly declining pool of voters to appeal to we rightly said this election was London’s “Last Stand” and the prospects of major gains, even with major resources, were slim.

      Despite all these factors, we have many reasons to be happy and content with our performance.
      Here are a few insights on the election outcome:

      Britain First gained huge numbers of second preference mayoral votes, more than double the number of first preference votes. This bodes very well for the future.

      In total, if you combine the first and second preference votes in the mayoral contest, 105,255 people put their crosses in the Britain First box on polling day, a vote we can be very proud of, considering it is our first effort.

      In suburban areas that are still overwhelmingly British, Britain First was beaten ONLY by the main parties {insert from DFD: in the UK that means Tories & Labor}. Areas such as Bexley, Bromley, Croydon, Sutton, Havering etc. This is a great achievement.

      In areas that are heavily Muslim, multicultural or “trendy”, the Britain First vote collapsed, naturally. Unfortunately these areas make up a majority of the new, colonised Islamised-multicultural London. We were in effect, swimming against the tide.

      Britain First decisively thrashed the BNP which used to have a seat on the London assembly. The BNP was even beaten by the “Cannabis is safer than alcohol” party and achieved a measly 0.6% of the vote.

      In the majority of suburban areas that are still overwhelmingly British, Paul Golding polled far more than infamous traitor George Galloway. Despite George Galloway’s extensive links and support among Muslims, plus his international fame, Paul Golding virtually tied with him in the mayoral race and again Britain First tied with his party in the assembly election. This is a great achievement for a first effort.

      Due to the “crowded” nature of the election, Britain First would have to have secured 160,000 votes to win a seat, not the expected 100,000. This made it virtually impossible to win a seat on the assembly. There were a record number of mayoral candidates as well as parties standing in this election, which helped to skew the percentages needed to win a single seat.

      The announcement of the mayoral vote was delayed until midnight because of “discrepancies” in the votes coming back from certain councils – some would say a fitting start for an Islamist mayor.

      When the mayoral vote was announced, post midnight, party leader Paul Golding turned his back on Sadiq Khan during his victory speech (pictured below), something which shocked the “Old Gang” contingents in the audience not to mention the media.

      All of the news coverage of the announcement was thus dominated not by Khan’s speech, but by our dignified protest against him. All the many thousands of photos taken by an army of journalists showed Khan with Paul’s back turned away from him.

      Dozens of the Labour, Green and Lib-Dem activists present shouted their anger at our protest against the new Islamist mayor. Showing your back is an age-old form of polite protest and the Left is particularly fond of this tactic. Thanks to Paul and his strong nerves they got a taste of their own medicine and Khan’s speech was spoiled.

      Once again we would like to thank the legions of members, supporters and donors that sacrificed so much to make this campaign a reality. Britain First is “knocking the door” of the political mainstream and our London election campaign has cemented our position as a serious political contender.

      God bless everyone who helped us achieve what we did and now we can focus on overhauling our administration, ramping up our activities and marching forward into the summer.

      Yours sincerely,

      Jayda Fransen
      Deputy Leader

      • Jerry says

        May 11, 2016 at 4:57 pm

        I don’t live in Britain but BF is awesome! Jayda is a queen for truth and moral justice and Paul G. is a voice of reason and good will for his country. I wish them the best in their good work.

      • Wellington says

        May 11, 2016 at 5:07 pm

        Thanks for that, DFD.

      • linnte says

        May 11, 2016 at 7:27 pm

        Thanks DFD! And good on Paul turning his back to Kahn. Hot dog!

      • Mark says

        May 12, 2016 at 5:21 am

        Britain first, a front group for the racist and nazi party, the bnp

        • ECAW says

          May 12, 2016 at 5:35 am

          I am no fan of BF or of the BNP but to call them Nazi is just stupid.

          You clearly wouldn’t know a Nazi if they bundled you onto a goods wagon but hey, name calling is all that’s needed isn’t it?

        • Jay Boo says

          May 12, 2016 at 5:56 am

          Mark
          Racist is Muslim baby rapists:

          Racist is
          Pakistani Muslims who target white children for their rape gangs.

          Cowardly is white people who call other white people racist who wish to defend these children from scumbags who behave exactly like child rapist Muhammad.

          Racist is the white skinned evil buffoon Muhammad who owned black slaves with the approval of his JOKE of a religion Islam, his personal sock puppet Allah, and the filthy disgusting garbage in the Qur’an.

          I would say more but my political correctness demands that I resist saying what I really think about Islam’s despicable lying buffoon Muhammad.

        • Bob says

          May 12, 2016 at 7:31 am

          In just on word – NONSENSE!!

  4. Angemon says

    May 11, 2016 at 10:22 am

    “Donald Trump’s ignorant view of Islam could make both of our countries less safe – it risks alienating mainstream Muslims around the world and plays into the hands of extremists,” he said.

    Ignorant as Trump may be of islam, his counselling of a moratorium on muslim migration into the US is on the right track.

    “Donald Trump and those around him think that Western liberal values are incompatible with mainstream Islam – London has proved him wrong.”

    How? How did London proved Trump wrong? 7/7? Lee Rigby?

    While Khan touted the liberal values of British Muslims, some polls have found worrying indicators that their assimilation is incomplete.

    Boy, talk about understatement…

  5. JawsV says

    May 11, 2016 at 10:22 am

    Check out the arrogance in the photo! That’s because Muslims are the “superior peoples” (Quran 3:110) !

    It’s mind-boggling that London’s new mayor is a Mohammedan. The Islamization of Britain continues apace.

    • RobertM says

      May 12, 2016 at 6:27 am

      I’m sure that Churchill is spinning furiously in his grave.

  6. Trico says

    May 11, 2016 at 10:24 am

    ” those around him think that Western liberal values are incompatible with mainstream Islam”
    Just like an Islamist to confuse Bad with Good and Good with Bad.
    It’s not Western liberal values that are incompatible with mainstream Islam, it’s Islam that is not compatible with Western liberal values and with Civilization in general.

  7. Brenda says

    May 11, 2016 at 10:32 am

    I think Trum is right on about Islam. Islam terrorists have shown what they really believe. I do not think they are peaceful. Britain is having all kinds of trouble with them–rape of white women, beatings, and murder. The Koran tells them to smile at the infidels and then stab the infidels in the back. I feel the Brits have made a big mistake by electing a Muslim.

  8. mortimer says

    May 11, 2016 at 10:36 am

    Sadiq Khan is aware that Islam permits vigilantism. Sharia law permits ‘anyone’ to kill apostates and blasphemers since they are ‘harbis’ verbally at war with Islam.

    Sadiq Khan is the master of the slay threat. His words are another version of “If you say Islam is violent, I’ll kill you.’

    Khan did not say, ‘We need to consider the validity of Trump’s concerns.’ He claimed that Muslims are innocent of doing harm or supporting it and also issued a veiled death threat without condemning the Muslim vigilantes he evoked.

    • sog says

      May 11, 2016 at 12:26 pm

      Most Muslims *are* innocent. Most would not directly cause harm, just as most people would not directly cause harm regardless of creed. The problem with Islam is that it morally Frees evil people to harm the innocent.

      • Mark says

        May 12, 2016 at 5:24 am

        No such thing as an innocent muslim!!!!

  9. Jaladhi says

    May 11, 2016 at 10:38 am

    Telling the truth is “ignorant view of Islam” – only in a warped Muslim mind!!

    • Mark Swan says

      May 12, 2016 at 12:46 am

      Absolutely Jaladhi

  10. Myxlplik says

    May 11, 2016 at 10:47 am

    The operative pieces of the statement is “Muslims will attack America”.

    That’s all I heard, most Americans will hear that as well.

    • linnte says

      May 11, 2016 at 3:46 pm

      Yer right Myx! That’s all I heard too, and it made my blood boil! I say, BRING IT ON SUCKER!

  11. Wakeup says

    May 11, 2016 at 10:53 am

    As I said before he will screw up just keep the debate going Jihad watch. He is now on the spot and will have to defend his point of view. I find it an odd feature of the modern world that nothing is ever debated one could for example say hitler was supporting the Zionists and wanted to relocate Jews to so called palestine but holy hell breaks loose and the points are never discussed.

    In pre PC days one would have said you are partially correct mr livingstone he did want to send Jews to so called palestine not out of the kindness of his heart but it just seemed the easiest route for him I guess. What actually happened is that the mufti of so called palestine (good term that ‘so called’) said burn them. Wether or not he was the inspiration for the final solution is open to debate but of course we are not allowed to debate anything these days, I doubt if any of the younger generation understand the very concept of an debate.

    I think Robert Spencer should visit some countries in the EU that will allow him in so as to provoke debate.

    Discuss among yourselves.

  12. mortimer says

    May 11, 2016 at 10:59 am

    If Americans are banned or restricted from entering certain countries, how do Americans react?
    Do Americans hold big rallies, burn flags and scream ‘Death to Berzerkistan’ ? No.
    Do American mobs burn embassies? No.
    Do American mobs burn buildings owned by those countries? No.
    Do Americans burn people from those countries, shoot them or slash them with knives or rape them because they are from those unfriendly countries? No.

    Do Muslims do all the above? Yes.

    Who are the more civilized people?

    • Christianblood says

      May 11, 2016 at 12:10 pm

      Who elected this barbaric muslim jihadist to be London’s mayor in the first place?

      • Lizzy says

        May 11, 2016 at 3:26 pm

        Londoners…of which some areas are 50% Islamic.

        • dumbledoresarmy says

          May 11, 2016 at 7:23 pm

          Isn’t it *more* than 50 percent in some boroughs by now?

  13. Jerry says

    May 11, 2016 at 11:05 am

    The only ignorant view I can think of is that islam is a religion of peace. You can’t mistake kill the infidel for anything other than a serious threat of murder and violence. Nor can one mistake the bigotry and ignorance of islam as anything other than a dangerous anachronism for civilized society. And how are mainstream muslims alienated? If someone calls me a Nazi when I’m not I don’t then respond by becoming one. I stay true to my peaceful self and overcome the accusation with my own good behavior. But with muslims apparently it’s different. If we dare speak of islam’s unmistakable bigotry and violence then the peaceful muslims may no longer be peaceful. This is a clear threat to not speak the truth. It’s bad enough this fake religion is causing mass murder and persecution of minorities in their own countries, but now we are threatened in our own backyard.

    Wouldn’t we have all been shocked out of our infidel shorts if this new tyrant with a tie had shown an ounce of good will. How much better he could have done with a wiser selection of words. But as we’re finding out, muslims aren’t worried about the feelings and concerns of others. Their base of operation is one of control and domination over others for allah. If allah were a good god this would still be cause for concern. But as the world has seen all too well, this is a religion born of man’s evil desires. The evidence is in every cut head, the rapes, the misogyny, acid in the face, homophobic murder, unjust stonings, religious persecutions, free-speech intimidation, unsafe enclaves…practically every bump and crack in the islamic culture is an expression of their dissimilitude and hatred for western culture and its people. But they’re humans too, I guess, so I suppose our leftist duty is to lay down our lives, our peace, and our future for them. No. Our duty is to fight this all pervading evil with every ounce of energy in our infidel souls, for humankind, for peace, and for the good god of love we hope exists.

    That’s my 2 cents on this one.

    • mortimer says

      May 11, 2016 at 11:25 am

      Perhaps Caliph al Baghdadi is also ‘ignorant’ of Islam.

      Jerry wrote: “The only ignorant view I can think of is that islam is a religion of peace.”

      Baghdadi has a BA, MA and PhD in Islamic studies. He is one of the best-read scholars on Islam in the world and is never criticized about his Islamic knowledge.

      Sadiq Khan is being allowed to muddy the waters by conflating the lackadaisical and slack Islam of most Muslims living in the West (such as himself) with strict ISLAMIC IDEOLOGY.

      Most Muslims are not following Islamic IDEOLOGY strictly and so are only moderately Muslim.

      Non-practicing Muslims are not ‘good’ Muslims. Sadiq Khan takes advantage of the fact that Westerners are unfamiliar with the foundational source texts.

      • mortimer says

        May 11, 2016 at 11:36 am

        Caliph al Baghdadi said: “Islam was never a religion of peace. Islam is the religion of fighting. No-one should believe that the war that we are waging is the war of the Islamic State. Do not think the war that we are waging is the Islamic State’s war alone. Rather, it is the Muslims’ war altogether. It is the war of every Muslim in every place, and the Islamic State is merely the spearhead in this war. It is but the war of the people of faith against the people of disbelief.”

        Ignorant or accurate?

        Does Khan disagree? Is Khan at war ‘against the people of disbelief’ ? Or is Khan standing with them?

      • Jerry says

        May 11, 2016 at 12:24 pm

        Most Muslims are not following Islamic IDEOLOGY strictly and so are only moderately Muslim.

        That’s true, but it’s not out of respect for western democracy and culture or because they want to be part of us. It’s because they can’t live out their religious devotions without acting like a terrorist. Some do become terrorists but the majority only tell us they want sharia and islam to dominate, every poll says this. They don’t live their creed’s violence, but the things they want to impose are themselves a form of violence. Sharia is violence, it’s a human rights abuser, and their religion is a fascist, supremacist killer. The majority may be peaceful, but they keep alive the doctrine that motivates others to kill for the things they want. I see this as no different from what the Nazis did 70 years ago. It’s all bad to me, it’s just that the “peaceful” ones do their part to destroy us on a more stealthy level.

