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Exposing the role that Islamic jihad theology and ideology play in the modern global conflicts

Pope Francis might jettison idea of a ‘just war’

May 30, 2016 3:15 pm By Robert Spencer

That would remove one of the West’s key philosophical foundations and leave Catholics no alternative but to surrender to the advancing jihad. But with the monuments of Catholic Europe in ruins and the Church subjugated and enslaved, as the jihadi’s blade slices through his neck Pope Francis can congratulate himself that he was never, ever “Islamophobic,” and that he and his bishops made sure that those within their purview who spoke honestly about the jihad threat were duly silenced.

The Pope has forgotten, if he ever knew, that (as Winston Churchill put it) “we sleep safely at night because rough men stand ready to visit violence on those who would harm us.”

“Leave them; they are blind guides. And if a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit.” (Matthew 15:14)

FrancisdovesFrancisdovecrow

“Pope Francis might jettison idea of a ‘just war,’” by Maria J. Stephan, Associated Press, May 26, 2016 (thanks to David):

Developed in the fifth century A.D. by St. Augustine, the doctrine of a “just war” empowers rulers to wage war only as a last resort to confront grave wrongs. As Augustine wrote: “Peace should be the object of your desire; war should be waged only as a necessity.”

Later, the Summa Theologica, written by St. Thomas Aquinas in the 1260s and 1270s, clarified that war could only be waged by a properly instituted authority like the state, that it could not occur for purposes of self-gain, and that attaining peace must be its central aim.

Though the Catholic Church’s “just war” doctrine has been modified over the centuries – accounting for things like new technologies and the changing nature of warfare – its basic principles remain the same.

As the 1992 Catechism of the Catholic Church describes, in order for the Church to sanction engaging in a war, “the damage inflicted by the aggressor on the nation or community of nations must be lasting, grave, and certain; all other means of putting an end to [the conflict] must have been shown to be impractical or ineffective; there must be serious prospects of success; [and] the use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated.”

But it seems that Pope Francis – who is by all accounts a progressive thinker, unafraid to challenge old Church doctrines – might welcome a debate over the church’s foundational tenets on war and peace.

“Faith and violence are incompatible,” he repeated in a 2013 mass prayer gathering at the Vatican. Like his predecessors of the past 50 years, he has called for the abolition of war. But this pontiff has gone one step further in pressing for nonviolent alternatives.

In his letter to a recent Rome conference, he exhorted participants to revitalize the tools of “active nonviolence.” It was a call, in other words, to challenge the idea of “just war” and to propose an alternative paradigm.

The concept of “just peace” is not new. It first emerged in the United States in the mid-1980s, when an interdenominational group of Christian scholars advanced alternatives to war that culminated in a just-peace framework.

It included practices like supporting nonviolent direct action; cooperative conflict resolution; advancing democracy, human rights, and religious liberty; fostering just and sustainable economic development; and encouraging grassroots peacemaking groups and voluntary associations.

The inter-religious dialogue expanded to include Jewish and Islamic traditions, focusing on the scriptural and practical meanings of “just peace” in the three Abrahamic traditions. The scholarly dialogue resulted in the creation of an Abrahamic framing of an interfaith just-peacemaking paradigm that was later published in book form….

Yes, and just look at how that has stopped the jihad.

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Comments

  1. John Galt III says

    May 30, 2016 at 3:28 pm

    Pope lectures us about Christianity. Now go back to molesting children, Francis.

    “Faith and violence are incompatible.”

    Really? Pick up a bible, Argentine Fascist apologist Francis, and read it.

    John 2:15

    So he (Jesus Christ) made a whip out of cords, and drove all from the temple courts, both sheep and cattle; he scattered the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables.

    In the Old Testament some tribe was exterminating another tribe every 2 or 3 pages.

    • Angemon says

      May 30, 2016 at 3:50 pm

      John Galt III posted:

      ““Faith and violence are incompatible.”

      Really? Pick up a bible, Argentine Fascist apologist Francis, and read it.

      John 2:15

      So he (Jesus Christ) made a whip out of cords, and drove all from the temple courts, both sheep and cattle; he scattered the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables.”

      Indeed. That was also the first example that popped into my mind upon reading the words of the usurper.

      • John Stefan says

        May 31, 2016 at 8:49 pm

        Faith and also righteous anger are very compatible. Because many in our country have lost faith in Jesus and His promises, they also have lost to a large degree righteous anger and righteous killing. There is great evil that the world including Islamists is doing but instead of being angry about it, the people rejoice and dance. Because the Muslims have no faith at all in the true God and in His promises, they rejoiced and danced at the fall of the twin towers and 3000 perished and their relatives and friends cried in shock. There is righteous anger and righteous killing (capital punishment, Romans 13) and there is righteous war.

        • harbidoll says

          Jun 1, 2016 at 1:59 am

          I dont believe in “righteous anger” cuz No man is righteous & anger belongs to G-d only. We need cool heads & cold judgments. The pope doesnt want to be beheaded like the Arch Bishop of Constantine on May 27 567! I think he is following the prophet Jeremiah story–“surrender & you will live”. Of course each nation must follow their own path! G-d said “count the cost- if the enemy’s army is too big, rush out to make peace”. I dont know what G-d is telling Our leaders!

      • Sandra Lee Smith says

        Jun 1, 2016 at 1:40 am

        Mine as well, or Yhwh’s actions against Egypt when Pharaoh refused to heed Moses. Then there was Sodom and Gomorrah, or perhaps Noah’s flood. All of those incorporated violence. And there are many more examples throughout the Bible where God directed violence to occur.

        • daniel sebold says

          Jun 1, 2016 at 1:51 am

          No problem. Give Sandra her gun. It’s her turn.

        • Jay Boo says

          Jun 1, 2016 at 2:21 am

          daniel
          A minor point about “The Example”

          If more Muslims would only read about the life of their “prophet” with an objective understanding they would be so ashamed to be called a Muslim that they would abandon all religion in disgust of the behavior of Islam’s lecherous child rapist and keeper of personal sex slaves.

    • Alexius Comnenus says

      May 30, 2016 at 6:21 pm

      Amen. Look at the picture showing the Pope hugging that muslim Egyptian imam: the Pope is initiating the hug and the Muslim stands unmoved. That picture shows us who this Pope really and the Muslim scholar do not give any respect to this Pope. Islam is not a ‘religion’ of peace. Everyone knows. The idiots and the political morons are selling their onw nations in order to maintain their rotten governments.
      Pope Francis is compromising the Catholic Faith and forgotten the words of the great Saints and scholars in regard to Islam.

      • Truth 101 says

        May 30, 2016 at 11:05 pm

        Alexius,

        I know you said the other day that you’re a Catholic clergyman (deacon?). Do you really think Just War Doctrine is going to be scrapped? I think that’s unlikely.

        But, yes, Francis is a confused, unwise man.

        Oh, let me say that I am sorry about the loss of your empire.

        • Bishop Guy-Julian says

          May 31, 2016 at 7:08 am

          What is more “Just” than defeating and evil ideology like “Islam”? “Dialogue” doesn’t work either. It is a stupid inward looking exclusivist “cult”.. As a Bishop in the Independent Old Catholic Movement, I find the Pope an absolute embarrassment. The cult is Satanic. It is not even “Abrhamic” but a mish-mash of ridiculous laws and so called “perfection” of their “prophet”. None of this convoluted tripe stands up to close exegesis and no theologian I know will take it as credible. And as for prosecuting those of us who detest it because the Ummah might be offended? It offends me and most of my fellows.

        • blitz2b says

          May 31, 2016 at 10:49 am

          Blunderous Bergoglio gives a new meaning to the term “infallibility of the Pope”…

        • Larry A. Singleton says

          Jun 1, 2016 at 12:02 am

          TO THOSE WHO SAY AS CHRISTIANS WE SHOULDN’T SUPPORT DONALD TRUMP! Highways and Hedges Ministries’s video.
          https://www.facebook.com/evangelistandrewgreen/videos/1018406378242009/

          “Why is the Pope Provoking War in Israel?” by Brad MacDonald. (The Philidelphia Trumpet)
          https://www.thetrumpet.com/article/12623.2.0.0/why-is-the-pope-provoking-war-in-israel
          Print: https://www.thetrumpet.com/article/12623.2.0.0/why-is-the-pope-provoking-war-in-israel?print

          The Dark Side of the Pope’s Visit to Jerusalem by Gerald Flurry (The Philidelphia Trumpet)
          https://www.thetrumpet.com/article/11869.24.166.0/middle-east/israel/the-dark-side-of-the-popes-visit-to-jerusalem?preview

          Catholic Aid Societies and Political Campaigns Directed at Israel (NGO Monitor—Executive Summery)
          http://www.ngo-monitor.org/article/catholic_aid_societies_and_political_campaigns_directed_at_israel_0

          Complaint says crosses at Catholic school offensive, prevent Muslim prayers (Beliefnet News)
          http://www.beliefnet.com/columnists/news/2011/10/lawsuit-says-crosses-at-catholic-university-offensive-prevent-muslim-prayers.php
          “Crosses in every room at Washingon D.C.’s Catholic University of America are a human rights violation that prevent Muslim students from praying.”

          Pope Calls “Palestinian” Leader Abbas an “Angel of Peace”
          http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2015/05/16/pope-calls-palestinian-leader-angel-of-peace/
          Pope Francis praised Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas as an “angel of peace” during a meeting Saturday at the Vatican that underscored the Holy See’s warm relations with the Palestinians.

          United Church of Christ and The “Big Lie” by Susan Warner
          http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5862/united-church-of-christ

          “The Christian Aid Conference on Peace and Justice in the Holy Land” by Denis MacEoin (Gatestone Institute) (See “Wafa al-Biss”)
          I would STRONGLY urge you to first read the Appendix at the end of the article: “From a letter to an anti-Israel activist, to be published in 2013”
          http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/3529/christian-aid-conference-holy-land

          NGO Monitor: The Role of Antisemtism in the Presbyterian Church (USA)’s Dcision to Support Divestment.

      • Spot On says

        May 31, 2016 at 9:48 am

        Pope Francis has completely capitulated to the barbaric Islamic European invaders. He has even asked them for forgiveness. For whatever reason, he sold out Christianity to Islam which would include the Pope’s acceptance of child perversion, debauchery, and slavery. Most likely it was his Marxist-Communist roots that distorted his sense of history and morality. All European political barriers to the Islamic invaders are now being systematically dismantled to ready the European population (and the Vatican) for the complete Islamic rape of Europe.

        Many in Europe are now fleeing to Hungary and other Eastern Block countries to protect their families. These eastern countries mostly still have their political (and physical) barriers in place to this Islamic military menace.

    • Myrtle Linder says

      May 31, 2016 at 11:12 am

      We do not, we cannot stand and watch evil spread and do nothing, this is the same as joining with the growth, we are assisting them.

      STAND AND BE COUNTED FOR JESUS CHRIST AND GOD, EVEN IF WE ARE PERSECUTED AND WE WILL BE, IF WE DARE!!!

      • Sandra Lee Smith says

        Jun 1, 2016 at 1:44 am

        Spot on, Myrtle! Yes we will be persecuted and possibly even prosecuted or worse, but we muststand against the evil madness possessing the world!

  2. CrossWare says

    May 30, 2016 at 3:32 pm

    It seems like this dude was right about Pope Francis. He will destroy the Catholic church:
    http://www.irishcentral.com/roots/history/st-malachy-predicted-pope-benedicts-successor-will-be-last-pope-190715001-237789421.html

    • gravenimage says

      May 31, 2016 at 4:01 pm

      The “St. Malachy prophecies” of the 12th-century saint were “discovered” in 1590, and are almost certainly fakes. Soothsaying was undergoing a vogue at the time; this is the same general period in which Nostradamus worked.

      Not surprisingly, the “prophecies” about the papacy are spot on until about, well, the last decade of the 16th-century–after that, they become pretty vague.

      It is quite possible to be critical of the actions of this witless pontiff without resorting to historical frauds for support.

      • Wellington says

        May 31, 2016 at 8:58 pm

        Eminently agree with you here, gravenimage. Unfortunately, there are those who post regularly here at JW who buy into this St. Malachy nonsense. Those who do so unwittingly discredit the anti-jihad cause because inaccuracy and looneyness in one area raises the understandable suspicion that one is looney in sundry other areas as well.

        I do wish this St. Malachy rot could be buried once and for all. But it won’t be because many never learn and are quite beholden to prejudices, false claims and superstitions in spite of massive evidence to the contrary.

        • gravenimage says

          May 31, 2016 at 10:24 pm

          Of course, fakes like the St. Malachy “prophecies” are positively benign compared to harmful abominations like “The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion”–but they are still a distraction.

          Wellington, I’m sure a lot of good people are unaware that they are fakes. I just like to point it out when I run across references to it.

        • Mark Swan says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 7:45 am

          Hopefully what You two, and others post on rebutting nonesense, will help put it to rest.

    • Sandra Lee Smith says

      Jun 1, 2016 at 1:49 am

      Yes, I believe the geopolitical situation is such that Malachy was correct, as was the vision of Pius X of a pop fleeing his ruined, inflames vatican over the bodies of his priests, and that this will be that pope also. Further, based on his actions and words regarding Islam and other religious systems, I hold him as a prime candidate for the false prophet leader of the 1world religion, “mystery Babylon”.

      • Champ says

        Jun 1, 2016 at 2:22 am

        Indeed, Sandra Lee. Many prophecy pundits have set their sights on ‘him’ as the false prophet, but time will certainly tell. Regardless, God has everything under control and will reveal these things at the appointed time. Take care! 🙂

  3. jihad3tracker says

    May 30, 2016 at 3:32 pm

    TURN THE “JUST WAR” DOCTRINE AROUND 180 DEGREES AND —- PRESTO CHANGEO ! ! ! —- WE HAVE JIHAD.

    • gravenimage says

      May 31, 2016 at 4:02 pm

      Yup.

      • ECAW says

        May 31, 2016 at 4:32 pm

        Just out of interest, here is a comparison, more of an equation really, of the Christian “just war” ethic and what the Koran has to say about war by a military scholar and convert to the foul creed, Joel Hayward:

        http://www.islamandwar.com/

        A couple of things struck me. Firstly that he went nowhere in the Islamic tradition beyond the Koran which made it easier to support his thesis. Secondly he employs a great deal of special pleading to make Allah look like a gentleman, for instance elsewhere he wrote that the line about smiting necks and cutting off fingertips just showed Allah/Mo’s compassion since they were the most humane ways to respectively kill and disable.

        • gravenimage says

          May 31, 2016 at 10:30 pm

          Thanks for that, ECAW.

          The idea that the Islamic concept of just war–which includes robbery, enslavement, and wholesale slaughter–bears any resemblance to that of civilized people is of course absurd.

  4. FuturePresident. says

    May 30, 2016 at 3:35 pm

    ‘Just?’ Don’t talk to me about just? Was 9/11 just? Was Brussels just? Arehonor killings and sharia just?

  5. Georg says

    May 30, 2016 at 3:41 pm

    “Faith and violence are incompatible,” he repeated…

    Well, somebody seems to understand IS. Maybe he ought to jettison idea of eating as it invariably deprives something else. And something else is always more important than we are, after all.

  6. Angemon says

    May 30, 2016 at 3:41 pm

    But it seems that Pope Francis – who is by all accounts a progressive thinker, unafraid to challenge old Church doctrines

    Or its core tenets.

    “Faith and violence are incompatible,” he repeated in a 2013 mass prayer gathering at the Vatican.

    Well, I guess we know where Holier-Than-Thou-Not-Bernie-Sanders over here would stand if he saw Christ driving the moneylenders out of the temple… and it would not be with Christ.

  7. Edward says

    May 30, 2016 at 4:18 pm

    The concept of “just peace”:

    “Yes and just look at how that has stopped the jihad.”

    Jorge: He [now] is trashing the VIRTUE of COURAGE!!!!

    —————————

    The right to defend ourselves!

    The “just peace sequel: Has the Pope Abandoned Europe to Islam?

    https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/05/has-the-pope-abandoned-europe-to-islam
    Edward says
    May 28, 2016 at 9:23 am

    Has the Pope Abandoned Europe to Islam?
    I feel sad that Pope Francis has to bow to those that want to harm him out of FEAR. That he has no faith, of what is promised in the scriptures that he professes. He is definitely setting the wrong examples to those that are affirmed believers of God’s WORD now! If he continues this trend he will be causing many to stray away from the Catholic FAITH!

    As God’s children we are promised what is written in these biblical passages:
    Psalm 91- Full Trust in God Ephesians 6:10-18 God’s Suit of Armor
    Ending: He is trashing the VIRTUE of COURAGE!!!!

  8. Mark Spahn (West Seneca, NY) says

    May 30, 2016 at 4:27 pm

    Synchronicity! Just yesterday I found on the new-books shelves of the local public library a book titled “Pope Francis: The Last Pope? Money, Masons [yay!] and Occultism in the Decline of the Catholic Church” by one Leo Lyon Zagami, who, the foreword points out, is also author of “Confessions of an Illuminati”.

    Hey. Isn’t the singular of “Illuminati” called an Illuminatus? And don’t they have a women’s auxiliary called the Illuminatae? The foreword refers to Bishop Malachy’s “Prophecy of the Popes” and intimates that Francis I could be the last pope, or an Antipope. Looks like an interesting book.

    • WorkingClassPost says

      May 30, 2016 at 4:47 pm

      Definitely sounds better than the twaddle of non-violent resistance that the Pope’s fanclub espouse.

    • Mockingjay says

      May 30, 2016 at 6:43 pm

      Read about it too, this Bishop Malachy’s “Prophecy of the Popes”, but it is quite probably a fraud actually.
      It is true that according to the list, Pope Francis is the 112th Pope – the last one – and symbolically described as “Peter of Rome” (which I hope won’t mean he’ll be crucified in Rome…).

      • gravenimage says

        May 31, 2016 at 4:33 pm

        Yes–almost certainly a fraud.

  9. WorkingClassPost says

    May 30, 2016 at 4:27 pm

    Is the author of this the same Maria J Stephan who writes about the effectiveness of civil resistance in fighting IS?

    http://www.defenseone.com/ideas/2014/06/how-nonviolent-action-could-thwart-isils-advance-iraq/87478/?oref=d-river

  10. Westman says

    May 30, 2016 at 4:55 pm

    It seems to take only two generations of peace in the homeland to forget that avoiding defensive war is impossible. Too many forget quickly that the basic motivator of humans is competition which will always lead to conflict and war. There is always a new enemy developing.

    When the attack in the homeland comes, such pacifist notions convert to survival; the pacifists are discreditied, peace on our time becomes survival in our time, the machines of war rumble to life, the hedonism ebbs, a killing beyond any former ensues, and even vegetarians will eat meat-infused MRE meals – if that means living.

    This well-meaning Pope is as out of resonance with current conditions as was Neville Chamerlain in his. No nation has been without war whether “just” or not. God does not come down with destroying angels to defend any nation, and certainly didn’t save Rome from Mussolini.

    In the sphere of war, we are on our own; defend your nation or lose it.

    • gravenimage says

      May 31, 2016 at 4:37 pm

      I hope so, Westman–but such intelligent defense is not automatic. Many others have rolled over for Islam (I am not including those who fought valiantly and lost). We have to make sure we are not the next to do so.

      The utterings of this witless pope are no help here.

  11. Kepha says

    May 30, 2016 at 4:59 pm

    I don’t know how many of us here are Evangelicals. However, to those of us who are, I would urge us that after four generations of liberal pseudo-Protestantism and now Pope Georgie who would unilaterally disarm the West, the time has come for us to stand up and be the adult in the room.

    We’ll have to start at the bottom, where we are. Rebuild our families. Nurture churches that preach the Gospel. No matter how much people scorn us, be those whom others can trust. Trash the Norman Vincent Peale and Joel Osteen and dust off the Bible and John Calvin, Think., Write. Create.Build our own media, and let the MSM go under.

    Perhaps we are discouraged with the secular left on one side and Islam on the right, but it is Jesus Christ who rose from the dead on the third day, not Karl Marx or Muhammad ibn Abdallah ibn Whoever.

    • Mo says

      May 30, 2016 at 5:11 pm

      @ Kepha

      Well said!

      The frustrating part is that I see very few Evangelical / Protestant churches of any sort even remotely involved in the issue of counter-jihad. The accepted attitude seems to be that such things are matters for “out there” and do not concern us.

