The 28-page section of the 9/11 report detailing Saudi involvement in the September 11, 2001 jihad attacks have finally been released (albeit with substantial portions still redacted), and it is now clear why one President who held hands with the Saudi King and another who bowed to him worked so hard all these years to keep these pages secret: they confirm that the 9/11 jihad murderers received significant help from people at the highest levels of the Saudi government.
The report states that Omar al-Bayoumi, who “may be a Saudi intelligence officer,” gave “substantial assistance to hijackers Khalid al-Mindhar and Nawaf al-Hamzi after they arrived in San Diego in February 2000. Al-Bayoumi met the hijackers at a public place shortly after his meeting with an individual at the Saudi consulate.” Around the same time, al-Bayoumi “had extensive contact with Saudi Government establishments in the United States and received financial support from a Saudi company affiliated with the Saudi Ministry of Defense.” That company “reportedly had ties to Usama bin Ladin and al-Qa’ida.”
Another possible Saudi agent, Osama Bassnan, who “has many ties to the Saudi government” and was also a supporter of Osama bin Laden, boasted that he did more for al-Mindhar and al-Hamzi than al-Bayoumi did. He also “reportedly received funding and possibly a fake passport from Saudi government officials.” The report says that at one point, “a member of the Saudi Royal Family provided Bassnan with a significant amount of cash,” and that “he and his wife have received financial support from the Saudi ambassador to the United States and his wife.” That ambassador was Prince Bandar, about whom the New York Times later noted: “No foreign diplomat has been closer or had more access to President Bush, his family and his administration than the magnetic and fabulously wealthy Prince Bandar bin Sultan of Saudi Arabia.”
Then there was Shaykh al-Thumairy, “an accredited diplomat at the Saudi consulate in Los Angeles and one of the ‘imams’ at the King Fahad mosque in Culver City, California,” who also “may have been in contact” with al-Mindhar and al-Hamzi.
Saleh al-Hussayen, “reportedly a Saudi Interior Ministry official, stayed at the same hotel in Herndon, Virginia where al-Hazmi was staying. While al-Hussayen claimed after September 11 not to know the hijackers, FBI agents believed he was being deceptive. He was able to depart the United States despite FBI efforts to locate and re-interview him.” Who got him out of the country?
There is much more. The report redacts the name of “another Saudi national with close ties to the Saudi Royal Family,” but notes that he “is the subject of FBI counterterrorism investigations and reportedly was checking security at the United States’ southwest border in 1999 and discussing the possibility of infiltrating individuals into the United States.” There is no telling who this could have been, but Prince Bandar’s unlisted phone number turned up in a phone book of Abu Zubaida, “a senior al-Qa’ida operative captured in Pakistan in March 2002.” Abu Zubaida also had the number of “a bodyguard at the Saudi Embassy in Washington, DC.”
The report also mentions a CIA memorandum that “discusses alleged financial connections between the September 11 hijackers, Saudi Government officials, and members of the Saudi Royal Family. This memorandum was passed on to an FBI investigator; yet “despite the clear national implications of the CIA memorandum, the FBI agent included the memorandum in an individual case file and did not forward it to FBI Headquarters.” Why?
There is still more, and with this much smoke, there is almost certainly fire: the Saudi connection to 9/11 goes to the highest levels of the Saudi government. And as I detail in my new book The Complete Infidel’s Guide to Iran, a U.S. District Judge ruled in 2011 that the Islamic Republic of Iran was liable for damages to 9/11 families because of Iran’s role in facilitating the 9/11 attacks. The judge found that Iran and its proxy Hizballah had cooperated and collaborated with al-Qaeda before 9/11 in planning the attacks, and continued that cooperation after the attacks.
After 9/11, the U.S. declared war on terror and entered Iraq and Afghanistan. But if Bush had really been serious about attacking jihad terror at its root, he would have invaded Saudi Arabia and Iran instead. Under Obama, the betrayal has gotten exponentially worse. There needs to be a full Congressional investigation now into why these 28 pages were kept secret for so long, with those responsible punished accordingly. And above all, the next American administration must make a searching reevaluation of our relationship with Saudi Arabia, and stop treating enemies as allies.
(Crossposted from PamelaGeller.com)

somehistory says
Many of us *knew* it, many more suspected it.
“There is nothing secret that will not be revealed, nothing hidden that will not be uncovered (Jesus Christ).”
And all of the guilty of taking human life, shedding the blood of innocent people, will face Divine Judgement.
Alarmed Pig Farmer says
They way the 19 looked at it, they faced eternity in Jannat, the Islam porno heaven. The same view is held by those mentioned in the 28 pages who are still alive, for they are holy warriors too, fighting in the Cause.
Salome says
To Jahannam with the lot of them.
Frank Cicero says
When you vote this November, vote for the one who will see us through WWIII.. and that we come out on top. USA bows to those fithty goat humpers is a national disgrace.
John A. Marre says
Obama’s bowing to the Saudi confirms that he is playing for the other side.
linnte says
This photo makes me want to puke! I can’t WAIT for him to be gone. Please God, can we elect Trump?
gungadin says
Didn’t I recently hear that we are putting out MORE OIL than these sand gnats and camel doodlers?? If that’s the case why the HELL do we need THEM??…..Grow AMERICAN RESOURCES, DRILL FOR YET MORE OIL –which will make the USA RICHER AND FORK those camel humpers !!!
Truth says
This photo makes me angry to have an idiot like Obama as President. Obama is the stupidest president the USA has ever had.
John Marst says
Obama scraping and bowing before the Nazis of the Desert. Seems fitting somehow.
Carolyne says
It confirms that he is a Sunni Muslim and was born as such, raised as a Muslim and is a Muslim. It also appears that he was kissing the desert rat’s hand or maybe his ring. But he was kissing something. It was ridiculously claimed that he was merely bending over because the king was short. He had just come from visiting the Queen of England who is shorter still, but there was no bowing to her. We all know the story.
The President of the united States should bow to no one. But Obama is a usurper.
gravenimage says
I don’t want to see the American president bow to anyone on general principle–but it would have been far less concerning if he *had been* bowing to the civilized Queen of England.
Tommy says
Obama and Bush wanted to censor this…..GO TRUMP!
Jake says
Do we honestly think these 28 pages aren’t edited or changed to appeal to certain people? I don’t get why everyone is trusting this manuscript. We need to stop being so desperate for a “leaked secret” or else we are going to get the wrong information
citycat says
And perhaps this doc is hiding further stuff.
gravenimage says
This material was not leaked. Reread the article, above.
biff says
It’s all about money. Oil money.
Saudi Arabia dumps money all over Obama, Bush, Clintons etc. Anyone as long as the taps keep flowing and the pipeline construction blocked.
Using oil or gasoline or energy that does not enrich Saudi Arabia must be crushed by all politicians.
Think about how much money you spend at the pump in a year per car.
Multiple that.
They pump it from the ground for free with slave labour. Sell it to our global oil companies and into our cars.
All politicians once they get power start getting paid off. Their family gets cushy jobs.
“investments” that work out.
It’s all payoffs. We fund this shit ourselves to enrich people like the Bushes and Clintons by way of Saudi Oil.
They know it’s a deal with the devil but they can’t help themselves.
The limousines don;t drive and pay for themselves…
Wellington says
“It’s all about the money.”
The money is secondary. Important but still secondary. Ultimately, it’s about, a la clueless John McCain, the Islam.
Money is the means to the end. Islam is the end.
Christianblood says
Saudi Arabia is the most barbaric nation on Earth!
It is the birth-place of islam. It is the birth-place mohamed. It is the birth-place of the quran. From 9/11 to the Nice jihadist attack a few days ago, almost every single islamic jihadist terrorist attack that takes place around the globe is ideologically rooted in Saudi Arabia. Saudi Arabia spends trillions of dollars every single year propagating islam in many different ways including bank-rolling radical imams all across the globe and building tens of thousands of madarassas and mosques. Saudi Arabia is an evil, racist state where if you are not a muslims you are legally off limits of huge area of that country, it is where slavery goes on unchallenged in this day and age and it is the only country in the world where buidling a church or a temple is illegal and where you can be beheaded for carrying a Bible or wearing a cross and yet America is allied with this evil house of Saud, collaborating with them and pushing their islamic jihadist agenda even if the result is going to kill millions of Americans! Shame on America!
gravenimage says
I thought that perhaps “Christianblood” was actually criticizing Islam–then I got to his last line, and it is clear that this is just more bashing of America.
Angemon says
With CB, GI, it’s always about excoriating America and/or the West, no matter what. Always. He’s not anti-islam, as it can be seen by his defences of shia islam and Iran, who – surprise, surprise! – are aligned with Moscow, he’s simply anti-American and anti-Western. And the worst thing on that ghoulish piece of human excrement is how lightly and quickly he takes the suffering of others and uses it to spread his vitriol – no sign of pity, no shred of empathy, no regard for the victims – nothing but contempt for the West, a contempt he must flaunt at all costs.
Wellington says
Yes indeed, gravenimage, Christianblood never disappoints. It’s all Russia all the time; the West is bad. Blah, blah, blah.
You’d think he’d learn and throw a few accolades to the West now and again, just for form’s sake and all that, but he functions in clumsy Russian mode and will never learn. No one knows this better than one Eastern European nationality after another, beginning with the Poles. As a spokesman for the Vatican replied not long after John Paul II became Pope and was asked, since the new Pope was a very talented linguist, if he spoke Russian, the sage spokesman retorted that no Pole speaks Russian but every Pole understood it. Indeed.
And this too will be lost on Christianblood. Guaranteed. More expansively here, the Achilles heel of Russian bravado is what sundry Eastern European ethnicities think of Russia. Instructive, highly so, that Christianblood never addresses this. Never.
Seabird says
I agree, to see a great power literally bowing to murderous savages who just killed 3,000 of your own citizens is truly shameful.
Selling them our best weapons is shameful, treasonous stupidity.
This (US M.E. foreign policy) is what we call a snafu.