        When my dog poops in the house I don’t just clean up the hard and leave the runny, I clean up the whole darn mess. And that’s what islam and its muslims are to me: islam is the “hard” and the moderates are the “runny.” It’s all part of the same stink that needs to be cleaned.

    • High Hopes says

      May 11, 2016 at 1:50 pm

      Beautifully said, regards from what was London.

    • Demsci says

      May 12, 2016 at 6:52 am

      ./The only ignorant view I can think of is that islam is a religion of peace. “”/

      You are so right on this. And yet ….. countless clueless people, journalists, politicians “buy” that notion.

      Often with the lame excuse that contending otherwise is undermining “societal cohesion + harmony”. And for fear of being branded “racist, bigoted or Islamophobic”.

      Thank god for Trump on whom Islamorealist Americans can now vote to express their disgust and protest against that.

      I now too believe that Islam is clearly pre-democratic, un-democratic and anti-democratic. This would mean Muslims are either already or in potential enemies of at least parts of our democratic system and countries.

      But this view might be for many swingvoters too extreme. But if it is now clear that the Muslims themselves both promote that Islam is a religion of peace (like Mayor Sadiq Khan et al) AND that Islam is supremacist and agressive (like ISIS and Iran et al, see MEMRI-TV), So they massively contradict each other.

      And if so many Political Corrects warn against “Painting all Muslims with the same brush.

      Then we can at least try to reason logically that in “THAT case logically Islam must be ambiguous and MULTI-Interpretabel, and that that is due to contradiction, obsoleteness, incompleteness inside Islam’s core-holy texts.

      And THAT would lead to the argument that Islam certainly is not a CLEAR religion that is beneficial or neutral.

      Which is the big lie of Muslims (who will never admit Islam is not clear) and political correct journalists and leaders who exonerate Islam completely be it from anti-democratic intent or unclarity and ambiguity.

      But if Muslims and political corrects angrily reject that Islam is clear and anti-democratic, let us at least deny them as much as we can them the chance to declare Islam to be both clear AND beneficial in a democratic context!!

  14. Mirren10 says

    May 11, 2016 at 11:09 am

    …“Donald Trump’s ignorant view of Islam could make both of our countries less safe – it risks alienating mainstream Muslims around the world and plays into the hands of extremists,”

    If I was a journalist, I would ask these questions.

    1. Why would ‘an ignorant view of *islam*’ make America or the UK less safe ?

    2. Would an ignorant view of Christianity/Judaism/Hinduism/Sikhism/Buddhism/Jainism/Wiccan make America or the UK less safe ?

    3. If not, why not ?

    4. Would an ignorant view of Christianity risk alienating mainstream Christians around the world ?

    5. If not, why not ?

    6. Would an ignorant view of any other religion, except islam, risk alienating its mainstream adherents around the world ?

    7. If not, why not ?

    8. Why would an ignorant view of islam play into the hands of extremists ? Please define extremism first.

    9. Would an ignorant view of Christianity ”play into the hands of extremists” ? If not, why not ?

    10. Would an ignorant view of any religion, except islam, ”play into the hands of extremists” ? If not, why not ?

    But there will never, in the gutless msm, be any ‘journalist’, anywhere, who will ask this scumbag Khan, (making threats before he’s even tried on his pretty chain of office) these questions. Not even one.

    • mortimer says

      May 11, 2016 at 11:46 am

      Ignorance of Islam’s ‘REVENGE’ and ‘VIGILANTISM’ doctrines will cause the world to be more at risk.

      Caliph al Baghdadi said:

      -“By Allah, we will take revenge! By Allah, we will take revenge! Even if it takes a while, we will take revenge, and every amount of harm against the Ummah will be responded to with multitudes more against the perpetrator. As quoted in Dabiq, issue #12; published November 18, 2015, pg. 2 [1]

      -“Soon, by Allah’s permission, a day will come when the Muslim will walk everywhere as MASTER, having honor, being revered, with his head held high, and his dignity preserved. Anyone who DARE TO OFFEND HIM WILL BE DISCIPLINED, and any hand that reaches out to harm him will be cut off. So let the world know that we are living today in a new era. Whoever was heedless must now be alert. Whoever was sleeping must now awaken.” As quoted in Dabiq, issue #12; published November 18, 2015, pp. 2-3

      Sadiq Khan agrees with those statements.

    • DFD says

      May 11, 2016 at 3:45 pm

      To Mirren10:

      You may ask the question, but will the editor permit the question to be printed – and the answer?

      No.

      Not unless he wants to lose his job.

  15. Myxlplik says

    May 11, 2016 at 11:36 am

    The premise is actually laughable, Trump wants to stop Muslims from coming in due to the fact that, compelled by their faith, they slaughter people. Then the Muslim Mayor of London says, that if we don’t let Muslims in they’ll slaughter people over hurt feelings.

    Muslims feel hurt when you won’t let them slaughter, so they’ll slaughter you more when you try to stop them.

    • Shmooviyet says

      May 11, 2016 at 2:02 pm

      Thank You for the real-world translation of Khan’s statement.

      He’s speaking straight to Trump supporters, or anyone who will not vote for his congratulatory leftist allies in the US.

      • dumbledoresarmy says

        May 11, 2016 at 7:34 pm

        The response should be a massive increase in people intending to vote Trump.

        I would strongly encourage Americans here present to contact Mr Trump and state that they are voting for him because they want a ban on Muslim immigration, because they are sick and tired of playing the lethal game of “Muslim roulette”.

        And that if he, Trump, *is* elected POTUS, they (those who have voted for him) will *expect* the ban to be imposed across the board ASAP – with NO exceptions or exemptions or ‘special allowances’, especially in light of our greasily-smiling Mr Sadiq Khan, regrettably now Mayor of London town, who (in response to Mr Trump’s offer of an invitation to visit) has just issued what any intelligent Infidel can instantly recognise as an open threat that boils down to the following – “You MUST keep on letting Muslims in mobs into the USA, OR ELSE… even more of the Muslims already there will start blowing sh*t up and shooting or stabbing people”.

        Make the point yet again – Got Muslims? Got Jihad – and note that you want that ban, oh dear god you want that ban on Muslim immigration, you want it, no matter how many threats are uttered by the likes of Khan; and that you don’t just want a temporary ban, you want it PERMANENT.

        • Daniel Triplett says

          May 12, 2016 at 12:32 pm

          Agreed.

          DJT is very active on Twitter, and does all his own Tweets. Write to him. He will read what you say.

          If you have more than 140 characters, write your words or essay on http://www.medium.com. It interfaces with Twitter very easily. Just put your Medium hyperlink on your Tweet, and the reader will be taken immediately to it. That’s what I’ve been doing, and it works great.

          Here’s an example of a http://www.medium.com essay I broadcast regularly across all social media, including Twitter. I’ve sent it to DJT also:

          “Total War: Extinguishing Islam from Earth” @dantriplett https://medium.com/@dantriplett/islamic-jihad-is-total-war-for-all-marbles-6c858098b76e

          Even though the hyperlink is long, it consumes just 80 characters, leaving you with 60 more to introduce it on Twitter, encouraging people to click and read it.

  16. Michael Copeland says

    May 11, 2016 at 11:41 am

    “Our” country, Mr. K?
    “The muslim nation is one nation to the exclusion of all others”
    Placard in Oxford Street.
    http://www.libertygb.org.uk/news/mr-cameron-islam-hostile

  17. cs says

    May 11, 2016 at 12:15 pm

    This guy is completely full of shit. he will have a hard time, trust me.

  18. awake says

    May 11, 2016 at 12:54 pm

    This mohammedan should be drawn and quartered in Leicester Square.

  19. Michael Warden says

    May 11, 2016 at 1:14 pm

    Lindsey Graham shows what to do with a Koran :

    • ECAW says

      May 11, 2016 at 2:04 pm

      Correction – Ann Barnhardt shows Lindsey Graham what to do with a Koran.

      Something similar here:

      http://www.yorkshirestandard.co.uk/news/19-year-old-released-on-bail-after-alleged-koran-burning-video-9133/

      You can guess what happened next.

      • DFD says

        May 11, 2016 at 3:52 pm

        Compare with a Bible placed into a toilet bowl, in a publicly exhibit – in an art gallery. Controversial art, and the artist was lauded for his daring stand. He probably won a price too, I couldn’t be bothered reading it to the end.

      • Jay Boo says

        May 12, 2016 at 3:31 am

        Look Mortimer

        Ann Barnhardt does not revere the words of the Qur’an.

        But, MORTIMER does.

        • Mirren10 says

          May 12, 2016 at 3:41 am

          ”Ann Barnhardt does not revere the words of the Qur’an.

          But, MORTIMER does.”

          Nonsense. Mortimer does nothing of the sort.

          I may not always agree with some of his conclusions, particularly ‘deprogramming’ muslims, but to imply, as you are doing, that Mortimer, an intelligent commenter, and one who is very knowledgeable about the koran, hadith and sira, is some sort of 5th columnist here, is unconscionable.

        • ECAW says

          May 12, 2016 at 4:10 am

          Well said Mirren10. I was just about to say something along the same lines but you saved me the trouble.

          Jay Boo – your hounding Mortimer is getting ugly.

        • Jay Boo says

          May 12, 2016 at 5:33 am

          “Well said Mirren10. I was just about to say something along the same lines but you saved me the trouble.”

          Ok Fine, ECAW
          I will be the first to admit that Mortimer has some good comments at times, but where were you when he does not?
          Where were you when he gratuitously and irresponsibly rants as if in a first person narrative voice that Muslims have duty to kill kafirs and then leaves it hanging or when suggests that Muslims are so brainwashed that they are not responsible for their actions.

          “just about to say something” perhaps but chose not to do so, or did not bother to notice?

        • ECAW says

          May 12, 2016 at 5:44 am

          ‘“just about to say something” perhaps but chose not to do so, or did not bother to notice?’

          I did bother to notice and was just about to reply as Mirren10 did but saw her post had arrived shortly after yours .

          I have seen one or two of what you call Mortimer’s first person rants and have always read them as ironic.

          By the way, do not think I have anything against you apart this one issue. I greatly appreciate your poetic turn of phrase. You provide the only poetry here.

        • Jay Boo says

          May 12, 2016 at 5:42 am

          ECAW
          Next time I chose to call Mortimer directly on such a typical comment, by all means feel free to come to his defense.
          Jump in.
          So far all I have seen is commenters sitting way back in in the bleachers on the side lines when I have done so directly. Not a peep.

          Now that I have taken an unusual step to remind Mortimer of past comments suddenly I have those with amnesia asking me to back up my claim that Mortimer made such comments.

        • Mirren10 says

          May 12, 2016 at 5:58 am

          ”Now that I have taken an unusual step to remind Mortimer of past comments suddenly I have those with amnesia asking me to back up my claim that Mortimer made such comments.”

          Not good enough. Provide the links, as others do.

        • Jay Boo says

          May 12, 2016 at 6:28 am

          Strange You have no comment about Mortimer’s tactic of using evasive fallacies.
          —————————————————————————–
          Do you want me to hunt down the links to deprogramming as well.
          That would take a while. But you agree to that.

          M10
          Provide me the challenge to my challenge to Mortimer as others do.

          I have commented about these thing directly to Mortimer many, many times as they occurred.
          Suddenly now you have an issue and claim no awareness.

          Have you ever challenged me before or come to mortimer’s defense when I repeatedly brought up these very same issues time and time again?

        • Jay Boo says

          May 12, 2016 at 6:34 am

          Now that I am “hounding” Mortimer and reminding him — (after the fact) you have selective amnesia and insist on proof.

          Next time I confront him directly, please jump in and defend him if you think you are able.
          By all means.

          It is not as if my frequent challenges to Mortimer have been too subtle to even notice.

    • linnte says

      May 11, 2016 at 3:54 pm

      Wow! She has ovaries! Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Good for her!

  20. Carmel says

    May 11, 2016 at 2:24 pm

    London mayor is doing municipal politic or international politic ?

    I would suggest he go in Hyde Park to speaker’s corner and listen to Jay Smith. They have common pakistan ancestors maybe they could blend together.

  21. chrisnj says

    May 11, 2016 at 2:39 pm

    Given not-so-veiled threats like that by a clear Islamist, it would seem that Trump’s views and proposals to temporarily restrict or ban travel by avowed and insufficiently un-vetted Muslims from travel into the US or it’s territories, is a not-so-ignorant view of Islam after all.

  22. R Cole says

    May 11, 2016 at 3:01 pm

    Very curious about the London Mayor’s election – repeatedly whenever there is a Muslim being elected – particularly in East London – there is enormous amounts of voter fraud and irregularities.

    For example, what has been found in the past – is that you have 30 or more Bangladeshis registered to vote at a single residence – but on checking they find that a Polish girl lives there. If these Muslim voters do exist – then they live outside of London – and in organised groups register to vote in places they don’t live in or have had absolutely no connection with.

    Just a theory!

    ::

    The London Mayor going on about ‘ignorance’ of Islam. Because he believes Islam endows him with special ‘knowledge’ which places him above the ‘ignorant’ non-believers “kufr”.

    The good Mayor called moderate Muslims ‘Uncle Toms’ – to which he gave a grovelling apology for. [When it was revealed days before the election.]

    Let’s see what his grand Islamization plans are for London!!

    First on the list ~ changing all the toilets to face Mecca?
    The multi-faith prayer room – becomes a mosque?
    Ramadan imposed on all mayoral staff. [The Mayor will lead by example]
    All things un-Islamic not permissible – includes types of food consumed on premise.
    No Christmas trees and even those ‘seasonal lights’ will be omitted.
    Trips to Mecca – each year which he is in office. [Worst than not being a Muslim – is not being seen to be one!]