      That’s not only ridiculous, it is anti-biblical. The early followers of Jesus turned their world upside down because they would not be like the rest of the people around them and bow down to the rulers of their day! (When they were pressured to do something unbiblical, like worship a mere man. Of course we are to be generally law abiding, decent citizens.)

    • Champ says

      May 30, 2016 at 5:14 pm

      Great comment, Kepha …

      “Trash the Norman Vincent Peale and Joel Osteen and dust off the Bible and John Calvin, Think., Write. Create.Build our own media, and let the MSM go under.”

      And I love this idea!

    • Jay Boo says

      May 30, 2016 at 11:03 pm

      How does Joel Osteen ever manage to keep that continuous smile.
      It must be Botox injections.
      Need to inject him with a shot or two of John Hagee to soften those smile lines.

      • Jerry says

        May 31, 2016 at 7:51 am

        It ain’t the Botox, it’s all the millions he’s made with his false promises about god, the god that may not even exist. What a racket.

        • Champ says

          May 31, 2016 at 8:57 pm

          Jerry wrote:

          ” …the god that may not even exist.”

          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

          “May” not exist? …instead of DOES not exist? Hey I’ll take that as a hopeful sign that you’re making progress, Jerry! 😉

    • Jay Boo says

      May 30, 2016 at 11:13 pm

      John Hagee – “ISLAM is Out to Kill All Non Muslims”

      • Champ says

        May 31, 2016 at 8:53 pm

        Jay Boo, thank you for providing this video excerpt of John Hagee speaking the unvarnished truth about islam & company–a rare find from a televangelist!

      • gravenimage says

        Jun 1, 2016 at 6:42 pm

        Good stuff.

        • ECAW says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 3:18 am

          Islam is not out to kill all non-Muslims…obviously. Who would pay the jizya?

        • Sandra Lee Smith says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 4:51 pm

          They may not have figured that out yet; forward -thinking doesn’t seem to be their strong suit, and when a rare one does manage to, somebody comes along and kills him, or tries to. Hope Al Sisi is watching his back well, because it has that target on it already. Sadat was the last example….

  12. David says

    May 30, 2016 at 5:20 pm

    So if someone breaks into my house to kill my family – I do nothing?

    I’m very tired of analyzing everything this Pope says, and I don’t need to. We do not live in a “Magisterium of the now” nor do Catholics take everything a Pope says as infallible. There are solemn conditions for papal infallibility, and speaking off-the-cuff on an airplane certainly does not qualify.

    • Gea says

      May 31, 2016 at 7:50 am

      I was always suspicious of men in dresses, be it ayatollahs and oil sheikhs or priests and Pope. I did not like this Argentinian Pope from the very beginning, as he was mum when Argentinian military were murdering people, just as Pope during WWII was mum about Nazis murdering Jews, but helped Nazis escape justice after WWII (to Argentina and Middle east to work for Muslims)…

      Catholic hierarchy should replace this Pope as he is also a traitor of the Western civilization.just as Obama and Angela Merkel. There must be some cardinal who is intelligent and not corrupt to become a Pope….Catholics around the world should stage mass protests against this traitor of the Christianity Pope.

  13. Barbara says

    May 30, 2016 at 5:32 pm

    I really wished people would stop releasing these poor white doves willy-nilly and without care for animal welfare. They end up as a snack for all manners of predators. Kind of like a euphemism for the indoctrinated West and predatory invasive new arrivals. Great site Robert. Particularly enjoyed your chat with the Gadfather.

    • gravenimage says

      Jun 1, 2016 at 7:08 pm

      Yes–this symbolism wound up much grimmer than was intended.

  14. Wellington says

    May 30, 2016 at 5:48 pm

    Increasingly I’m inclined to think Francis is to Catholicism what Obama has been to America, i.e., a travesty.

    • Mark Swan says

      May 31, 2016 at 2:49 am

      It sure seems that way.

    • Gea says

      May 31, 2016 at 7:48 am

      I was always suspicious of men in dresses, be it ayatollahs and oil sheikhs or priests and Pope. I did not like this Argentinian Pope from the very beginning, as he was mum when Argentinian military were murdering people, just as Pope during WWII was mum about Nazis murdering Jews, but helped Nazis escape justice after WWII (to Argentina and Middle east to work for Muslims)…

      Catholic hierarchy should replace this Pope as he is also a traitor of the Western civilization.just as Obama and Angela Merkel. There must be some cardinal who is intelligent and not corrupt to become a Pope….Catholics around the world should stage mass protests against this traitor of the Christianity Pope.

      • Wellington says

        May 31, 2016 at 1:00 pm

        Pope Pius XII working quietly behind the scenes saved some 800,000 Jews and many non-Jews during WWII. Also, it is not true he was mum. For instance, his Christmas message of 1942 was a very thinly veiled harsh criticism of Nazism which infuriated Hitler, but much of the time he kept quiet and saved lives because he knew that speaking out against Nazism regularly would be counter-productive. In this he was backed by leading Jews at the time..

        Almost no major twentieth-century figure has been more distorted than has that of Pius XII. When he died in 1958 he was lauded by the worldwide Jewish community, then deceitful revisionism began in the early 1960s with Rolf Hochhuth’s play The Deputy and continued into the Nineties. Fortunately, a revisionism of the revisionism began around 2000 and it has made much headway in restoring praise for what Pius so adeptly and humanely did.

        • gravenimage says

          May 31, 2016 at 5:00 pm

          Smart stuff.Very true, Wellington. Excellent post.

      • Constance says

        May 31, 2016 at 1:36 pm

        I quote the following excerpts from Jimmy Akin, How Pope Pius XII Protected Jews on Catholic Answers in defence of Pope Pius XII against your false accusations:

        One is tempted simply to dismiss these accusations, so wildly out of touch with reality, as the deluded ravings of persons with no sense of historical truth. This would underestimate the power of such erroneous charges to influence people: Many take these writers at their word.

        Stepping out of the nightmare fantasyland of Hunt and Chick and back into sunlight of the real world, we discover that, not only was Pius XII no friend of the Nazis, but that his opposition to them began years before the War, before he was elected to the papacy, when he was still Cardinal Eugenio Pacelli, the Vatican Secretary of State.

        On April 28, 1935, four years before the War even started, Pacelli gave a speech that aroused the attention of the world press. Speaking to an audience of 250,000 pilgrims in Lourdes, France, the future Pius XII stated that the Nazis “are in reality only miserable plagiarists who dress up old errors with new tinsel. It does not make any difference whether they flock to the banners of social revolution, whether they are guided by a false concept of the world and of life, or whether they are possessed by the superstition of a race and blood cult.”[3] It was talks like this, in addition to private remarks and numerous notes of protest that Pacelli sent to Berlin in his capacity as Vatican Secretary of State, that earned him a reputation as an enemy of the Nazi party.

        The Germans were likewise displeased with the reigning pontiff, Pius XI, who showed himself to be a unrelenting opponent of the new German “ideals”—even writing an entire encyclical, Mit Brennender Sorge (1937), to condemn them. When Pius XI died in 1939, the Nazis abhorred the prospect that Pacelli might be elected his successor.

        Dr. Joseph Lichten, a Polish Jew who served as a diplomat and later an official of the Jewish Anti-Defamation League of B’nai B’rith, writes: “Pacelli had obviously established his position clearly, for the Fascist governments of both Italy and Germany spoke out vigorously against the possibility of his election to succeed Pius XI in March of 1939, though the cardinal secretary of state had served as papal nuncio in Germany from 1917 to 1929. . . . The day after his election, the Berlin Morgenpost said: ‘The election of cardinal Pacelli is not accepted with favor in Germany because he was always opposed to Nazism and practically determined the policies of the Vatican under his predecessor.’ “[4]

        Former Israeli diplomat and now Orthodox Jewish Rabbi Pinchas Lapide states that Pius XI “had good reason to make Pacelli the architect of his anti-Nazi policy. Of the forty-four speeches which the Nuncio Pacelli had made on German soil between 1917 and 1929, at least forty contained attacks on Nazism or condemnations of Hitler’s doctrines. . . . Pacelli, who never met the Führer, called it ‘neo-Paganism.’ “[5]

        A few weeks after Pacelli was elected pope, the German Reich’s Chief Security Service issued a then-secret report on the new Pope. Rabbi Lapide provides an excerpt:

        “Pacelli has already made himself prominent by his attacks on National Socialism during his tenure as Cardinal Secretary of State, a fact which earned him the hearty approval of the Democratic States during the papal elections. . . . How much Pacelli is celebrated as an ally of the Democracies is especially emphasized in the French Press.”[6]

        Pius XII also took a public stance concerning the Jews of Italy: “The Pope spoke out strongly in their defense with the first mass arrests of Jews in 1943, and L’Osservatore Romano carried an article protesting the internment of Jews and the confiscation of their property. The Fascist press came to call the Vatican paper ‘a mouthpiece of the Jews.’ “[13]

        Prior to the Nazi invasion, the Pope had been working hard to get Jews out of Italy by emigration; he now was forced to turn his attention to finding them hiding places. “The Pope sent out the order that religious buildings were to give refuge to Jews, even at the price of great personal sacrifice on the part of their occupants; he released monasteries and convents from the cloister rule forbidding entry into these religious houses to all but a few specified outsiders, so that they could be used as hiding places. Thousands of Jews—the figures run from 4,000 to 7,000—were hidden, fed, clothed, and bedded in the 180 known places of refuge in Vatican City, churches and basilicas, Church administrative buildings, and parish houses. Unknown numbers of Jews were sheltered in Castel Gandolfo, the site of the Pope’s summer residence, private homes, hospitals, and nursing institutions; and the Pope took personal responsibility for the care of the children of Jews deported from Italy.”[14]

        Rabbi Lapide records that “in Rome we saw a list of 155 convents and monasteries—Italian, French, Spanish, English, American, and also German—mostly extraterritorial property of the Vatican . . . which sheltered throughout the German occupation some 5,000 Jews in Rome. No less than 3,000 Jews found refuge at one time at the Pope’s summer residence at Castel Gandolfo; sixty lived for nine months at the Jesuit Gregorian University, and half a dozen slept in the cellar of the Pontifical Bible Institute.”[15]

        Notice in particular that the Pope was not merely allowing Jews to be hidden in different church buildings around Rome. He was hiding them in the Vatican itself and in his own summer home, Castel Gandolfo. His success in protecting Italian Jews against the Nazis was remarkable. Lichten records that after the War was over it was determined that only 8,000 Jews were taken from Italy by the Nazis[16] —far less than in other European countries. In June,1944, Pius XII sent a telegram to Admiral Miklos Horthy, the ruler of Hungary, and was able to halt the planned deportation of 800,000 Jews from that country.

        The Pope’s efforts did not go unrecognized by Jewish authorities, even during the War. The Chief Rabbi of Jerusalem, Isaac Herzog, sent the Pope a personal message of thanks on February 28, 1944, in which he said: “The people of Israel will never forget what His Holiness and his illustrious delegates, inspired by the eternal principles of religion which form the very foundations of true civilization, are doing for us unfortunate brothers and sisters in the most tragic hour of our history, which is living proof of divine Providence in this world.”[17]

        Other Jewish leaders chimed in also. Rabbi Safran of Bucharest, Romania, sent a note of thanks to the papal nuncio on April 7, 1944: “It is not easy for us to find the right words to express the warmth and consolation we experienced because of the concern of the supreme pontiff, who offered a large sum to relieve the sufferings of deported Jews. . . . The Jews of Romania will never forget these facts of historic importance.”[18]

        The Chief Rabbi of Rome, Israel Zolli, also made a statement of thanks: “What the Vatican did will be indelibly and eternally engraved in our hearts. . . . Priests and even high prelates did things that will forever be an honor to Catholicism.”[19]

        After the war, Zolli became a Catholic and, to honor the Pope for what he had done for the Jews and the role he had played in Zolli’s conversion, took the name “Eugenio”—the Pope’s given name—as his own baptismal name. Zolli stressed that his conversion was for theological reasons, which was certainly true, but the fact that the Pope had worked so hard on behalf of the Jews no doubt played a role in inspiring him to look at the truths of Christianity.

        Lapide writes: “When Zolli accepted baptism in 1945 and adopted Pius’s Christian name of Eugene, most Roman Jews were convinced that his conversion was an act of gratitude for wartime succor to Jewish refugees and, repeated denials not withstanding, many are still of his opinion. Thus, Rabbi Barry Dov Schwartz wrote in the summer issue, 1964, of Conservative Judaism: ‘Many Jews were persuaded to convert after the war, as a sign of gratitude, to that institution which had saved their lives.’ “[20]

        In Three Popes and the Jews Lapide estimated the total number of Jews that had been spared as a result of Pius XII’s throwing the Church’s weight into the clandestine struggle to save them. After totaling the numbers of Jews saved in different areas and deducting the numbers saved by other causes, such as the praiseworthy efforts of some European Protestants, “The final number of Jewish lives in whose rescue the Catholic Church had been the instrument is thus at least 700,000 souls, but in all probability it is much closer to . . . 860,000.”[21] This is a total larger than all other Jewish relief organizations in Europe, combined, were able to save. Lapide calculated that Pius XII and the Church he headed constituted the most successful Jewish aid organization in all of Europe during the war, dwarfing the Red Cross and all other aid societies.

        This fact continued to be recognized when Pius XII died in 1958. Lapide’s book records the eulogies of a number of Jewish leaders concerning the Pope, and far from agreeing with Jack Chick that he deserved death because of his “war crimes,” Jewish leaders praised the man highly:[22]

        “We share the grief of the world over the death of His Holiness Pius XII. . . . During the ten years of Nazi terror, when our people passed through the horrors of martyrdom, the Pope raised his voice to condemn the persecutors and to commiserate with their victims” (Golda Meir, Israeli representative to the U.N. and future prime minister of Israel).

        “With special gratitude we remember all he has done for the persecuted Jews during one of the darkest periods in their entire history” (Nahum Goldmann, president of the World Jewish Congress).

        “More than anyone else, we have had the opportunity to appreciate the great kindness, filled with compassion and magnanimity, that the Pope displayed during the terrible years of persecution and terror” (Elio Toaff, Chief Rabbi of Rome, following Rabbi Zolli’s conversion).

        Finally, let us conclude with a quotation from Lapide’s record that was not given at the death of Pius XII, but was given after the War by the most well-known Jewish figure of this century, Albert Einstein: “Only the Catholic Church protested against the Hitlerian onslaught on liberty. Up till then I had not been interested in the Church, but today I feel a great admiration for the Church, which alone has had the courage to struggle for spiritual truth and moral liberty.”[23]

      • Keys says

        May 31, 2016 at 5:48 pm

        @Gea. Thank you to Wellington for his response to you, and I agree with Wellington.

        Also, if you are interested, you may find this book interesting to back up the points made: “Before the Dawn: Autobiographical Reflections by Eugenio Zolli, Former Chief Rabbi of Rome”.

        Israel Zolli was the Chief Rabbi of Rome during the Nazi occupation. He converted to Roman Catholicism, and changed his first name to Eugenio, in honor of Pope Pius XII, Eugenio Pacelli.

        Also, in Wikipedia check out: Priest Barracks of Dachau Concentration Camp. The book, reviewed on Amazon, “Priestblock 25487: A Memoir of Dachau” by Father Jean Bernard would give you an idea why Pius XII had to speak carefully to save lives. The movie “The Ninth Day” is based on this book.

        War is hell, but certainly just at times.

  15. Tony46 says

    May 30, 2016 at 5:58 pm

    The only thing you need to know about this Pope is in Saint Francis of Assisi’s prophecy:

    ”’….because —in that time– the Lord won’t send you a Shepherd but a Destroyer””

  16. Mockingjay says

    May 30, 2016 at 6:53 pm

    What chilling pictures though.
    The black crow attacking, likely killing, the white dove of peace.
    A sign from above if there ever was one, – for whoever who’s willing to see.
    The blackness of islam – and isis – against the “innocence” and good intentions of Christianity.
    Quite creepy actually.

    • Mark Swan says

      May 31, 2016 at 2:50 am

      Yes, Quite creepy

    • Ginger says

      May 31, 2016 at 1:30 pm

      As a Jesuit, Francis is known as The Black Pope.

  17. mortimer says

    May 30, 2016 at 6:53 pm

    “It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions in favor of vegetarianism, while the wolf remains of a different opinion.” – William Ralph Inge

    The pope’s Pollyanna-ism is irresponsible and EMBOLDENS and encourages the supremacists. They will not fear the counterstrike of the West. Another pope will have to repair the damage to Christendom caused by Francis’ naivety.

    Islamic jihad is the reverse of the Christian view of lawful warfare. Christian soldiers and police have a religious duty to defend those who are vulnerable.

    Pope Francis is mad.

    • Wellington says

      May 30, 2016 at 7:14 pm

      I don’t know if Francis is mad, mortimer, but I do know he’s a fool. He’s the anti-Urban II. Well, for that matter, he’s the anti-Benedict XVI too. Anti-Julius II also (big time). Actually, he’s on track for the dubious distinction of being the most harmful Pope in history, which is saying something considering the many Renaissance Popes who, while true appreciators of great art (gotta’ give ’em this), did great damage to the reputation of the Church because of their personal corruption, the best example here being Alexander VI. But with Francis I it’s not a matter of personal corruption but rather sheer foolishness which, in the final analysis, is far more harmful than “mere” corruption.

      And I have to wonder how many Catholics worldwide realize this about Francis and, more important, how much the present Catholic hierarchy does. Hell, the present Catholic hierarchy may prove to be the ultimate problem in the Church and not Francis unless there is a majority in said hierarchy who still have both feet on the ground. Not sure here. Hope so.

    • CogitoErgoSum says

      May 30, 2016 at 10:41 pm

      Wellington, I think you hit the nail on the head. The men of the Catholic hierarchy are the ones who chose this man from Argentina to be Pope. He is the one for whom the majority of the Cardinals voted at the papal conclave. Roman Catholics and the world (and God) got what THEY wanted. I’m beginning to think we would have been more likely to have gotten the Pope God wanted if they had just drawn straws. This Pope’s understanding of his own religion seems to very shallow and lacking in many respects ….. and the Cardinals should have been aware of this but they lacked the ability to discern any signs of a problem. I can only hope that God will find a way to provide better leadership for the Roman Catholic Church in the near future.

      Even worse, I’m also now leaning towards believing that the true third secret of Fatima has yet to be revealed because it probably warned of the dangers of Vatican II and the subsequent leadership now holding positions of power within the Church. It should have been revealed in 1960 but was not released until 2000. I see nothing in it (the version that was released) that would justify holding it beyond 1960.

      (Sorry, Pope Francis, it pains me to think any of this but that’s how it’s all beginning to appear to me.)

  18. Concerned Indian says

    May 30, 2016 at 7:24 pm

    All leaders including the religious ones are aspirants for the Nobel or some similar peace prize .

  19. Lusael Merlin says

    May 30, 2016 at 7:39 pm

    If a lie is told enough times it becomes the truth. Islamists have told two lies for over one hundred years that have had serious repercussions on Christians and their faith and those of ethnic European descent.

    The first lie Christians are responsible for slavery. The second lie is the Jews control the media and world.

    Most people believe these lies. No surprise as Allah is the greatest of deceivers. 24)Satan deceives the nations. (1kings 22, revelation 16, 20)
    Allah is the best deceiver. (Quran 43:54, 7:99) The first law of Sharia is to allow no criticism of Islam.

    Slavery still exists in Africa and Islam. The word slave slav Slavic white. Yes people, we were the last to the slave party and we were the slave race.Our skin is white because we ran so far north from the slavers. We couldn’t hack slavery.After a few hundred years we abolished it. We even shed blood trying to end slavery in Africa.What other race has ever done that for another race.
    This lie divided the body of Christ. Black and white Christians would have greater power against Islam if they were united.

    The second lie about Jews serves to keep our eyes off of Islams conquests. It is also a way to change the subject and defer blame.It also has cut Christians from their roots of Torah. Every time a Christian curses a Jew they are cutting off the light of Jesus. You cannot love Jesus and curse his family. The first Christians were all Jews or converts to Judiasm.
    It was, in fact, Constantine who corrupted Christianity in the 4th century, when he divorced the true Faith from its Hebraic roots and substituted multiple idolatrous deities and the heretical, pagan religion of Ancient Rome in its place

    Like a tree cut down and placed in a tub of water the Christian faith without Torah has withered and gradually died.

    Wiki leaks has proved most our news is controlled by Saudi Arabia

    • Sandra Lee Smith says

      Jun 2, 2016 at 12:39 am

      Well said, and true.