Mark Swan says
If He would pipe in on members of the Government being suspect, then fine—but His
hammering all Americans—is creepy.
Christianblood says
Wellington
To know the truth about Ukraine and what America and the West did there and how they overthrew and (regime-changed) the democratically elected president of that country, please watch the short video clip below:
Angemon says
Christianblood posted:
“Wellington
To know the truth about Ukraine and what America and the West did there and how they overthrew and (regime-changed) the democratically elected president of that country, please watch the short video clip below: ”
Oliver Stone? Truth?
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!
What’s next, suggesting we believe in Hillary Clinton? No, wait, you already did that.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
*snort*
Les says
Thank God Russia is imploding and losing 750,000 communists a year! 🙂
Christianblood says
Les posted
(..Thank God Russia is imploding and losing 750,000 communists a year!..)
You got WRONG! It is America which is imploding with drugs, violence, hate, racism, broken families, the epidemics of mental illness, godlessness, moral breakdown, societal breakdown, hate and social confusion. Tens of thousands of Americans are losing their lives every year year due to gun violence and hate and tens of thousands more are dying by committing suicide annually. America is becoming a hell on Earth and it is going to get worse in the coming months and years! Now, I will back up my words with real facts and the two factual pictures below will tell you which country is imploding. Plz click on those two PICTURES and compare and see the real difference between America and Russia and which one is culturally, socially and spiritually imploding.
1. America:
http://americansfortruth.com/uploads/2015/07/NYC_Pride_2015_Guy_in_G-String_resized_credit.jpg
2. Russia:
https://www.rt.com/politics/319490-chastity-faith-and-patriotism-/
America is an INSULT to God! It insults God to His face!
Russia honors God. It honors God for trying to avoid the American/Western ungodly moral corruption.
Now, do you see the difference? BTW, can you see right from wrong? Most Americans, Westerners can see right from wrong anymore!
Angemon says
Christianblood posted:
“You got WRONG! It is America which is imploding with drugs,”
Citations needed. You know, numbers for both America and Russia.
“violence”
Again, citations needed. In Russia, Putin’s opponents are gunned down in broad daylight.
“hate”
“Hate” is a very broad term, buddy. “Hate” of what? Wouldn’t your anti-Western, especially anti-American, propaganda qualify as “hate”?
“racism”
Oh, this is rich! A country that has black police officers, black generals, black sports and culture icons, black attorney generals and a black president is “imploding with racism”? Lol! Meanwhile, in Russia:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4737468.stm
“broken families”
Again, citations needed for comparison.
“the epidemics of mental illness”
Again, citations needed for comparison.
“godlessness”
“Godless Commies”, anyone?
“moral breakdown”
Again, citations needed.
“societal breakdown”
Again, citations needed for comparison – it’s not in the US that political opponents of the current ruler are gunned down on the street.
“hate”
You’re repeating yourself by now.
“and social confusion.”
What a broad, meaningless term.
“Tens of thousands of Americans are losing their lives every year year due to gun violence”
Again, meaningless without citations for comparison among the two countries.
“and hate ”
Again with the “hate”? It seems your mind is filled to the brim with “hate”…
“v”
We’ve been through this before, troll. I even gave you the numbers – suicide rates in Russia are GREATER than suicide rates in the US:
“America is becoming a hell on Earth”
Still not as bad as Russia.
“and it is going to get worse in the coming months and years!”
Again with the future readings? Remember what I told you about the lottery?
“Now, I will back up my words with real facts”
This will be a first…
“and the two factual pictures below will tell you which country is imploding. ”
So not actual numbers or facts then – just two pics and your word.
“America is an INSULT to God! It insults God to His face!”
Are you God’s lawyer or something?
“Russia honors God. It honors God for trying to avoid the American/Western ungodly moral corruption.”
Lol! Ever heard of the third commandment? Do not misuse the name of God.
Christianblood says
Correction:
Most Americans, Westerners cannot see right from wrong anymore!
Angemon says
Citation needed.
Ex-muslim says
@ Christianblood
You are right. I will also add that USA had more people in jail than any other nation on Earth! Even China with 1.3 billion population has far less people in jail than USA!
When you say America is an insult to God, you are so right because millions of Americans and other Westerners who are all Anti-Christ PAGANS celebrate sin and shame every summer and defy God and insult God to His face when they distort His moral law and celebrate what called an ‘abomination’. God should apologize to Sodom and Gomorra if He is going to tolerate the celebration of sin and moral corruption that goes on in US and in the Western world.
Angemon says
“Ex-muslim” jumping from the shadows to say that whatever it is CB posted is right? Gee, what a shocking surprise… The comparison I made with the Human Centipede is growing increasingly more apt…
Ex-muslim says
@ Christianblood
You are right (CB). S.A is the head of the Islamic dragon and without S.A we would be living in a different world and there would be no islam. USA is in S.A pocket and even though Saudi jihadists murdered all the 3000 Americans on 9/11 and the ideology that murdered those people came from, and was funded from S.A American are so stupid and evil loosers that they will NOT do anything about it and I am disgusted by the whole thing!
They are ANIMALS!
Angemon says
Ex-muslim, the last part of the Human Centipede, posted:
“@ Christianblood
You are right (CB). S.A is the head of the Islamic dragon and without S.A we would be living in a different world and there would be no islam.”
EM, as I told CB before, islam predates Saudi Arabia by several centuries. If Saudi Arabia were to vanish into thin air tomorrow you’d be left with the other 55 OIC countries, many of them with much larger populations that Saudi Arabia’s ~30 million – for example, Iran, who is ~80 million and a worldwide sponsor of terrorism, or nuke-wielding Pakistan with its ~185 million.
“USA is in S.A pocket”
Why, then, is the Obama administration going through the Iran nuke deal, despite Saudi Arabia’s opposition, an opposition so strong that Saudi officials are considering to work with Israel to prevent?
“and even though Saudi jihadists murdered all the 3000 Americans on 9/11 and the ideology that murdered those people came from, and was funded from S.A”
Iran had a part in that as well. Where’s your criticism of Iran?
gravenimage says
“Christianblood” is now just frothing at the mouth. Citing the anti-American Oliver Stone? Why not just bring out Michael Moore for a fair and balanced look at the state of America? sarc/off
He wrote:
Les posted
(..Thank God Russia is imploding and losing 750,000 communists a year!..)
You got WRONG (sic)!
……………………………..
Actually, while it is inaccurate to characterize all Russians as “communists” at this point, Russia *is* losing population, due to low birth rates, and–*especially*–high death rates. Life expectancy is much lower in Russia than it is in the West. *Abortion rates* are much higher in Russia, as well. The population dropped from about 148 million in the early 1990s to around 143 million today.
More:
It is America which is imploding with drugs, violence, hate, racism, broken families, the epidemics of mental illness, godlessness, moral breakdown, societal breakdown, hate and social confusion. Tens of thousands of Americans are losing their lives every year year due to gun violence and hate and tens of thousands more are dying by committing suicide annually.
……………………………..
Actually, the divorce rate in Russia is much higher than in America–and higher than that of Europe, as well. It is almost double that of the UK.
Russia ranks 14th in the world in suicide rates; the US 50th. This is one area where having a high ranking is *not* desirable.
Drug abuse rates *are* higher in the US than in Russia–but only marginally so. However, alcohol abuse is a much more serious problem in Russia than it is here in America.
More:
America is becoming a hell on Earth and it is going to get worse in the coming months and years! Now, I will back up my words with real facts and the two factual pictures below will tell you which country is imploding. Plz click on those two PICTURES and compare and see the real difference between America and Russia and which one is culturally, socially and spiritually imploding.
……………………………..
Well, that’s just silly. One picture of an American in a G-String and one religious procession against AIDS in Russia supposedly backs up all of “Christianblood’s” easily disproven assertions?
In that case, I could pull up a picture of Pussy Riot acting out in a cathedral in Russia, and contrast it with a huge church service in the US, but as a rational person I realize that this would not constitute statistical proof of anything.
Incidentally, rates of new cases of AIDS in the United States are lower than in Russia, as are death rates. Over all rates of AIDS cases are lower in the US than in Russia, as well–and this, even though the survival rate is so much higher here.
More:
America is an INSULT to God! It insults God to His face!
Russia honors God. It honors God for trying to avoid the American/Western ungodly moral corruption.
Now, do you see the difference? BTW, can you see right from wrong? Most Americans, Westerners can see right from wrong anymore!
……………………………..
Says the person belching out reams of false statistics.
By the way–as I have pointed out many times–the US is actually far more a Christian nation than is Russia–83% of Americans are Christian. But “Chistianblood” has asserted many times that this does not count, because most American Christians are Catholic or Protestant, and not Eastern Orthodox. He has held that anyone who does not venerate icons cannot be considered Christian.
Not only is “Christianblood” unhinged in his hatred of America, he is incapable of being honest. This should surprise no one who has read his comments here.
By the way, does “Christianblood” think that Putin saying that Orthodoxy is “closer to Islam than Catholicism is” is “honoring God”?
Here’s this disturbing story:
http://windowoneurasia.blogspot.com/2010/12/window-on-eurasia-putin-says-orthodoxy.html
Angemon says
gravenimage posted:
“By the way–as I have pointed out many times–the US is actually far more a Christian nation than is Russia–83% of Americans are Christian. ”
Remember that time CB, to back his claim that 80% of Russians were baptised as Orthodox Christians, linked to a blogpost, I took the time and effort to read said blogpost, pointed out it also said that less than 10% of Russians regularly went to religious temples (not only churches but also mosques and synagogues) and he replied by saying that the blogpost he brought up to defend his claim was, in fact, anti-Russian propaganda written by an Russophobe? The post was a couple or so of months old and the person he accused of having written the post died several years ago.
gravenimage says
And here’s “Ex-muslim”:
@ Christianblood
When you say America is an insult to God, you are so right because millions of Americans and other Westerners who are all Anti-Christ PAGANS celebrate sin and shame every summer and defy God and insult God to His face when they distort His moral law and celebrate what called an ‘abomination’. God should apologize to Sodom and Gomorra if He is going to tolerate the celebration of sin and moral corruption that goes on in US and in the Western world.