    ::

    He emerges from the UK Labour Party – where Muslims are granted a privileged position. So protected when Muslims within the party spew antisemitism and Nazi-Hitler-praising – because they are Muslim – it’s not viewed as ‘racism’ and is tolerated!!

    This is the problem with PC – who controls it?

    Khan is deluded if he thinks he can take on Trump!

    Trump is not bound by Khan’s PC!

  23. Klaas de Bakker says

    May 11, 2016 at 5:23 pm

    Thanks for calling this what it is: a veiled threat. I was really hoping somebody else would spot this.

  24. Richard Paulsen says

    May 11, 2016 at 5:46 pm

    Seems as if most people in Europe do agree with him. Islamization or death.
    Will it ever change? Waiting. Doesn’t want neither Europe nor the U. S. A. being turned into Islamic States.

    • Richard Paulsen says

      May 11, 2016 at 5:51 pm

      Correction.
      ” I don’t want neither Europe nor the U. S. A. being turned into an Islamic State. “

  25. Jerry says

    May 11, 2016 at 6:35 pm

    You see Jayda as a “typical” politician in Britain? Wow, you must know something I don’t. She and Paul are so Atypical they are like accidents of nature. Please enlighten me, how is BP’s bold stand against islam typical in dhimmi-groveling Britain?

    • Jerry says

      May 11, 2016 at 6:37 pm

      Britain First, not BP

    • Richard Paulsen says

      May 12, 2016 at 4:48 am

      No, it just says ” typical politician “. Not ” typical politician in Britain “. Best regards.
      Like when TV here (in Sweden) says that Trump hates mexicans, instead of that he is just taking about legal and illegals.

  26. dumbledoresarmy says

    May 11, 2016 at 7:00 pm

    I would encourage Americans here present who have, correctly, interpreted this statement by Sadiq Khan as a threat by any other name, to contact Mr Trump and his campaign team and point this out.

    Myself, I hope that Trump himself has already perceived the threat. But a couple of thousand emails from well-informed Americans explaining that they, too, have read Mr Khan’s statement as a threat, would be a good idea anyway.

    • dumbledoresarmy says

      May 11, 2016 at 7:04 pm

      The proper response to Mr Khan’s threat would be a tweet reading, succinctly, something like this: “Threat noted. Invitation withdrawn.”

  27. dumbledoresarmy says

    May 11, 2016 at 8:18 pm

    One must remember that Muslims think of themselves as the Illuminated ones, the ones ‘in the know’, superior and special (and therefore having the right to treat all non-muslim humans like sh*t).

    Whereas all us Infidels are “ignorant” by definition, because we have not embraced the so-called “light” of Islam. If we refuse to become Muslim we are ‘ignorant’. In countries conquered by Islam the pre-Islamic period – no matter what heights of civilisation said countries previously enjoyed, and the miserable deserts and slums that they become under Islam – is described and perceived, by the conquering Muslims, as a time of darkness and ignorance.

    It’s a stunning piece of turnspeak/ projection/ reversal of reality… because in fact, to any unbiased observer who examines human history, it is pretty damn obvious that, as Andre Servier noted many many years ago, Islam is “not a torch, but an extinguisher”.

    Everywhere it goes it extinguishes the light of human intellect, the light of life and love and art and beauty; it silences music and burns books; it annihilates real history and science and replaces them with its own nonsense-and-lies.

    • linnte says

      May 11, 2016 at 11:04 pm

      Where two or more are gathered together in my name… Let’s pound Britain with PRAYER! In Jesus Name! I am with you Dumbledore!

  28. somehistory says

    May 12, 2016 at 12:15 am

    The veil on the threat is as clear as the one worn by a moslim woman. It means war.

    Reminds me of those movies where the bad guy tells the protagonist or other actor, at the point of a gun, “Don’t make any noise, no cry for help,” with the clear threat of death if such noise is made.
    Bad guy forces protagonist or other actor to walk to a car, cliff, etc., clearly with the intent to kill the person when a certain point is reached.

    It is advice of law enforcement that says don’t go with someone forcing you into a car…scream and make a scene and someone may help you. If you go quietly, when a remote area is reached, you will be killed with no one to help you.

    So, if Trump keeps speaking as he has been, there will be acts of terrorism from moslims.
    If Trump doesn’t keep speaking as he has been, there will be acts of terrorism from moslims.

    If he becomes president and prevents more moslims from coming in, there will be acts of terrorism…maybe here.
    If he becomes president and doesn’t prevent more moslims from coming in, there will be far more moslims in the country to carry out acts of terrorism.

    And of course moslims have proved they can behave in the UK…they behave just like they do in moslim countries… .just look at all those kidnappings and rapes of young girls…these behaviors have clearly proved just how despicable is islam and its adherents.
    And they have proven that any country where moslims are allowed in in large numbers, will be places where it is unsafe for children, as these will be kidnapped and raped by moslims..

    Thankfully, like any wild beast, islam has a limited life span. Its doom is on the horizon.

    • linnte says

      May 12, 2016 at 12:46 am

      To me, it IS war. I am just beginning to see it is a spiritual war also though. Slow learner, eh? I really don’t know how to fight spiritually. Except for casting spells! Hahahahahahaha! I promise to not do that. So, I will pray. But if the fight comes to my state? BOOM!

      • Mark Swan says

        May 12, 2016 at 2:12 am

        Ephesians 6:10 -17

        • linnte says

          May 12, 2016 at 2:57 am

          And verse 29! That I may open my mouth boldly to tell the Gosple. Wow! THANKS MARK! That’s some really awesome warrior stuff. Wow!

        • linnte says

          May 12, 2016 at 2:58 am

          Not 29 but 20. ?

  29. Annak says

    May 12, 2016 at 2:09 am

    The London people’s ignorant choice of mayor is the biggest danger around to GB and the world.

    Especially as he seems to regard himself now he is mayor as a PM or a President the way he arrogantly ponces around and preaches.
    As if Trump could care less what this proven-terrorist- supporting misogynist upstart thinks !

  30. Richard Paulsen says

    May 12, 2016 at 5:14 am

    “A muslim can live in a western country”, mr Khan says. Even muslim women can? Always muslim men in politics, obedient muslim women standing in the background.
    There are a majority men in ages around 17 now in Sweden. The demography dramatically changing. There are some 1,1-1,2% men compared to women. Before women used to be the majority over women.
    On its way in UK and the U.S.A. as well? Soon there will be a majority of muslim men there? Like in Sweden and muslim countries.
    How about Christians in islamic states? There are not many left. 0-10%.
    Could a muslim woman become mayor in London or be allowed to through he veil either in a muslim caountry or a western?
    Take warning from Sweden and islamic states when you still can.

    • Richard Paulsen says

      May 12, 2016 at 5:17 am

      Correction line 5-6. ” Before women used to be the majority over men. “

    • Richard Paulsen says

      May 12, 2016 at 5:23 am

      Correction line 9-10:. ” Threw her veil away. ” ” Country” not “Caountry”.
      Apology. But there is no other way to correct mistakes. Limited English.
      Thank you.

      • Richard Paulsen says

        May 12, 2016 at 5:34 am

        No: Should be “Throw.” Sorry.

        • dumbledoresarmy says

          May 12, 2016 at 9:27 am

          don’t worry. Your English is much, much better than my French, German or Italian would be, if I were trying to post at a forum where those languages were used.

          I can understand what you’re saying, just fine.

      • linnte says

        May 12, 2016 at 9:35 am

        No apology necessary Richard! Your meaning comes through loud and clear!

        • Richard Paulsen says

          May 12, 2016 at 11:50 am

          Thank you.

    • linnte says

      May 12, 2016 at 9:29 am

      How I wish every American could hear your words Richard.

  31. Nick Harris says

    May 12, 2016 at 6:51 am

    I visit this site regularly because it often reports on stories about Islamist activity that are skipped over by the mainstream media.

    I have to say as a white British Liberal who absolutely acknowledges there are issues with some Muslims who want to return to the dark ages (and have succeeded in parts of the Middle East), Sadiq Kahn is not one of them. I have a friend who knows him personally and he is a progressive man who is fully aware of the responsibility he carries on his shoulders. He has spoken out against anti-semitism, has been supportive of the LGBT Community and he certainly lives in this century.

    This was not a veiled threat. His point was that a blanket ban on all Muslims casts all Muslims as terrorists which is ridiculous. The argument is that if you treat people unfairly (in this case Muslims but it could just as easily be gays, jews, women) you create resentment which makes that group more sympathetic to extremist messages and less likely to be integrated.

    I agree that Islamism is a big problem that we face in these times. I’m a gay man which depressingly means both extremist Muslims and Extreme right wing folks hate me and don’t think I should have the right to a decent life, or any life at all in some cases. But sometimes the bitterness from one particular writer on here for not being allowed in the UK really does cloud their judgement and makes for bad journalism and muddied thinking…..Which ultimately chips away at the credibility of this very important website. It’s also a shame because I respect said writer’s views on many things, agree with much of what he says and I also think he’s quite woofy.

    If Sadiq Kahn messes up, believe me there is a queue of folks who are waiting to pounce and say “See! I told you so!!”. Besides which, being Mayor of London doesn’t mean that all of a sudden you can change the face of the city single handedly. My town has been through the Blitzkrieg, absorbed wave after wave of immigrants from all over the world and Londoners are a hardy & canny bunch. Don’t think for a moment when push comes to shove, we won’t speak up for ourselves or call out wrong doing.

    If Sadiq Kahn does turn out to be a wolf in sheep’s clothing I will be happy to acknowledge that. But there’s a difference between honest analysis and seizing every opportunity to damn someone before they even leave the starting blocks. There’s no point asking where the moderate Muslim voices are if you’re going to demonize all of them…..Both the secular and the Islamic world need moderate mainstream Muslims who can demonstrate a way to be at peace with their own beliefs and also those of people around them. In doing so, they build trust and create a template for other would be moderates to follow.

    If folks on here really want things to improve, they should be cheering on people like Sadiq Kahn to do a good job as London Mayor for all Londoners. London is one of the most diverse cities in the world, if he’s not what he says he is, he’ll be found out soon enough. For now though, please give him the benefit of the doubt.

    • ECAW says

      May 12, 2016 at 11:53 am

      Nick

      1. If Sadiq Khan has spoken out against anti-Semitism and supported the LGBT community he is not really following the “excellent example” of the “perfect man” is he? Why not?

      2. “if you treat people unfairly (in this case Muslims but it could just as easily be gays, jews, women) you create resentment which makes that group more sympathetic to extremist messages”

      If you treat gays, Jews and women unfairly they rarely behead you in the street or blow you up at a rock concert. Does this difference not warrant a different level of caution about letting Muslims into your country? As an aside, it puzzles me that the three groups you mention are not more vociferous about allowing people, a certain (that is an uncertain proportion) of whom want to kill or abuse them into the same living space. Instead they often seem keen to side with their potential oppressors.

      3. “I agree that Islamism is a big problem”

      I will just ask you this…who could be more of an Islamist than Mohammed? Rather than look at the results of Islam which are referred to with a confusing slew of names…moderate, extremist, fundamentalist, radicalised etc…may I suggest that the better approach is to go to the centre, study the life and character of Mohammed, and decide whether you think he was a wise and benign lawgiver or a genocidal megalomaniac, and then consider how someone who considers him a perfect example is likely to act.

      If you have done this already I apologise and would be grateful to hear your conclusion.

      • Nick Harris says

        May 12, 2016 at 5:47 pm

        Hi Ecaw

        I describe Islamism as the imposition of the doctrines, customs and religious sensibilities of Islam on non Muslims. Jihadism is the pursuit of that goal through violence. I oppose both, fundamentally….I’m a liberal man with Western values as well as being an Atheist and having no time for any religiosity.

        There are clearly Muslims in the world, particularly in the West who have realised just as Christians have done that a lot of the outlandish claims of their faith are in fact bunk, the world wasn’t created in 7 days 10,000 years ago (or whatever the biblical figure is) and that the sun does not indeed set in a puddle of mud at night, bringing darkness over the flat Earth. Lots of Muslims are so just by default, because of where they were born. It’s much harder for them to leave the faith because of harsh punishment for Apostasy (which again, is ridiculous).

        A lot of Talk Radio hosts and televangelists in the US quote the Old testament and bundle it up with “Christian Values” but the Old Testament is every bit as violent and nasty as the Qur’an and in fact, very un-Christian. The difference is of course that Christians are not currently meeting out punishment as per the good book because Christianity has collided with Science and the modern world and lost. Ultimately, this is the destiny of all the old religions as Science knocks down the myths one by one. This is a good thing I believe but it’s also why some followers of some religions are so against science and discovery. What you’re often left with is people just following “The good bits” of their religion and ignoring the nonsense which is as it should be…..”Wearing your faith lightly” as they say.

        There are lots of people who describe themselves as Christians but who don’t live to the letter of the Bible. To assume this is different for Muslims is illogical. Again, there is a problem right now, there is a war of ideas going on and I myself worry about the future. Ultimately it’s going to lead to some awful and bloody confrontations unless moderate and mainstream Muslims are encouraged to help bring Islam into the 21st Century and leave the beheading stuff behind.

        I’ve a lot of time for reforming Muslims such as Maajid Nawaz, Zuhdi Jasser, The Quilliam Foundation etc. These people are incredibly brave….They are often threatened with death and get tainted with horrible racial slurs such as “Porch Monkey” and “Native Informant” from Islamists within their own community. These people are trying to make things better and I think they deserve our support rather than our cynicism.