  20. Jack Holan says

    May 30, 2016 at 7:48 pm

    It’s not that I disrespect the Catholic Church per say and Pope Benedict would have clearly stated a non-compromising position at this point. This Simpleton or Self-Gratifying Peacenik/Marxist talks BIG with other Christians slaughtered, forced into sex slavery or converted out of Christianity but they call him his holiness. He talks Big with other peoples property earned over a lifetime of toil to just give away willy-nilly to People who broke into your home raped your sisters and Mother &spit on all you believe in but you Pope Francis when will you strip the church of all valuable collections, precious gems semi precious paintings sculptures hat. Clothing and all holdings? Open the doors of all real estate for housing migrants Yes a BIG talker Francis. You never had to work for money and worry about your meals and lodging

  21. xavier says

    May 30, 2016 at 8:43 pm

    Robert

    No I areas of state craft while i’ll respect tfullyliten to the piope doesn’t have final say as this is a prudential matter

    Besides there’should 1200 years of writings that won’the be so easily jettisoned and I think everyone had enough of the elites’ antics

  22. Keys says

    May 30, 2016 at 9:36 pm

    From this article, if Aquinas claims in paraphrase that “it [a just war] could not occur for purposes of self-gain, and that attaining peace must be its central aim”, then an argument can be made for annihilating Islam completely, since all who are not Muslim are considered to be in the world of “Harb”, war.

    So, peace is only possible when Islam is no more, or all of us are Muslims. Then, to opt for “Islam no more” is always – always just, and a just war for non-muslims, because only that will bring peace for non-Muslims. Ironically, this is exactly how “true” Muslims see it, only when Infidels are no more.

    Pope Francis seems to have no sense of history, (or understanding of the goals and methods of Islam), even recent history through which he lived [WWII]. He does seem to be a fool unable to see [blind] these connections and similarities. Not confronting now, like not confronting Hitler early on, will lead to the horrific deaths of multi millions – already multi thousands have died within the past decade.

    What spirit is leading him? Loving your enemies is not letting them destroy you and your loved ones; he is not loving what he believes is the Church Jesus established and sustains by letting others destroy it – and to destroy it is exactly the aim of Islam.

  23. Risto Kantonen says

    May 30, 2016 at 10:00 pm

    This has no effect what so ever to war time command of sovereign nations because the pope has no say in such matters, with the possible exception being the Vatican of course. When one faces an opponent which has hostile intent and all peaceful means of resolution have been exhausted, only one thing remains; war.

    I will end my comment by providing few important quotes to support my reasoning.

    “If someone doesn’t value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn’t value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?” -Sam Harris, source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pk7jHJRSzhM&t=1m10s

    “Kind-hearted people might of course think there was some ingenious way to disarm or defeat the enemy without too much bloodshed, and might imagine this is the true goal of the art of war. Pleasant as it sounds, it is a fallacy that must be exposed: War is such a dangerous business that mistakes that come from kindness are the very worst.” -Carl von Clausewitz, source: On War, Chapter 1, Section 3, Paragraph 1.

    “War therefore is an act of violence to compel our opponent to fulfill our will.” -Carl von Clausewitz, source: On War, Chapter 1, paragraph 2.

  24. Lord Wrath says

    May 30, 2016 at 10:54 pm

    No one seems to have brought op the matter of, ” leave Catholics no alternative but to surrender to the advancing jihad.” Catholics (for that matter all Christians) have the alternative of fighting back!!! Listen Catholics… You do not need the approval of the Pope to fight for your faith or for that matter your life…The only way to defeat Jihad is to kill all those who would war against you… Kill the men… Kill the women in order to eliminate the breeding stock… And kill the children to assure that they don’t grow up to kill your children… It’s called “Total War” and it is the best way to assure a lasting peace…

    • CogitoErgoSum says

      May 30, 2016 at 11:18 pm

      Lord Wrath, killing everybody seems a little bit harsh. Even the Muslims are supposed to give the enemy a chance to convert before the slaughter begins. A few Muslims might actually want to leave Islam but just haven’t seen a way to do so without risking death. Maybe we should work on that problem first and see how things go. The difficulty is that this Pope seems to be okay with letting all Muslims remain enslaved to Islam. He does not know how to set free the captive. In fact, he does not even see anyone being held captive.

    • Phil says

      May 31, 2016 at 8:07 am

      The Catholics of this world are a very diverse fold – a Pope can make a pronouncement at will but the Faithful are not sheep and will make up their own minds. Our current Pope can and often does make announcements for public consumption, but I suspect he’ll get a great deal of resistance from the College of Cardinals over any attempt to ditch the doctrine of Just War – the primary reason being it looks far too much like an absolution of the Church’s mealy-mouthed stand during WWII – and one thing the Church does not want is people raising the issue of the Concordat with Fascism at this time. Remember as well that Third World Cardinals are not all dhimmi and many of them would oppose any further concessions. Much of this I suspect is targeted for the liberal westerners the Church alienated with its appalling mishandling of priestly paedophilia; remember, the majority of faithful are not from the west – but a very large portion of the Church’s revenues come from westerners.
      Personally I don’t care what Francis says – and I am a Catholic. We survived the Borgia Popes – we’ll survive him.

    • gravenimage says

      May 31, 2016 at 5:52 pm

      The idea that there is no alternative to rolling over for Islam is genocide is a false moral dichotomy.

      • gravenimage says

        May 31, 2016 at 10:35 pm

        Oops–incomplete edit. I meant to say, “The idea that there is no alternative to rolling over for Islam but genocide is a false moral dichotomy.”

  25. mortimer says

    May 30, 2016 at 11:38 pm

    The more Francis opens his mouth, the more church members will withhold their offerings. Someone in the Curia should take this loose cannon in hand and manage his communications. He’s destroying his church.

    • Jay Boo says

      May 31, 2016 at 12:10 am

      You must be a mind reading psychic to make such a grand presumption and predict that church members will withhold their offerings from individual churches.

      Why Are Muslims Leaving Islam?

  26. Jay Boo says

    May 31, 2016 at 1:08 am

    That is defeatist thinking.

    The Pope is one person.
    The idea that eliminating the Catholic Church is the solution is looney.

    That is what filthy, dirty, vile, disgusting Muslims hope to accomplish during their invasion of Leftist secular Europe.

  27. Jura says

    May 31, 2016 at 2:37 am

    Yet another Chamberlain of our time.

  28. ECAW says

    May 31, 2016 at 3:06 am

    “we sleep safely at night because rough men stand ready to visit violence on those who would harm us.”

    Not Churchill. The source of the quote, as far as I can find, is this:

    In his 1945 “Notes on Nationalism”, George Orwell wrote that pacifists cannot accept the statement “Those who ‘abjure’ violence can do so only because others are committing violence on their behalf.”, despite it being “grossly obvious.”

    • gravenimage says

      May 31, 2016 at 6:27 pm

      This quote is often attributed to either Winston Churchill or George Orwell.

      The quote itself likely comes from journalist Richard Grenier, who wrote in the Washington Times, “As George Orwell pointed out, people sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.”

      That meant he was paraphrasing Orwell’s views.

      Incidentally, Grenier died not long after 9/11, so he didn’t experience the horrific revival of Jihad terrorism, but he had a suitably jaundiced view of the “Prophet” Muhammed.

      Oddly, I ran across this on a review of Robert Spencer’s book, “The Truth About Muhammad”:

      http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2006/oct/14/20061014-102317-6886r/?page=all

      • ECAW says

        Jun 1, 2016 at 1:41 am

        Thanks for the link graven. It’s one to keep. Bostom makes the simple point, which I think is absolutely right, that the central thing in Islam is the example of Mohammed…Allah is only a prop.

        • gravenimage says

          Jun 1, 2016 at 7:16 pm

          Agreed, ECAW.

  29. harbidoll says

    May 31, 2016 at 4:04 am

    He doesnt want to be beheaded like the Arch-Bishop of Constantinople 574 yrs. ago today! (May 27/th actually). Things arnt looking so good for Christianity these days. No way could he gather up an army like the Crusades of yesteryear. Best to play it cool till the right time. Besides didnt Trump say he would protect the Vatican?

    • DFD says

      May 31, 2016 at 10:42 am

      I beg to differ. Firstly, I do not think that capitulation is cool. I am Anglo-German, I assure when the Wehrmacht had to capitulate, nobody felt cool about it. I know that even though that was long before I was born. Nor do I believe that anybody in Dixie felt cool when they had to capitulate. Add other examples as you wish.

      And rising from ashes and ruins is very difficult. I think you are in danger of deluding yourself with ‘soft’ or ‘comfortable’ defeatism. That is *not* meant to be derisively.

      Things would look a lot better for Christianity if the clergy, regardless of denomination, would act as Christians. Why do you think Christianity was and is under attack by the left, in any possible form, for the last 50 years – and more? See School of Frankfurt, this isn’t anything new, it’s coming for a long time.

      If the Pope, and other Church leaders would call, at least 500,000 troops, including Atheists! And they could make Obama, Merkel & Co. sweat. Soros or mot.

      • DFD says

        May 31, 2016 at 10:50 am

        Typo:

        …. Soros or not….

        Sorry

    • gravenimage says

      Jun 1, 2016 at 8:20 pm

      If this was just about the pope being terrified, he could just avoid mentioning Islam at all–instead, he is actively appeasing it. This doesn’t make *anyone* safer, Catholic, other denomination Christian, or any other faith or none.

  30. Graham Ford says

    May 31, 2016 at 4:11 am

    Jesus said, ‘sell your tunic and buy a sword.’ Luke 22:36. When John is writing about the Beast (Islam) he says of this: ‘Those who gather captivity’ (ie kidnap) will be imprisoned and those who kill with the sword, it is necessary that they are killed by the sword.’ Rev 13:10.

    ‘Love your enemy.’ Yes. But if evil men force me to choose between loving them or loving my family, it is an absolute evil to betray my family.

    Why does the Pope find this hard?

  31. UNCLE VLADDI says

    May 31, 2016 at 4:38 am

    The “Just War” concept is obviously entirely a defensive one. But then like all criminals, Dope Francis insists his victims have no right to defend them selves or innocent others.

    And like all leftist gangsters, he tries to sell it to his victims by way of moral equivalency, positing that “ALL ATTACKS ARE EQUALLY BAD!”

    But back here in reality, the real truth is that the innocent defender is always ALREADY morally better than the predatory criminal aggressor attacker – period.

    In fact, only by refusing to COUNTER-attack in defense of one’s self and/or of innocent others, does one ever really condone and enable the criminal attackers as a willing accessory, and thereby literally become “as bad as they are.”

    😉

    Libertine “liberal” criminals prefer to look backwards to pretend to think their crimes weren’t really crimes at all, but only moral reactions to others’ crimes against themselves – as all criminals always do.

    At most, they prefer to pretend that there are no real crimes or criminals, because “we (i.e: you) all do it, too!”

    This argumentum tu quoque critical thinking logical fallacy is the basis for their endless immoral relativism (victim-blaming slander) stance.

    Everything they do is designed to promote criminals as victims and perversion as just retaliation.

  32. Brian McCarthy says

    May 31, 2016 at 4:51 am

    When and where, exactly, has Pope Francis said he would ‘jettison the idea of just war’ as the article title suggests?

    • gravenimage says

      May 31, 2016 at 7:07 pm

      He hasn’t gone so far as to outright ban the idea of just war, but he is certainly leaning in that direction. I think this is reasonable interpretation.

      We do have to consider the source, of course. Maria Stephan is a senior policy fellow at the United States Institute of Peace (USIP) who “focuses on the dynamics of civil resistance and their relevance for violent conflict prevention and democratic development”.

      Before that, she directed policy and research at the International Center on Nonviolent Conflict (ICNC).

      Insanely, she’s worked at NATO.

      Perhaps most salient here, she is the editor of “Civilian Jihad: Nonviolent Struggle, Democratization and Governance in the Middle East” (Palgrave, 2009).

      In it, she claims that there is a vibrant non-violent and anti-autocratic movement in the Muslim world. Notable–perhaps–that this came out before the “Arab Spring”.

      Of course, most “Civilian Jihad” is not non-violent protest; instead, it is mostly violent Jihad committed by those not acting on the behalf of governments–in other words, most Jihadists.

      This may in part be wishful thinking on her part regarding Pope Francis. But there is absolutely no doubt that this pontiff has such tendencies.

      In this speech from three years ago, the pope asserts that war always comes from man “thinking only of himself”–he has no conception, it seems, that Muslims can wage violent war in the name of their foul god–nor that good and decent people can choose to resist such offensive violence.

      He said, “…we bring about the rebirth of Cain in every act of violence and in every war. All of us!” and “…violence and war lead only to death, they speak of death! Violence and war are the language of death!”.

      Note there is no exception for acting defensively–nor to protect your loved ones from unprovoked aggression.

      In fact, he specifically addresses responding to violence in this same speech:

      “we can see God’s reply: violence is not answered with violence, death is not answered with the language of death. In the silence of the Cross, the uproar of weapons ceases and the language of reconciliation, forgiveness, dialogue, and peace is spoken. This evening, I ask the Lord that we Christians, and our brothers and sisters of other religions, and every man and woman of good will, cry out forcefully: violence and war are never the way to peace!”

      Of course, there can be no peace and reconciliation with a violent invading force.

      I guess he would have urged us to roll over for Hitler, as well.

      “Pope Francis: War is Always a Defeat for Humanity”

      http://www.news.va/en/news/francis-war-is-always-a-defeat-for-humanity

  33. Agnishtoma says

    May 31, 2016 at 5:49 am

    There is a saying. Before destroying somebody the gods make him/her made and incapable of basic thinking. Looks like this guys days are numbered

  34. Agnishtoma says

    May 31, 2016 at 5:49 am

    Sorry typo in my previous comment i meant “Mad” and not “made”

  35. ECAW says

    May 31, 2016 at 6:48 am

    I used to argue with people that the Christian religion was a bulwark against Islam even if you don’t believe in it. But it has become so supine, in all its major varieties so it seems, that it is now worse than useless, even part of the enemy.

    Are you believers starting to wonder what the point of it is?

    • Concerned Indian says

      May 31, 2016 at 6:53 am

      ECAW, the unfortunate part is the missionaries are spreading Christianity in India whenever they can.These people are no use to Europe .I am not religious but religion did offer a sense of belonging and unity.With many people beginning to become atheists,( unlike Muslims) most of the religions are getting weaker.

    • Graham Ford says

      May 31, 2016 at 7:32 am

      ” the Christian religion was a bulwark against Islam even if you don’t believe in it”.

      There are the religious organisations, and there are the believers, and these are not the same thing.
      You are witnessing the believers leaving the established churches in droves, simply because so many of these so-called churches have betrayed the Bible’s plain teaching.
      But the believers have not gone away, and will come together to defend against the evil of Islam.
      We are seeing the darnel being separated from the wheat. (Matt 13:30)

  36. John says

    May 31, 2016 at 6:52 am

    John 2:15

    So he (Jesus Christ) made a whip out of cords, and drove all from the temple courts, both sheep and cattle; he scattered the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables.

    Exaclty. Notice that he uses a WHIP. Notice that the threw the tables around. This was no “peaceful act” but the true earthly wrath of GOD against pagan practices (today I would count Islam as one of those practices).

    I’m Catholic, I love the Church, and thus the Pope, but this seems to be getting very out of hand, to say the least. But we are the Church – perhaps a letter-storm to the Vatican? I can’t see how they would not respond to, say, 500,000 letters from its faithful? What do you guys think?

  37. Mark says

    May 31, 2016 at 7:28 am

    I am all for looking for alternatives to war, but in the case of Islam we can see throughout history they have all failed.

  38. Jerry says

    May 31, 2016 at 7:53 am

    It included practices like supporting nonviolent direct action…advancing democracy, human rights, and religious liberty…

    What a coincidence, those are the very things jihadists are killing us for. When that fails then what? Oh yeah, I forgot, grassroots peacemaking groups and voluntary associations. Stupid me.

  39. peter fleming says

    May 31, 2016 at 8:02 am

    These are times when I keep thinking from month to month, “I have just read the most important article of our times”. Robert’s article today, is now the most important article of out time, and the amazing letters and comments to follow combine a wealth of supportive truth that the man currently elected as the head of The Church, is every bit as destructive and evil as is our current president in office. Both are destroying their world and attempting to betray their followers to some horrible end. Robert, thank you again! Peter

  40. Richard Paulsen says

    May 31, 2016 at 8:37 am

    Would like to see islamic scholars being criticized as Christians and Christianity. Wishing so anyway.

    • gravenimage says

      May 31, 2016 at 7:13 pm

      Robert Spencer certainly criticizes Islam, Richard.

      He also notes–as here–when Dar-al-Harb is acting suicidally.

  41. TH says

    May 31, 2016 at 8:46 am

    I think it will be very difficult for him to outright reject the doctrine of a Just War, as propounded by St.Augustine and St.Thomas Aquinas, who happen to be the greatest doctors of the Church, plus what is in the Catechism of the Catholic Church. He has a similar problem with capital pubishment. He has stated that it is “inadmissable”.What does this mean? Does he mean that it is immorral? The word inadmissable is not part of the Church’smoral vocabulary. In fact, both the Bible and the whole tradition of the Church allow capaital pubishment, so he cannot say it is immoral. He will probably come out with another of his attempts to square the circle, but it will not be binding on Catholics. A Pope cannot just change Church teaching as his will. He has to follow the tradition of the Church. One Pope cannot just reject 2000 years of Catholic teaching. He has caused more than enough problems for the Church aleady with his ill founded affirmations which have to be corrected later by his spokesman. He is imprudent and irresponsible. According to St. Thomas Aquinas (I just wish he would study him a bit) prudence is the principle virtue of those calle to rule. He obviously lacks it and it is clear that the Cardinals make a mistake in electing him. For now,we have to put up with him and his off the cuff remarks.

    • Jerry says

      May 31, 2016 at 9:14 am

      In fact, both the Bible and the whole tradition of the Church allow capital punishment.”

      The biblical god was never shy about killing and for reasons we would deem inhumane and unfair:

      http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2010/04/drunk-with-blood-gods-killings-in-bible.html

      I’m safe in saying, the Judeo-Christian god has committed the worst humanitarian crimes in history. But that was then, this is now. Islam is the new killer of our age.

      • Constance says

        May 31, 2016 at 2:09 pm

        Stop slandering God. He gives life and He takes it away; it is His prerogative.

        I guess you haven’t noticed the one billion plus innocent lives taken/ snuffed out through abortion in the last century through the most violent means imaginable?

        • Mark Swan says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 7:24 pm

          Good Points Constance

  42. Dr, Gonzalo de Porras y Rodriguez says

    May 31, 2016 at 9:09 am

    ES publica y notoria la ignorancia de S.S. Francisco I en todo lo referente al Islam, añadamos a esto sus constantes manifestaciones y manifestaciones equivocas que dan lugar a constante explicaciones por parte de distintos jerarcas de la Iglesia Católicas. Pero la ignorancia de S.S. Francisco I en materias ya definidas por Pontífices anteriores como el caso de la “Guerra Justa”, me obligan a recordar las siguientes doctrinas, ya definidas por S.S. Juan Pablo II quien en el “Catecismo de la Iglesia Católica” (números 2264 y 2265) y en la Encíclica “Evangelium Vitae”( artículo 55) define claramente y sin dudas los casos en que se puede usar la violencia para la Legítima Defensa. Por tanto si persistiese en su error de decir que el ejercicio de la defensa propia esta vedado para un cristiano, estaría incurriendo en error

  43. Ninsuna says

    May 31, 2016 at 9:24 am

    Just when I think this Pope can’t get more idiotic, there he goes again.

    “Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves.” Matthew 10:16

    News flash, Pope, you can’t just delete the “wise as serpents” part.

  44. Manual Paleologos says

    May 31, 2016 at 9:34 am

    I’d like to see what Frank actually said, from an authoritative source, preferably a Vatican source. Both sides of the political spectrum have been madly misquoting the guy and trying to misrepresent him for their own purposes. He makes it easy for them to do, because he often speaks imprecisely.

    No doctrine that absolutely rejects war can be valid. It is the path of suicide.

    • gravenimage says

      May 31, 2016 at 7:19 pm

      You can see my links to one of his speeches from 2013 above–it gives a good sense of his disturbing views.

      • Manual Paleologos says

        Jun 1, 2016 at 9:03 am

        Thanks. I don’t see him going so far as condemn Just War. That would pit him against some of the Doctors of the Church, and they have some pretty big shoes to fill. But war is definitely a disaster for Mankind. It is really the game of the least loser.