……………………………..
Actually–as I have noted several times here–the United States is 83% Christian. Estimates of Pagans in the US are tiny–usually between 0.1%-0.5% of the population.
What I presume he actually means, though, is that we do not throw gay people off tall buildings here, as do his (former?) coreligionists.
What could be more indicative of “corruption”?
More:
You are right (CB). S.A is the head of the Islamic dragon and without S.A we would be living in a different world and there would be no islam…
……………………………..
This assertion is just silly. Saudi Arabia is a hideous, barbaric polity, but it is *hardly* the only Islamic sponsor of Jihad terror. For instance, has “Ex-muslim” forgotten the Islamic State?
The idea that Islam would cease to exist if Saudi Arabia expired is just ridiculous.
Christianblood says
Seabird posted
(..I agree, to see a great power literally bowing to murderous savages who just killed 3,000 of your own citizens is truly shameful.
Selling them our best weapons is shameful, treasonous stupidity.
This (US M.E. foreign policy) is what we call a snafu..)
Indeed! Even normal American civilians don’t care about these issues. They are not even outraged that their governments are continuously in bed with the evil Saudis who murdered 3000 of them on a single day and who will kill even millions of Americans if they could today! Could anyone explain this? Could anyone explain why American people are not outraged at this? Anyone?
Angemon says
Christianblood posted:
“Could anyone explain why American people are not outraged at this? ”
Note: he’s not being ironic. No, seriously, he’s serious.
Dean says
I can explain the reduction of the American electorate to useful idiots. The USSR programmed their citizens to believe that so-called good intentions is enough regardless of the atrocities and lies that were easily known to the average citizen, just like the gas chambers in Germany. Govt education has groomed the average American to much the same oblivious trust in their favorite political leaders, both sides, despite enormous amounts of information to the contrary. I talk with my very smart about to be 14 year old granddaughter every week and emphasize the relevance and importance of info she and her friends are well are of. She is wide-eyed and amazed by my never discussed point of view. I use her disappointment with music and acting favorites to highlight that she can multiply that several times over for every politician, particularly the president.
Angemon says
Dean posted:
“I can explain the reduction of the American electorate to useful idiots. The USSR programmed their citizens to believe that so-called good intentions is enough regardless of the atrocities and lies that were easily known to the average citizen, just like the gas chambers in Germany. Govt education has groomed the average American to much the same oblivious trust in their favorite political leaders, both sides, despite enormous amounts of information to the contrary.”
Courtesy of decades of Russian infiltration:
gravenimage says
Good posts, Angemon and Wellington.
mortimer says
Russia has never cared about the needs of Poland, Czechoslovakia, Ukraine or other Slavic countries…quite the contrary. Russian megalomania and empire is what Russians care about. Americans, on the other hand, mostly want the world to do business with Americans fairly and leave America the hell alone. The business of America is business…and charitable works.
Christianblood says
mortimer posted
(..The business of America is business…and charitable works..)
Save me the crap, mortimer! The business of America is regime change, it is supporting jihadists, it is invading other countries, it is destroying anyone who is not part of its imperialistic hegemonic empire, it is spreading godlessness, materialism, moral relativism, greed, the so-called LGBTQ moral filth and chaos. For example, today the US has placed hundreds of soldiers illegally in Syria, daily violating that country’s territorial integrity by land, air and sea and thereby breaking all international law. Who gave America to invade into other countries illegally and change their regimes by force? Who gave them that right?
Angemon says
Christianblood posted:
“Save me the crap, mortimer! The business of America is regime change, it is supporting jihadists, it is invading other countries, it is destroying anyone who is not part of its imperialistic hegemonic empire, it is spreading godlessness, materialism, moral relativism, greed, the so-called LGBTQ moral filth and chaos. ”
We get it – you’re paid to spread anti-Western – and especially anti-US – propaganda.
“For example, today the US has placed hundreds of soldiers illegally in Syria”
You were rambling about this a couple or so of days ago. I’ll repeat what I said then: citation needed. Plus, please explain how is this alleged presence any different from Russian troops in Crimea.
“daily violating that country’s territorial integrity by land, air and sea and thereby breaking all international law. Who gave America to invade into other countries illegally and change their regimes by force? Who gave them that right?”
Again, Russia, Crimea, difference, explanation.
Ex-muslim says
I don’t personally know much about Russia but from what I see in the world today and how the US governments and the Western countries are corrupting the world, whether it is their intentional support of the global jihadists or whether it is their fanatical global promotion of moral filth, Russia makes far more sense to me than the US and the West because Russia is clearly standing against both of these destructive US, Western agendas!
Angemon says
“Ex-muslim” logic: the US, where gays are treated like people, is an immoral nation while Russia, where gays are discriminated against and army recruits are raped and forced into prostitution by their older brothers-in-arms, represents purity. Makes sense to him, I guess…
linnte says
Amen!
mortimer says
Americans are blamed because they are organized, hard-working, forward-looking, while in other countries, people are chaotic, indolent and stuck in the past…as many are in Russia.
Alarmed Pig Farmer says
All politicians once they get power start getting paid off. Their family gets cushy jobs.
Bush family member Jeb! got a job a couple of years ago paying $20,000 a month for consulting. I’m sure it was all legit, and I’m just as sure none of that was petrodollar money. Funny how not one of his opponents brought it up, and how the Fox RINO news entertainers were just as silent.
linnte says
The Bush family have their OWN oil company. Of course they would be in cohoots with other oil manufacturers.
biff says
The Saudi’s royal family stays in power by spreading Islam around the world. ( The kind that has been misinterpreted from the PURE PEACE ISLAMA ).
Imagine if USA etc did not buy Saudi Oil. for example if they said, we will not buy oil from you while you sponsor world terrorism.
Without massive cash payouts by the Saudi Family (a Monarchy remember) to the people of the country the entire system falls apart.
Local Muslims would take over Saudi.
The USA politicians are well paid with American oil money to make sure this never happens.
These murderous Muslims would never have left the desert if the world did not keep buying oil from them.
The more development of North American Resources (environmental nonsense) the more money it drives to Saudi to keep this sham going.
For the general public we get murdered by Islamists we finance by buying oil from Suadi instead.
Who the fuck cares how dirty the oil is from the oilsands etc. IT can be cleaned up.
Usually saving a life is worth spending up-teem billions by govt.
Fred says
The oil sands are well monitored. Environmental laws in Alberta Canada are the best in the world. Leftist media tries to portray the oil sands as dirty oil which is false. Eastern Canada buys oil from Saudi and not from Alberta Canada. Why? It amounts to 20 billion a year for Saudi. My numbers may be off a bit. Watch this. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWy3Yk95FYE
Fred says
Also Canada could supply USA with all the oil they need. Canada wanted pipeline to USA. Democrats Obama blocked it. Why. Because warren buffet company owns the railroad and makes 2 billion a year from railing what oil they can handle. And how much did warren contribute to the democrats? You get the idea of how things work. By the way the Obama says the pipe line has environmental concerns. What a bunch of bs. Trump says he’d build the pipeline and buy Canadian oil by the way.
gravenimage says
Yes–there are both high environmental and worker safety standards in the US and Canada, but this is *not* the case in sh*t holes like Saudi Arabia. Standards are also high in northern Europe. Even places like Russia and Mexico are much better than is Dar-al-Islam.
RonaldB says
Good for you, Fred. The US gets more oil from America than it does from Saudi Arabia. We can indeed build the pipeline, expand fracking, and continue offshore drilling. Saudi Arabia is already hurting (not critically) from the lowered oil prices due to US-developed recovery technology.
There are always problems associated with advanced technology. But the prevention and amelioration are local and as you mentioned, can be handled by decent laws. Not allowing the pipeline was a travesty.
It chills my libertarian bones to suggest it, but Trump as President might consider a larger tariff on imported oil. This would serve to not only cut off funds from the Saudis, but would encourage domestic (US) oil production facilities and oil-field support. I think it is long past the time when the US should pass laws making foreign investment in education, news, or religious institutions in the US. And politicians. Any politician accepting money from foreign sources should be guilty of a felony. It should be illegal for PACs to accept foreign money.
By the way, the Saudis can always sell oil. But, setting up tariffs and encouraging domestic oil production will increase world competition and decrease the price of oil the Saudis can sell it at. But, it would definitely raise the price of gas for US drivers. It’s worth it!!!!
Kepha says
I am not so sure I agree, Ronald. What if Ho Fu-nan, a successful Taiwanese software developer, decides to plow some of his money back into Podunk State somewhere in the USA, where he got his Master’s?
My own experience has been that the openness to the rest of the world on the part of American universities, colleges, theological seminaries, and the like have been a net plus, and of very great educational value. While I wholeheartedly agree that Sa’udi Arabia is a bad actor (and I suspect that the Bush II administration rightly used some of the info in the recently declassified papers to blackmail it into giving us some cooperation), a lot of people with US degrees in other parts of the world can be highly patriotic towards their own countries while at the same time having a real appreciation for ours.
As for Western Hemisphere oil production, we’d still have to have good relations with Canada and some others. My own guess as to why the continental pipeline wasn’t built was because it would bring jobs and wealth to some red states; and perhaps Canada’s prairie provinces, where I understand a lot of people may have political views at odds with those of the O and his political allies north of the Great Lakes.
RonaldB says
Hi Kepha,
I am always delighted to hear from you and read your opinions whether or not I agree.
And in this case, I disagree. Granted, you may have students who wish to pay their educational institutions back. But, the capture of educational institutions and departments is too pervasive and too destructive to permit the situation to continue. I think the US should control its own institutions. Ho Fu-nan, much as I appreciate his success, should plow his money into Taiwanese institutions, and consider his US education as a free ride. It’s the trade-off. But,foreign sponsorship means foreign control, and it means educational focus, communications focus and political focus that is not necessarily in the best interest of the US.
gravenimage says
Hi, Kepha. I agree that American universities are open–as they should be–to foreign students, and that they benefit from donations from international sources.