        I don’t think we should just let anybody into our country…And I don’t think we should be letting *any* young (20’s, 30’s, 40’s) Muslim men into the country from the Middle East as refugees. I think we should offer to look after the women, the children and the elderly whilst the young men kill each other until they realise how ultimately futile and barabaric it is. Europe and the US have done enough war to know the cost of it….I think every culture has to learn this lesson it seems.

        • ECAW says

          May 13, 2016 at 2:34 am

          “I describe Islamism as the imposition of the doctrines, customs and religious sensibilities of Islam on non Muslims”.

          So do I…and that was exactly the attitude of Mohammed and his immediate successors so I maintain that the jihadis are closer to the example of Mohammed than the many milions of nominal Muslims. You didn’t answer my question about what you make of Mohammed rather than modern Muslims. I assume that means that you haven’t studied him. If you have half an hour to spare I offer this, the highlights of the earliest biography of Mohammed:

          http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/sira/index.htm

          If you have only 5 minutes here are the highlights of the highlights:

          https://ecawblog.wordpress.com/2015/09/16/ibn-ishaq/

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 7:48 am

          By today’s standards, it would be fair to describe Mohamed as a Pedophile, a rapist, a murderer and a warlord….So yes, I know a bit about the chap ;-).

          But as I have said before, that doesn’t turn all Muslims into the same thing just as all people who describe themselves as Christians don’t walk about giving away all their earthly possessions and helping the poor and needy all the time. Many thinking Muslims (particularly in the West) acknowledge these problems and are trying to reform the faith. We need to encourage this challenging of the ideology by Muslims themselves because that’s where the reform needs to come from.

          I’ve said before, I’m an atheist. To me, the argument about which religion is more true or better is like 2 lunatics in an assylum trying to convince each other they’re the real Napoleon. Ultimately I don’t want freedom of religion so much as freedom *from* religion. Then perhaps we can all concentrate on dealing with actual problems that really exist and go about solving them through intellect and science rather than prayer!

        • ECAW says

          May 13, 2016 at 8:09 am

          But was he an Islamist? You won’t commit yourself but this is the important point.

          No one imagines that all Muslims follow Mohammed’s malign example any more than all Christians follow Jesus’ (mostly) benign example. The argument about Muslims does not rely on their all emulating Mohammed. Only a very small minority have to in order to bring death and destruction to Europe and a slew of polls, most recently Trevor Phillip’s one, showed that a sizeable minority do see things just as Mohammed did.

          As to thinking Muslims trying to reform their faith, how do you reform a religion whose god said long ago “This day I have perfected for you your religion”? Even if Zusser and Usama Hasan are genuine they both got run out of their mosques with death threats and have a negligible following. Waiting for the moderates to show up is not nuanced, it is just wisful thinking.

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 9:15 am

          I’ll happily commit to the idea that yes, of course Muhammad was an Islamist….I wouldn’t suggest otherwise because the evidence is overwhelming.

          I agree that reformers have a tough task but they are gaining ground. And Atheism is taking root in many pockets of Islamic countries precisely because of the insane barbarism we’re seeing in Syria and Iraq. Ultimately I believe the only solution to this problem is the absolute insistence on Secular government and the separation of church and state. Obviously, any Islamist is going to have a problem with that and they should therefore not be welcome in any democratic Western country. Upon consideration for refugee or asylum status, this must be made absolutely clear…..This is where we have gone wrong in the past and why we are paying for it now.

          You mentioned Trevor Phillip’s program on the TV. I saw that too. His proposed solution is exactly what I also advocate, ie “Muscular Liberalism” which champions democratic values and equality for all before the law and certainly makes no apologies for it.

          What’s your solution?

        • ECAW says

          May 13, 2016 at 9:40 am

          We are not so far apart on immigrants but…

          The old and infirm do not need vetting because they are unlikely to be able to do much harm, vetting children would be a nonsense and vetting women would be practically impossible, partly because women leave very small footprints in Muslim societies and partly, as with anyone, there is no vetting possible for what is going on between anyone’s ears. Even so I would give preference to Christian and other refugees who are being decimated in Muslim lands and prefer to aid in situ.

          Re young males. it seems we would both bar them but would you send back those who have already arrived and who continue to be ferried across the Mediterranean by European naval vessels?

          But, going to my earlier point, I am glad to see that you accept the view that Mohammed was what we would call an Islamist. I don’t know how much you know about Islamic scriptures and tenets. Do you know that the Sunnah is the example of Mohammed and that is why Sunnis call themselves that? If Mohammed was an Islamist and Muslims are expected to follow the example of Mohammed, why do you not think that a good Muslim shouldn’t be an Islamist? There are many Muslims who are not Islamists but are they not just lax Muslims? Mohammed had another word for them and they end up even lower down in hell than you or me.

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 10:17 am

          i think you make some good points about immigration. But there is some value in vetting, starting with the basics of knowing who people actually are. In my view, part of the decision of whether to allow people into the UK or anywhere in Europe should rest on how transparent people are during that process. Any kind of opacity should immediately raise concern. Similarly, older people from that part of the world can still do a lot of damage by inspiring Jihadism amngst younger generations. Most of the influential Clerics in Saudi are crazy old flat Earthers.

          I also have some sympathy for favoring Christians given the extreme persecution they have been facing in Syria and the likely higher similarities from a cultural point of view. But I think it would be a mistake to make judgements solely on this basis since it looks like more sectarianism and as if the West considers Christian Lives more important than Muslim ones. I know plenty of people here might feel that way and offer up seemingly valid reasons for why that is (“Well Muslims think they’re more important than Christians” for example). But I think there is a larger issue at stake here about the West’s ability to deal with this from a humanitarian point of view, whilst still robustly sticking to our own values of equality. In that sense, I think it is important to deal with people as humans, and to make it clear that religion plays no part in the decision making process.

          Regarding Sunni Muslims following the example of Muhammad…I agree it’s absolutely a big problem for the West when religious fanatics (Islamists) take up that cause. In my view, these people have no place in our society and need to be watched very closely. But if all Sunnis felt this strongly, there would be a much bigger problem than there currently is.

          In the UK, we were naive in the 90s and first decade of this century when Islamism went unchallenged due to a dismissive attitude towards it, viewing it as marginal. But recently we have got better at stopping the spread of the ideology with better laws….When did you last see Anjem Choudhary on the TV talking his nonsense? That’s because he’s banged up and awaiting trial (Good!!!). I believe this is the way forward….Absolute insistence on abidance with our laws and prosecution for any crimes committed, regardless of any religious or cultural justification. Our house, our rules.

          We can still demonstrate humanity and compassion, but on condition of respect for our values and way of life….That should be the deal.

    • ECAW says

      May 12, 2016 at 12:05 pm

      ps “a blanket ban on all Muslims casts all Muslims as terrorists”

      No it doesn’t. This is very important. What it does do is to acknowledge that a proportion of Muslims will be terrorists (or other kinds of jihadis…I’m sure you know that violent jihad is not the only kind). We are just haggling about that proportion. As Ali Sina says…if you are presented with 100 [or 1000 or 10,000] glasses and know that one of them will contain strychnine, would you drink even one?

      • Nick Harris says

        May 12, 2016 at 5:54 pm

        But nobody is presenting you with 100 glasses, one or more of which is poisoned. It’s a weak metaphor. It’s a real eye opener when something ridiculously skewed is written about the UK on this site and all the folks in the US steam in like it’s all 100% accurate. A lot of It isn’t. The truth is far more nuanced and difficult to get to unfortunately.

        • ECAW says

          May 13, 2016 at 2:13 am

          You don’t explain why it is a weak metaphor. I think it a perfectly good one. I imagine the head of German Intelligence would too…now!

          http://www.dw.com/en/german-intelligence-head-admits-misjudgment-on-islamic-state-strategy/a-19176809

          I am British by the way ( long live favour, civilisation and aluminium)

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 7:07 am

          It’s a weak metaphor because I don’t think people are comparable to glasses of water. As I keep saying, this is a nuanced problem that needs an intelligent, well thought out solution.

          Again, I know there is a big problem….But what is exacerbating it is the knee jerk reactions of the extreme left and extreme right (“They’re all refugees lets save them all” Vs “They’re all terrorists, keep them out!!!”). What isn’t being done enough is the application and enforcement of Western Values in Western countries. We have governments who won’t use the word Islamism on the one hand, and Trump on the other. It’s polarizing the debate and stifling an honest conversation.

        • ECAW says

          May 13, 2016 at 7:52 am

          Nick – You don’t seem to understand what a metaphor is. Do you think the phrase “one bad apple spoils the barrel” is a weak metaphor because people are not comparable to apples?

          Let me make it more literal. Would you invite 100 strangers into your house if you knew that one of them was a burglar?

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 9:02 am

          Analogy would have been a better choice of word than Metaphor.

          But since you ask, yes I do think the expression about one bad apple is also weak and here’s why. In every neighborhood there will be good people, great people, OK people and one or two really quite bad people. Is that neighborhood therefore spoiled?

          As for the question about inviting 100 strangers into my house….I would never do that! What right thinking person would? I would definitely invite 100 people I knew and felt comfortable around to my house though and that decision would be made on my own judgement of their character based on personal experience of getting to know them. Indulging the analogy for the sake of argument, in terms of Syrian refugees this would equate to a thorough vetting procedure of anybody granted asylum and would only extend to woman, children and the elderly & infirm only….No angry Algerian men in their 20’s screaming Allah Akbar! for example.

          You seem to be trying to counter my argument that life is too complex and nuanced to reduce down to a few proverbs and sayings, by responding with more simplistic proverbs and sayings.

    • linnte says

      May 12, 2016 at 2:59 pm

      Nick, look on the net for that video of Khan at a forum for Muslims where the black flag of Islam is flown in the crowd. Also note the index fingers pointing up in a sign of solidarity to Allah. Your opinion just might change.

      All Muslims read the same books and all Muslims listen to the same messages in their Mosque. The message doesn’t change. The words they use to convince non-Muslims that they are on the same moral ground DOES change. It is IN THE QUR’AN that lying to obtain an advantage over non-Muslims is commanded! Not asked or requested, or recommended, but commanded! Read the Qur’an, then read Sharia Law and the Hadith. Find out what your future will be like. And PLEASE do not believe me! Read it for yourself, so there will be no second guessing.

      • Nick Harris says

        May 12, 2016 at 6:08 pm

        “Nick, look on the net for that video of Khan at a forum for Muslims where the black flag of Islam is flown in the crowd. Also note the index fingers pointing up in a sign of solidarity to Allah. Your opinion just might change.

        All Muslims read the same books and all Muslims listen to the same messages in their Mosque. The message doesn’t change. The words they use to convince non-Muslims that they are on the same moral ground DOES change. It is IN THE QUR’AN that lying to obtain an advantage over non-Muslims is commanded! Not asked or requested, or recommended, but commanded! Read the Qur’an, then read Sharia Law and the Hadith. Find out what your future will be like. And PLEASE do not believe me! Read it for yourself, so there will be no second guessing.”

        Thanks, I appreciate what you’re saying. I’m well aware of the things you’re speaking about but you need to ask yourself this…..Are ALL Muslims devout enough followers to be plotting and scheming to bring down our civilisation? I absolutely agree that some are and they need to be caught and stopped. But ultimately that war will be won when they have no credibility and people see them for the knuckle draggers they are.

        Please read this article by Maajid Nawaz…..who knows Sadiq Kahn very well. He speaks of thie things you mention with Sadiq kahn’s platform sharing with dubious characters. It is not an apologists’ piece by any means, Maajid takes a “Wait and see” approach which is also my own view. Link below.

        http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/05/08/the-secret-life-of-sadiq-khan-london-s-first-muslim-mayor.html

        • linnte says

          May 12, 2016 at 9:07 pm

          Thanks Nick. Now, have you read the Qur’an yet? Hadith? No? Well, let’s pretend you are a Muslim. And you go to Friday prayer every Friday. You read the same book I do, follow the same Hadith and Sharia that I do. I live in an area where most people are Muslims, but you live where you are a real minority. Time goes by and soon it’s 15 years later. My community has grown exponentially where yours has stayed basically the same. My new Imam has been going through the whole Qur’an and many are asking questions about some Sura that haven’t really been read in a long time. My new Imam is telling us that we must become more devout and follow the way of Allah closer. Your Imam is still reading and teaching the same peaceful non adversarial Sura for years. You know them by heart and in Arabic even! But now MY Imam who is encouraging greater devotion has been reading Sura 9 and others about what Muhammad expects from his followers. Some of those words sound violent, but it is the word of God after all. ……….. do you see where I am going with this? Many Muslims know those violent verses are in there, but they ignore them. THAT DOESN’T MEAN THEY AREN’T STILL THERE. And there in lies the problem. As long as Sura 9:5 and 9:21 are there(and many many more like them), those words give Muslims the OK to commit what ever they want in the way of Allah.

          There is an obscure Oregon Law that if someone plants vegetation that produces food, like an apple tree, legally that produce will always belong to the person who planted it. No one takes a harvest from a new owner, but I have planted many an apple, pear, and herbs in my day that still produce. I could if I WANTED to, harvest from many different places. It’s the same with Islam.