        Pacifism, on the other hand is the path to annihilation. It only works on an opponent with a sense that they are good. That’s why it worked, more or less, in India. It would not have worked against the Japanese or the Nazis. The Shoah is a demonstration of that.

        I’m going to continue to watch what Frank does, before I reach the conclusion that he must be condemned. My gut feeling is that he will go down in history as a terrific pastor, but a rotten politician.

        • gravenimage says

          Jun 1, 2016 at 8:41 pm

          Agreed–I am not, of course, suggesting rushing into war. But there does come a time when you have to stand and defend yourself, your loved ones, and your values, or else you lose everything.

          And if I have not said so, I love your username.

  45. duh swami says

    May 31, 2016 at 9:39 am

    There may be no such thing as a ‘just war’, but there is ‘legitimate’ self defense…bu the word ‘legitimate’ has to be there or it is not legitimate…

  46. John A. Marre says

    May 31, 2016 at 9:50 am

    St. Thomas of Aquinas was right. If this pope rejects that teaching, he will have cut himself off from the Church’s long-standing traditions and teachings, and will no longer be fit to be pope, and will need to resign.
    There is no chance at all that he will resign.

  47. Greg says

    May 31, 2016 at 10:04 am

    :rolleyes:

    I see that even JihadWatch is not immune to being duped by those to twist and reinterpret Pope Francis’ words to further their own agenda. This was an OPINION piece picked up by a left-leaning little “c” catholic site “Crux” and everyone here has their knickers all twisted. Maria Stephan is a senior fellow at the United States Institute of Peace so you would expect that her “opinion” to be wishful thinking and completely ignore the fact that Pope Francis previously called the US efforts against ISIL as a “just war” and urged all nations to “unite to end atrocities by Islamist militants”. I am far from being a Francis Apologist but one needs to responsibly consider the source before going off half-cocked.

    • gravenimage says

      Jun 1, 2016 at 9:53 pm

      You can read the pope’s own words on this subject that I linked to,

  48. DFD says

    May 31, 2016 at 10:13 am

    Just two, only 2, tell tale points this traitor against Christ has missed:

    1) Jesus healed the servant of a Centurion and commented upon that man’s faith, being such that it could save all Israel if enough of his (Jesus’) compatriots would have it too. He did not condemn the Centurion nor his military profession.

    2) Jesus commanded his followers to sell the shirts of their backs and get swords!

    Well, what next? Will it be permissible to mention Jesus in Church – or only Mohamed? I am not a Catholic, I gave up on denomination long time ago, but here is my suggestion to you Catholics: Band together until you reached a thousand or a few thousand, elect a new Pope out of the Cardinals whom you trust, and publicise this in the religious/Christian press/websites.

    If such action carries legal weight or not is irrelevant, it wont, it’s the deed that matters – and attracts more followers. That’s the only thing you can do. IMHO…

    Good luck!

    • Greg says

      May 31, 2016 at 10:29 am

      “Band together until you reached a thousand or a few thousand, elect a new Pope out of the Cardinals whom you trust, and publicise this in the religious/Christian press/websites”

      It has already been done – it’s called Protestantism.

  49. Jay Boo says

    May 31, 2016 at 10:26 am

    Self defense of course

    However, the idea of a ‘just war’
    That might lead to a slippery slope with a lot of collateral damage.
    Are we truly prepared to go that course?

    I doubt it.

    • DFD says

      May 31, 2016 at 10:48 am

      Hi Jay Boo,

      You doubt it, so do I. That’s why I keep on saying and hoping for more atrocities, until the barrel overflows. Or something big and extremely nasty.

      The people either have to be jerked out of this, or have to become so disillusioned that they see no other way. Were ‘disillusioned’ means frightened.

      • Jay Boo says

        May 31, 2016 at 11:51 am

        Yes
        While I do not advocate violence, it does not preclude me from telling the unpleasant truth about Muslims.
        After their coreligionists attack ‘soft targets’ the usual suspects come out and say “nothing to do with Islam” and Muslims go off gleefully claiming “Not our problem” in full accordance with Islamic teaching.

        “Not our Problem” syndrome in Muslims never gets better from the groveling apology tours by Obama and company, it only gets worse.

        When arrogant carpet kissing Muslims are worried about being soft targets themselves as they bend over to kiss the rug, only then will Muslims see this as (their problem) much as Nazi supporters did after the carpet bombing retaliation at Dresden. I do not in any way say that this is the only solution. I am merely stating a hard cold reality.
        I recently commented that most of the people killed in Hiroshima were civilians to which one commenter rightly asserted Japan was committing atrocities against Chinese civilians.
        In theory all soft targets should be off limits.
        With a hate filled ideology I do not believe Muslims have any respect for us at all if we announce in advance that we refuse to even consider Muslim soft targets.
        After the Boston attack I have become thoroughly convinced that Muslims do not see such murders as THEIR PROBLEM and they will never respond to reason.

        • DFD says

          May 31, 2016 at 1:27 pm

          I think we are in agreement. But getting us western people to really have a go at the enemy, that will take a lot more.

          I might have come across wrongly as ‘advocating violence’. Sorry if it came across as such. Permit me to clarify, but we are being attacked, continuously. 28,000+ since 2001.

          The problem is, we don’t strike back appropriately. For instance, take 9/11, the US’ response, and that of its NATO allies, was completely wrong. We, the west, though primarily the US since it was the *main* victim, should have done the following: “We lost 3-4k people, we avenge our dead by taking 4-5k of yours. Do it again thereafter, and we will double the number. And then again. That were every atrocity stemming from you societies is concerned. Regardless!” Plus ceasure of some assets, their leaders fear that more than dead fellow Muslims.

          They would have understood that. Instead, we engage in ‘nation building’. In addition we are assuring them that we are not at war with them, whilst they are obviously at war with us. And on top of that we are apologizing the moment they ‘feel offended’. We are pathetic to the extreme, and turning ourselves into a laughing stock.

          So, not mindless violence, but measured response, then increasing the measure of the response gradually, but over proportionally. Though, by now that’s too late. Thus, the end result will be a mess. But, the longer we wait, the messier it will be, since they consider our desire for peace to be a weakness and thus increase the revolting efforts.

        • Graham Ford says

          May 31, 2016 at 2:32 pm

          In response to DFD’s “The problem is, we don’t strike back appropriately. ” Killing 4 – 5 thousand of theirs because they killed 3 – 4 thousand of ours is wrong morally, wrong strategically, illegal and indefensible.

          Killing is an incredibly serious business. It is generally murder unless within the rules of war, and even then I know too many soldiers with the deepest psychological scars because they were ordered to kill.

          That does NOT mean I am a pacifist – I certainly am not as my other posts will tell, but there has to be a lot more Sun Tsu AND St Augustine and a lot less football hooligan about the response.

          We first must understand the enemies goal – what they value. They are not trying to win, per se. They just want to ensure we, i.e. Christianity, loose.

          So, we need to become far more strategic. The thing that they do not want is Christianity growing in their (Muslim) countries. Therefore focus on promoting Christianity, enabling Christian communities to defend themselves, even against state power; calling to account every OIC nation that permits a double standard in their law (i.e. Sharia) and favouring businesses that are Christian, not Muslim. Call for safe haven areas for Christians in every OIC nation, and campaign for the outlawing of the OIC as a political entity. Any country which kills or even discriminates against Christians or Jews on the basis of religion, or converts to Christianity, will suffer economic sanctions. Anyone who breaks those sanctions will suffer sanctions.

          It isn’t about killing Muslims. Yes, by all means make sure those murderers are dealt with, but it is about shaming Islam and weakening it as a so-called religion.

          Why favour Christians and Jews? Two reasons: a) precisely because the Muslims don’t like them, and b) Because Christianity is the only way Islam can be held in check.

        • DFD says

          May 31, 2016 at 5:32 pm

          To: Graham Ford

          – You say: “In response to DFD’s “The problem is, we don’t strike back appropriately. ” Killing 4 – 5 thousand of theirs because they killed 3 – 4 thousand of ours is wrong morally, wrong strategically, illegal and indefensible.”

          Answer: It is *not* morally wrong to strike back, nor is it ‘illegal’. Strategically it is most certainly right. For the objective of a punitive counter attack is cheaper and easier to achieve than a 10 year-plus nation building exercise, which results in nothing, but more deaths on all sides. Again, defending oneself is *not* illegal (except currently in Europe and in the US, against attacks by Muslims). Indefensible? Nonsense, that’s just a catchphrase added to sound good. Read again what I just said.

          – You say: “Killing is an incredibly serious business. It is generally murder unless within the rules of war, and even then I know too many soldiers with the deepest psychological scars because they were ordered to kill.”

          Answer: Killing is indeed a serious business, that’s why I want to avoid that our people get killed, strange as it may seem to you. Yes, it is generally murder what the Muslims do, you are right about that. If that is what you meant… As far as the rules of war are concerned, as per quran and hadith, the Islamic rules of war are terror – and at the end of the day, the enemy sets the rules. Referring to you ‘knowing too many soldiers’ etc., I sympathize. It is indeed terrible, that they were not told that as soldiers, they may receive the orders to kill enemies. What an irresponsible oversight on behalf of their officers, utterly shocking. Of course, they could have been confused or even been tricked to believe that they were joining the Salvation army. I feel so sorry.

          – You say: “That does NOT mean I am a pacifist – I certainly am not as my other posts will tell, but there has to be a lot more Sun Tsu AND St Augustine and a lot less football hooligan about the response.”

          Answer: “… football hooligan…” Pathetic! I am aware however that it takes one to know one. In your case though that’s wrong, I never played nor liked football. But then, if you have to resort to such impoverished innuendo, it certainly speaks volumes about *you*, not me.

          – You say: “We first must understand the enemies goal – what they value. They are not trying to win, per se. They just want to ensure we, i.e. Christianity, loose.”

          Answer: Hilarious. May I suggest you read the quran, read hadith, listen to Erdogan, to the Ayatollahs and Imams. Do it for just a small bit, you’ll be amazed.

          – You say: “So, we need to become far more strategic. The thing that they do not want is Christianity growing in their (Muslim) countries. Therefore focus on promoting Christianity, enabling Christian communities to defend themselves, even against state power; calling to account every OIC nation that permits a double standard in their law (i.e. Sharia) and favouring businesses that are Christian, not Muslim. Call for safe haven areas for Christians in every OIC nation, and campaign for the outlawing of the OIC as a political entity. Any country which kills or even discriminates against Christians or Jews on the basis of religion, or converts to Christianity, will suffer economic sanctions. Anyone who breaks those sanctions will suffer sanctions.”

          Answer: Are you from this planet? Try to promote Christianity in Saudi or ‘moderate’ Egypt; just make sure you wrote your last will and deposited it with a law firm. “Call for save havens..” In case you are not trying to be funny, you’ll need a phenomenal, as of yet not invented, loudspeaker for that call. If you can get one, you’ll reach even more Muslims – though their laughter may drown out your call, even if you had such a loudspeaker.

          Answer continues… “suffer economic sanctions…” You can’t be from earth, impossible. Let me put it this way, so far OPEC (mostly Muslim) has successfully applied economic sanctions against the west, not the other way round. Of course, the success of sanctions against Muslims is well proven, instances abound. Such as the economic sanctions at Poitier by Charles Matell. Or those applied against the Turks by the Holy Roman Empire and the Polish Lithuanian Commonwealth at the Gates of Vienna, and let us not forget how the Moors were economically sanctioned out of Spain. Marvellous. And of course more recently, how economic sanctions prevented N-Korea from nuclear weapons – as was also the case with Iran. Iran is an excellent example here, once economic sanctions were in place it stopped immediately funding, training and equipping terrorist organizations like Hamas. Your political and economic understanding is enormous, very enormous.

          Answer continues… “Anyone who breaks those sanctions will suffer sanctions.” What a good idea, make China, large parts of Oceania, India, most of Africa and South America ‘suffer’ sanctions. For this alone I must apologize for having asked if you are from this planet. Permit me to rephrase myself: Are you from this galaxy?

          – You say: “It isn’t about killing Muslims. Yes, by all means make sure those murderers are dealt with, but it is about shaming Islam and weakening it as a so-called religion.”

          Answer: No we shouldn’t kill Muslims just because they torture, murder, bomb, mutilate and rape us, or openly as well as tacitly support those who do so. That’s no reason to harm them – what was I thinking, oh dear! Just the murderers, but not a Muslim nation; so, no sanctions either. After all, those murderers have nothing to do with Islam. Right, no harm to Muslim peoples or Muslim nations, got that. Let’s do as you say, let’s shame Islam: Altogether now, in chorus we chant: Islam is bad! Islam is bad! Well, that will show them, wont they be ashamed; they probably lose half a second of sleep. And we will continue defiantly to live according to our values. Unless they decide to kill or to enslave us, a mere cultural difference, we must accept that as diversity, mustn’t we?

          What more can I say? I know, I do thank you for showing your objectives and concerns.

          To paraphrase lieutenant Colombo: Oh, and one more thing: Since this is the first time you responded to one of my posts, and with personal innuendo even, I obviously must have struck a chord.

          It was really nice to hear from, Salute.

          PS: There is one point I agree with you, namely to arm and train Christians. Though, I somehow doubt that that is what you really want. Calling for that is cheap, but we *all know* that with the current crop of governments that will not happen.

        • Graham Ford says

          May 31, 2016 at 5:41 pm

          Your 4 -5 thousand. Were they just random Muslims or actual jihadists? If the latter, then I do, actually, agree with you, but if the former, then I don’t.

          I am trying to contribute strategic thinking here. Fine if you don’t like any of the ideas. But, we are suffering from an absolute absence of strategy: HBO doesn’t have one, apart from say how nice they all are, Cameron does not have one, apart from saying how peaceful they all are.

          I am not hearing strategy from anyone. Killing thousands is not a strategy, even if it’s necessary.

        • DFD says

          May 31, 2016 at 6:09 pm

          To Graham Ford,

          Thank you for your reply. That sounded rather different, pleasantly so, than name calling and innuendo. If you are interested in this matter as per your statement, I will gladly respond since it is indeed an important subject. And of course, interesting to discuss.

          It also requires lengthy deliberations and it is getting rather late. So, assuming an interest on your behalf, I will respond by tomorrow.

        • Graham Ford says

          May 31, 2016 at 6:16 pm

          Looking forward to it.

        • gravenimage says

          May 31, 2016 at 7:28 pm

          DFD wrote:

          We, the west, though primarily the US since it was the *main* victim, should have done the following: “We lost 3-4k people, we avenge our dead by taking 4-5k of yours.
          ………………………

          DFD, there is no doubt that the Afghan War was a great debacle–mostly because US and coalition forces had no real idea of what they were fighting with Islam.

          But it was at least an attempt to take out a polity–the Taliban, in this case–that had backed our attackers and given them asylum.

          It was *not* simply an “eye for an eye” taking out random members of a group–we do not believe in collective guilt.

        • Jack Holan says

          May 31, 2016 at 9:49 pm

          I’m going to reduce my thoughts down to some basic concepts avoid a full blown discussion of Christianity since I’m not a Christian and all of you truly seem well versed in the teachings of the second testament. Please don’t take offense that I’m setting the mosiac in a basic motif. It’s not because you lack any scholarly level of acuman. ICAN tell you that even without the USA EUROPE has the resources, training and fortitude to overcome IS not just defeat them but to kill every last one of them. I don’t believe the will be deradicalized Look at the prisoners at GITMO after 15 years. They are released and go back to the battlefield. You won’t change they’re ideaology. They come from countries that are the same as them but maybe 2 notches less. Full destruction is the only solution or they will rebuild. Their infrastructure goes far beyond what they can muster on the territory they currently hold so Saudi Arabia Sudan or other. Countries or friends living there are helping.
          What scares me is the state of affairs in Europe and England with the Whiteman. People of color have what Whites used to have 40+ years ago. The G-d given instinct to struggle to survive at all costs. The Government says move over for these Migrants., yes you grumble but comply even though you know at some point it will affect what you take home benefits you receive without any contributions being made just the opposite. This is not going get into a Race affair. An enemy who promises to destroy you militarily, culturally,religiously and force you to be them tells you their future tactic of how they will accomplish it. IS declared we are going to flood Europe with Refugees and we will be amongst them. It is so clear and Armies send teams of Agent to gather intel such as this and they gave it to us. Why? Why is Chancellor Merkle protecting them why is Europe following no rules and accepting them but not Christian Refugees fighting for their lives. Blaming their own young women for being raped by these animals

        • DFD says

          Jun 1, 2016 at 5:50 pm

          To Graham Ford,

          Hi Graham,

          Let me begin by stating that I do agree with you on the need for ideological battle. Even more than you think.

          I am writing currently on Islam and part of that is to take the ideological battle to them, into Islam, into the hearts and minds of Muslims. To that extent there are two sections, namely: Quran & Mohamed, the contradiction. And: Disproving the False the False Prophet.

          These two sections are specifically or primarily aimed at Muslims. Weaken the enemy from within, turning them, or at least weakening their faith. These two sections are being translated into Arabic, Urdu, Farsi, Turkish and German (for the Turks there). Each Section is about 3 pages A4/Foolscap long. I can upload/post these in two parts each. There are restrictions in reference to the length of a post.

          If you wish I can begin with section one tonight (depending upon when I see your reply, transmission time), then let me know when you are ready for section two. Please note, this being a blog type website, all type setting arrangements will be lost. I am sure you will have no problem with that.

          Further writings in reference to the matter concerned, these too are aimed at Muslims, but also at Christians and Atheists. These are titled as: Islam 1; Taqyia, Hijra & Koran and: Islam 2; Concession upon Concession. These two sections, each about 8 pages A4/Foolscap, deal with various aspects, their tactics, lies, types of lies and applications and historical instances thereto. Again, translations are being prepared. In many ways, these point also, vaguely though, at what reaction they can ultimately expect from the west.

          Then there is a section dealing with the upcoming civil wars, note plural, in Europe and the US. This commences with “Section 1: Money, Money, Money”. This part has been completed and waits for proof-reading. It deals with one of the three backgrounds of the current situation. Here ‘background’ refers to the Muslim determination of fighting and winning, combining financial Jihad with subversion Jihad. With the latter briefly referencing the application of individual and small group terror against the hosts. No translation intended, solely aimed at western readers. Very long though. You can view this at http://gatesofvienna.net/2016/03/tatjana-festerling-on-the-soros-brokered-migration-deal-between-europe-and-turkey/#comment-443715 The link will lead you to the last part (part 4) of the document, thus you will have to scroll up to part “1” of it. Again, it had to be broken into components due to length restrictions.

          Section 2: “Beginning of the wars” Has been (practically) completed. A special thanks here to a poster by name of “ RonaldB ” who has been most helpful by asking very useful and important, thus constructive, questions. (if I can catch him I will invite him to participate in the possible, or hoped for discussion; others too if interested, of course) It is again long, 8 pages A4, but that is unavoidable given the subject matter. This section deals with the actual main or primary protagonists, namely the far left and the right up to the extreme right. I know, this sounds hard to believe, but the Muslims merely play the role of useful idiots, for they cannot win.

          Section 3: “The wars and possible outcomes”

          Section 4: …ready in four to six weeks – hopefully. It will be rather extensive, dealing with the development of the wars in Europe, with Germany being the lynch pin, spilling into the US, the situation there. And the possible resultant political ramifications, various constellations are possible. These will be studied in as much detail as possible, within the aim of keeping it as short as the subject matter allows. The propaganda parts currently running, left and right, etc. plus of course a look at some of the emerging players.

          I would suggest to start with the first two sections, Koran & Mohamed, plus: the False prophet. Your views, and those of others of course, are most appreciated. Particularly considering that you seem to concentrate on the ideological aspect. So this may interest you the most.

          Conversely to all this, may I enquire please as to what kind of work have you done? In reference to the subject matter at hand and / or generally. or perhaps, what you intend to do.

          Regards
          DFD

        • Graham Ford says

          Jun 1, 2016 at 6:13 pm

          Dear DFD,

          My email is gf.mansion@gmail.com if you want to email me. I will not use your material except with your permission.

          I am involved in Jesus Christ for Muslims, http://www.jesuschristformuslims.com, and Partners with the Persecuted, http://www.pwtp.org.

          Thank you for sharing these with me. I would be most interested to receive your material.