I think it depends on the *nature* of the donation.
If it is simply from a grateful alum, this is all well and good.
If it is Saudi Arabia giving money with strings attached in the interest of spreading Da’wa–as has often been the case–then this is very different. American–or any Western–universities should not allow Islamic nations to use them to spread Shari’ah, as they regularly do.
“Saudi Arabian Dollars Buying American Influence”
http://www.wnd.com/2011/07/321169/
Dean says
Most politicians have already sold their soul to get elected and the money coming in after getting elected seals the deal with blood. Limited government that only protects us has always been just an ideal and the 20th century ended even the pretense. Thought that George had his own priorities regarding the devil Saddam and other than Afghanistan was ignoring the real threat from the “peaceful religion.” He paved the way for Obama in may ways albeit unintentionally.
RonaldB says
“unintentionally”
George W Bush has always been a thoroughly unintelligent, but canny roustabout, who has always been interested in running for office and asserting a macho image, but is singularly uninterested in any details of governing or leadership.
George W Bush was thoroughly involved with Saudi money shoring up his failed businesses and was an enabler of Islamic penetration of US agencies. The Republican Party is every bit as penetrated by Islamist agents as the Democrats: maybe more so. The Bush administration issued directives to airport security to specifically not target Muslims, both before and after 9-11.
Carolyne says
I believe that with Bush and Clinton (Including Hillary Clinton) that it is oil money. With Obama, it is his religion.
Angemon says
If for Barack Obama is about religion, Carolyne, how do you account for his pursuit of the shia-Iran nuclear deal, to the chagrin of sunni Saudi Arabia? I believe Dinesh D’Souza has it right when he called Obama an “anti-colonialist” – he believes that the rich nations got rich by exploiting the poor nations and he’s striving to amend perceived past sins:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/10/07/AR2010100705485.html
Ali Bey says
So far I haven,t listened theese worrying confirmation news through the media.
gravenimage says
How many do you want?
Fox News:
http://www.fox13news.com/news/u-s-and-world-news/174777945-story
USA Today:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2016/07/15/28-declassified-pages-911-commission-report-released-public/87134942/
There are many more.
mortimer says
Saudi Arabia is the home of the Wahhabist-Salafist ideology that is causing havoc throughout the world.
Wellington says
Islam in general, mortimer, is causing havoc throughout the world. Think Shiite Iran which has NOTHING to do with Wahhabism. Think Sunni groups like al-Qaeda which, while ready to take money from the Saudis, would gladly overthrow the regime if it could. Think ISIS which isn’t technically tied to the Wahhabist sect. ISIS has its own agenda and ideas (e.g., the caliphate needed to be established NOW). Think the Muslim Brotherhood, which to my knowledge has never formally embraced Wahhabism. And on and on and on like this. The havoc is due to Islam, all of it, and not just some sect of it.
gravenimage says
All true, Wellington. Saudi Arabia is a vicious backer of Jihad terror, but they are *far* from the only source. Ultimately, it is Islam which is the source.
That being said, we should cut all diplomatic ties with the barbaric Saudi Arabia–and we should have done it *long since*, long before these pages were declassified.
Mark Swan says
Absolutely Wellington & gravenimage, I Agree.
RonaldB says
” we should cut all diplomatic ties with the barbaric Saudi Arabia…”
Haha.
I don’t agree, gravenimage. I am currently in the process of reading Spencer’s book, which is a “can’t put it down” type of reading, by the way.
Anyway, the Saudis are petrified of the “apocalypse now” theology in Shi’ite Iran, and see Iran as a major threat to them, so much so that they are developing commercial and military relations with Israel.
The Saudis can be used, as long as we recognize them as confederates (sometimes, when it is convenient) and not as friends. They are not to be trusted, but the enmity between Saudi Arabia and Iran can be useful to us if we play our cards right.
I will say the US has made things much, much worse both for itself and for Middle-Easterners in both the Bush and Obama administrations. Both Iran and Saudi Arabia had far more involvement in 9/11 than Iraq did, but we deposed and leveled Iraq, leading to not only the insurgency, the slaughter of Iraqi civilians and our own soldiers, but an Iranian puppet Shi’ite government in Iraq. It couldn’t be much worse.
gravenimage says
RonaldB wrote:
” we should cut all diplomatic ties with the barbaric Saudi Arabia…”
Haha.
I don’t agree, gravenimage. I am currently in the process of reading Spencer’s book, which is a “can’t put it down” type of reading, by the way.
Anyway, the Saudis are petrified of the “apocalypse now” theology in Shi’ite Iran, and see Iran as a major threat to them, so much so that they are developing commercial and military relations with Israel.
The Saudis can be used, as long as we recognize them as confederates (sometimes, when it is convenient) and not as friends. They are not to be trusted, but the enmity between Saudi Arabia and Iran can be useful to us if we play our cards right.
…………………………..
I take your point, Ronald, but the Saudis just a few years after we stationed troops there to protect them from Saddam Hussein happily supported a plot that murdered nearly 3,000 of our people.
I still think that our diplomatic interactions with Dar-al-Islam should be *minimal*.
I think it was wise when we had no real diplomatic ties with Iran. Now they are closer to having nuclear weapons than ever.
More:
I will say the US has made things much, much worse both for itself and for Middle-Easterners in both the Bush and Obama administrations. Both Iran and Saudi Arabia had far more involvement in 9/11 than Iraq did, but we deposed and leveled Iraq, leading to not only the insurgency, the slaughter of Iraqi civilians and our own soldiers, but an Iranian puppet Shi’ite government in Iraq. It couldn’t be much worse.
…………………………..
There is no doubt that Iraq was a debacle–because Bush thought that Muslims were just “moms and dads” who wanted democracy.
The period when the West was safest from Islam was when it was most nearly isolated from the civilized world, and when we came down hard on them whenever they started depredations against us.
Angemon says
gravenimage posted:
“I take your point, Ronald, but the Saudis just a few years after we stationed troops there to protect them from Saddam Hussein happily supported a plot that murdered nearly 3,000 of our people.”
A plot orchestrated by al-qaeda, whom the Saudis snubbed in favour of the US when looking for protection from Saddam. The House of Saud knew they wouldn’t get to keep their lifestyle under al-qaeda’s zealotry.
Carolyne says
I think the document purports to show Saudi Arabia’s connection to 9/11 and not all of Islam, which is, of course, the source of the conflagration in the Middle East which has now been brought to civilized countries.
gravenimage says
Angemon wrote:
gravenimage posted:
“I take your point, Ronald, but the Saudis just a few years after we stationed troops there to protect them from Saddam Hussein happily supported a plot that murdered nearly 3,000 of our people.”
A plot orchestrated by al-qaeda, whom the Saudis snubbed in favour of the US when looking for protection from Saddam. The House of Saud knew they wouldn’t get to keep their lifestyle under al-qaeda’s zealotry.
……………………………
Yes, Angemon, but Saudi officials *were* involved in 9/11, as the story above shows.
You actually see this all the time in Dar-al-Islam. A rational (non-Muslim) person would assume that authorities in the Muslim world would be staunchly opposed to any group that wants to oust them; but actually since Jihadists are Islamic mostly the attitude towards them is rather equivocal.
This happens in Pakistan, in Afghanistan, in Saudi Arabia, in Turkey, and many other parts of Dar-al-Islam, where officials sometimes fight Jihadist groups, sometimes are reluctant to oppose them even when said groups are launching violent Jihad attacks on them, and sometimes support and fund with them outright.
Al Qaida *does* want to drive out the House of Saud; but that does not necessarily, as here, prevent members of that royal family from working with them to slaughter Infidels–even those they are supposed to be allied with.
Angemon says
gravenimage posted:
“Yes, Angemon, but Saudi officials *were* involved in 9/11, as the story above shows.”
Oh, I’m not disputing that, GI – just pointing out how unreliably duplicitous and treacherous Saudi Arabia is. Best case scenario the Saudi government is so inept they can’t keep their own backyard in order, worst case scenario the Saudi government was complicit in attacking the people they ask help from. Years ago I read somewhere (can’t remember where, sorry) that the Saudi approach to American request of information regarding islamic terrorists on their soil was “they’re not here and we know nothing of it”. When confronted with undeniable evidence that they were, in fact, on Saudi soil, their tune changed to “oh, yeah, we just found out they are, in fact, here”.
gravenimage says
True, Angemon.
Alarmed Pig Farmer says
It is also home of the Islam ideology, headquartered in Mecca. But you knew that. Islam is Islam. All variants of it are ultimately the same.
Jack Diamond says
Ah, Prince Bandar again. The longest serving diplomat in Washington, who threw the best and most lavish parties. Head of the Saudi national security council, too. Son of the Crown Prince. Colin Powell’s tennis partner whom, Hugh told us in 2008, presented Powell’s wife with a brand new Jaguar when he heard her remark she missed the one she used to have. Involved in an act of war against America and the murder of 3,000? The genial tennis partner of Colin Powell with access to the highest councils of power in the U.S. government?
Anyone who read the suit brought by the 9/11 survivors knows about the myriad of Saudi charities, banks, and royals intimately involved in funding bin Laden and other terrorists (besides infesting the world with jihad breeding mosques and madrassas, schools, stooges, and PR (deceit) campaigns).
The Muslim World League, for instance, is an ARM of the Saudi government. Huma Abedin’s patron Omar Naseef was Sec. General of the MWL, he formed a subsidiary Rabita Trust, part of the notorious SAAR network. He selected Wael Hamza Jalaidan, one of the founders of Al Qaeda, to direct Rabita Trust. A foreign terrorist entity. But then so is the House of Saud.
According to Andrew McCarthy: “In 2003, in connection with a terrorism prosecution in Chicago, the Justice Department proffered that Osama bin Laden had told his aide Jamal al-Fadl that the Muslim World League was one of al-Qaeda’s three top funding sources.”
It is good to see more dots connected and where they lead. Leaving us the question, what the hell is redacted? Iran and Saudi Arabia need to held accountable for acts of war against the United States.