        • Nick Harris says

          May 12, 2016 at 10:03 pm

          I see what you’re saying, but I don’t think it holds up. The Bible has some choice advice about smiting your neighbour, enslaving people, sacrificing first born sons etc etc. By your logic, Christians and Jews should still be doing this stuff but they don’t because they know it’s from another much darker time when people were more tribal and less civilized. There are still pockets of lunatic fundamentalist Christians who terrorize doctors who carry out abortions and who delight in the idea of homosexuals burning in hell fire for eternity. We both know these people don’t represent the Christian faith on the whole….Why can we not have a more nuanced view about Muslims too?

          I’m not underplaying the danger of Islamism….I worry about it a lot. But casting every Muslim as evil seems to be woefully simplistic. I know I’m probably p*ssing in the wind saying this here and I’m OK with that. Normally I resist the urge to comment because it’s just not worth it but this is a subject close to my heart…I love London, it’s my home town. Although it isn’t perfect, some of the reportage that I’ve seen aired and circulated in the US has been way off. Mr Spencer, much as I respect his courage for speaking out about Islamism and extensive knowledge of Islamic scripture, cannot help himself when the subject of the UK comes up and I think it is compromising the standard of his journalism & also more importantly, the truth.

        • linnte says

          May 13, 2016 at 1:06 am

          It is good that you comment! I don’t think every Muslim is a terrorist either! I don’t hate Muslims! I just hate the doctrine and Ideology. And I love your conviction. For the sake of Great Britain, I hope you are right.

          One last thought for you though. Take an objective look at what the influx of Muslims is doing to Europe. Look at how the Middle East has never really had peace. Ask yourself why. And please read the Qur’an without the help of any Muslims! Don’t ask them questions, just get your own feel for what it says. Promise! ?

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 7:32 am

          Hi linnte

          I’ve read parts of the Qur’an, and read enough about it to know it’s just another old book written before the advent of science full of superstitious nonsense designed to control people through a fear of death and eternal suffering in the afterlife (Sound familiar??). But I know what you’re saying, it’s very geared towards supremacy, compliance through the application of violence and terror and I personally find it abhorrent. But remember…Christians did this once upon a time. I’m not referring to the Crusades by the way….I’m referring to the Spanish explorers and conquistadors for example who did a fair amount of raping pillaging and murder in the name of Jesus in South America.

          I think the best way to defeat such an ideology is to wear our Western values proudly and demonstrate them in a robust manner that cannot be misinterpreted. What does that mean in practice? I think it means humanitarian aid in and around warzones such as Syria. I think it means sharing the burden of sheltering refugees (women, children and elderly *only* though) and taking them exclusively from refugee camps in neighboring countries after they have been vetted thoroughly. Turn back anybody who arrives in Europe through other means.

          It means instant expulsion from the country sheltering you if you break the law or attempt to subvert the culture of that country. It means stopping the building of Saudi funded Mosques and stating clearly that misogyny, homophobia, pedophilia, rape and honor killing have no place in our societies and will be treated like the crimes they actually are.

          To me, Western values involve compassion based on the common human experience, tempered with an uncompromising enforcement of Liberal principles which allow us all to live peaceful lives without fear of persecution or oppression from others. In the case of what is going on in Syria, I think we effectively have to say “Yes, we will help. But in our house it’s our rules”.

        • Wakeup says

          May 13, 2016 at 8:27 am

          Let me be clear I DON’T WANT THEM. We have a Christian/humanitarian duty to help them but for me that is over there not here. Once they are over we will have a very hard time getting them out in time they would be granted citizenship and then we are on course to be taken over. I do not want to visit or live in an islamic country so why should I import it.

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 9:26 am

          Well, if ultimately your argument is “I don’t want them here” then I suggest we end this discussion. That very statement and others like it (“they would be granted citizenship and then we are on course to be taken over” for example) confirms that you have in your own mind a stereotype for all Muslims. You should be aware this is pretty much the definition of bigotry and I’d urge you to consider that a little more. I’m sure you don’t consider yourself to be a bigot, or wish to be one.

          I’m not accusing you by the way….I understand why people feel nervous and apprehensive about Islam as a faith and culture….I share some of those concerns.

        • linnte says

          May 13, 2016 at 3:21 pm

          If all of Europe and Britain did what you suggest, there wouldn’t be a problem, would there? Unfortunately, most Muslims would not tolerate and do not tolerate anything that interferes with Shari’a, and “refugees” have been brought up in Shari’a controlled countries. As it stands the millions of single men ages 16-40 who have “emigrated in the way of Allah” don’t intend to conform to your values. They are an ARMY Nick. They are stronger, more dedicated to their doctrine, and intent on “the way of Allah”. Good luck to you and your friends.

          I see complete refusal of allowing asylum seekers to enter any Western country, the only way of staving off the eminent demise of Europe.

        • Wakeup says

          May 13, 2016 at 7:35 am

          The problem is this the bible is not an instruction manual even the Catholic Church says that we have to obey our concience as a last resort in our decisions. There is also the requirement that a Christian must do the most loving thing in a situation. Admitting large numbers of muslims to the United States would not be the most loving thing at all.

          Anyway back to the subject the key thing for a Christian to focus on is the life and example and teaching of Jesus. It is quite clear the transformative effect of commiting ones life to Jesus God gives us a class demonstration if you like in St Paul he is a totally different person after the road to damascus encounter. I have experienced the same thing in my own life I am not the same person I was before becoming a Christian. I was not a bad guy but I have something immensely strong going on inside me and this is my hope and wish for muslims.

          The problem with islam is that it is what a computer programmer would call a logical operator not open to interpretation if x kill if Y chop hand off that sort of thing, it is a workshop manual for life.

          Our problem in the modern world for Christians is that it has been made more difficult by the PC crowd we are suppressed in communicating our faith. People being fired for wearing crosses ( british airways) getting fired as a carer for tellying an old woman one would pray for her the examples are endless. It is accepted that muslims are compelled to pray five times a day and provision is being made for this in workplaces, how about the Christian requirement to shar our faith Mathew 28 the comission. Sharing ones faith can be as little as just wearing a cross but it should be out there.

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 8:51 am

          I’m an atheist so to me, all religion is mumbo jumbo. But even as an outsider, it seems that everybody here thinks that all Christians behave like Christ (which they blatantly don’t) and all Muslims behave like Mohamed (which they also blatantly don’t).

          Anyway, people believe what they want to believe…..Which is at the root of the problem.

        • ECAW says

          May 13, 2016 at 9:11 am

          I see nothing in the posts here to remotely justify your comment. Indeed, if you are including me in that generalisation, I specifically said the opposite in my last post to you.

          I have to say your insistence on confusing “some” with “all” in most of your posts make me doubtful of being able to hold a rational discussion with you. I have noticed, mostly from reading the Guardian, that it is precisely those who use the word “nuanced” most who are themselves the most absolutist.

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 9:35 am

          Fine, no problem. We tend not to see things as they are so much as see things as *we* are. I’m not going to spend my time going through these comments just to prove a point…Life’s too short and I don’t believe in the afterlife, so….Time is precious for me.

          Catch you later 🙂

        • Angemon says

          May 13, 2016 at 6:46 pm

          Nick Harris posted:

          “it seems that everybody here”

          Weasel words, gross generalization, etc.

          “thinks that all Christians behave like Christ (which they blatantly don’t) and all Muslims behave like Mohamed (which they also blatantly don’t).”

          By now this is beating a dead horse. Christ behaved nothing like mohammad. That some Christians do unchristian things and some muslims live a better life that its scriptures and perfect example of conduct call for means nothing to the crux of the matter. Islam teaches that imitating a thief, rapist, pedophile murderer as clsoely as possible is a good thing. Why should anyone’s default assumption be “well, some Christians don’t practice what Christianity teaches, and some muslims don’t practice what islam teaches, so it all evens out in the end”?

        • Mirren10 says

          May 13, 2016 at 9:55 am

          Interesting conversation between you, linnte and others, with Nick Harris.

          ”I have to say your insistence on confusing “some” with “all” in most of your posts make me doubtful of being able to hold a rational discussion with you. I have noticed, mostly from reading the Guardian, that it is precisely those who use the word “nuanced” most who are themselves the most absolutist.”

          Spot on, ECAW. I’ll bet good money Nick Harris voted for Khan. But he strikes me as a typical Islington luvvie, so when Khan starts to show his true colours, which he will, it won’t affect *him* or his luvvie, gay, guardianista friends; they will be well away from it all.

          No, it’ll be the ‘chavs’ who suffer, and who will be expected to suffer, because they’re bigoted, racist islamophobes, who don’t understand ‘nuance’.

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 10:37 am

          Well Mirran10, let me set the record straight for you.

          Firstly, I voted for the Liberal Democrat candidate in the mayoral elections. I despise the Guardian and consider it now a publication fatally compromised by the regressive leftist politicians and activists who have seized control of the Labour party and drowned out the moderate voices. I think Jeremy Corbyn is a disaster and that Labour have once again fallen on their sword by putting yet another man in charge who is utterly unelectable. I’m from a working class background, I run my own business using skills I taught myself (programming) and nobody has ever given me a hand up in life…I was also adopted and come from what would now be described as a deprived background (there wasn’t really such a thing in the 70s when I grew up).

          I also live in West London, not Islington in the North.

          Doesn’t really tie up with your picture of a “Gay Guardianista luvvie” does it sweetie? I think perhaps I might be a little too Nuanced for your myopic intellect to comprehend after all. Never mind luv, why don’t you go have a lie down and take your Daily Mail with you…..The grown ups are trying to have a little chat.

        • Mirren10 says

          May 13, 2016 at 11:56 am

          ”Well Mirran10, let me set the record straight for you.”

          Well, Nick Harris, let me point out to you that this is the Internet. Anyone can say anything at all about themselves, and there is no way to prove otherwise.

          However, we’ll assume you’re telling the truth about your background, attitudes, voting choices, and choices of news matter.

          ”Firstly, I voted for the Liberal Democrat candidate in the mayoral elections. ”

          The difference in attitude and policy to the hijra presently engulfing Europe and the UK between Labour and the LibDems is very little. Both want to flood our country with third world savages who are inimical to every value we have. The only difference is in the style both use in order to persuade the rest of us, or guilt the rest of us, into acceptance. What is Caroline Pidgeon’s stance on this ? I assume she toes the party line.The Tories are no better.

          ”I’m from a working class background, I run my own business using skills I taught myself (programming) and nobody has ever given me a hand up in life…I was also adopted and come from what would now be described as a deprived background (there wasn’t really such a thing in the 70s when I grew up).”

          Good for you. You’re a Yuppie, not a luvvie. No, seriously, good for you. Which mystifies me all the more as to why you would be so amenable to the idea of letting into this country thousands of third world, illiterate, unskilled savages, who share none of our values, and see the West as a host to feed on. People like Khan, however superficially educated, however shiny the veneer, see islam as a religion for the whole world, to be enforced by whatever means work. The only way I would ever trust someone like Khan, is if he openly apostasised.

          ”I also live in West London, not Islington in the North.”

          I see, Kensington, Harrow, Hammersmith etc, is the heartland of the London working class, is it ? 🙂 But maybe it *is* significantly different from luvvie-land; I’m not a Londoner, so I’ll take your word for it.

          ”Doesn’t really tie up with your picture of a “Gay Guardianista luvvie” does it sweetie?”

          As I pointed out, this is the Internet, you can tell me anything you like, and I can’t prove otherwise.

          ” I think perhaps I might be a little too Nuanced for your myopic intellect to comprehend after all. Never mind luv, why don’t you go have a lie down and take your Daily Mail with you…..The grown ups are trying to have a little chat.”

          You know, I *may* have erred in my description of you as a putative Islington luvvie, but I didn’t insult your intellect, or sneeringly compare you to a silly child out of his depth amongst the ‘grown ups’.

          Scratch a working-class West London yuppie, find a wannabe Islington luvvie … 🙂

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 1:01 pm

          So basically and for the sake of brevity, your argument is:

          This is the internet and all Muslims are backward savages.

          Outstanding!

          Your simplistic world view is revealed by the way you describe swathes of individuals as a single group, for example “Luvvies, Yuppies, Guardianistas, Terrorists, Illiterate, unskilled savages” etc etc etc. Honestly it’s depressing how facile and lazy some people have become. As if trying to get to the truth of this problem with genuine Islamism wasn’t enough, one also has to contend with 2 dimensional ignorant thinking from the opposite side. It amuses me that some here take such issue with the word “Nuance”, given it’s meaning seems to be so utterly lost on them. Please tell me, what social group do you consider yourself to be a member of? And don’t say “Normal” or I will roll my eyes so far back I might fall over.

          So, the London Mayoral election wasn’t about immigration. The Mayor of London has no influence on government policy regarding immigration either, so as such it’s not or at least shouldn’t be a consideration. The more important issue is who will do a better job for all Londoners (which is kind of the job description, clue’s in the name). That is what you should base your decision on. I hope Sadiq Kahn does a good job even though I did not vote for him. I say this because I want him to demonstrate both to disaffected Muslims that it is possible to integrate and be part of UK culture and also to Anti Muslim bigots (I think given your comments on Muslims, that would be you dear) that their world view is woefully binary and just plain wrong. That said, if he messes it up, I’ll be the first to call him out on it. That’s the deal with political office…..We use the instrument of public accountability. I assure you, I’m very protective of my rights and have more to fear from Islamists than you…They like to see if people like me can fly from the top of tall buildings. Sometimes they don’t even give us a sporting chance by tying us to chairs and blindfolding us first. However unlike you, I don’t think all Muslims feel the same way and I’d like their voices to be heard. You see…..Nuanced!