          Kind regards

          Graham

        • ECAW says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 3:08 am

          DFD – Perhaps I missed it in your post but how do you plan to get Muslims to read your information? I find it difficult enough to get neutrals to read anything critical of Islam.

      • gravenimage says

        May 31, 2016 at 11:09 pm

        DFD wrote:

        You doubt it, so do I. That’s why I keep on saying and hoping for more atrocities, until the barrel overflows. Or something big and extremely nasty.

        The people either have to be jerked out of this, or have to become so disillusioned that they see no other way. Were ‘disillusioned’ means frightened.
        ……………………………..

        Hi DFD. I know you’ve said this before–but besides the general horror of Jihad terror, it may–we are already seeing some signs of this–lead to this being considered the “new normal”. It might, perversely, lead to a greater acceptance of Islam, and a greater inclination to roll over for it.

        • ECAW says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 3:13 am

          It’s a toss up isn’t it?

          I sadly side with DFD. Further atrocities may or may not wake the population up but if things merely continue as they are with ever greater Muslim populations in Western countries we will go the way of the frog in the slowly heated water.

      • DFD says

        Jun 2, 2016 at 12:06 pm

        ECAW says: “DFD – Perhaps I missed it in your post but how do you plan to get Muslims to read your information? I find it difficult enough to get neutrals to read anything critical of Islam.”

        Hi,

        Thanks for your reply, which requires two answers:

        1) To reach Muslims, of no particular import for you
        2) To get neutrals… Of IMPORT for you.

        Your questions are most welcome, particularly since you are a blogger, thus you are high on our list, definitely so since you are a European (UK that is) blogger. Since blogging implies that you are active. A significant point confirmed by your sentence ‘…I find it difficult enough to get neutrals to read anything critical of Islam’. To commence with

        1, Muslims): Distribution for or to these, disks/videos, articles, by friendly websites. Ex-Muslims, Arabs, etc. Also, mailshots and spams, accompanied by instructions.
        Now the important bit, ‘to get neutrals…’, and so to

        2, Neutrals): First of all,

        don’t mention Islam! Yes, that’s what I said.
        =================================

        You want to inform, good. But people don’t like being told. Particularly so since you are contradicting TV and the press – and the consumers of such media consider themselves to be well informed. And then telling them that they are getting it all wrong, that they have been fooled; meaning they are fools. Fat chance. My highest respect and compliments that you are apparently get people to listen! The bulk of these, readers?, consumers?, are interested only in TTBF. Were TTBF = Twaddle, Tits, Bums & Football. About 80% of their attention, or greater still…

        You surely have experienced that when you mention Islam, the shutters come down. Various reasons in the back and in the front of their minds. Begins with ‘Islamophobe’, runs the gamut from there. Also, it’s a highly complex matter – ‘I can’t be bothered/don’t want to get involved’. They are 100%, or near, victims of a massive propaganda onslaught. Put the previously paragraph and this one together, and there’s a big, BIG problem.

        Thus what is required is counter propaganda, essentially that means telling them the truth in an acceptable and digestible form.

        You want to get them to read the Quran, Hadith? Aren’t you optimistic 🙂 They can’t be bothered reading just the four canonical Gospels. History? “…Oh yes, I know all about it! There was Hitler, Dunkirk and D-Day. And the Blitz and Stalingrad.” …. “We also had an Empire … and there was a battle with sailing ships, err, yeah, Trafalgar! That’s the one. And Hastings, and Queen Budoccea… There you are, I know all about it!”

        Pointless!

        That means to address or to play on something they will respond to, namely fear, worries. You will get response in at least 5 out of 10! Minimum. Human psychology will make sure of that. Except with much of the US, many of them are lulled into a false sense of security due to their 2nd amendment. But we are concerned with Europe, where people feel, and are, far more vulnerable. Exploit this. *Just don’t mention Islam.*

        How? Timing? Type of effort?

        Fear of hostile aliens, you don’t have to mention Muslims or Islam, that’s as irrelevant as race. Nobody is afraid of the West Indians, of Hindus, Sikhs; neither of the Poles, Hungarians etc. But Islam. So, you don’t have to mention Islam, unnecessary. Just ask, for instance: “…why are we not permitted to… Why do we have to make this and that concession to foreigners, actually aliens, who simply don’t wont to integrate, even though we welcome them, help them and protect them (we are such good people). They can do things here that they can’t do in their own countries, there they would be beheaded… I mean I am all for helping people, it’s just normal, human decency, and yes, I am willing to make some sacrifices for that… And it has nothing to do with race, you know, just look at all those blacks and Indians, they too are afraid…” Et cetera est.

        Did you notice, I didn’t mention Islam, neither Muslims nor Mohamed. What for?

        That was fear, number one.
        Now fear, number two, MONEY! Very, very important:

        “…Who is paying for all this, there are masses of people coming, mostly unskilled, illiterate even. They will require homes, they bring there families later, often with two or three wives, who is going to pay for their homes and support? They will require a few million homes, that’s Manchester and Birmingham together – and they multiply far out of proportion to Asians, Africans or us. What does it cost to feed them, to supply them? Where do we take the extra power stations from? Look, what I am saying is this, look at your electricity bill, now pay the bill for a few million extra consumers… And before that, power stations will have to be build, and these costs hundreds of millions each, where does the money come from? The workers, the taxpayers (throw your hands into the air to underline)… And the cost for hospitals and all that, for a few million people, I can’t afford this (you don’t have to ask: Can you?)… And the constant threats and violence, always those expressions of hate, you can say what you want, immediately one is badmouthed called names such as…. One can’t even ask reasonable questions – always hate and accusations, except when they/those people fear a backlash… That’s why I am so afraid. Blah, blah, blah…”

        Have I mentioned anywhere Islam? Mohamed?

        But learn when to back off. You don’t want to lose friends or associates, you want to make new ones. Start cells, guide into movements.

        Want to know more? Such as how, times, whom? Let me know.

        Regards, DFD

        • ECAW says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 12:32 pm

          Thanks for your long reply. I wish you well with your “Don’t mention Islam” strategy. As it happens I don’t live in Britain, or anywhere that face to face contact would have any effect. Apart from family and friends in Britain, I rely largely on the internet to try and spread the word, probably reaching only the already converted…but I hope that has some minor encouraging effect just as commenting here does.

          Good luck with your master plan!

        • ECAW says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 12:40 pm

          Even if it doesn’t have any effect it gives me the impression that it might. Did you ever see the film Titanic, not the recent confection but the one starring Kenneth More? At one point a man is beside himself not knowing what to do for the best. More says “pull on that rope” which the man does. As the camera pulls back we see it is attached to a stanchion. Maybe it’s the same for all of us here, maybe not, but we have to try don’t we?

        • Sandra Lee Smith says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 12:46 pm

          I believe you mean the movie “A Night to Remember” with Kenneth More In the role of 2nd Mate Lytoler, circa 1954. There is an older movie titled “Titanic” but I don’t believe More is in it, if memory serves.

        • ECAW says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 12:51 pm

          Yeah, that was it.

        • Sandra Lee Smith says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 3:54 pm

          I thought so, when you named Kenneth More. It’s an excellent movie, based on the book by the same title.

  50. DFD says

    May 31, 2016 at 10:27 am

    Mac-101 says: “…. is the Pope Christian?”

    No!

  51. daniel sebold says

    May 31, 2016 at 10:40 am

    Is that what you believe, that only Christians can go to heaven? I was raised Catholic and don’t remember that as a Church doctrine. Is this what Catholics today believe–that only Christians can go to heaven? I am writing from Bangkok which is a Buddhist city with a lovely people. There are Muslim neighborhoods, though you would not know it except for an occasional mosque or a scarf on the head. The Muslims here seem to have no problem with the Thai girls and their short shorts. In fact, I would say the Christians back in Minneapolis where I grew up are far less tolerant. But, if what you say of Catholicism today is true, that only Christians can go to heaven, then surely it is not just a question of whether or not Islam is a wicked religion

    • CogitoErgoSum says

      May 31, 2016 at 12:44 pm

      Daniel, I have wondered about that too. I don’t think anybody can say for certain who will go to heaven and who will not. I believe that only Christ has the power to make that decision. The Bible has Jesus saying that “No one comes to the Father except through me” so somewhere along the line all souls must get the opportunity to stand before Jesus and receive judgement. Just when this judgment happens I am not sure but I think it takes place in the final seconds before the soul departs the physical body and Jesus comes to you to prepare you for your death. (That’s just my personal opinion and I’m assuming the laws of time and space do not apply while this is occurring)

      I also look to the story of the good thief hanging on the cross next to Jesus. This thief admitted he deserved to die for his crimes, rebuked the other thief for mocking Jesus and then asked to be remembered when Jesus entered His kingdom. Jesus responded that the penitent thief would be with Him in Paradise. So that tells me that anybody can be saved if they only ask and accept what Jesus offers them …. and this can happen at any point in life.

      Pope Francis caused a stir recently when asked a similar question and responded that even atheists can go to heaven. It was another one of his off-the-cuff remarks which requires further explanation and I would like to know myself what the official Church position is on the subject. I was raised Catholic also and I don’t remember being taught at my Catholic school that only Catholics or only Christians can go to heaven but maybe I was out sick the day that was discussed.

      It’s an interesting topic which requires much additional research, analysis and explanation and the Pope should have been prepared to give a deeper answer than what he is reported to have said.

      Perhaps some of the other readers here will be able to add more to this discussion. I’m curious too about what other Christians think concerning this subject.

      • Wellington says

        May 31, 2016 at 1:06 pm

        Speaking in general, CES, the three major divisions of Christianity have taken three different views on this particular matter. The typical Protestant view has traditionally been that one must be a Christian to go to Heaven. The Catholic view is that if one lives a Christ-like life, even though not a Christian, that person can go to Heaven. The Orthodox Christian world (e.g., Russian Orthodoxy) maintains that this is a matter for God to decide. I think some more mainstream Protestant denominations have recently inclined to either the Catholic or Orthodox view but the more fundamentalist a Protestant is the more likely the traditional Protestant view on this issue will be adhered to.

        • Graham Ford says

          May 31, 2016 at 2:03 pm

          The range of teaching on Salvation is not entirely surprising since the NT scriptures say a number of different things – often by the same people, implying their understanding of salvation was more ‘three-dimensional’ that many denominational statements allow.

          For example, St Peter in Acts 10:34-35 “‘I truly understand that God shows no partiality, but in every nation anyone who fears him and does what is right is acceptable to him.”

          Romans 2: 6-10 “For he will repay according to each one’s deeds: to those who by patiently doing good seek for glory and honour and immortality, he will give eternal life; while for those who are self-seeking and who obey not the truth but wickedness, there will be wrath and fury. There will be anguish and distress for everyone who does evil, the Jew first and also the Greek, but glory and honour and peace for everyone who does good, the Jew first and also the Greek. For God shows no partiality.”

          And by the same author, St. Paul, Ephesians 2:1-10 “You were dead through the trespasses and sins in which you once lived, following the course of this world, following the ruler of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work among those who are disobedient. All of us once lived among them in the passions of our flesh, following the desires of flesh and senses, and we were by nature children of wrath, like everyone else. But God, who is rich in mercy, out of the great love with which he loved us even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ[a]—by grace you have been saved— and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the ages to come he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness towards us in Christ Jesus. For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God— not the result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are what he has made us, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand to be our way of life.”

          and Jesus, in John 3:16-18 ‘For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal life.

          ‘Indeed, God did not send the Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Those who believe in him are not condemned.” and

          Matthew 5: 20, Jesus says, “For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.”

          Of the Roman Centurion, Matt 8:10 He said, “‘Truly I tell you, in no one in Israel have I found such faith.”

          So, unless our theology agrees with all such scriptures, and there are many more, we must admit it is wanting.

      • Hope says

        May 31, 2016 at 10:51 pm

        As a Christian, I don’t focus on the idea of who will go to heaven and who will not.

        First of all, I believe this is a matter for Almighty God to decide, and who am I to make such a declaration? Saint Peter said, “Humble yourself under the mighty hand of God.”

        Second, I have enough of my own faults and sins to worry about! As believers we should be concentrating on improving ourselves every day in thought, word, and deed. The Bible says, “Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.”

      • Champ says

        May 31, 2016 at 11:06 pm

        Great words of encouragement, Hope, and so true …thank you! 🙂

    • gravenimage says

      May 31, 2016 at 4:22 pm

      daniel sebold wrote:

      I am writing from Bangkok which is a Buddhist city with a lovely people. There are Muslim neighborhoods, though you would not know it except for an occasional mosque or a scarf on the head. The Muslims here seem to have no problem with the Thai girls and their short shorts. In fact, I would say the Christians back in Minneapolis where I grew up are far less tolerant…
      ………………………………

      Daniel, I realize that this is not the main point of your comments, but they seem the most salient here at Jihad Watch.

      I’m afraid that your idea that Muslims in Thailand are somehow all “moderate” and tolerant is quite mistaken.

      “Bangkok bombing that murdered 20 people at Hindu shrine was an Islamic jihad attack”

      https://www.jihadwatch.org/2015/08/bangkok-bombing-at-hindu-shrine-that-murdered-20-people-was-an-islamic-jihad-attack

      There is a vicious Islamic Jihad going on in the south of the country, as well. Here is just one story:

      “Ramadan in Thailand: Islamic jihadists murder six, injure eleven in string of bomb and arson attacks”

      https://www.jihadwatch.org/2015/07/ramadan-in-thailand-islamic-jihadists-murder-six-injure-eleven-in-string-of-bomb-and-arson-attacks

      Christians in Minneapolis–whatever else you might think of them–are not doing things like this.

      By the way, the Catholic Church has held since at least Vatican II back in 1964 that non-Catholics, if good people, can enter heaven.

      • Mazo says

        May 31, 2016 at 8:54 pm

        Farthead, the Bangkok bombing was committed by Uyghurs and Turks.

        The insurgency in South Thailand is an ethnic Malay insurgency.

        Thai speaking Muslims who live around Bangkok like Sonthi Boonyaratglin were not involved in any acts of violence.

        Next time you want to smear a group of people stick to your own kind.

      • Champ says

        May 31, 2016 at 9:07 pm

        Undoubtedly “Fessitude” will rush-in to defend Gravenimage against this unwarranted attack from Mazo–you know, since “Fess” considers it Gravens submissive duty to defend him and without hesitation. I mean “Fess” is *constantly* reminding us that it’s her job to come to his defense. But of course I’m kidding about “Fess” offering Graven a hand with this nasty creep, Mazo; since the friendship factor only works one-way in “Fess’s” twisted world of friendship …his way.

      • Champ says

        May 31, 2016 at 9:09 pm

        Mazo, you’re always so nasty and hard at work defending the indefensible: islam & company–tsk, tsk!

        Oh dear, I almost feel sorry for you …almost.

      • gravenimage says

        May 31, 2016 at 10:13 pm

        The repulsive Muslim supremacist Mazo wrote:

        Farthead (sic), the Bangkok bombing was committed by Uyghurs and Turks.
        ……………………………..

        This is not, of course, as cut-and-dried as Mazo would like us to think.

        At least one of the arrests was of a Thai Muslim woman.

        More:

        The insurgency in South Thailand is an ethnic Malay insurgency.
        ……………………………..

        The idea that this is perforce not a threat to Thailand is absurd.

        More:

        Thai speaking Muslims who live around Bangkok like Sonthi Boonyaratglin were not involved in any acts of violence.
        ……………………………..

        Where did I say that Sonthi Boonyaratglin was behind this bombing?

        It is notable, though, that this Mohammedan head of security (and later coup leader) has done a great deal to protect his coreligionists in the south, suggesting it was actually communists behind the terrorism there. Leaders of southern provinces were skeptical, to say the least.

        Even though the Jihad insurgency was escalating in 2007, he began *withdrawing* troops from there. He has said he wants to “negotiate” with the Jihadists.

        All pretty iffy stuff. I’m not sure I’d want to use this Muslim as the poster boy for Thai patriotism.

        Final point: how is noting that Muslims engage in violent Jihad “smearing” them? The repulsive Mazo certainly supports it.

      • gravenimage says

        May 31, 2016 at 10:17 pm

        Thank you, Champ.

      • daniel sebold says

        Jun 2, 2016 at 4:17 am

        When I landed in Kuala Lumpur last Janurary, arriving from Saudi Arabia, I saw a newspaper article of an ISIS arrest in KL. So Malaysia may have a problem, but I have never experienced it in Thailand with Thai Muslims, even in the South where it is supposedly dangerous. (I have no problem with going through Hat Yai tomorrow on my way to Malaysia) . I walk all over this city every day taking photos. I have something like thirty thousand photos of Bangkok, have flown in and out of here more than any other city. I have photographed over three hundred of the four hundred odd temples, churches and mosques–some of them repeatedly, walking through Cham Muslim neighborhoods and see no problem. There are lots of us western nuts who are totally enamored with this city and its funny people and can’t stay away from it. You can have ugly experiences here with the Thai tuk tuk drivers, so I never use them and know how not to use them. I just checked Wiki again and see no evidence that it was local Muslims. Uigyrs from northwest China who I think are Muslim may be the problem. Maybe Malay Muslims, but even so the problem looks more ethnic than religious. I do believe there are ideological problems with Islam but there are ideological problems with the Christians I served with in the US military. They were as radicalized as any Muslim terrorist group and would have no problem with going into Al Falujah and killing every man, woman and child..

      • gravenimage says

        Jun 9, 2016 at 6:15 pm

        Daniel Sebold wrote:

        I do believe there are ideological problems with Islam but there are ideological problems with the Christians I served with in the US military. They were as radicalized as any Muslim terrorist group and would have no problem with going into Al Falujah and killing every man, woman and child..
        ……………………………….

        Uh huh. That’s why Christians are mass-murdering Muslims everywhere…oh, wait…no they’re not.

        The fact is that Muslims are violently targeting Infidels all over the world–including in many parts of Thailand.

        The idea that Christians or other Infidels are similarly targeting Muslims is simply false.

    • Sandra Lee Smith says

      Jun 2, 2016 at 1:25 am

      That prohibition was firmly in place all through the ’50s . I grew up in a predominantly Catholic area, and went to masses with friends often, but not 1ever came to church with me. That was on LI.
      As for Salvation, none does come except through Jesus, and none comes to Him, except the Father draws that 1 to Him. Our choice is to either say yes and come, or say no and turn away.

  52. Supplicator says

    May 31, 2016 at 12:13 pm

    Here is what the Just War Doctrine has gotten us: the Islamofascists, who are out to destroy the world as we know it, justify their murderous jihad in the name of their G-d who they call Allah, just as Jews and Christians have justified their murderous trends in religious or racial cleansing since the Hebrews took the Promised Land.

    In my opinion, the author of the original article has spun the words of this poor, idealistic leader of the Roman Catholic Church in order to push her own agenda – Maria J. Stephan has a “dog in the hunt” and her career and her standard of living depend on the propagation of her ideas: She is a “contributor” to the Middle East Institute and works for Obama Administration as a strategic planner with the US State Dept. She is co-author of “Why Civil Resistance Works: The Strategic Logic of Nonviolent Conflict.” She is the editor of “Civilian Jihad: Nonviolent Struggle, Democratization and Governance in the Middle East.” She has also worked as Director of Policy and Research at the International Center on Nonviolent Conflict (ICNC) and was adjunct professor at Georgetown University and American University.

    Judging by Mr. Spencer’s reaction, and by the many comments from readers who seem to have an axe to grind with the Roman Catholic Church, unfortunately, the ramification of the spin seems likely to impact the unity of Catholic Christians and Jews in this confrontation with the Islamofascists.

    We have been duped: the Pope is not “jettisoning” what in my opinion is the flawed, non-scriptural, Just War Doctrine. The Just War Doctrine was manifested because it is in our DNA, our human condition. We need the Doctrine in order to help those who send us to war look at themselves in the mirror each day and sleep at night. Sadly, PTSD as a result of seeing war up close and personal is never mitigated by any doctrine. That reality stated, the Pope seems to be simply calling for dialogue in order to ensure war is indeed the last resort. Read the original article and look for the quotation marks.

    If one believes what the Hebrew Scriptures say, G-d, הוה, told His people, “Thou shall not kill.” Still, upon entering the Promised Land, the Israelites put to the sword the Canaanites, including their women, children, and even their livestock. The Hebrews justified this slaughter in their scriptures in order to salve their own consciences and souls – perhaps this was the first example of monotheistic man trying to reconcile killing before G-d.