Jack Diamond says
be held accountable for acts of war against the United States. (I’m firing my typist).
Mark Swan says
Good One Jack
gravenimage says
Yes–we already knew about Saudi involvement in 9/11 and many other acts of Jihad terror. This is just further confirmation.
linnte says
Redacted stuff probably names a President or two. Gee, sounds kinda conspiracy theory stuff eh?
Kepha says
My own guess, after having gone to the CNN site to read their facsimile reproductions of the pages, is that the parts that are still blacked out are probably protecting foreign and domestic sources, as well as the names of intelligence and law enforcement personnel who were working on the issue. As a former US Foreign Service Officer, one major gripe I have with both Snowden and Shrillary Shrooooo is that their deliberate and negligent leaks of classified information endangered people in Afghanistan who may have helped us, Chinese dissidents who have met with US diplomats; and many others.
Back when I served, if I ever quoted someone by name, the cable went out marked Confidential or higher–unless it dealt with something blatantly public, such as remarks made by a local politician at some highly public event in which there would be a large media presence anyway. In other matters, such as dealing with foreign officials on sensitive matters (such as treatment of refugees, trade, security, etc.), you did not want to commit either the US or the other guys to some position before the details of an agreement had been worked out. Further, if some dissident in a totalitarian country approached you, or someone local gave you news that the host government didn’t want out (such as non-sanctioned demonstrations against corrupt Party officials in some off-beat part of China), you definitely wanted to protect your source.
gravenimage says
Most likely, Kepha.
Angemon says
*gasp*
I’m shocked, SHOCKED!!!
Norger says
Exactly. How many of the hijackers were Saudis; wasn’t it 14 out of 17 or something like that? Everyone always knew the Saudis had a hand in this.
Cecilia Ellis says
Norger, here is the breakdown of countries from which the 19 hijackers came:
Saudi Arabia: 15
United Arab Emirates (UAE): 2
Egypt: 1
Lebanon: 1
http://www.911memorial.org/faq-about-911
robert says
Bomb Mecca. Simple as that. Choot ’em!
cs says
dismantle it, obliterate it.
gravenimage says
Confirmed: Top Saudi Officials Aided the 9/11 Jihad Plot
……………………
None of this surprises–but it is good to see official confirmation.
Peggy says
So why then attack Iraq?
it would’ve made more sense to attack Saudi Arabia and get rid of that regime there. Seems to me that should’ve been the priority.
Instead they went after Saddam who posed no threat to America and kept the Jihadists in line.
Well, I think we know the answer to all that. Oil, money and keeping the globalists swimming in it all.
It all makes me sick.
Anyone who played a part in spilling innocent blood over there and in the west should pay dearly.
Angemon says
Peggy posted:
“So why then attack Iraq?”
Really? You’re asking that now? Threats to use WMDs, violation of treaties, shooting against US and British planes, etc.
“Well, I think we know the answer to all that. Oil, money and keeping the globalists swimming in it all.”
Oh, great, more tinfoil hat conspiracy theories… First of all, citations needed. Second, have you ever read a history book, Peggy? Remember the first Gulf war? Saddam went after the Kuwaiti oil fields. The Coalition troops got them back, although Iraqi troops set them on fire. What did America do? Did it keep the oil fields for itself? No, it put out the fires, fixed the fields and returned them to their rightful owner. Now the second Gulf war. How many Coalition troops lost limb and life fighting in the desert to take control of an oil field? None whatsoever. They were gunned down or caught in IED blasts while fighting in cities, defending hospitals and protecting civilians from terrorists (al-qaeda. etc.).
Where’s the war for oil you’re claiming?
The way you spit on the blood, sweat and tears and disregard the sacrifice of many brave young men and women is shameful, if not outright criminal.
Why are you propagating those debunked lies after all these years, Peggy? What’s your goal here?
duh swani says
The way you spit on the blood, sweat and tears and disregard the sacrifice of many brave young men and women is shameful, if not outright criminal.
That’s a little heavy ain’t it…?
Angemon says
No, not really. The Coalition troops who died in Iraq did not die in a forsaken desert fighting for an oil field, they died in urban combat. There’s no good reason on this day and age to parrot the “war for oil” lie, and I’d dare anyone who believes that lie to tell to a Gulf War vet that he/she went in Iraq to steal oil.
The numbers for American crude/oil imports can be found here:
https://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/pet_move_impcus_a2_nus_ep00_im0_mbbl_m.htm
I suggest people chart a graph with “all countries” and “Iraq” to see how little Iraqi oil matters in the long run:
http://oi68.tinypic.com/2q3204i.jpg
If the US went to war in Iraq for oil, it would stand to reason that the US would maintain a stranglehold on both on Iraqi oil production and supply. Where’s this stranglehold? Where are US companies profiting from it? China, not the US, won the first postwar oil license awarded by the Iraqi government.
“War for oil” = BDS – “Bush Derangement Syndrome”.
duh swani says
Angemon
Yes really…You are intelligent enough to state facts and opinion without personal insults…
I already know about ‘blood for oil… That;s not why I addressed you…but thanks anyway…
Angemon says
While I see where you’re getting, DS, I stand by my words. The “Iraq was because of oil” collectivist crowd needs a cold shower of reality. They’re not just lying about the US, they’re lying about everyone involved in it. They’re saying that the UK, Australia, Poland, and every other country involved at some point, whether in the initial invasion or later as a peacekeeper, went to Iraq to steal oil for America, and that the soldiers who lost limb and life were rapacious plunderers. There’s enough material, on several levels, to repudiate the Second Gulf War many times over (and paradoxically, enough material to defend it) – no need to resort to slanderous falsehoods.
RonaldB says
I’ll jump in here.
There was no reason to attack Iraq. The WMD was never proven, and if it was there at all, was old chemical weapons. The accusation that Iraq was developing nuclear weapons was a discredited claim by Bush apologists. Recall the Bush administration maligned Joe Wilson, who debunked their yellow cake uranium claims.
And the urban casualties of US troops actually came not from the toppling of Hussein’s regime, for which no one should shed any tears, but from the efforts of the Bush administration to nation build. The American administrator, Paul Bremer, systematically dismantled the Iraq army, Iraq bureaucracy, and Iraqi police. He opened up Iraq to the insurgency. There is no excuse for that..none. This is what is responsible for the bulk of US casualties there, and was thoroughly avoidable.
And Iraq under Hussein didn’t attack US planes. They occasionally trained their radar on the planes, generally resulting in an attack on the missile site. It was a nuisance, but didn’t justify a full-blown war.
I’ll assert here: the attack on Iraq was not justified and totally unproductive to the US. Hussein was a nasty character, but as it turned out, you need that sort of vicious dictatorship to govern an Islamic country.
Angemon says
Hindsight 20-20, Ronald – it’s easy now, more than 10 years after the fact, to look back and say that the reports of WMDs were exaggerated. Things were different back in 2003, when 9/11 was still a fresh wound.
duh swani says
Angemon I stand by my words,,,
If you mean the insults to Peggy, your words give JW a bad name…It’s hard to defend abuse…
Angemon says
duh swani posted:
“If you mean the insults to Peggy, your words give JW a bad name…It’s hard to defend abuse…”
Not sure what insults are you talking about – my mention of tinfoil hat? That’s nothing compared with the bitter, repeated invectives I have endured from her. In any way, mentions of tinfoil hat are perfectly apt when someone insists on the nonsense of “war for oil”.
Kepha says
I have not always agreed with Angemon, but his reply to “blood for oil” conspiracy-mongering is spot on. Further, Sadam Hussein was one bad actor who paid families of Falastin suicide bombers 25K ( a lot of money for them ), and in the first Gulf War offered bounties on murdered coalition diplomats and their dependents. Would the evil Bush II have offered 10K for a 7-year-old’s head, even if the offspring of a prominent Iraqi Ba’athi?
Sadam Hussein got a pass from the Immoderate Left because he was an erstwhile Soviet client, not because he kept Muslim crazies in check (he checked only those whom he didn’t like, and backed those whom he did like).
BTW, while OBL was holed up in Sudan, his people were in almost daily contact with Sadam Hussein’s embassy in Khartoum. What the details were, I do not know, except they probably weren’t talking pain-killers and building projects. It’s only in the movies that the CIA and NSA know everything.
RonaldB says
Hi again, Kepha,
While reading Spencer’s book on Iran, I found that the 9/11 hijackers were very closely linked to Iran, with multiple trips to Iran and multiple contacts with Iranian agents. My impression is that the direct Iranian support for the 9/11 hijackers was far more extensive, as was the Saudi support, than Saddam Hussein’s.
Saddam Hussein was indeed a bad apple. The question is, were we better off with him holding Iraq together and serving as a foil for Iran, or without him?
And, even if we took Hussein out, just to show we could, the subsequent dismantling of all Iraq institutions was devastating. We would have been far better off simply allowing whatever strong man emerged after Hussein to take over.
Peggy says
Stop with the insults. Can you control yourself?
Now, we were discussing Saudis involvement in 9/11. I remember very well being told by our media that we have to go after Saddam because of 9/11.
Yes, that was one of the excuses for that invasion.
Second, WMDs was also used to attack Iraq.
Surprise, surprise, no WMDs found.
Then a third excuse was offered. Saddam is a tyrant and just has to go.
So don’t start with tin foil rubbish. Just because I never bought those excuses doesn’t make me a conspiracy theorist.
Just to make something clear. Are you saying that the Iraq war was for a noble cause?
Then you say:
“The way you spit on the blood, sweat and tears and disregard the sacrifice of many brave young men and women is shameful, if not outright criminal”
How exactly do I spit on the blood, sweat and tears of the troops? Tell me how or stop lying.
Stop putting words in my mouth.
I have NEVER said anything against the troops. I am hard on the government but never on the soldiers. They are sent to a war whether just or not. They don’t get a say so they should always be backed.
I have tried not to respond to you but you have gone too far again. I cannot sit back and take your abuse, yes abuse, you twist my words and lie.
Angemon says
Peggy posted:
“Stop with the insults.”