          Anyway Mirren10, it’s been real.

          P.S. So whereabouts exactly is “Luvvie-Land” anyway? I’m having problems finding it on google maps, could you give me an OS reference or a postcode perhaps? Did you assume I’d know because I’m gay? (the only fact about me that you got right by the way, for which there is no Kudos due, I volunteered the information). Or was that just another example of shallow, lazy thinking?

        • Mirren10 says

          May 13, 2016 at 12:19 pm

          You might find this of interest, Nick.

          http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/318555/All-migrants-to-get-a-British-pension

          Are you in, or are you out ?

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 1:31 pm

          I rarely find anything in the Daily Express interesting, given the cesspool of so called journalistic talent it springs from.

          Sadly, this article was no different. Just more fear mongering, doom saying nonsense to make everybody frightened and compliant. That you shared the link wasn’t in the least bit surprising.

        • Mirren10 says

          May 13, 2016 at 3:02 pm

          ”So basically and for the sake of brevity, your argument is:

          This is the internet and all Muslims are backward savages.

          Outstanding!”

          You have some hide to describe my world view as ‘simplistic’, when you reduce what I said to the above silly sneer. 🙂

          I pointed out to you that anyone can describe themselves as anything at all on the Internet, and there is no way to prove the truth or otherwise of what they choose to tell you. Are you saying that isn’t the case ?

          I didn’t say ”all Muslims are backward savages”, as you know very well. But like all your ilk, you would rather set up a strawman than deal with what was actually said; it’s so much easier.

          What I *did* say was that the majority of these mohammedans from third world countries are illiterate, unskilled savages. From Afghanistan, Somalia, et al, who think they can rape European women with impunity, steal, murder, and demand that we bend to them, rather than they obey our laws and mores, who think they are *entitled* to free housing, clothes, education, medical care, food etc, off the backs of those of us who have worked hard all our lives and paid into the pot.

          If you really want to dispute this, I suggest you take a look at some of the articles here. And now the EU is deciding that these people, who have contributed nothing, will be entitled to pensions.

          ”So, the London Mayoral election wasn’t about immigration. The Mayor of London has no influence on government policy regarding immigration either, so as such it’s not or at least shouldn’t be a consideration.”

          And you think *my* world view is ‘simplistic’ ! Oh boy. Khan is a mohammedan. And a devout one, apparently. If you think that won’t influence him, in any way at all, you’re more wet behind the ears than my 3 year old great-niece.

          ” I hope Sadiq Kahn does a good job even though I did not vote for him.”

          Have you wondered exactly who *did* ? And why ?

          I say this because I want him to demonstrate both to disaffected Muslims that it is possible to integrate and be part of UK culture and also to Anti Muslim bigots (I think given your comments on Muslims, that would be you dear) that their world view is woefully binary and just plain wrong.”

          Who are these ‘disaffected muslims’, and why haven’t they already integrated ? What other immigrant minority requires so much mollycoddling and handling with kid gloves ? Only mohammedans. Have you ever wondered why that might be ?

          You can call my views on mohammedans as bigotry all you want, it’s what people like you do, because you refuse to look at facts that don’t suit *your* world view. I am anti-islam, and anti *any* mohammedan who flouts our laws, whines and complains and demands special status, wields the jihad of the pen in favour of sharia, more accommodations for muslims, etc, etc. I don’t call that bigoted, I call it realistic.

          ”That said, if he messes it up, I’ll be the first to call him out on it. That’s the deal with political office…..We use the instrument of public accountability.”

          Once Khan has seeded the offices of the mayoralty with his fellow mohammedans, provided jobs for the boys, and infiltrated mohammedans in all the myriad ways he now has available to him, I doubt that very much. People like you are so terrified of being called a racist, bigoted islamophobe, (and that is *exactly* what they will call you) you will more than likely simply acquiesce, by which time it will be too late. But if you really think you will, the best of luck.

          ”I assure you, I’m very protective of my rights and have more to fear from Islamists than you…They like to see if people like me can fly from the top of tall buildings. Sometimes they don’t even give us a sporting chance by tying us to chairs and blindfolding us first.”

          Yes, this is what will happen to you if the UK is ever unfortunate enough to have a mohammedan majority. But the implementation of sharia will take a while, maybe 30-40 years. Frog, pot, boiling, cooked.

          ”However unlike you, I don’t think all Muslims feel the same way and I’d like their voices to be heard. You see…..Nuanced!”

          Uh-huh. I can hear the vociferous chorus of disapproval of murder of gays from these muslims, throughout the ME. Not. Funnily enough, the only place gays are free to pursue their sexuality/lifestyle in the ME is *Israel*. And yet, there is a group called ”Gays for Palestine”. Of course, if they set foot in Gaza, their lives would be miserable and short. It is to weep.

          ”P.S. So whereabouts exactly is “Luvvie-Land” anyway? I’m having problems finding it on google maps, could you give me an OS reference or a postcode perhaps? Did you assume I’d know because I’m gay?”

          Nope. I assumed, perhaps erroneously, because your tone, choice of words etc, seemed to me to be redolent of too many luvvie, ”I’m so special” types I’ve known. To be honest, nothing you’ve said leads me to think I’m wrong, or at least, not all that wrong.

          From your last post:

          ”Just more fear mongering, doom saying nonsense to make everybody frightened and compliant. That you shared the link wasn’t in the least bit surprising.”

          So, the EU *isn’t* planning to do this ? Are you at all interested in the truth of anything, or will you always prefer your rosy coloured spectacles ?

          ”Anyway Mirren10, it’s been real.”

          Unfortunately, I can’t say the same. People like you live light years away from reality, and it’s a deliberate choice.

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 4:15 pm

          Oh Mirren10 you are indeed the gift that just keeps giving. So I’m going to put some special time aside here to go through your post one point at a time as you have so meticulously done so far. Are you sitting comfortably? Then I’ll begin:

          “You have some hide to describe my world view as ‘simplistic’, when you reduce what I said to the above silly sneer. ?”

          My dear, you started the sneering with your “Gay Guardianista Islington Luvvie” remark. You just picked the wrong person to sneer at and now you’re being schooled on how to do it properly. Suck it up.

          “I pointed out to you that anyone can describe themselves as anything at all on the Internet, and there is no way to prove the truth or otherwise of what they choose to tell you. Are you saying that isn’t the case ?”

          Not at all, you’re absolutely correct. I find it amusing however that you choose this argument with people who you disagree with. Are you equally skeptical when you read something you do agree with? Being a Daily Express reader, I have my doubts.

          “I didn’t say ”all Muslims are backward savages”, as you know very well. But like all your ilk, you would rather set up a strawman than deal with what was actually said; it’s so much easier.

          What I *did* say was that the majority of these mohammedans from third world countries are illiterate, unskilled savages. From Afghanistan, Somalia, et al, who think they can rape European women with impunity, steal, murder, and demand that we bend to them, rather than they obey our laws and mores, who think they are *entitled* to free housing, clothes, education, medical care, food etc, off the backs of those of us who have worked hard all our lives and paid into the pot.”

          Err…You do realize everything you’ve said prior to now is listed above for all to see right? Can you point me specifically to the use of the word “Majority” in anything you wrote before in this thread? Take your time, I’ll be here waiting.

          Actually, let me save us both some time…..You said:

          ( Referring to Liberals and I presume Labpour) “Both want to flood our country with third world savages ”

          and:

          “Which mystifies me all the more as to why you would be so amenable to the idea of letting into this country thousands of third world, illiterate, unskilled savages, who share none of our values, and see the West as a host to feed on.”

          Struggling to see any qualification with the word majority amongst all that bunk Mirren10. But to be honest, using the word Majority hardly redeems your argument.

          And you think *my* world view is ‘simplistic’ ! Oh boy. Khan is a mohammedan. And a devout one, apparently. If you think that won’t influence him, in any way at all, you’re more wet behind the ears than my 3 year old great-niece.

          I have no words for how ridiculous the above is. Sadiq Kahn is a figurehead, not some omnipotent leader able to effect great cultural change on a populous of millions against their will in 4 years. I’m not going to engage with someone who has no idea of the man’s character save for what they read in the Daily Express and UKIP pamphlets. You obviously hate him and there’s no way short of apostatizing himself you would give him a chance, based on his religious background. If you don’t consider this as bigoted…..What does one have to say to be bigoted against Muslims? In your world, is it even possible to be so?

          Have you wondered exactly who *did* [VOTE]? And why ?

          Well, my husband told me he voted for him because he liked his policy on housing and disliked the negative campaign the Tories ran.

          “Who are these ‘disaffected muslims’, and why haven’t they already integrated ? What other immigrant minority requires so much mollycoddling and handling with kid gloves ? Only mohammedans. Have you ever wondered why that might be ?”

          You see, you almost drag me into arguing against you just because your views are so extreme. I agree there is a problem with many Muslim immigrants that we don’t see in other cultures. I agree that some of it relates to a rather backward set of religious beliefs. Where we differ is I think the best way to tackle this is to give mainstream moderate Muslims a chance to do a good job by Western standards. To demonstrate that our way is better and more civilized. To show that man-made law is in fact demonstrably better than some medieval harsh penal code. To provide a template for other Muslims who want to reconcile their heritage and beliefs with life in a modern democracy. But hey, lets do it your way and have loads of aggro instead right? Lets just write off an entire culture and keep up the in/out group mentality and call it “realism” as you do here:

          “You can call my views on mohammedans as bigotry all you want, it’s what people like you do, because you refuse to look at facts that don’t suit *your* world view. I am anti-islam, and anti *any* mohammedan who flouts our laws, whines and complains and demands special status, wields the jihad of the pen in favour of sharia, more accommodations for muslims, etc, etc. I don’t call that bigoted, I call it realistic.”

          Do you know any Muslims? Have you any as friends or work colleagues? Have you read anything of what I’ve written in response to both your own and other people’s posts on here? Please find me one example where I have in any way shown that I’m happy to compromise any of the western values of fairness, equality and secular governance I hold dear? Just search this page for “Harris” and read what I have written. I’m sorry again not to live up to your stereotype of a leftie apologist. You’re reaching now, Mirren10, and it as obvious as it is depressing.

          “Once Khan has seeded the offices of the mayoralty with his fellow mohammedans, provided jobs for the boys, and infiltrated mohammedans in all the myriad ways he now has available to him, I doubt that very much. People like you are so terrified of being called a racist, bigoted islamophobe, (and that is *exactly* what they will call you) you will more than likely simply acquiesce, by which time it will be too late. But if you really think you will, the best of luck.”

          Again, read everything I have written in this set of comments. I have to put up with being called an apologist by your ilk as well as a bigot by regressive leftists when I call out real examples of Islamist activity. I cannot begin to tackle the level of hysteria and paranoia you are obviously going through so I won’t try….Life is too short.

          “Yes, this is what will happen to you if the UK is ever unfortunate enough to have a mohammedan majority. But the implementation of sharia will take a while, maybe 30-40 years. Frog, pot, boiling, cooked.”

          Yes, and here’s the irony…..It feels like as you were typing the above, you were willing it [being thrown off a rooftop] to happen. Beware when fighting monsters you don’t become one….If it isn’t already too late for you that is.

          Uh-huh. I can hear the vociferous chorus of disapproval of murder of gays from these muslims, throughout the ME. Not. Funnily enough, the only place gays are free to pursue their sexuality/lifestyle in the ME is *Israel*. And yet, there is a group called ”Gays for Palestine”. Of course, if they set foot in Gaza, their lives would be miserable and short. It is to weep.

          I must say, much as it pains me to do so….I agree with everything you’ve just said. The ME is awful for LGBT people. As is Uganda in Africa (A Christian nation) where they were narrowly persuaded not to introduce the death penalty for homosexuality and only when the threat of Aid money cancellation loomed. Russia is no better, with awful oppressive laws against gays which equate us to pedophiles and where vigilante groups ensnare gay people through online dating sites and then torture them, whilst filming it and putting it on Youtube. But go ahead and deceive yourself some more if you think it’s just a problem in Islamic countries.

          “Nope. I assumed, perhaps erroneously, because your tone, choice of words etc, seemed to me to be redolent of too many luvvie, ”I’m so special” types I’ve known. To be honest, nothing you’ve said leads me to think I’m wrong, or at least, not all that wrong.”

          Think what you like about me dear, there isn’t a scientific measurement above zero that accurately describes how much I care. I don’t have to explain myself to you and besides which, this is the internet right? I’m probably lying so why bother anyway.

          So, the EU *isn’t* planning to do this ? Are you at all interested in the truth of anything, or will you always prefer your rosy coloured spectacles ?

          I’ll get my facts from reputable & multiple sources and then come to my own conclusions accordingly. I wouldn’t wipe my bum with the Daily Express if the only alternative were sandpaper.

          “Unfortunately, I can’t say the same. People like you live light years away from reality, and it’s a deliberate choice.”

          Aww, don’t be like that 🙂 Give me a hug!

        • Angemon says

          May 13, 2016 at 6:59 pm

          “Do you know any Muslims? Have you any as friends or work colleagues?”

          I was wondering when that canard would show up. Took you your sweet time. “Yeah, go meet a nice muslim, see how friendly they can be, all your doubts will be answered”. Unfortunately, things are a bit more, *ahem*, “nuanced” than that. That some muslims in the West act better than what their religion commands them to doesn’t mean that ALL muslims do that. Especially those in countries like Afghanistan, Pakistan, Nigeria, etc.