    Confronted with the same need to justify Christians killing one other, which they did in great, untold numbers, and to justify Christians killing Jews and pagans in great, untold numbers, 1,200 years into A.D., Aquinas and Augustine, retreated from their Christian Scriptures, which commanded one to love his enemies, to the Hebrew Scriptures in order to salve the consciences and souls of the killers thousands of whom were sent by the Christian hierarchy and were going about their killing in the name of G-d. In the ancient Christian church monophysites were killing dyophysites and in more modern times (16th century and beyond) Catholics, Lutherans, and Reformed Protestants were all killing each other as well as millions of Jews.

    Now, 1,200 years after Muhammad, history repeats – different religion, same results.

    THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN HUMANS JUSTIFY WAR.

  53. gravenimage says

    May 31, 2016 at 3:35 pm

    Pope Francis might jettison idea of a ‘just war’
    …………………………….

    This falsely condemns *defensive* warfare as no different from unprovoked aggression–and it leaves us completely able to defend ourselves.

    The Greeks and Romans understood the difference–Ares (Mars) was the god of aggressive, conquering warfare; and he had fear, terror, and discord as his companions–whereas it is no coincidence that the goddess of defensive warfare, Athena (Minerva), was also the goddess of wisdom, courage, inspiration, law and justice, the arts, and civilization itself. You cannot hope to maintain such civilization if you do not have the moral right to defend them.

    More:

    As the 1992 Catechism of the Catholic Church describes, in order for the Church to sanction engaging in a war, “the damage inflicted by the aggressor on the nation or community of nations must be lasting, grave, and certain; all other means of putting an end to [the conflict] must have been shown to be impractical or ineffective; there must be serious prospects of success; [and] the use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated.”
    …………………………….

    Sounds like the very definition of just warfare to me.

    More:

    It included practices like supporting nonviolent direct action…
    …………………………….

    This is great–*if* you are facing an essentially moral polity which you believe is not living up to its own ethical standards. Examples of this are fights for civil rights for minorities, equal rights for women, and independence for nations.

    This paradigm basically worked for women gaining the vote in the United States and other parts of the West, India gaining independence from the British Empire, the civil rights movement in the United States in the 1950s and early ’60s, and the end of apartheid in South Africa.

    All essentially civilized places, where there was a eventually a great deal of public support from the society at large.

    But how would such “civil disobedience” work if it had been tried by the Jews in Germany and other Nazi-controlled places during the Holocaust? Clearly, it would not have. As for support in the general population, there would have been little enough of that–and the few who might have supported them would have been too terrified for their own safety had they spoken up.

    Obviously, the above is ridiculous to even suggest.

    And it would be just the same with Islam–and with many other aggressors.

    This from the Pope is nothing less than suicidal if followed–and will drive good people away from the church if it is not. Madness.

    But not a surprise. How many of this pontiff’s actions have tended to support our just supinely rolling over for Muslim savagery?

  54. Edward says

    May 31, 2016 at 6:10 pm

    Is the pope ignorant of the passages of the Holy Bible?

    Before 1990 I relied on the GUN for security. However, the more powerful the weapons were the more attraction to strife was witnessed.

    In 1992 a friend of mine introduced me to the Holy Bible……she especially pointing out to these passages:

    Ephesians 6:10-18 ‘God’s Suit of Armor’ and Psalm 19 ‘Trust in God’

    In time as my understanding of these passages increased my courage magnified to a point of me being invisible to danger. You may ask how this could be. Simply, it’s the affirmed BLESSINGS received from HIM. OUR CREATOR I understand!

    If Pope Francis is a man of GOD, he should be teaching these heavenly phenomena and not instructing us how to comport with our enemies…….this weakens our COURAGE.

    Sans our Courage we lose our BLESSINGS!

    Note: experiencing the results has made me a daily reader of the Holy Scriptures.

    2 Timothy 1:7 “For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.”

  55. Jack Holan says

    May 31, 2016 at 10:00 pm

    Are you referring to Pope Francis? I do have a sense not felt with previous Pontiffs that he craves the adulation he feels from the crowds cheering him and it pushes him even further

  56. Larry A. Singleton says

    May 31, 2016 at 11:22 pm

    RULES OF ENGAGEMENT 11-20-15

    Part I

    Study the “Rules of Engagement” and the fact that in Iraq and Afghanistan we left a sharia law totally intact that have been responsible for the mass murder of our troops and the troops of our allies like those from Australia and compare this with how we addressed Japanese Shintoism and German Nazism after WWII:

    Check out Obama’s “COIN (counterinsurgency) Strategy”, a fraud perpetrated on the American people, that was little more than “a post-modern form of human sacrifice” in Iraq and Afghanistan.

    Barbarians Inside the Gates: Navy Secretary Ray Mabus and the Cultural Evisceration of the U.S. Navy by Craig Luther.

    Our Estranged Generals: Our Generals Are Not on the Same Page as the Rest of Us. In Fact, They’re Not Even Reading From the Same Book by Caroline Glick.—-This is an article about the General Staff of Israel’s Defense Forces. But you could practically superimpose every fact in this article on what is happening in our military.

    This liberal, leftist, Commie, Christian hating multicultural suicide is now taking over our military. Our Sailors in fully armored and equipped gun boats were literally put on their knees by a couple of Iranian “fishing boats” and paraded and humiliated before the world. This administration actually had ROTC cadets march in red high heels to “feel what it’s like to be a woman”!!! Making soldiers wear lactation devices and lecturing them on “white privilege!!!!

    Russian Jets did barrel roles a stone throw from our war ships showing exactly how we have lost all credibility in the eyes of the world. Completely INSANE!

    NO2PC: Former Drill Sgt Unleashes HELL On Obama Admin.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sc7wrMR9F8k
    Active duty military members can’t say this or they risk getting into trouble, so I’ll say it for them because I will use this platform to bring to light the issues our men and women face that are doing their best to train and lead while having their hands tied behind their backs. I’m ashamed for what our military is turning into. The decaying of the military from the “give everyone a trophy” leaders that are fucking everything up, and creating an environment of weakness and softness. IT’S THE MILITARY! WE ARE NOT THE F**KING BOY SCOUTS! OUR JOB IS TO KILL AND TRAIN SOLDIERS TO KILL.

    How political correctness may hamper the fight against the Islamic State: Absolutely jaw-dropping.
    https://www.facebook.com/theblaze/videos/1018983194805687/?fref=nf

    Sayonara Shari’a: Japanese Lessons, Lost? By Andrew Bostom.

    “Gifts from Heaven”: The Meaning of the American Victory over Japan, 1945 by John David Lewis | Foreign Policy & Defense, History
    https://www.theobjectivestandard.com/issues/2007-winter/american-victory-over-japan-1945/
    Read this article for parallels on Afghanistan and Iraq and with how we’re fighting terrorism today. We are totally failing when it comes to identifying the enemy, stating our objectives and destroying our enemies. We should do with Islam the same as we did with the other state religion in Japan; Shinto. This was a policy of NO negotiation. Our policy was “surrender or die”. There status as a “defeated enemy and the democratic reforms were hammered into the heads of every man, woman and child in Japan.

    The U.S. Occupation of Japan—four Lessons for Iraq by Jean-Pierre Lehmann 1-28-04 What lessons for Iraq can the Bush Administration take away from the post-World War II occupation of Japan

    Poster on Japan’s Policies regarding Islam and Muslims (Facebook)
    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=190665434602056&set=gm.1515906135391074&type=3

    A Kamikaze Who Lived to Tell the Tale
    http://www.historynet.com/a-kamikaze-who-lived-to-tell-the-tale.htm
    But the fact that he did survive meant that he was able to correct the central myth of the kamikaze—that these young pilots all went to their deaths willingly, enthused by the Samurai spirit.

    The Glazov Gang: How “Rules of Engagement” Get U.S. Soldiers Killed 11-16-15
    http://www.jihadwatch.org/2015/11/the-glazov-gang-how-rules-of-engagement-get-u-s-soldiers-killed

    US Military Pilots Get Fed Up, Say Exactly What Obama Didn’t Want Them To
    http://www.westernjournalism.com/us-military-pilots-get-fed-up-boldly-say-exactly-what-obama-didnt-want-them-to/
    “There were times I had groups of ISIS fighters in my sights, but couldn’t get clearance to engage,” a Navy F-18 pilot tells Fox News in a report published Thursday. “They probably killed innocent people and spread evil because of my inability to kill them. It was frustrating.”

    Shades of Vietnam: Spike in U.S. troop deaths tied to stricter rules of engagement by Rowan Scarborough 12-5-13 (The Washington Times)
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/dec/5/increase-in-battlefield-deaths-linked-to-new-rules/?page=all

    Rules of Engagement getting Our soldiers killed at alarming rate by Doug Book 10-18-12 (Western Journalism)
    http://www.westernjournalism.com/rules-of-engagement-getting-our-soldiers-killed-at-alarming-rate/
    “Tragically, the unwillingness of today’s American leaders to decisively win a war is responsible for the needless—indeed, criminally callous and cynically disregarded—death of countless American soldiers.”

    The rules murdering our troops by Ralph Peters 9-24-09 (New York Post)
    http://nypost.com/2009/09/24/the-rules-murdering-our-troops/
    “Mission-focused, but morally oblivious, Gen. Stan McChrystal conformed to the Obama Way of War by imposing rules of engagement that could have been concocted by Code Pink…The next time you read about the death of a soldier or Marine in Afghanistan, don’t just blame the Taliban. Blame the generals and politicians who sent them to war, then took away their weapons”

    MORALS… We are dealing with Islamist who do not practice the same morals or culture of the USA. So a decorated Green Beret will be kicked out of the US Army … Watch this video!
    https://www.facebook.com/AmericansAgainstMuslimsakeOver/videos/941209502580778/

    Our “allies” Iraq, Pakistan and Afghanistan openly stabbed us in the back courting Iran while our troops literally died trying to “create a light unto the Muslim nation in Iraq” and Afghanistan. $2 trillian dollars, a decade long campaign in Iraq and look how well that turned out. One example; General Petreus crawled on his belly apologizing for that preacher who threatened to burn the Koran while totally ignoring the 8 UN workers and soldiers who were butchered by “regular” Muslims incited by local Imams who drove around inciting the local population to kill the infidels. They weren’t even terrorists or Taliban.

    Hating Jews, like hating America and all it stands for, is a badge of honor for Muslims. The Grand Mufti of Egypt, Sayyid Tantawi, the nearest Muslim equivalent to a pope, who was also the Grand Imam of Al Azhar University; the Vatican of Sunni Islam, famously said “More than 1/3 of the Koran deals with the Jews”. None of it good. And the reason why, again, the legacy of Jews living under Islam is one of pogroms, mass murder, rape, pillaging, looting, forced conversions, humiliation, ethnic cleansing, ghettos, Muslim Inquisitions that predated that of the Catholic church by 300 years. All this “Interfaith” and “Muslims lived a life of peaceful existence with the Jews and all that “Golden Age” crap is just that: CRAP!

    Read People Are the Same the World Over by Hugh Fitzgerald and The Vast Majority Myth by William Kilpatrick where they expose the fact that not everyone, everywhere loves the kind of “freedom” America is based on.

    Read what Tocqueville, the man who wrote Democracy in America, said about Islam and realize just how bankrupt our military and administration is when it comes to the “religion of peace”:

    Notes on the Quran: “Everything that relates to war is precise, everything that relates to morals is general & confused. Muhammad concerns himself far more with making himself believed than with giving rules of morality. And he employs terror much more that any other motive.

    “Reading the Koran is one of the most instructive things imaginable because the eye easily discovers there by closely observing all the threads by which the prophet held & still holds the members of his sect that the first of all religious duties is to blindly obey the prophet and that holy war is the first of all good deeds.

    “All of these doctrines of which the practical outcome is obvious are found on every page and in almost every word of the Quran are so striking that I cannot understand how any man with good sense could miss them.” Alexis de Tocqueville.

    Truth in Media: Origin of ISIS (Hint: The U.S. Government) (You Tube)

    • Larry A. Singleton says

      May 31, 2016 at 11:23 pm

      Part II

      The Anti-Refugee Immigration Video That is Going VIRAL Around The GLOBE!
      https://www.facebook.com/FreedomDailyNews/videos/1023438524384931/

      SHAMEFUL: Obama claims we don’t have ‘religious test’ for refugees, but LOOK what we found…by Michelle Jesse 11-17-15
      http://www.allenbwest.com/2015/11/shameful-obama-claims-we-dont-have-religious-test-for-refugees-but-look-what-we-found/

      Muslim Countries Refuse to Take a Single Syrian Refugee, Cite Risks of Exposure to Terrorism by Donna Rachel Edmunds 9-5-15
      http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/09/05/gulf-states-refuse-to-take-a-single-syrian-refugee-say-doing-so-exposes-them-to-risk-of-terrorism/
      Although the oil rich countries have handed over aid money, Britain has donated more than Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates and Qatar combined.

      4-Star Admiral Slams Obama: Muslim Brotherhood Infiltrated All Of Our National Security Agencies (You Tube and Family Security Matters)
      http://www.familysecuritymatters.org/publications/detail/muslim-brotherhood-has-penetrated-all-of-obamas-national-security-agencies?f=must_reads
      Muslim Brotherhood ties to the US government. Informative video by Tom Trento of the United West. Trento is dedicated to exposing the radical agenda of the Muslim Brotherhood–We are pulling back the veil to reveal how close to the Great Tribulation we currently are! We must recognize the signs of the Times!

      Former CIA Agent Says Obama is Working With The Muslim Brotherhood Against America by Melissa Davis 11-14-15
      http://usherald.com/former-cia-agent-says-obama-working-muslim-brotherhood-america/
      Clare Lopez, a former agent with the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA), has gone on the record about the Islamic influence of some members of the Obama administration saying the U.S. has now “switched sides.” She says America now supports the enemy in the war on terrorism, rather than devoting itself to stopping the spread of Sharia law, the stated goal of radical Islamic forces.

      Raymond Ibrahim: D.C. Refuses to Arm Persecuted Christians Fighting ISIS by Raymond Ibrahim 11-18-15
      http://www.jihadwatch.org/2015/11/raymond-ibrahim-d-c-refuses-to-arm-persecuted-christians-fighting-isis
      In recent months, Mideast Christians have been forming militias to fight the Islamic State (IS) and other jihadi groups in both Iraq and Syria—even as the Obama administration, which arms the “opposition,” refuses to arm them.

      Exposing Obama’s Muslim Operatives in His Administration
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EW3vniK5cx4

      Ten Part “Muslim Brotherhood in America” by Frank Gaffney (Center for Security Policy)
      http://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.org/the-muslim-brotherhood-in-america/

      A Troubling Influence: An Islamic 5th Column Penetrates the White House by Frank Gaffney Jr. With an Introduction: Why We are Publishing this Article by David Horowitz (Frontpage Magazine)
      http://archive.frontpagemag.com/readArticle.aspx?ARTID=15084

      The Islamist-and Their Enablers- Assault on the Right: The Case Against Grover Norquist and Suhail Khan (Introduction and pdf) (Center for Security Policy)
      http://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.org/2014/02/11/the-islamists-and-their-enablers-assault-on-the-right-the-case-against-grover-norquist-and-suhail-khan-2/

      A Disturbing Event: the American Conservative Union Embraces an Islamist by Raymond Ibrahim (Frontpage Magazine)
      http://www.frontpagemag.com/2012/raymond-ibrahim/a-disturbing-event-the-american-conservative-union-embraces-an-islamist/

      Justice and the Obama Justice Department by Former Attorney General Michael B. Mukasey. (Imprimis)

      Foreign Policy and the Constitution by Tom Cotton. (Imprimis)
      Obama’s U.N. Plan: Globaize Cops Against ‘Violent Extremists’ by Leo Hohmann.

      US Attorney General, US Cities, Join UN to Create Global Police Force Initiative!
      https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=1042128009145249

      What’s the Goal of DOJ’s Strong Cities Network? by Johanna Markind 10-8-15
      http://www.islamist-watch.org/21128/what-the-goal-of-doj-strong-cities-network#print

      Column One: Obama’s Enemies List: Today Iran is harming America directly in multiple ways by Caroline Glick.
      http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Column-One-Obamas-enemies-list-411390

      First, an act of war followed by spinelessness. Then cowardice in the face of the enemy: Iran fires upon, seizes U.S. commercial ship, U.S. “monitoring” the situation April 28, 2015 By Robert Spencer (Jihad Watch)
      http://www.jihadwatch.org/2015/04/iran-fires-upon-seizes-u-s-commercial-ship-u-s-monitoring-the-situation

      U.S. Denies Treaty-Bound Duty to Protect Marshall Islands from Iran
      by Lt. Col. James G. Zumwalt, USMC (Ret) (Gatestone Institute)
      http://www.familysecuritymatters.org/publications/detail/us-denies-treaty-bound-duty-to-protect-marshall-islands-from-iran?f=must_reads
      “Pentagon lawyers have determined US has no obligation to come to the defense of a Marshall Islands-flagged vessel at sea.”

      America Doesn’t Have a Gun Problem. It Has a Democrat Problem by Daniel Greenfield.

      The San Bernardino Killer’s Family Sure Is A Cair Clan: They’re being represented by the unindicted co-conspirators in terrorism by 12-3-15 Daniel Greenfield
      https://www.frontpagemag.com/point/261002/san-bernardino-killers-family-sure-cair-clan-daniel-greenfield

      Daniel Greenfield Moment: Why Feminism Failed Cologne’s Women.
      http://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/01/daniel-greenfield-moment-why-feminism-failed-colognes-women/comment-page-1#comment-1366715

      Women’s Studies and the Moral Vacuity of an Academic Boycott Against Israel: Feminists Turn a Blind Eye to the Real Oppression of Women by Richard L. Cravatts 12-7-15

      • Larry A. Singleton says

        May 31, 2016 at 11:24 pm

        Part III

        Administration Nixed Probe Into Southern California Jihadists by Phillip Haney:

        “We had these two groups in our sights; if the investigation had continued and additional links been identified and dots connected, we might have given advance warning of the terrorist attack in San Bernardino. The combination of Farook’s involvement with the Dar Al Uloom Al Islamiyah Mosque and Malik’s attendance at al-Huda would have indicated, at minimum, an urgent need for comprehensive screening. It could also have led to denial of Malik’s K-1 visa or possibly gotten Farook placed on the No Fly list.

        “But after more than six months of research and tracking; over 1,200 law enforcement actions and more than 300 terrorists identified; and a commendation for our efforts; DHS shut down the investigation at the request of the Department of State and DHS’ own Civil Rights and Civil Liberties Division. They claimed that since the Islamist groups in question were not Specially Designated Terrorist Organizations (SDTOs) tracking individuals related to these groups was a violation of the travelers’ civil liberties. These were almost exclusively foreign nationals: When were they granted the civil rights and liberties of American citizens?

        “Worse still, the administration then went back and erased the dots we were diligently connecting. Even as DHS closed my investigation, I knew that data I was looking at could prove significant to future counterterror efforts and tried to prevent the information from being lost to law enforcement. In 2013, I met with the DHS Inspector General in coordination with several members of Congress to attempt to warn the American people’s elected representatives about the threat.

        “In retaliation, DHS and the Department of Justice subjected me to a series of investigations and adverse actions, including one by that same Inspector General. None of them showed any wrongdoing; they seemed aimed at stopping me from blowing the whistle on this problem. Earlier this year, I was finally able to honorably retire from government and I’m now taking my story to the American people as a warning.

        “My law enforcement colleagues and I must conduct our work while respecting the rights of those we monitor. But what I witnessed suggests the Obama administration is more concerned with the rights of non-citizens in known Islamist groups than with the safety and security of the American people.”

        Immediate action request to:
        Mitch McConnell – Senate Majority Leader
        Frank J. Larkin – Sergeant at Arms United States Senate
        Paul Ryan – Speaker of the House
        Paul D. Irving – Sergeant at Arms United States House of Representatives

        I call for the immediate arrest of President Barack Hussein Obama aka Barry Sortero aka Barry Obama aka Barack Hussein Sortero for the crime of treason.

        For repeatedly subverting the constitution of United States of America.

        For aiding and abetting our enemies, by giving aid, comfort, material and financial support. For signing into law measures which were not legally passed by congress. For illegally selling weapons of war in Libya to Syrian terrorists now known as ISIS aka ISIL. For engaging in an illegal war in Libya, against the war powers act, and without the authorization of the United States Congress. For implementing rules of engagement for the US Military designed to allow enemies of the United States to continue operations against the US and it’s allies.