What insults? What did I say that was an insult? Are you that conditioned to lie about me and try to play the victim you don’t actually bother to read what I post?
“Second, WMDs was also used to attack Iraq.
Surprise, surprise, no WMDs found.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LgQw8EhPJWw
“So don’t start with tin foil rubbish. Just because I never bought those excuses doesn’t make me a conspiracy theorist.”
Huh, you know that anyone can read what you wrote, right? You blamed the war on Iraq on oil and globalists. That’s why I talked about tinfoil hats and conspiracy theories. Give it up, Peggy – you can’t rewrite your posts without an “edit” function, no matter how much BS you fling:
“How exactly do I spit on the blood, sweat and tears of the troops? Tell me how or stop lying.”
It’s in the part of my post that you conveniently left out. You know, where I debunk your claim that the war in Iraq was for oil. And it was further expanded on another post. Oh, can’t address that, can you? Much easier to pretend it does not exist.
“Stop putting words in my mouth.”
Exactly what words have I put in your mouth? Oh, wait – none whatsoever. You’re just conditioned to fling insults in my general direction and hope something sticks.
“I have tried not to respond to you”
Oh, this is rich, coming from someone who has repeatedly gone well out of her way to attack, insult, deride and lie about me.
“but you have gone too far again. I cannot sit back and take your abuse, yes abuse, you twist my words and lie.”
Exactly what words am I twisting? What did I say that it was a lie?
gravenimage says
Kepha wrote:
Further, Sadam Hussein was one bad actor who paid families of Falastin suicide bombers 25K ( a lot of money for them )…
………………….
All very true.
gravenimage says
Peggy wrote:
So why then attack Iraq?
it would’ve made more sense to attack Saudi Arabia and get rid of that regime there. Seems to me that should’ve been the priority.
Instead they went after Saddam who posed no threat to America and kept the Jihadists in line.
…………………………………
Actually, I never thought Iraq should have been our biggest focus. That being said, it was unfinished business–I think this was what was most on George Bush’s mind.
As for Saddam’s keeping the Jihadists in line, I believe he was–with good reason–considered a Jihadist himself.
This is rather like after-the-fact lauding of Gaddafi as such a (supposedly) staunch anti-Jihadist, despite Lockerbie and everything else.
And I *was* behind our going into Afghanistan, though, both to take out the Taliban and to take away Osama bin Laden’s safe haven there.
I did not know at the time that things would be so botched–that we would be so clueless as to allow Shari’ah law there, and that the Taliban would be all but poised to regain power there.
More:
Well, I think we know the answer to all that. Oil, money and keeping the globalists swimming in it all.
It all makes me sick.
…………………………………
Ah, the usual–that the bad old West is not really concerned about Muslim savagery, but just attacks innocent Muslims so that we can “steal their oil”. Never mind that we never stole any of Iraq’s oil. In fact, their oil did not even pay for the cost of the war, as Bush had hoped.
More:
Anyone who played a part in spilling innocent blood over there and in the west should pay dearly.
…………………………………
Actually, almost all of the blood spilled in Iraq was done–and is still being done–by pious Muslims, and not by American or coalition forces.
Peggy says
Anyone who played a part in spilling innocent blood over there and in the west should pay dearly.
…………………………………
Actually, almost all of the blood spilled in Iraq was done–and is still being done–by pious Muslims, and not by American or coalition forces.
===========================
I did say anyone.
Don’t fool yourself. Coalition forced did spill plenty of innocent blood too. Have you seen Wickileaks footage of some of civilian killings? I have.
As you know, I don’t defend jihadists and have no love to Muslims. I have shown that over and over but I think that Iraq war was a huge mistake.
Saddam was not a jihadist. He was a dictator but Muslims can’t cope with democracy and need a dictator like Saddam. While the likes of Saddam, Gadaffi etc were in power that region was ruled with a firm hand and we didn’t have a situation like we do today.
Iraq did not pose any threat to the US or the west. Why was there a need to remove him? What have we accomplished?
Angemon says
Peggy posted:
“Saddam was not a jihadist. He was a dictator but Muslims can’t cope with democracy and need a dictator like Saddam. While the likes of Saddam, Gadaffi etc were in power that region was ruled with a firm hand and we didn’t have a situation like we do today.”
This is – I kid you not – on the same post as ” I don’t defend jihadists”. What was the Lockerbie bombing then? You know that Saddam actually let jihad terror groups build bases and training camps in Iraq, right?
gravenimage says
Peggy wrote:
Don’t fool yourself. Coalition forced did spill plenty of innocent blood too. Have you seen Wickileaks footage of some of civilian killings? I have.
………………………..
Yeah–that’s the problem–the perfidious West.
More:
Saddam was not a jihadist. He was a dictator but Muslims can’t cope with democracy and need a dictator like Saddam. While the likes of Saddam, Gadaffi etc were in power that region was ruled with a firm hand and we didn’t have a situation like we do today.
………………………..
Bringing down that plane over Lockerbie was, no doubt, proof that Gadaffi was not a Jihadist. That plane must have been full of Islamic terrorists…or not…
linnte says
Graven was the Lockerbie incident Islamic? I didn’t know!
gravenimage says
Linnte–yes, the terrible Lockerbie Bombing was a Jihad terror attack–before many of us fully understood what Jihad was.
Here are the basic outlines of the case:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pan_Am_Flight_103
As an appalling codicil, one of the bombers was released by Scottish authorities on humanitarian grounds after being diagnosed with last-stage terminal prostate cancer in 2009, and was allowed to return home.
He was received like a conquering hero in Libya.
He spent the next several years snubbing his nose at the foolish, overly-compassionate West. Jihad Watch covered the story quite extensively:
“Surprise, surprise: Lockerbie bomber disappears”
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2009/12/surprise-surprise-lockerbie-bomber-disappears
“Fooled you, kuffar: Lockerbie bomber living in luxury villa six months after being at ‘death’s door’”
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2010/02/fooled-you-kuffar-lockerbie-bomber-living-in-luxury-villa-six-months-after-being-at-deaths-door
There are more. The Jihadists who ousted Gaddafi may have opposed him on many points; but they would not extradite this Jihadist, either. No surprise there…
Richard Paulsen says
Recommend raising taxes for receiving money from Saudi Arabia and to lower for companies, high, medium and low wages.
sidney penny says
“And above all, the next American administration must make a searching reevaluation of our relationship with Saudi Arabia, and stop treating enemies as allies.”
Robert,is Pakistan an enemy we are treating as an ally?
Why are we giving so much aid to Pakistan?( when they get enough from Saudi Arabia)
gravenimage says
Yes. Robert Spencer has rightly noted many times that Pakistan is not an ally of ours, any more than is Saudi Arabia.
eduardo odraude says
Another unique video from David Wood. The last minute of it has a Christian message, but the rest of it has much that may be of interest to non-Christians as well. Even if you are not Christian you should be able to appreciate this man’s absolute fearlessness, sense of humor, and logical brilliance.
Dealing with Death Threats
linnte says
I got my first death threat the other day!
Peggy says
That’s horrible. Do they have any idea where you are?
linnte says
No they couldn’t connect me to anything. And I actually told the man Saudisomething, that he honored me and I thanked him, after telling him he was a coward and that I must have hit the truth that’s why he wanted to make me go away! Then I LAUGHED at him! Hahahahahhaha! Like this hahahahahahaha!
Peggy, there are about 20 different women in my county alone with my exact same name. Ha! And I sleep with my pistol and my big black dog. ? And I am not afraid to use either one!
I know I’m crazy but I will never stop telling anyone, Muslim or not, the truth about Islam. It really DOES freak them out when you can quote Qur’an and Hadiths! They usually stop communicating with you right then and there.
duh swani says
I got my first death threat the other day!
What took so long?
linnte says
Awww Duh Swami, gimmee a break! I’ve only been at this for a year now! hahahaha!
gravenimage says
What happened, Linnte?
linnte says
Oh, I was responding to Newt Gingrich’s statements on a YouTube video about Islam that he made after the Nice tragedy. Quoted some Qur’an regarding how Qur’an commands Jihad. And then said Islam must be eradicated in the West and if Muslims don’t like that send them back to the ME where they can enjoy Shari’a all they like. And this guy with the moniker Saudi blah blah said I had never read Qur’an and that I was a Zionist Jew pig. So I responded that he was a coward and didn’t know the Qur’an as well as I. Then he came back and said I know where you live…..Bridge is a nice town and I will get you and you are done. hahahahaha! I responded and thanked him for honoring me with my first death threat and that I must have said the truth to have it bother him so much. And I called him a coward again because he couldn’t control himself as it was just words we were saying. And then I laughed at him!
He went away. Hahahahahahaha! It really didn’t bother me. There is no way for him to find me.
gravenimage says
You are a brave person, Linnte. Kudos to you.
linnte says
Naw, it wasn’t brave, it was what needed to be done to shut the guy up! And it worked. He was blasting others too. If I hadn’t had you all to learn from, I would have backed down terrified! Calling him a coward was what got him. I will stand my ground. And having protection helps me be a bit gutsy. hahahaha! But thanks though. I know my kids if they find out will be verrrry angry with me. But they know their ma. If I know it’s true, nuthin’ can change my mind.
We are at war! HU RAH!
gravenimage says
Linnte, a lot of these cowardly Mohammedans *will* back off if challenged. But not all of them–be safe.
cs says
We all love and respect David Wood.
gravenimage says
Yes–he’s a treasure.
gravenimage says
I finally watched the video. I didn’t think it possible for me to respect David Wood more than I already did, but that was just awesome. A great combination of defiance, courage, humor, and compassion.
jorge says
usa is saudi arabia ally, usa is an empire care not for human rights its business is to make war atack irak secular country and saddam was cia asset and then betray him gave wepons to iran and irak at the same time during the irak iran war, then was de facto ally with assad to invade irak then supported the muslim brotherhood in egypt and betray mubbarack another cia asset then bribe ukranian politician generals and corrupt oligarc to stage a coup annex hawai and california new mexico etc have been invading and in war 70 year the usa govermnent is corrupt paid by big corporation dictators wall street thiefs weapon manufactor monsanto agro shit etc etc
Jeff says
You sound like a conspiracy theorist. Although everything you’ve said sounds correct.
linnte says
Yes Jorge, and it has to stop!