        • Mirren10 says

          May 13, 2016 at 4:54 pm

          Neither of us is going to be convinced by anything the other says, obviously. I would only urge you to read the Islamic texts, and spend some time reading the articles in the archives. It’s instructive to see the situation from 9/11 up to the present day.

          Of course, 9/11 wasn’t the start, just the point at which islam impinged on world consciousness.

          It would be pointless to go through your whole post point by point, because as far as I can see, you are so divorced from reality, it’s surreal, and if over 28,000 jihad attacks since 9/11, plus innumerable *thwarted* attacks, plus the articles on JW, plus even the reports of the msm when it can’t avoid it, have failed to make you see sense, nothing I can say will do so. There is none so blind as those who will not see.

          I will cover a couple of points though, in justice myself.

          1. “I pointed out to you that anyone can describe themselves as anything at all on the Internet, and there is no way to prove the truth or otherwise of what they choose to tell you. Are you saying that isn’t the case ?”

          Not at all, you’re absolutely correct. I find it amusing however that you choose this argument with people who you disagree with. Are you equally skeptical when you read something you do agree with? Being a Daily Express reader, I have my doubts”

          You surely must see, unless you’re being deliberately thick headed, that what I said, and what you said, are totally different. Describing oneself on the Internet, whether truthfully or otherwise, has nothing to do with a newspaper article, which can be checked up on. But of course, you know that. Or maybe you don’t.

          2. There is a difference between the word all, and the word majority. I don’t humptydumpty words.

          3. Khan’s religion is intrinsic to who he is. If you can’t grasp that, you know nothing about islam, and no doubt will one day be unpleasantly surprised.

          4. “Yes, this is what will happen to you if the UK is ever unfortunate enough to have a mohammedan majority. But the implementation of sharia will take a while, maybe 30-40 years. Frog, pot, boiling, cooked.”

          Yes, and here’s the irony…..It feels like as you were typing the above, you were willing it [being thrown off a rooftop] to happen. Beware when fighting monsters you don’t become one….If it isn’t already too late for you that is.

          What an utterly vicious thing to say, and completely unfounded by anything I said, ever thought, or would ever wish for. I was pointing out that people like you who think they are immune from sharia, will one day find the opposite to be the case.

          Anyway, enough. This exchange is a waste of time, for both of us.

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 6:47 pm

          Just some brief points.

          At no point before I called you out on it did you say you were referring to “The Majority of Muslims”. You imagined that into your narrative afterwards and even then, the fact you think suggesting that “Only the majority” of Muslims are illiterate savages somehow made it better is mind blowing.

          So best case scenario and giving you the benefit of the doubt, I have the impression therefore you genuinely believe “only” the majority of Muslims want to live in the dark ages and go around acting like barbarians. You certainly seem to suggest this is the case with Sadiq Kahan, simply based on the fact he’s a Muslim or a Mohammedan as you like to more provocatively term him.

          I dare you to google and look up on Youtube the following 4 Muslims and tell me they are anything but brave, intelligent and progressive human beings.

          Maajid Nawaz
          Zuhdi Jasser
          Haras Rafiq
          Usama Hasan

          There is a ton of interview material, videos and such available to watch. These people are trying to reform Islam and you should be applauding them rather than writing them off because doing otherwise would mean you’d have to adjust your world view. These people routinely face death threats and ostracism from Islamists who try and smear them at every turn, and they are saying the uncomfortable things that need to be said about Islam. They are trying to win the hearts and minds of moderate, law Muslims and to counter the victim narrative used by Jihadist movements, who incidentally feed off the idea that all Westerners hate Muslims. What chance have they got if you’ve written them off too?

          And before you even bother to point out this is just 4 people out of 1.6 billion….Osama Bin Laden was just one person, as is Baghdadi, as is Sadiq Kahn. Right now I can almost feel your discomfort at not even being able to use the argument “Yes but they were Muslims”.

          Finally, at no point have I given the impression I consider myself immune from some theoretical UK Sharia law scenario (which won’t happen ever, trust me)…In fact I pointed out to you specifically and quite graphically that I have more to fear from it than most. Yet still you accuse me of being utterly ignorant of its consequences. I can’t help but think you’re reading what I say but just not wanting to process it because it doesn’t fit with what you want to believe about me.

          I wish you no ill. You did annoy me with your initial snarkey comment about being a Gay Guardianista Luvvie and I make no apology for pushing back. I hope you will at least consider some of the points I have raised. If I had billed for my time discussing this with you, I’d have enough for a decent weekend break in a nice European city, I shan’t waste any more of my time or yours.

        • Angemon says

          May 13, 2016 at 7:12 pm

          “I dare you to google and look up on Youtube the following 4 Muslims and tell me they are anything but brave, intelligent and progressive human beings.

          Maajid Nawaz
          Zuhdi Jasser
          Haras Rafiq
          Usama Hasan

          There is a ton of interview material, videos and such available to watch. These people are trying to reform Islam and you should be applauding them ”

          Whoa, “progressiveI” – that’s the magic word, ain’t it? Anyway, ‘ll applaud them once they start preaching in Saudi Arabia, Iran, Pakistan, Turkey, etc. They can preach how wonderful and benign islam is in the comfort of a Western society, where they can count with law enforcement to defend them from their more devout coreligionists, to the 3 or so like-minded muslims and the thousands of useful idiots eager to grab the first so-called “muslim reformer” they see, take a selfie and post it on their social media with a caption like “LOOK AT ME!!!! STICKING UP FOR A PERSECUTED GROUP!!! I’M SUCH A GOOD PERSON” (exact words may differ, but that’s the message in-between the lines 😉 ). However good their intentions may be, I wouldn’t count on them spreading amongst muslims.

          That reminds me, whatever happened to that nice moderate muslim guy who people lined up to take pics with in the late 90’s and early 2000’s? You know, Abdurahman Alamoudi? Bill Clinton’s islamic adviser? Oh, yeah – doing prison time for financing terrorism.

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 7:32 pm

          Gosh Angemon, 3 replies to my comments in such short succession, you are keen. I’m flattered.

          I’m sorry, I’d love to play but it’s 12.30 here in cheery old London town and I’ve waded through enough sewage for one day.

          I bid you goodnight sir.

        • Angemon says

          May 13, 2016 at 8:54 pm

          Nick Harris posted:

          “Gosh Angemon, 3 replies to my comments in such short succession, you are keen. I’m flattered.”

          I read them as as see them – you know, subscribing to the thread and all.

          “I’m sorry, I’d love to play but it’s 12.30 here in cheery old London town and I’ve waded through enough sewage for one day.

          I bid you goodnight sir.”

          *yawn*

          Petty snark as a substitute to actual arguments? Gee, how new and refreshing…

          Anyway, my guess is that you’ll be back soon. Sorting google results can’t take that long, can it? 🙂 Unless, of course, even google can’t help you, in which case you can claim to be non-nonchalant about it.

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 7:43 pm

          Actually, before I go….Here’s a 6 minute clip of Maajid Nawaz debating Islamist and general all round nutcase and bad egg, Anjem Choudhary.

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BrueU4xd2w

          Since you said you’d respect them more if they “preached” in Pakistan, I can reliably inform you that Maajid regularly goes to Pakistan at great risk to his personal safety. He doesn’t “preach” though because he’s not a cleric. He does speak up for secular governance and is vehemently opposed to Jihadism and theocracy….And he knows all about Jihad because he used to be a Jihadi for one of the first extremist Islamist groups in the UK.

          Go on, watch the video, I dare you.

        • Angemon says

          May 13, 2016 at 9:02 pm

          Nick Harris posted:

          “Actually, before I go….”

          You mean, after you go. You went and came back. Took you longer than I thought though – kudos for that, I guess…

          “Here’s a 6 minute clip of Maajid Nawaz debating Islamist and general all round nutcase and bad egg, Anjem Choudhary.”

          A fool debating a nut – that should be enlightening…

          “Since you said you’d respect them more if they “preached” in Pakistan, I can reliably inform you that Maajid regularly goes to Pakistan at great risk to his personal safety. He doesn’t “preach” though because he’s not a cleric.”

          So you’re telling me he doesn’t do what I said I’d respect him for doing. Hmmmm…. Anyway, if he’s not a cleric, how does he expect to “reform” islam? Is he not planning to use the core texts? He might as well start a new religion…

          “He does speak up for secular governance and is vehemently opposed to Jihadism and theocracy….And he knows all about Jihad because he used to be a Jihadi for one of the first extremist Islamist groups in the UK.”

          Is that the same a being a reformer? Because I have the feeling you’re purposely conflating things and muddying the waters.

        • ECAW says

          May 14, 2016 at 4:18 am

          “I have the feeling you’re purposely conflating things and muddying the waters.”

          Nuance…Guardianspeak for “I am about to confuse the issue then claim greater intellectual sophistication”.

          Yes, I know Nick isn’t a Guardian reader, he just talks like one.

        • Mirren10 says

          May 13, 2016 at 7:34 pm

          ”The difference in attitude and policy to the hijra presently engulfing Europe and the UK between Labour and the LibDems is very little. Both want to flood our country with third world savages who are inimical to every value we have.”

          I don’t see either the word ‘all’, or ‘majority’ there.

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 7:59 pm

          Nor do I see the word “Majority”. Just the inference that *all* Muslim migrants must be “third world savages who are inimical to every value we have” since you didn’t specify otherwise.

          But even if I grant you that (which I don’t), you also say this nonsense:

          ” Oh boy. Khan is a mohammedan. And a devout one, apparently. If you think that won’t influence him, in any way at all, you’re more wet behind the ears than my 3 year old great-niece.”

          and this:

          “Once Khan has seeded the offices of the mayoralty with his fellow mohammedans, provided jobs for the boys, and infiltrated mohammedans in all the myriad ways he now has available to him, I doubt that very much.”

          So….There it is again, Muslims are according to you “Not to be trusted” and nefarious. Come on Mirren10, don’t welch out on me now love! Wear your ignorance with pride!

          PS….These Muslims are crafty buggers no? Not only are they backward and illiterate, they are also according to you, infiltrating the highest electoral posts in the land!!!!!!

          PPS. I dare YOU to click the link I posted showing Maajid Nawaz debating Anjem Choudhary.

        • Mirren10 says

          May 13, 2016 at 7:38 pm

          ”I’m sorry, I’d love to play but it’s 12.30 here in cheery old London town and I’ve waded through enough sewage for one day.

          I bid you goodnight sir”

          Brave Sir Robin ran away. 🙂

          https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=monty+python+brave+sir+ran+away&qpvt=monty+python+brave+sir+ran+away&view=detail&mid=815F3A1FBCF6D60BE66F815F3A1FBCF6D60BE66F&rvsmid=43E7E30A743C08BF942E43E7E30A743C08BF942E&fsscr=0&FORM=VDQVAP

        • Nick Harris says

          May 13, 2016 at 8:00 pm

          Oh Mirren10….I thought you were so much better than that!

        • Angemon says

          May 13, 2016 at 8:55 pm

          Indeed 😀

          I would assume that he actually enjoys wadding in “sewage” since no one’s forcing him to come here, but oh well, no big loss 🙂

  32. Angry Citizen says

    May 12, 2016 at 8:42 am

    What is wrong with Trump?

    He stated over and over that he stands by his belief on a Temporary Ban for muslims and now he is wimping out.

    Does Trump not realise the DAMAGE that he is doing to his reputation?

    Trump is slowly turning into another Bitch of islam.

    So what now?

    – He is losing credibility with those who supported him.

    – The Loony Left will never accept him.

    – He has riuned anyone elses chance of a conservative win.

    If he continues appeasing, YOU CAN WELCOME PRESIDENT CLINTON.

    I am not American, but I supported Trump as the Presidency affects the WHOLE world and not just America. After TWO TERMS of obama destroying Christianity and Western Values, the World NEEDS a new leader to repair the DAMAGE created by obama.

    Trump started strong but now I am asking, is Trump for real or is he a fraud?

    • linnte says

      May 12, 2016 at 9:33 am

      My same sentiments! I am deeply disappointed in him, but at least he is showing his colors now instead of after his (potential) Presidency. What a depressing situation the USA is in!

    • common sense says

      May 12, 2016 at 1:42 pm

      I’m American. Trump will win and big he has to get in the big chair first, he often changes his words. He will negotiate for a ban on *refugee* Muslims first. It will be a start. The polls you might be seeing are utterly influenced by the communists against Trump. The numbers for Trump are there and most people know that Clinton= death.

  33. b.c.terry says

    May 12, 2016 at 11:33 am

    “New London Mayor Sadiq Khan Says Islam, Western Values ‘Compatible’

    “What Thursday election showed is that mainstream Islam and western liberal values are compatible. It is possible to be like me Western and Muslim. All of us have multiple identities. I am a Londoner, I am British, I am European, I am a father, I am a husband, I am of Islam faith and Asian origin… No one thing defines who we are,” Sadiq Khan told reporters.”

    Either he hasn’t studied his own scripture, or he’s lying through his teeth when he expects us to buy that bullxhit.

    • ECAW says

      May 12, 2016 at 11:56 am

      Agreed, very much agreed.

      • Annak says

        May 12, 2016 at 3:43 pm

        Me too.
        And with your comments ECAW to naive Nick. Very well put.
        Khan is just a muslim using taqiyya and he knows it works. Mire fool Londobers !
        Apart from that surely most are aware politicians of every stripe say all sorts before election ? Naivety and immaturity seem to be another contagious disease nowadays.