        For felony fraud by providing fraudulent documents concerning his eligibility to hold the office of president. For providing a forged Hawaiian birth certificate. For fraud committed against the Social Security Administration by using a social security number that does not belong to him. For identity theft against one Harrison J. Brunnel (now deceased) whose social security number Obama has been fraudulently using. For blatant fraud in misstating the scope, cost, and details of the Affordable Health Care and Patient Protection Act. If in fact Mr. Obama is a natural born US citizen, for fraud committed against Columbia University for enrolling and attending as a foreign student.

        For blatantly violating federal law by allowing and insisting upon the admittance of individuals belonging to organizations who have declared the US as an enemy, access into the United States.

        For illegally suppressing and sealing records of cabinet and judicial appointees.

        For failure to instruct the Department of Justice to investigate and prosecute the theft of and/or misappropriation of five billion dollars from the US treasury under former Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton. For failure to prosecute former Secretary Clinton for trafficking in classified information

        For illegally using the IRS to suppress organizations whose views oppose his.

        For illegally using the EPA to suppress free market commerce under the unproven belief of man made global warming.

        For granting exemptions to the Affordable Health Care and Patient Protection Act to campaign contributors.

        For illegally suspending the enforcement of federal laws on immigration. For illegally implementing de facto amnesty for illegal aliens via executive order. For releasing criminal illegal aliens back into the population of the United States.

        For repeatedly attempting to infringe upon the 2nd amendment rights of US citizens to keep and bear arms.

        For repeatedly attempting to infringe upon the 1st amendment rights of freedom of speech and freedom of religion of of US citizens.

        For violating the Constitution by gathering personal information of US citizens without a warrant.

        For violating nearly every condition in his oath of office.

        I also call for the immediate removal of all cabinet, bureaucratic and judicial appointees made by President Obama, and that all policies, proclamations and judicial decisions made by said appointees be nullified.

        This is but a short list of legal offenses committed by the sitting President and is by no means a complete account. Many more violations and crimes are sure to come to light once thoroughly and honestly investigated. His moral offenses also call into question his ability to hold the office of President and Commander in Chief.

        Every single elected and appointed official, whether city, county, state or federal who has taken an oath of office, is bound by his or her oath of office to protect and the defend the constitution of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic. Any and all officials who have failed to take action for the above offenses are in direct violation of their oaths of office.

        • gravenimage says

          Jun 1, 2016 at 10:20 pm

          Larry, you are right that the military rules of engagement in the US and the rest of the West have gone from ethical to suicidally impossible.

  57. Larry A. Singleton says

    May 31, 2016 at 11:29 pm

    Christians Against Jews 11-18-14

    TO THOSE WHO SAY AS CHRISTIANS WE SHOULDN’T SUPPORT DONALD TRUMP! Highways and Hedges Ministries’s video.
    https://www.facebook.com/evangelistandrewgreen/videos/1018406378242009/

    Part I

    “Why is the Pope Provoking War in Israel?” by Brad MacDonald. (The Philidelphia Trumpet)
    https://www.thetrumpet.com/article/12623.2.0.0/why-is-the-pope-provoking-war-in-israel
    Print: https://www.thetrumpet.com/article/12623.2.0.0/why-is-the-pope-provoking-war-in-israel?print

    The Dark Side of the Pope’s Visit to Jerusalem by Gerald Flurry (The Philidelphia Trumpet)
    https://www.thetrumpet.com/article/11869.24.166.0/middle-east/israel/the-dark-side-of-the-popes-visit-to-jerusalem?preview

    Catholic Aid Societies and Political Campaigns Directed at Israel (NGO Monitor—Executive Summery)
    http://www.ngo-monitor.org/article/catholic_aid_societies_and_political_campaigns_directed_at_israel_0

    Complaint says crosses at Catholic school offensive, prevent Muslim prayers (Beliefnet News)
    http://www.beliefnet.com/columnists/news/2011/10/lawsuit-says-crosses-at-catholic-university-offensive-prevent-muslim-prayers.php
    “Crosses in every room at Washingon D.C.’s Catholic University of America are a human rights violation that prevent Muslim students from praying.”

    Pope Calls “Palestinian” Leader Abbas an “Angel of Peace”
    http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2015/05/16/pope-calls-palestinian-leader-angel-of-peace/
    Pope Francis praised Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas as an “angel of peace” during a meeting Saturday at the Vatican that underscored the Holy See’s warm relations with the Palestinians.

    United Church of Christ and The “Big Lie” by Susan Warner
    http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5862/united-church-of-christ

    “The Christian Aid Conference on Peace and Justice in the Holy Land” by Denis MacEoin (Gatestone Institute) (See “Wafa al-Biss”)
    I would STRONGLY urge you to first read the Appendix at the end of the article: “From a letter to an anti-Israel activist, to be published in 2013”
    http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/3529/christian-aid-conference-holy-land

    NGO Monitor: The Role of Antisemtism in the Presbyterian Church (USA)’s Dcision to Support Divestment.

    Presbyterians to Divest as Protest Against Israel by Jeff Karoub and Rachel Zoli.

    Presbyterian Church USA Voted on Erasing “Israel” from Prayers by Lea Speyer.

    Presbyterian Church USA Considered Banning the Word ‘Israel’ From Prayers by Elders of Ziyon.

    Presbyterian Church ‘Demonizing Israel’ with Divestment Vove by Lea Speyer.

    The Dangers of Muslim-Christian ‘Interfaith Dialogue’ by Robert Spencer.

    Has the Church in the U.S.Succumbed to the Charms of Islam? By William Kilpatrick.

    New Anti-Semitism Tailored for Evangelicals by Christine Williams (Gatestone Institute) (And her latest: Feeding Christians Propaganda Against Jews)
    http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/4230/christ-at-the-checkpoint
    “For any self-respecting person, the endorsement of terror… at a Christian conference is obscene.” — Kay Wilson, tour guide attacked by Palestinian terrorists.

    Response to the Anti-Israel Event at London’s St. James Church (Gatestone Institute)
    http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/4123/st-james-church

    In the Shadow of Death by Kay Wilson

    I would be remiss if I didn’t submit one thing concerning something called the Kairos Document. I strongly urge you to do your research into this aspect and the World Council of Churches mentioned in this article. If this is the same WCC I saw get a mention in the book “Disinformation” by Gen Ion Mihai Pacepa who says that the WCC has been infiltrated top to bottom by the Soviets. Don’t take my word for it. Read the book. It’s an ass-kicker.

    The Palestinian “Kairos” Document: A Behind-the-Scenes Analysis by Malcolm Lowe
    http://www.newenglishreview.org/Malcolm_Lowe/The_Palestinian_%22Kairos%22_Document%3A_A_Behind-the-Scenes_Analysis/

    The Source: http://www.kairospalestine.ps/

    This group and this document is about as despicable the Hamas Charter and the Protocols of the Elders of Zion. Read this document along with Lowe’s article. Including “Who Are the Heads of Churches in Jerusalem”, “Former German President to Praise Anti-Israel Theologian” and “Palestinian Theologian” Trashes “Palestinian Theology”. (A Smorgasbord of Swedish Anti-Semitism by Nima Gholam Ali Pour 1-2-16 and mention of Chruch of Sweden and Kairos Palestine Document.)

    The Church of Sweden Used as a Weapon Against Israel by by Tobias Petersson, Nima Gholam Ali Pour

    Presbyterian Church’s guide is dead wrong about Iranian Jewry by Karmel Melamed (Jewish Journal)
    http://www.jewishjournal.com/iranianamericanjews/item/presbyterian_churchs_guide_is_dead_wrong_about_iranian_jewry

    Islamists Exploiting the Interfaith Racket by Hillel Zaremba (FrontPage Magazine)
    http://www.frontpagemag.com/2012/hillel-zaremba/islamists-exploiting-the-interfaith-racket/

    UK: The Interfaith Industry by Samuel Westrop (Gatestone Institute)
    http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/4051/uk-interfaith

    Anti-Israel Palestinian Lutheran Pastor Mitri Raheb of Bethlehem to receive German Media Prize
    http://www.fighthatred.com/recent-events/individual-hate/991-anti-israel-palestinian-lutheran-pastor-mitri-raheb-of-bethlehem-to-receive-german-media-prize

    BDS Movement: Barbarians Inside the Gates – Part I by Denis MacEoin
    http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/4274/bds-movement

    BDS Movement: Barbarians Inside the Gates – Part II by Denis MacEoin
    http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/4275/bds-movement-barbarians

    The Palestinians’ Real Enemies by Efraim Karsh
    http://www.meforum.org/3766/palestinians-enemies

    Hamas’ “Gift” To Israel on Independence Day by Khaled Abu Toameh (I attached this article to the ones above in my file.)
    http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/4304/hamas-video-hatikvah

    The End of Evangelical Support for Israel? by David Brog
    http://www.meforum.org/3769/israel-evangelical-support

    Moderate Fatah threatens Israelis: “This is a land of a Palestinian state and the occupation to leave immediately”
    http://www.jihadwatch.org/2014/05/moderate-fatah-threatens-israelis-this-is-a-land-of-a-palestinian-state-and-the-occupation-to-leave-immediately

    “Letter to the Editor” International Herald Tribune, July 1, 2003 by Giulia Boukhobza (Also in Andrew G. Bostom’s “Legacy of Islamic Antisemitism”: Chapter 68, page 677: “A Libyan Jew Breaks Her Silence 36 yrs after surviving the 67 Tripolitan Pogrom”)
    http://faithfreedom.org/forum2/viewtopic.php?t=6423&sid=49c22d2ad59e3561b5fb8fe0a2eae537

    • Larry A. Singleton says

      May 31, 2016 at 11:29 pm

      Part II

      Historical Facts and Figures: the Forgotten Jewish Refugees from Arab Countries
      http://unispal.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/0/FE7989175118CDA585256D750050CBC9

      Jews Displaced from Arab Countries: A Story of Collusion (pdf)
      (See p-4 “Exhibit E”!)
      http://www.justiceforjews.com/chrono_web.pdf

      A japanese View of the Palestinians by Yashiko Sagamori
      http://www.freeman.org/m_online/mar03/sagamori.htm

      This is Islam: “She’s Buried Chest High”
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXdy5Fwwfzg

      Martin Kramer:
      Gaza is a place with no Israeli settlements, from which Israel has totally withdrawn to the 1967 lines, and which nonetheless has become a Hamas terror state. That’s what happens in conditions of Gazafication. So when people say that in a two-state solution, Palestinians would have a “right of return” to the West Bank and not Israel, I do not find that particularly reassuring either. Any influx of Palestinians across the Jordan poses a problem for Israel, and it is naive to dismiss it. I would like to hear how, in a two-state scenario, Gazafication of the West Bank can be prevented. I haven’t heard it yet.

      Neither have I.

      Read The Haj by Leon Uris. And ask these questions:

      What year did the nation of Palestine come into existance?
      What were its national borders and what year did it cease to exist?
      What currency did the nation of Palestine use and why is there no history of it?
      Name one leader to the “nation of Palestine” prior to Yasser Arafat.

      The Israeli Solution: A One-State Plan for Peace in the Middle East by Caroline B. Glick. READ THIS BOOK!!!

      The Haj by Leon Uris (A Primer on the “right to return” scam)
      Lessons from ‘The Haj’ A book review by Joseph Puder
      http://www.frontpagemag.com/2011/joseph-puder/lessons-from-the-haj/print/

      and

      Because They Hate: A Survivor of Islamic Terror Warns America by Brigitte Gabriel (These three books should be sold as a gift set.)

      The Case for Israel by Alan Dershowitz

      Amb. Prosor addresses UNGA debate on the Question of Palestine (You Tube) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a1–Os_apR0

      BDS: The Attempt to Strangle Israel (You Tube)
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTuTL8aCx6k

      Fiction: The Source by James Michener-Need proof of the Jewish claim to Jerusalem?
      Non-Fiction: Archaeology Exclusive: Ancient Gold Treasure Discovered in Jerusalem https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRP-qAzLIRo
      The Book of Jewish Knowledge by Nathan Ausubel
      The Archaeology of Ancient Israel by Amnon Ben-Tor
      The Pledge by Leonard Slater. A book about how the Jews got arms to Israel for the war of Independence.

      The Legacy of Islamic Antisemitism: From the Sacred Texts to Solemn History by Andrew G. Bostom (Read the “Note on the Cover Art-Execution of a Moroccan Jewess” or this book Review/article by Benjamin District; “Jewess Heroine-Sol Hachuel”.
      http://myrightword.blogspot.com/2008/02/jewess-heroine-sol-hachuel.html

      Supplemental Article “The First and Last Enemy: Jew Hatred in Islam.” by Bostom
      http://archive.frontpagemag.com/readArticle.aspx?ARTID=28549

      The Legacy of Jihad: Islamic Holy War and the Fate of Non-Muslims by Andrew G. Bostom MD

      Book Review-The Legacy of Jihad by: Alyssa A. Lappen (Frontpage Magazine)
      http://archive.frontpagemag.com/readArticle.aspx?ARTID=7334

      The Legacy of Islamic Totalitarianism: Sharia vs. Freedom by Andrew G. Bostom. Read the Reviews on this latest book by Eileen F. Toplansky and Alyssa A. Lappen (Get the whole set)

      Book Review by Eileen F. Toplansky Tackling the Totalitarianism of Islam (American Thinker)
      http://www.americanthinker.com/2012/10/tackling_the_totalitarianism_of_islam.html

      Book Review by Alyssa A. Lappen-Sharia States: Totalitarian to the Core
      http://pjmedia.com/blog/sharia-states-totalitarian-to-the-core/

      Also read his other Review on Amazon
      http://www.amazon.com/Sharia-Versus-Freedom-Islamic-Totalitarianism-ebook/dp/B00C4B2HEK

      A Concise History of the Crusades by Thomas F. Madden

      Slavery, Terrorism and Islam, (and Holocaust in Rwanda), by Peter Hammond (This is an Ass-Kicking little resource of 276 pages.)

      Indoctrination U: The Left’s War Against Academic Freedom and The Professors: The 101 Most Dangerous Academics in America by David Horowitz

      “Indoctrinate U.” Watch This Documentary!!! (You Tube Video)
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHyvRHrYYBA

      Subscribe to Jihad Watch and Campus Watch and the Middle East Forum/Quarterly, Family Security Matters, Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI), Gatestone Institute, FrontPage Magazine, American Thinker, The Clarion Project, NGO Monitor, Answering Islam, Cross Muslims, Palestinian Media Watch (PMW), Islamist Watch, Muhammad unveiled, Pat Condell, Religion of Peace and read Raymond Ibrahim, Andrew Harrod, Efraim Karsh, Denis MacEoin, Andrew G. Bostom, Frank Gaffney, Martin Kramer, Alan Dershowitz, David Horowitz, Robert Spencer, Pamella Geller, Patrick Poole, Caroline Glick, Hugh Fitzgerald, Ralph Sidway, Bat Ye’or and others.

  58. daniel sebold says

    Jun 1, 2016 at 12:51 am

    When I was growing up in the small town of Worthington, Minnesota back in the early sixties, I attended Saint Mary’s Elementary School where I was regularly slapped around by my first grade teacher for day dreaming and stood in the corner (Misses Ostrafeldt was later committed to a mental institution). Notre Dame nuns in very conservative habits that formed a small oval around their faces told us children that it was a venial sin to wear shorts and a mortal sin to wear shorts shorts, that we would burn in hell for showing our thighs in public. My Catholic mother who later also claimed to be a feminist told me only girls could wear short shorts, that it wasn’t natural for boys to do so, and, in fact, was outright unnatural and grotesque if a boy showed his thighs in public, though, oddly enough, there were boys in early and late sixties running around in short shorts in America, though not today anymore.

    I have traveled 75 countries, fought in the ’91 Gulf War, have lived in Saudi Arabia, Oman, Greece, Thailand, Mexico and South Korea. When I go back to the USA I don’t feel for me as a male, when I go to the mall and see all the men and boys in calf length shorts and all the women in their short shorts, I don’t see where it is all that much better for men in America than for men in Saudi Arabia. I can wear the same hip hop shorts to the mall in Saudi Arabia. Of course, I am not interested in spreading my Catholicism to the rest of the world, not interested in converting Muslims to the relatively indecent religion of Roman Catholicism.

    It is really weird to read all these attempts to scour the Bible to look for an excuse to kill Muslims. In fact, I have never been bothered by Muslims in America for what I wear to the beach. It is always the Christians that tell me that men can’t wear Speedos to the beach. I would be curious to know how many of the Catholics and Christians on this page have gone through what I have gone through but who still think that Christianity is a groovy way to raise children. I frankly feel the world would be a better a place with neither of these religions for both moral and scientific reasons.

    I wonder what brand of Catholicism Robert Spencer believes in.

    • Jay Boo says

      Jun 1, 2016 at 2:07 am

      daniel
      Did you find the Saudi people friendly and hospitable.
      I hear that they have a low crime rate.

      • daniel sebold says

        Jun 1, 2016 at 2:23 am

        The best place to live in Saudi is Jizan Province down on the Saudi Yemen border. I used to live above a goat market where these very colorfully clothed Saudi Yemen’s would sell their goats in the late afteroon. I have incredible photos of Saudi yemen fathers carrying babies with their children standing next to them in the market. I also have National Geographic quality photos of a one kilometer line of yemeni refugees in Jizan standing in line at immigration because the Saudi miliitary had destroyed their homes in Yemen during the current war against the Houthis, The people are poorer and more humble their than the more materialistic Saudis in the capital.

        The biggest danger living in Saudi is crossing the street. The Hiluxes come at you and wont stop until they run over you. Check out Saudi Drifting videos on You Tube if you want to see a disconnect between the religion of peace and the madness of every day life in a lawless land. I have lots of photos posted on Facebook, but it would take a few years to scroll down to the Saudi photos which were less than a year ago.

        • Jay Boo says

          Jun 1, 2016 at 2:42 am

          If Saudi’s have a sense of humor, they would love my comments about Islam. Just in case they do not, I will be watching out for The Hiluxes.

    • Jay Boo says

      Jun 1, 2016 at 2:10 am

      BTW
      No offence but during the ’91 Gulf War were you employed as a Saudi bodyguard.

      • daniel sebold says

        Jun 1, 2016 at 2:25 am

        Well said, Jay

    • gravenimage says

      Jun 1, 2016 at 10:33 pm

      Daniel Sebold wrote:

      I don’t see where it is all that much better for men in America than for men in Saudi Arabia…
      ……………………………….

      *Really*? Ask these guys:

      “‘At about 20 I lost count because I was in too much pain’: British man given 50 lashes reveals barbaric punishment awaiting frail grandfather”

      http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3270600/At-20-lost-count-pain-British-man-given-50-lashes-allegedly-breaking-Middle-East-s-strict-alcohol-laws-horror-barbaric-punishment-awaiting-frail-grandfather.html

      Ask the other victims at Chop Chop Square, as well.

      By the way, your implication that it is illegal for men to wear short shorts in the United States is mistaken at best. The fashion right now is for longer shorts for men; that does not mean that bucking fashion here is illegal. It is not.

      More:

      It is really weird to read all these attempts to scour the Bible to look for an excuse to kill Muslims.
      ……………………………….

      You appear to believe that the problem in the world is Christians murdering Muslims; it is not.

      However, Muslims are mass-slaughtering Christians and other Infidels. Perhaps you should read here more at Jihad Watch to see the truth of this.

      • daniel sebold says

        Jun 2, 2016 at 1:41 am

        We Christians killed over a million Muslims in the 2,003 Iraq War, according to the World Health Organization which goes from door to door and asks people how many have been lost. That is far far more than what ISIS has killed, and ISIS wouldn’t exist had we not done this war crime. Most who died in Iraq were civilians, as in Al Falluja. We really need to leave those people alone and develop alternatives to oil. Just a suggestion. I mean, seriously, there is something wrong with Islam. It is a dark depressing grim reaper religion.

        As far as the USA is concerned, it has gone through over fifty years of feminism and sexism conscious raising as well as the human rights movements of the sixties and seventies and yet black women are being incarcerated and murdered by the police in Texas for issues like not using a turn signal, and gay/transgender children are still being beaten up and murdered in the public schools. There is no excuse for these kinds of human rights problems in a country with this kind of wealth, with excellent libraries and schools, excellent teachers. Well, maybe not excellent teachers. Most are creationist illiterates.