Angemon says
jorge, what do you think about Trump’s wall?
gravenimage says
Somehow I think “agro shit” sums up jorge’s post…
Peggy says
I do agree with your statement that Saddam was US asset. He was backed by US when he had a war with Iran.
Jeff says
I hate to be Debbie Downer(or Hillary) but what difference does it make now. Nobody cares. Nothing is going to be done about it. Who is going to bring charges? Lorreta Lynch? James Comey? Obama? Hillary? The CIA? Home land Security? It doesn’t matter. It’s history get over it. BOO HOO
Peggy says
Many people care and we can’t just say it’s done so let’s move on.
These people have to be punished for their crimes against humanity and maybe, just maybe, Trump will put the right people in certain positions who will go after these parasites.
I am assuming that Trump will win. If he doesn’t then the US has blown the last chance to save itself. These parasites don’t need much more time to get us to the point of no return.
The US has a huge influence throughout the world and it affects us all.
Jeff says
Every sentence you wrote is exactly what I believe and am “fighting” for. I’ve been using the same defeatist language to provoke a (hopefully) positive response like yours. I gave CNN one that far left liberals could use in their leftist propaganda manual. It’s a kind of reverse psychology. I ordered 38 Trump flags so far and sold them. Plus 8 hats. I’ve held 4 unofficial on my own Trump rallies. Thank you.
Jack Diamond says
Apathy for the Devil.
gravenimage says
Grimly brilliant, Jack.
linnte says
It makes a HUGE difference Mr downer. Because we will win this thing! If it takes Revolution or Nuclear War, humanity will come out UNISLAMIC! And I believe Jesus wouldn’t want us to just give in and submit to Islam either!
Peggy says
I wish we can d this without shedding blood of the innocent.
Eur says
Impossible. France is on the brink of civil war. Once start the revenge of indigenous terrorist groups against Islam nobody know (or maybe yes) how they can react against westerns and Christians in Islamic countries. France is a nuclear army ….. the situation is more serious than people thinky.How many Muslim attacks will stand the French and European society? Now disgust , fear, rejection occurs ur Islam and Muslims in Europe is explosive. Something is about to happen , it is evident.
linnte says
Me too Peggy! Muslim kids especially and there are millions of them, I believe, who have no clue what’s going on. And innocent non Muslims will suffer too. It makes me sick. Desperately sick.
gravenimage says
Eur wrote:
Impossible. France is on the brink of civil war. Once start the revenge of indigenous terrorist groups against Islam nobody know…
……………..
Ah, the usual. The “real danger” is “indigenous terrorist groups”, rather than ravening Jihadists. *Ugh*.
underbed cat says
Like they say to the “get over it crowd”, history repeats itself…..when you don’t get it the first time. So it does matter…it will matter.
RonaldB says
“what difference does it make now”?
Past wrongs cannot be made right. But, the future is still in our hands.
The first lesson is to not trust Saudi Arabia. We can use them, but not trust them.
The second lesson is to make it a felony for any politician to have foreign contributions, directly or indirectly.
The third lesson is to cut off all foreign funding of educational, communications, or religious institutions.
The fourth lesson is to severely limit or stop altogether foreign entry into the US, except for very controlled purposes. Many of the Saudi hijackers entered the US under a special visa program designed to bypass any security vetting, and even so, when the visa applications were reviewed, the vetting didn’t even meet the woeful standards that were in place. In other words, the Bush administration directly oversaw the easy entry of US visitors who, by any imaginable standards, should never have been admitted.
But, as I said before, the Republicans and the Bush administration was riddled with Islamist agents, as is the Obama administration.
Anyone want references on that?
gravenimage says
Jeff wrote:
I hate to be Debbie Downer(or Hillary) but what difference does it make now. Nobody cares. Nothing is going to be done about it. Who is going to bring charges? Lorreta Lynch? James Comey? Obama? Hillary? The CIA? Home land Security? It doesn’t matter. It’s history get over it. BOO HOO
…………………
No, it’s *not* just history. Nothing can be done for the victims of 9/11 now, but it you don’t believe that continuing to think we can ally with a nation that was behind the murder of almost 3,000 of our people, then you are a fool.
The idea that we can do *nothing* to change our policies going forward is very much mistaken.
gravenimage says
Oh–now I see that Jeff was just playing games. Even more unpleasant.
siesmann says
And Bush and Cheney made sure that their Saudi benefactors had a safe passage out of USA and from the clutches of the law.
Ver Auger says
It seems to me that the junior President Bush acted against the safety and best interests of the USA by allowing a cover-up of the involvement in the 9/11 attacks of a purported ally. And how does that differ from treason?
linnte says
It IS treason. And this is why it took so long for these 28 pages to be published, and why the Saudi King said he would sell off billions of dollars of assets belonging to USA if the papers were revealed. Am waiting for THAT shoe to fall!!!!!!!
RonaldB says
” Saudi King said he would sell off billions of dollars of assets belonging to USA…”
The assets held by the Saudis are hundreds of billions of dollars worth of treasury bonds the US government has used to fund the Obama deficit spending. And it didn’t start with Obama.
The first principle of security is to live within your means and reject financial dependence on other people. “He who pays the piper calls the tune”. The US cannot truly be secure while it uses other countries to fund its deficit spending.
gravenimage says
Yes–our sky-high debt makes us much less secure.
Jack Diamond says
Assets that could be seized as reparations. How many trillions did 9/11 cost us?
Hugh Fitzgerald from 2008, “Why We Do Not Need the Saudis”:
“Saudi Arabia is hopelessly dependent on us, and on the outside world, for its wage-slaves, for its protection (of the regime especially), and for access to education and medical care. It is we, or rather, it is those in the capitals of the West, who as individuals — those who leave “public service” (ex-diplomats, ex-Congressmen, ex-intelligence agents), as well as journalists and professors who can benefit from showing the “right attitude” toward Saudi Arabia — have convinced ourselves, and convinced too many of those in power, that “we just can’t alienate Saudi Arabia” because we “need their oil.” It just isn’t true. It shows a misunderstanding of the oil market, and of Saudi dependence. It has allowed individuals who may benefit from being rewarded directly or indirectly by the Saudis to confuse their own private well-being with the well-being of the United States.
“the State Department’s so-called Middle East “experts” are stuck in a time-warp. They can’t free themselves from their own cliches and misreadings of Saudi Arabia, of both its “friendliness” (it’s nonsense) and its “power” over us. It has no power over us. We should first be clear about that ourselves, and about why it is so, then explain to the Al-Saud that we understand that better, and they will have to as well. And as a sign of that new understanding, on both sides, we want an immediate halt to the Saudi financing — about 100 billion dollars so far — used to spread Islam in the Lands of the Infidels, and to propagandize on behalf of both Islam and of Saudi Arabia. They don’t like it? Too bad. They’ll make noises about “selling our oil” elsewhere? The oil market is fungible. Saudi Arabia sells us oil at the same market prices as does (or would) any other producer, whether friend or enemy. And all those non-liquid assets various Gulf Arabs have bought in the West are…non-liquid, and can be seized, if the mood comes upon us, and we remember what we did to the assets of those deemed enemy aliens during World War II. Are not those in Saudi Arabia supporting, directly and indirectly, the worldwide Jihad, not “enemy aliens”? Why not?
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2008/08/fitzgerald-why-we-do-not-need-the-saudis
gravenimage says
Thanks for quoting Hugh Fitzgerald here, Jack. Excellent stuff. We *do not* need the Saudis–in fact, they continue to be a serious threat to us.
Kepha says
How do we know that OBL’s half-brother #27 or someone like that didn’t hate OBL’s guts, and offer the USA some valuable intelligence? Polygamous families aren’t happpy ones, and you often have half-brothers ranged against each other. There were reasons why Ottoman Sultans made it a point to kill off their siblings on ascending the throne, and the Old Testament itself is very open about issues in the houses of the Patriarch Jacob and King David (one reason why I like it is because it ddoesn’t shrink from exposing the sins of the ssaints). How do we know that some of the Sa’udis allowed to go home didn’t leave with messages like, “OK, we have had to declare a few of your people personae non grata, and if you want continued backing, you’re going to have to ….”?
While the Bush family may have been too close to the Sa’udis, I’m sure that there were a number of Sa’udi and UAE vulnerabilities of which the US government was aware, and willing to use regardless of administration.
RonaldB says
“there were a number of Sa’udi and UAE vulnerabilities of which the US government was aware, and willing to use regardless of administration.”
I like your idea,Kepha, but it doesn’t go nearly far enough. Use the Saudis, but keep them at arms length, and make it clear we don’t trust them.
Having said that, I think it’s a huge mistake for the US to assume it can positively affect events in the Middle East by acting rather than by not acting. The Saudis will follow their own council. They are making covert alliances with the Israelis because the crazy Iranians are threatening the Saudis. This has nothing to do with the US. The less the US interferes in the Middle East, the better.
Baucent says
I read the report and was amazed at the details of intrigue linking the 9/11 terrorists to named Saudi diplomats and high officials. And John Brennan has the nerve to say the Government of Saudi Arabia is in the clear? What many people forget is the government of Saudi Arabia is a kingdom not a democracy and is based on a “royal” family with strong tribal connections. Members of the Royal Family are indirectly agents of the Saudi Government if not directly working for it with official title. There are just too many connections to be a coincidence and too many for the Saudi Government not to know about the 9/11 plot.
UNCLE VLADDI says
HANG BUSH AND OBAMA FOR TREASON!
Jay Boo says
You have added a bit of false equivalence.
It is ok to call Obama guilty of treason with out adding Bush.
Bush is chump change compared to Obama’s love affair with Muzzies.
No comparison.
It is customary to shoot traitors at a firing squad.
linnte says
I wonder why this isn’t plastered all over Facebook? It should be a top story. Weird!