        • Annak says

          May 12, 2016 at 3:44 pm

          Oops here I go again, I must find my reading glasses!
          Correction..’ more fool Londoners ‘

  34. common sense says

    May 12, 2016 at 1:33 pm

    OH no BOY! ONLY YOU and Islam are now less safe. We have suffered enough already and now its coming back to this guy and the false religion. Trump is going to eat this guy alive. Cowardly twerp!
    He does pick up on things quick though I’ll give him that because he realizes by stating this that we are indeed watching and are actively engaged. This so called Mayor will be the fall guy for Islam in the UK. That is his purpose to make Islam look even worse day by day……It’s coming.

  35. Guest says

    May 12, 2016 at 4:20 pm

    I voted for Cruz and the only reason Trump is the nominee is because he bought the media…
    But he was right Islam hates us and we don’t need the Middle East’s rape culture here.

    • Guest says

      May 12, 2016 at 4:21 pm

      So I will vote for him. We need a Republican President and he’s the last one standing.

      • Guest says

        May 12, 2016 at 4:22 pm

        It’s Trump or Clinton. Who will you vote for in November

  36. Nick Harris says

    May 13, 2016 at 10:09 pm

    OK, this is fun so deal me in one more round and then I really have to get some sleep….Angemon, you’re just too hard to resist although I think this will be even easier than Mirren10….you’re snack food :-).

    OK, here goes.

    “You mean, after you go. You went and came back. Took you longer than I thought though – kudos for that, I guess…”

    Pedantry and Snark in one go! Bravo!! I hope that’s not the best you’ve got.

    “A fool debating a nut – that should be enlightening…”

    And was it? Did you even watch the video? Did you listen to a senior Islamist being called out on National TV for his views on killing apostates? Maajid has done the same thing with Stoning adulterers and killing homosexuals to many other prominent Islamists, there are videos and articles documenting this. He is an Islamic scholar who knows the Qur’an very well. Being a former Islamist extremist, he knows the tactics and methodologies of Islamist groups and works tirelessly to call them out on it. And they hate him for it which you should recognize for the valuable asset that it is.

    But no, he’s a Muslim so lets stick to your incisive judgement instead shall we? Which is he…The fool or the nut?

    “So you’re telling me he doesn’t do what I said I’d respect him for doing. Hmmmm…. Anyway, if he’s not a cleric, how does he expect to “reform” islam? Is he not planning to use the core texts? He might as well start a new religion…”

    Maajid recently completed a book called “Islam and the Future of Tolerance” with Sam Harris (renowned atheist and secularist). Maajid’s knowledge of the Qur’an is well above the level of most well educated Muslims and he is fluent in Arabic so also understands the etymology of the Qur’an in its most native state before translation. How’s your Arabic Angemon? Yeah, thought as much :-). Sam Harris doesn’t hold back in his scrutiny of Islam and has said since the experience had opened his eyes to a way for bringing islam into the 21st Century. Of course, just ditching the religious mumbo jumbo would have been preferable but as a pragmatist, reform is still the more realistic goal. So what’s your plan?

    “Is that the same a being a reformer? Because I have the feeling you’re purposely conflating things and muddying the waters.”

    No no sweet cheeks, I don’t need to make this any easier by muddying any waters and besides, I’m in the business of seeing more clearly. Maajid is part of an organization called the Quilliam Foundation. Their reason for being is to challenge and debunk the Jihadist narrative and to promote a reformation within Islam…..So…”I think we got us a reformer! Yeehah!!!”. Saying it like that….Does it make it any easier for you to grasp?

    Anyway, I haven’t had this much fun since I accidentally ripped off a fingernail. I’m under no illusion anything I say will make a difference here and that’s fine. You chaps are doing a fine job of keeping the reputation of this site exactly where it is.

    Congrats.

    • Mirren10 says

      May 14, 2016 at 7:25 am

      Nick Harris says

      May 12, 2016 at 6:51 am

      ”I visit this site regularly because it often reports on stories about Islamist activity that are skipped over by the mainstream media.”

      Now:

      Nick Harris says

      May 13, 2016 at 10:09 pm

      ”Anyway, I haven’t had this much fun since I accidentally ripped off a fingernail. I’m under no illusion anything I say will make a difference here and that’s fine. You chaps are doing a fine job of keeping the reputation of this site exactly where it is.”

      🙂 🙂

      • Angemon says

        May 14, 2016 at 8:32 am

        Nice catch 🙂

    • Angemon says

      May 14, 2016 at 8:31 am

      Nick Harris posted:

      “OK, this is fun so deal me in one more round and then I really have to get some sleep….”

      Whoa, deja vu. Does your legal guardian know you’re up way past your bedtime?

      “Angemon, you’re just too hard to resist ”

      Things your mum said last night. BOOM!

      “although I think this will be even easier than Mirren10….you’re snack food :-).”

      Stroke the shaft, baby, stroke it! Your shaft, that is.

      “Pedantry and Snark in one go! Bravo!! I hope that’s not the best you’ve got.”

      Nah, just stating facts. You said you were gone. You came back shortly after. And afterwards you came back yet again. And you’ll be back again. Your kind always does. It’s like you have a quota to fill or something.

      “And was it? Did you even watch the video? Did you listen to a senior Islamist being called out on National TV for his views on killing apostates?”

      I have seen “islamists” (a distinction without a difference) being called out for their views on local, national and international TV. Never saw one changing their minds because of it. Must have had something to do with them being able to point to their texts and say “this is the law of allah therefore its the right thing”. As the quran says, “you may like something that’s bad for you and dislike something that’s good for you, but you know not while allah knows best”. Which, BTW, is a thing – a while back a muslim cleric in Canada was asked about stonings and death for apostasy and his reply was a hearty laugh and something along the lines of “look, I didn’t make this up. It’s the law of allah”.

      “Maajid has done the same thing with Stoning adulterers and killing homosexuals to many other prominent Islamists, there are videos and articles documenting this. ”

      How many of them changed their minds about it? You’re sounding like a bigot trying too hard to hide his bigotry by exaggerated virtue signal, if not outright tokenism.

      “He is an Islamic scholar who knows the Qur’an very well.”

      Then he should know the futility of what he’s allegedly trying to do. Also, you do realize that there’s more to islam than the quran, right? Muslims who only take the quran into consideration are few and far between because tosing out the sirah and ahadith is akin to apostasy – and we know what the penalty for apostasy is

      “Being a former Islamist extremist, he knows the tactics and methodologies of Islamist groups and works tirelessly to call them out on it.”

      Do you know who is actually a former “islamic” “extremist”? Walid Shoebat. He left islam. Did Did Nawaz apostatize or something? Wait, let me check. Nah, still a muslim. What’s his day job?

      “And they hate him for it which you should recognize for the valuable asset that it is. ”

      Ah, so your “validation” of Nawaz is that “islamist” “extremists” hate him, therefore I should be for him? Boy, there really is one born every minute… Like I said, tokenism – “look, there’s this muslim chap who says he’s against islamists and wants to reform islam. Support him. SUPPORT HIM!!!”.

      “But no, he’s a Muslim so lets stick to your incisive judgement instead shall we?”

      Indeed. If he found the ideas of stoning adulterers, tossing gays from roofs and killing apostates appalling and horrifying, and if he knows islamic scripture as half as well as you claim then why didn’t he leave the faith like others before him?

      “Maajid recently completed a book called “Islam and the Future of Tolerance” with Sam Harris (renowned atheist and secularist). Maajid’s knowledge of the Qur’an is well above the level of most well educated Muslims and he is fluent in Arabic so also understands the etymology of the Qur’an in its most native state before translation.”

      And despite that he was still an “islamist” “extremist”. Forgive me if I don’t feel any more reassured of his good intentions…

      “How’s your Arabic Angemon?”

      I can say “sharmoota”. As in “Nick, you old sharmoota, how you doin’? Still hanging to old tired muslim apologist excuses like that one needs to know arabic to understand islam despite the huge collection of translations and exegeses available in many languages, both in print form and online? You should know that horse is dead, buried and decomposed so beating it will only tire your arm, you old sharmoota”.

      “ Sam Harris doesn’t hold back in his scrutiny of Islam and has said since the experience had opened his eyes to a way for bringing islam into the 21st Century. ”

      Ah, a fool with a mission. Can’t see how that can possibly go wrong… Did he hear voices in his head telling him to do that? Is he also trying to find a way to bring Christianity, or Judaism, or Buddhism, or Scientology into the 21st century?

      “Of course, just ditching the religious mumbo jumbo would have been preferable but as a pragmatist, reform is still the more realistic goal.”

      Islam has been reformed. It’s called “wahabism”, and it’s very mainstream in Saudi Arabia. Also, define realistic.

      “So what’s your plan? ”

      For starters, not place all my eggs in the basket of sketchy taqqyia artists. Or any egg for that matter.

      “ I’m in the business of seeing more clearly.”

      Right, only you are smart enough to see past the ever increasing pile of evidence that says you’re wrong and understand you’re right all along…

      “Maajid is part of an organization called the Quilliam Foundation. Their reason for being is to challenge and debunk the Jihadist narrative and to promote a reformation within Islam…..So…”I think we got us a reformer! Yeehah!!!””

      Be honest: you don’t know what “reformation” is, do you? I’ll chalk that up to being way past your bedtime. Didn’t the Quillian Foundation wrote, when opposing surveillance of muslims by law enforcement:

      Ordinary Muslims are our first line of defence against Islamist terrorism and our allies against extremists.

      It doesn’t seem like they’re not trying to reform anything. It seems like they assume British muslims are “moderate”, or “reformist-minded”, or whatever you’re calling them, when in fact polls in the UK show that while “only” 40% of British muslims state they want sharia law, more than half want homosexuality outlawed and almost 70% want people arrested and prosecuted for “insulting” islam. What are those if not enforcing sharia law? And why is the Quillian Foundation relying on them to “combat” “extremism”?

      “Anyway, I haven’t had this much fun since I accidentally ripped off a fingernail.”

      The difference being that you’re coming here willingly. And way past your bedtime.

      “ I’m under no illusion anything I say will make a difference here and that’s fine. ”

      Said Nawaz in Pakistan. BOOM!!! Probably followed by “I’m just in it for the money and media attention” 😉

      “You chaps are doing a fine job of keeping the reputation of this site exactly where it is.”

      A shining beacon of freedom of though and speech where even third-rate dawah artists like yourself are free to spew their nonsense.

    • Mirren10 says

      May 14, 2016 at 12:55 pm

      Nick Harris says:

      ”You chaps are doing a fine job of keeping the reputation of this site exactly where it is.”

      Thanks, Nick ! 🙂

      https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/04/jihad-watch-9-among-the-top-10-conservative-political-blogs-everyone-should-know-about

      • Angemon says

        May 14, 2016 at 6:29 pm

        🙂 😀 XD

  37. Michael Johnson says

    May 14, 2016 at 6:39 am

    I don’t care for Donald Trump’s ways be he is right concerning Islam

  38. JadedInSanDiego says

    May 20, 2016 at 5:10 pm

    So London’s first Muslim mayor Sadiq Khan states that Islam is compatible with western society? Interesting choice of words, but I’ll defer to the words of another who I will ascribe as having much greater weight. Here’s what this man said- and I will identify the speaker later:

    ” The precept of the koran is, perpetual war against all who deny, that Mahomet is the prophet of God. The vanquished may purchase their lives, by the payment of tribute; the victorious may be appeased by a false and delusive promise of peace; and the faithful follower of the prophet, may submit to the imperious necessities of defeat: but the command to propagate the Moslem creed by the sword is always obligatory, when it can be made effective. The commands of the prophet may be performed alike, by fraud, or by force.”

    The man who spoke these words was President John Quincy Adams, America’s sixth President, and his words have been recorded in a series of essays he wrote in 1830 and recorded for posterity by Joseph Blunt (1830), in The American Annual Register for the Years 1827-8-9 (New York: E. & G.W. Blunt.) It should also be noted that Adams not only had firsthand experience with Mohammedans of his day, but also an extensive personal library as well as a working knowledge of the political history of Islam as it pertained to Europe, Asia, Africa, Asia Minor, and China. Unlike so much of the progressive left in America and Europe today- a progressive left that has bought a bill of goods regarding Mohammed’s religion that is largely half-truths and sheer fabrication- a number of Americas’ Founding Fathers such as Adams saw very succinctly what this religion is all about.

    Islam hasn’t changed one whit in 250 years. The only thing that has changed regarding Islam are people’s perceptions of it- and those perceptions are not based on what is and what has been- but rather what is hoped for the future. Wasn’t it that Santayana guy who said something about those who don’t learn from their mistakes are condemned to repeat them? Well, those mistakes are being repeated now all across Western civilization- and one has to look no further than the willfully ignorant in every Western country who substitute foundational facts for empty emotion and who willfully obfuscate the truth to further their own social and political agendas.

    As for mayor Khan and his London- when I see the thousands of people of his own faith demonstrating on the streets of his city with signs that say “British Police- Go To Hell!” and “British Soldiers- Burn in Hell!”, then I would say that the true follower of Mohammed isn’t quite ready to dance arm-in-arm with the Kafir across the world stage singing “Kumbayah” any time soon.

  39. JadedInSanDiego says

    May 24, 2016 at 4:08 pm

    The supposedly educated and intelligent people of the west are now chiming in with the Muslim population across the globe with the same mantra: “the vast, overwhelming majority of Muslims across the globe are peaceful and are not radicalized extremists.”

    It is also true that the vast, overwhelming majority of Germans in Hitler’s Germany were peaceful and were not members of the Nazi Party.

    So how’d that work out?

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