        I have no problem with you and your friends being for killing off ISIS, or for going after Muslim extremists in Europe and America, but are you going to do it? Or are you advocating that someone else does the job for you? Because I have already fought in the Middle East,and what with my age and declining health I am not sure I am up to it, and with the gay witch hunts I went through when I came home to the land of the free, and my diabetic toes, i doubt the military would have me anymore. though I was a highly rated Arabic linguist. Frankly, I don’t think I am up to going back to the States again to put up with all the hate from the Christian right. What the hell is there to go back to? It is nothing. When I go live in Saudi Arabia, nobody tells me i am free. I follow their rules, and people leave me alone. I make my money for a year, then go to Thailand for a couple years. In America, they constantly are telling you how free you are as the police state runs around threatening everyone who is different, throwing transgender people out of shopping malls for their attire while the Hooter’s girls run around with their butts sticking out of their shorts. Shopping malls are one less place to go in America, and many are boarded up now anyway, so no problem, i guess.

        When i go back to America, I will travel on Greyhound Buses where the drivers are constantly threatening people for nothing. They grunt at you like gorillas–meaning the bus is about to leave, and you have to try and interpret this strange new American metalanguage. The Bus Stations are filled with obese people who are dying while watching Fox News in the waiting room. Impoverished war veterans in Oklahoma complain to me that they are suffering from post traumatic stress and that they can’t get their money from the government. They will twitch and twist in their seats, and then will look at you and tell you they just got back from Afghanistan. God, i am so glad to get back home to Bangkok where I have my freedom, can wear whatever I want on the streets. The only people that harass me here are redneck American tourists and all they do is fight with other tourists and harass the katoui transgender community of Bangkok. The Thai police are always glad to see me come back. Thailand, the land of the free as long as you don’t insult the King’s dogs. That will get you get you 38 years.

        By the way, I am going to Malaysia tomorrow for a visa run, a very tolerant Muslim country where, like Indonesia, Turkey and Dubai, you can wear whatever you want on the street no matter what gender and the Muslims leave you alone. Can’t say the same for the Christians in America

        • Jay Boo says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 12:49 pm

          Daniel said,
          “We Christians killed over a million Muslims in the 2,003 Iraq War”
          Was that number from Huff Post or Al Qaeda’s online magazine?

          Does that number include Muslims killed by other Muslims?
          Cite a reliable source

        • Jay Boo says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 12:53 pm

          Many Americans living in Saudi as contractors are probably too busy boinking Pilipino “maids” to dare criticize their boss man’s evil ideology.

        • Jay Boo says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 12:55 pm

          boinking (underage) Pilipino “maids”

        • daniel sebold says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 12:58 pm

          I already sited my source: The World Health Organization which actually goes out into the field and is the most reputable source by an standards on this topic. I value their statistics on the subject in the same way that I value the work of those who actually take the time to go out and look at the facts. I don’t rely on Bible creationists or Koran thumping morons.

        • Sandra Lee Smith says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 3:50 pm

          You DO realize the whole UN, including the WHO is nothing but a tool of the NWO globalists whose goal is to have some 6 1/2 billions of us die, because we’re “polluting their Earth” and the remainder will be allowed to be their serfs in the most feudal context? Of course they’d “never fudge their stats”, like the whole climate change fiasco, or anthing like that….

        • Angemon says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 6:07 pm

          daniel sebold posted:

          “I already sited my source: The World Health Organization (…). I value their statistics on the subject in the same way that I value the work of those who actually take the time to go out and look at the facts”

          Oh, dearie. You wrote:

          We Christians killed over a million Muslims in the 2,003 Iraq War, according to the World Health Organization

          http://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/releases/2008/pr02/en/

          A large national household survey conducted by the Iraqi government and WHO estimates that 151 000 Iraqis died from violence between March 2003 and June 2006.

          The findings, published today on the web site of the New England Journal of Medicine, are based on information collected during a wider survey of family health in Iraq, designed to provide a basis for the Iraqi government to develop and update health policies and plan services.

          The estimate is based on interviews conducted in 9345 households in nearly 1000 neighbourhoods and villages across Iraq. The researchers emphasize that despite the large size of the study, the uncertainty inherent in calculating such estimates led them to conclude that the number of Iraqis who died from violence during that period lies between 104 000 and 223 000.

          Somewhere between 104 and 223k people killed violently – which, mind you, is not the same as having being killed by coalition troops, who, BTW are of diverse backgrounds, including religion.

          Seems like you value WHO numbers so much you don’t want to use them to begin with, lest they become worn out or something…

        • Angemon says

          Jun 2, 2016 at 5:33 pm

          daniel sebold posted:

          “We Christians killed over a million Muslims in the 2,003 Iraq War, according to the World Health Organization which goes from door to door and asks people how many have been lost. ”

          OK, so let me see if I got that MO right:

          Step 1 – Ask people how many they lost
          Step 2 – Christians did it. All of them.

          Now, I’m not a member of the WHO, but I don’t think that’s a good MO, especially considering that shias and sunnis in Iraq are killing one another because each considers the other heretics.

          “By the way, I am going to Malaysia tomorrow for a visa run, a very tolerant Muslim country where, like Indonesia, Turkey and Dubai, you can wear whatever you want on the street no matter what gender and the Muslims leave you alone.”

          Ah, I hadn’t realized that your posts were satire and not meant to be taken seriously 😉

        • gravenimage says

          Jun 9, 2016 at 7:39 pm

          Daniel, if you *really* believe that Malaysia, Turkey, and Dubai are freer than America, and think that Greyhound Bus drivers are more threatening than are Jihad terrorists, then there is really nothing that anyone here can do for you.

        • Concerned Indians says

          Jun 9, 2016 at 8:58 pm

          Gravenimage,please let me know how the middle eastern nations such as UAE are or appear moderate.This is what attracts people and they feel Islam is not bad.I would like to know how these few small nations,albeit for tourism and business,can manage to attract people from all nations and impress them.Thanks and regards,

  59. somehistory says

    Jun 1, 2016 at 3:45 am

    First of all, there is only One individual between God and man, Jesus Christ. He is all we need.
    Second, every person will *stand or fall* before God for what each one does or doesn’t do, say, etc.
    No one can face the music for another, so each person needs to make his or her own decisions.

    Who even believes this old man who washes and kisses the feet, and hugs those who would gladly cut off his head, comparing those violent actions to the preaching of the “good news about Christ,’ has enough of a Christian about him to make any good decisions for himself, much less, telling others what to do or not do?

    He has said that Christians are like moslims in their ideas of taking over countries; that Christians should wash moslim feet, make room for them and that the only thing a Christian should do is acknowledge the molsims *right* to come in and take over. (There are not meant to be direct quotes of the pope.)

    Jesus Christ gave commands to Christians as to how to live, what to do, what not to do, in order to please God and be given “everlasting life.” Christians don’t need a human creature made from dust to tell them anything other than what Christ said.

    The Bible is replete with examples of people who pleased our Creator, both before and after Jesus walked among men.
    For a good example, Genesis says that God told Abraham that “through you, all the nations will bless themselves.” God sent angels to talk to Abraham about the situation in Sodom and allowed Abraham to question Him about what He was going to do.

    Now, when the kings of several towns in the area captured Lot, Abraham’s nephew, Abraham got his many men together and went up to fight against these kings and their armies in order to rescue Lot.

    Personally, to me, the pope is no better than any other human. And no other human can decide things for me as no other human can stand in for me when I am judged…worthy of a blessing or deserving of punishment. And his advice basically is less than worthless, because it is even dangerous when it comes to moslims and islam.

    • duh swami says

      Jun 1, 2016 at 7:49 am

      You need your own church,,

      • somehistory says

        Jun 1, 2016 at 11:36 am

        I am a congregation of one. Some people I know agree with me, however. 🙂

    • Constance says

      Jun 2, 2016 at 12:32 am

      Pope Francis’ washing the feet of muslims is biblically and theologically unsound. Jesus washed the feet of his disciples, the same men who would walk the paths of evangelization across much of the known world to their martyred deaths. Jesus washed the feet of his followers and servants. He also informed Peter, who asked Jesus to wash his entire body, that Peter had already been cleansed (by baptism and by hearing the word of God through Jesus) and only needed his feet washed. Jesus emboldened and blessed his apostles and gave them the example of humility and mutual support and encouragement that the servants of Christ require in a hostile world. “I am sending you as sheep among wolves.”

      Thus Pope Francis should only be washing the feet of the followers and servants of Jesus; his own bishops and priests for whom he is the leader – the baptized faithful. He should be serving the servants of Christ. He should not be washing and kissing the feet of non-believers who hate Christians and Jews and non-muslims. Also Jesus never kissed anyone’s feet. It is unseemly and erroneous and sends a message of submission to satan’s army.

      • Keys says

        Jun 2, 2016 at 11:09 am

        Well stated, Constance. My thinking about this is like yours. I would like to know how Pope Francis would respond to all the points you have made.

        Perhaps he sees this as being a good Samaritan, seeing the refugeses as being in need of help. Perhaps he sees this as loving your enemy (which he probably won’t say, because he does not want Muslims to think he sees them as the enemy). Perhaps he thinks the Holy Spirit is guiding him to do this. Perhaps he hopes, erroneously, that Muslims will tend to be more peaceful toward Christians with these kinds of gestures. Perhaps he is hoping some Muslims will be more open (an inviting action rather than a condemnation) to know Jesus, rather than see what he is doing as a sign of weakness and submission to Allah.

        I just don’t know what is in his heart and mind, but would like an explanation from him. Unlikely, I guess.

  60. duh swami says

    Jun 1, 2016 at 7:58 am

    I have been given the shortest words with the widest implications…

    Billions of words have been written describing Islam, when only one
    is required EVIL…once you understand that, the rest is just details…

    • somehistory says

      Jun 1, 2016 at 11:33 am

      Yes. Evil.

  61. icefalcon says

    Jun 2, 2016 at 11:11 am

    John Galt III: “Pope lectures us about Christianity. Now go back to molesting children, Francis.”

    I am a lifelong, loyal Roman Catholic, and I find it difficult to understand much of what Pope Francis says. But as far as I am aware, he has never even been accused of molesting children.

    If John Galt III has information to the contrary, he should initiate a criminal investigation. If he disagrees with the Holy Father on some issue, he should lay out his arguments in a logical and reasonable fashion. Resorting to disgusting innuendo only makes John Galt III look weak and sleazy.

  62. daniel sebold says

    Jun 2, 2016 at 5:56 pm

    How would Angemon go about finding out how many were slaughtered by the Americans in Fallujah? Ask Jesus? How would Angemon go about finding out how old the Universe is? Why, he would read Genesis. He wouldn’t learn how to do parallax calculations, or learn how to calculate the luminosity of Cepheid Variables. He wouldn’t bother to learn about red shifts, why, he is an American, and in America they only learn about America and how great it is and about how their military never commits war crimes, well, because that’s what their history books, written in Texas, tell them to believe. Why, we are all good Christians here in America, just thinking about how we may have to save that stupid Pope by killing Muslims again. We just know we are going to have to do it, well, because it says so in the Bible. So let’s go on Jihad Watch and quote the Bible any possible passages that might give us justification to kill more Muslims. Of course, we aren’t going to kill the Muslims. It is going to be the poor kid down the block who will do it for us, and when he comes home we will shun him and tell him he can’t have a job because he is a baby killer, so you have more veterans killing themselves when they come home than what actually died in the war, as in Afghanistan and Vietnam. But we won’t tell the school children that. Why that would involve going around and counting bodies, and we just don’t like counting in America. That’s mathematics and science and that’s just way over our heads.

    • Angemon says

      Jun 2, 2016 at 7:03 pm

      daniel sebold posted:

      “How would Angemon go about finding out how many were slaughtered by the Americans in Fallujah?”

      Certainly not according the way you did it – giving a random number and claiming it came from the WHO.

      “ Ask Jesus?”

      If Jesus is the guy in the WHO responsible for giving out info, sure, why not?

      “How would Angemon go about finding out how old the Universe is? Why, he would read Genesis. ”

      That would astonish, seeing how I’ve said, several times, I’m an atheist – I don’t believe there’s a God. The rest of your post is more of this – baseless assertions about what I would or not do that have no basis in reality and are simply meant to draw attention away to the *fact* that you ascribed the WHO a number that’s 10 or more times higher than their reported number, and you blamed all of those deaths on Christians, for whatever reason – that the shias and sunnis are killing one another in droves didn’t even factor in into your little narrative.

      I’m not American and I’m not Christian, and even if I were, that wouldn’t change the fact you tried to pass a big, fat stinky lie and I called you on it. No amount of personal attacks will change it – you’re a fraud, and it’s out there for everyone to see.

      May I suggest you spend a little more time checking your alleged sources and less doing parallax calculations, calculating the luminosity of Cepheid Variables or writing fanfic about me?

      • daniel sebold says

        Jun 10, 2016 at 9:18 am

        Fair enough, Angemon. i was wrong. It seems the most common count is around 150,000. Some go up to over a million, some a half million, some six hundred thousand. The Lancet survey, according to Wiki, says over 600,000. Why don’t we just round it off and say 4,000 died?

        I apologize for my mistake, for accusing you of being a narrow minded religious goof. You are okay in my book. I just check an NBC News poll that says that ISIS has killed 18,800 in the past two years.

        As a 91 Gulf War vet who served as an Arabic cryptologist in the US military and who has lived in Saudi and Oman as well as having traveled Yemen, Syria, Egypt, Iraq, etc. I try to be as honest as I can, though ultimately this issue is too depressing to keep up with at all times. A Tunisian woman told me recently that the Sunnis and Shiites on the whole got along quite well in Iraq until the Americans came in and started playing them off against each other. She alleged that we would attack a Shiite neighborhood, then blame it on the Sunnis and visa versa. I am skeptical about this and pointed out that, when I was showing my Saudi students a photo of a piece of 12 century turquoise art from Iran, one of them stood up and said that I shouldn’t be showing them objects made by such inhuman filth as a Shiite. She told me that the people in the Gulf States are different. At any rate, I don’t accept her theory. I think it an outright lie. At any rate, we need to get off our addiction to oil and find alternatives, and when we do, we should isolate ourselves as much as possible from the Middle East.

        • Keys says

          Jun 10, 2016 at 10:12 am

          Heartening to see an apology, Daniel Sebold.

          Thank you for your service to our wonderful country.
          A Doctor I know from Nepal says he has found no place on earth as good as living in the States.

    • harbidoll says

      Jun 2, 2016 at 10:49 pm

      When the pope visited the US Trump told him he would defend the Vatican.”Youd better pray Im president when the Muslims attack the Vatican.” he said Also the pope isnt in the Bible. G-d is against 1 man rule over over His Body of believers same as He was against the Tower of Babel. We are ruled over by the Holy Spirit !! & His written Word. We are the most Diverse people of the earth. (can the eye say to the toe “submit to me”?) hes not the Brain-Head! G-D is.

    • gravenimage says

      Jun 9, 2016 at 7:45 pm

      Daniel Sebold wrote:

      So let’s go on Jihad Watch and quote the Bible any possible passages that might give us justification to kill more Muslims.
      ……………………..

      The idea that warning about how violent Islam is on Jihad Watch is “killing Muslims” could not be more grotesquely false.

      • daniel sebold says

        Jun 9, 2016 at 9:34 pm

        I have not only seen posts on this site advocating the killing of Muslims (if you scroll up far enough on this thread you will find one that I reacted to), but I have also seen posts advocating the killing of Muslims and homosexuals, also on this thread, I believe, which is really curious, because many people come to this site because of all the terrible things that Muslim extremists do to women and homosexuals. It’s as if there are Christians who somehow equate Islam with homosexuality (In Saudi there isn’t much of a choice what with the way women are cloistered).

        As far as Malaysia is concerned, I am treated far better here than I was ever treated by the Christians in the USA, at the beaches or wherever, and I would like to know what that is about. Why are the Muslims here more tolerant than the Christians in America? Why dont they gay bash men for wearing Speedos to the beach here the way they do in liberal Minneapolis? Why are Christian cops murdering black women in Texas for not using their turn signals, and why is it not talked about more back there. I dont see colored women being subjected to racism here. Americans should be horrified at that. It looks to me like a Christian jihad back there against black women, a cop in Florida beating up on a black woman after she dropped off her kids because she had tinted plates on her car, something not uncommon there from what I have heard. I was born in 1956 and it looks like it is regressing back to the early sixties in the south. Sounds like a white Christian jihad back there led by Donald Trump.

        I think that Malaysia is a Malay culture first and a Muslim culture second, but it is also a strongly Chinese culture, and the Chinese do what they want. The Muslims are very tolerant of the Chinese girls in their hot pants and mini skirts..

        I am no Reza Aslan. he says that men and women are equal in Malaysia and Indonesia, but FGM is perpetrated against well over ninety percent of Muslim women in both Indonesia and Malaysia according ot UNESCO. He has either lied on CNN or he is incredibly ignorant given all these religious credentials he seems to have and he arrogantly thinks that his moron Ph D in Sociology trumps the facts from UNESCO about FGM. So I am no apologist for Islam. I have lived in Saudi Arabia and seen terrible things there. The problem I have with the States is that it is headed in their direction with all the misogynist and anti gay legislation constantly proposed and passed now in states like Oklahoma and North Carolina. Certain rights are inalienable and cannot be legislated away. The civilized world looks down on us.

        You don’t seem to see how insanely violent our own culture is in the States. I don’t feel safe there. I feel safe here. Why is that? An Afghan war vet committed suicide in the school library at Minnesota State Mankato six months ago, and they won’t release any information about the man and why he did it, have censored the school newspaper from doing any serious investigative journalism . It is business as usual there: celebrate the diversity of Islamic cultures while abusing your own veterans. I as a war veteran there was harassed and treated as a freak, was told by the school that unfortunately Mankato, Minnesota is not a community tolerant of people who are perceived as gay (you don’t have to do much to get labeled “gay” there. Just be a straight A student in Spanish and wear a pink polo shirt to class), and that there was nothing they could do about the harassment. So, yes, I like Malaysia more than Mankato, Minnesota. There is something wrong with a school that allows its straight A students to ne abused, labeled homosexual and cat called across the campus. They falsely accused their football coach of being a pedophile and still fired him after he was found innocent, and still have the same university president in charge of the school. The wife of the football coach had written in to the school paper begging for mercy from the local newspaper to stop ridiculing the man and his family. Mankato is a good Christian community in which many of its churches ban gay children from their congregations. What a wonderful country you have back there. Maybe you should go to Bangkok or Paris some time and listen to people talking about what assholes American tourists are.

        I served in a US military of religious extremists. Killing Muslims was cool. Going into Falfalujah and slaughtering families while they were sitting in front of their televisions eating popcorn. The soldiers were told that Al Falujah was revenge for 911. Really? What did the Iraqis have to do with 911. That’s why we have the high suicide rate amongst our veterans. More Afghan and Vietnam vets have committed suicide than what died in those wars.

        The problem I have with the USA is that it is my country and I feel responsible..

        • harbidoll says

          Jun 10, 2016 at 12:12 am

          youd make a terrible lawyer!! the black women were puller over!!! for breaking the law! They were shot for starting a fight with he cops (something they probably dont do in Malaysia, right). The reason they fight is because they have” Attitude!” & many times a fight leads to a law suit & big money. Getting beat up could lead to big money. Ya see? Get with the program baby. We know Malaysia has “churchophobia”!! & being of a different religion can get one killed. Did they just pass a bill to go full Sharia in Malaysia?

        • daniel sebold says

          Jun 10, 2016 at 9:36 am

          Hardidoll: Churchophobia? Yes, you are right. Why? Because as the bus went by a church here in Georgetown, the Muslim passengers winced and hid their faces as if they were vampires. There are some gorgeous Portuguese Catholic churches here. Today I photographed a beautiful tutor style Catholic church from the eighteenth century. My fellow passengers moaned and I looked up and saw that church and couldn’t believe how beautiful it was, and quickly jumped off. At any rate, I have been posting photos of gorgeous Chinese temples here in Penang Island’s Georgetown. i have also posted one beautiful Malaysian Catholic church on Facebook, and will be posting this new one, the Immaculate Conception Church, some time in the next few days. I just don’t have a clue what the cure is for my Muslim counterparts and their churchophobia.

        • harbidoll says

          Jun 10, 2016 at 12:38 am

          Vets kill themselves cuz the snowflakes in the US say killing is bad! Like being a cop is bad (no one tells me what to do). Tis the total rejection of an authority figure (God!) & most fatherless (Human or Spiritual) children grow up challenging any authority. Like young male animals wanting to take over the pack from the ageing alpha male!

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