Luke says
Sorry but I’m not buying it. 2 problems:
1. This is as big a pretext for war the world has ever seen. Ever. Instead they trumped some weak garbage about Saddam. Not to retaliate against SA is treason if this is true.
2. Having seen the overwhelming evidence that 9/11 was an inside job, and with half the world now convinced it was, realeasing this information smacks of a PR job. See: September Clues. Once again, if no war is now launched against Saudi Arabia, their oilfields occupied and Mecca dismantled, then the story has to be garbage. Any government which does not act on this information is complicit.
duh swani says
2. Having seen the overwhelming evidence that 9/11 was an inside job,
So does all that evidence lead to the ‘Mr Big’ who ordered it? If not the evidence is useless…
RonaldB says
The 9/11 conspirators have their own hermetically sealed world where any scientific or engineering calculations designed to disprove conspiracy are part of the conspiracy.
There are quite enough loose ends about the handling of 9/11 without bringing in the red herrings that 9/11 was perpetrated by the Israelis or the CIA.
There was a systematic refusal of US security agencies to follow through on information that was already in their hands. In my opinion, the Israelis may have had a general idea that something was going on. But, then again, so did US agencies, so are you going to blame the Israelis for not acting on what they knew? Who would they tell?
The US had a wall between domestic and foreign intelligence, so the CIA was not allowed to share the contents of a hard disk they were in possession of to the FBI. A ticket agent thought Muhammad Atta, one of the hijackers, stood out like a sore thumb, but didn’t say anything because of the mandates from the Bush administration to not single out Arabs or Muslims.
So, there are quite enough facts to work on without pulling conspiracies and fantasies out of the air.
Jack Diamond says
It is despicable not to hold the murderers accountable and an insult to the dead.
To deny both (Islamic) responsibility and the (Islamic) reason they were killed.
gravenimage says
Yes–these “Truthers” are despicable.
Baucent says
Quite agree Jack.
Carolyne says
I had a sister (She died several years ago) who was convinced that no one died in the World Trade Towers destruction and that those claimed to be dead were alive and living in Canada. She had no explanation as to how the US could convince its citizens to do that–to leave their families forever and to allow fake funerals, etc. And she had no explanation as to why Canada would conspire to allow those 3,000 or so people to become Canadian. I gave her instructions for folding a tinfoil had–actually aluminum hat– but she went to her grave determined that it was a hoax. She was otherwise an intelligent person.
gravenimage says
So sorry to hear about your sister, Carolyne. While this is more extreme than most, I think most of us have otherwise intelligent loved ones in pretty deep denial about the Jihad threat.
David M says
The day after 9/11 Bin Laden said he didn’t do it. Why did you say he admitted to it?
Rick Spencer says
Hi Luke…
Any thinking person would strongly agree with you that ‘9/11’ was indeed an INSIDE JOB! There is no way that the 2 aircraft could have caused the towers to collapse. No way!
Think JW people… THINK! How the !@#$% did Building 7 collapse? Even the OFFICIAL 9/11 REPORT makes NO MENTION of this! Then think about the flight trajectory into the Pentagon… an inexperienced pilot could NEVER have flown a huge Boeing so accurately. Whatever… there was absolutely NO EVIDENCE of a passenger plane having crashed into the Pentagon. THINK for yourselves, JW people! Where were the wings, the engines, the wheels, the seats, the bodies, the luggage, etc, etc? Fore sure: It was his by a low flying unmanned aircraft of some sort! Street poles were knocked down. No footage of a large plane, when there are cams all over the show, covering the most safeguarded building on the planet!
Anyway, do have a look at this: https://youtu.be/IYUYya6bPGw. As with WTC7, there can be NO DOUBT in an intelligent person’s mind that both WTC1 and WTC2 were IMPLODED!
The biggest CONSPIRACY is the OFFICIAL STORY!
Angemon says
Rick Spencer posted:
“Think JW people… THINK! How the !@#$% did Building 7 collapse? Even the OFFICIAL 9/11 REPORT makes NO MENTION of this! ”
http://www.nist.gov/public_affairs/releases/wtc_062907.cfm
“Then think about the flight trajectory into the Pentagon… an inexperienced pilot could NEVER have flown a huge Boeing so accurately.”
Citation needed. Exactly how much training is required to steer an airplane in mid-air? They did NOT need to know how to take-off and and, just steer. And it was not exactly flying a thread into a needle’s eye – Boeings and skyscrapers tend to be very large.
“there was absolutely NO EVIDENCE of a passenger plane having crashed into the Pentagon. THINK for yourselves, JW people! Where were the wings, the engines, the wheels, the seats, the bodies, the luggage, etc, etc?”
http://www.popularmechanics.com/military/a5659/debunking-911-myths-pentagon/
“The biggest CONSPIRACY is the OFFICIAL STORY!”
How does this report fit in your conspiracy theory?
David M says
No explosives in WTC 7 eh? That’s not what the fire chief Daniel Negro says at 0:22 of this video: “clear the area, the building is going to blow up” right after an explosion.
Angemon says
David M posted:
“No explosives in WTC 7 eh? That’s not what the fire chief Daniel Negro says at 0:22 of this video: “clear the area, the building is going to blow up” right after an explosion.”
What fire chief Daniel Negro says is NOT “there are explosives in the building”, is it? And one only says “blow up” when he knows, for a fact, there are explosives set up and ready to explode, right? Are you suggesting fire chief Daniel Negro was in on this alleged conspiracy?
smh
Talk about grasping at straws…
Trico says
Part 2:
David M
Did you know that Marvin Bush, George W’s younger brother headed the Security firm that had the Security contract for the WTC? Their Security contract with the WTC ended on September 10, 2010.
How convenient.
They also had the Security contract at the airports and airlines that were breached on 9/11.
Here’s some articles on Google:
https://www.google.com/search?q=neil+bush+was+in+charge+of+security+for+WTC&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8
–
WTC & Asbestos
Here’s some articles on: “World Trade Center” Scam Exposed |”
https://www.google.com/search?q=World+Trade+Center+Towers+were+condemned+for+asbestos+in+early+2001%2C&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8
–
Trico says
Part 1:
David M, I wish I was able to contact you directly but will do so here one time. You are trying to convince people that not only don’t want to be convinced , I believe they are paid Agents making sure your 9/11 narrative goes no where. DAT Agent=Disinformation Attack Team Agent.
They work in teams and gang up on you, belittle you, aim to discredit and silence you so you do not bring awareness to those innocently unaware.
I believe there are several DAT Agents here. You should be able to figure who they are. as They attack everything you say and will discredit any “proof” you offer up. When you were told Building 7 came down because of the weight of burning debris on the roof , that has to be a DAT Agent. No one can be so utterly clueless.
Yesterday Robert Spencer came out with an article on 9/11 and Iran’s complicity. In the article, Robert Spencer espoused the Official Government Narrative, 19 Hijackers and 3 Commercial Airplanes. So David, you will only frustrate yourself trying to convince those who don’t want to be convinced and are actively working against you. If anyone tries to join your narrative, they will also be attacked.
Remember being called a “Truther”? Wear the Truther label like a Badge of Honor.
The Medical Establishment kept us from the true Healers by labeling them as Quacks and their medical disciplines as Quackery and it worked.
The Muslim Brotherhood uses “Islamophobia” as a word weapon to silence critics of Islam and it works.
The CIA came up with the “Conspiracy Theorists” to discredit those who challenge the Official Government Narrative and it works and has also morphed into the labels “Truthers” and “Preppers”.
–
There are a bunch of reasons why 9/11 happened. Little known is that the World Trade Center had been condemned for Asbestos Contamination in early 2001 before Larry Silverstein officially took ownership. Why would a sophisticated investor like Larry Silverstein buy the condemned WTC property? It would have costs billions of dollars to have the asbestos removed floor by floor. Here’s a clue: Architectural plans for a Building 7 replacement had already been drawn up in 2000.
Of course, the never ending War on Terror which started the systematic loss of Freedom and Privacy was another big reason. The Patriot Act had been written before 9/11 and flew through Congress.
You probably have learned of some of the other reasons.
–
In this short video Larry Silverstein admits he ordered WTC Building 7 to be “pulled” because the fires were out of control. I think he admitted this just to provide an answer to how Building 7 came down. He’s lying, of course, that the decision to bring #7 down was made on the spot on 9/11.
It would have taken weeks to cut the steel girders and plant the explosives.
All the elevators in WTC underwent refurbishing in the months leading up to 9/11. That’s when the girders were cut and the explosives were planted.
–
“Larry Silverstein admits to having demolished wtc building 7 ”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2q2mD2HaKA
–
Article from 2013: “9/11 could be insurance fraud as “trial” of conspiring duo begins in NY today”
http://www.infowars.com/911-could-be-insurance-fraud-as-trial-of-conspiring-duo-begins-in-ny-today/
–
Angemon says
Trico posted:
“You are trying to convince people that not only don’t want to be convinced , I believe they are paid Agents making sure your 9/11 narrative goes no where. DAT Agent=Disinformation Attack Team Agent.”
Because what else would someone who doesn’t buy your conspiracy theories possibly be if not a disinformation agent, right?
You want to look for disinformation agents, start looking for Russian trolls paid to spread anti-Western, anti-American propaganda. Oh, wait – part of their propaganda is that 9/11 was an inside job…
“They work in teams and gang up on you, belittle you, aim to discredit and silence you so you do not bring awareness to those innocently unaware.”
A more accurate description would that people with a functioning brain ridicule people who willingly believe something that’s ridiculous to begin with. If you were to tell us you believe in the Easter bunny you’d be ridiculed – would that mean there’s a conspiracy to hide the existence of the Easter Bunny?
Those you describe as “innocently unaware” should be able to make their own minds. And what’s this about “silencing you”? Who is preventing you from posting here?
“Yesterday Robert Spencer came out with an article on 9/11 and Iran’s complicity. In the article, Robert Spencer espoused the Official Government Narrative, 19 Hijackers and 3 Commercial Airplanes.”
OK, let’s see if I can follow: Robert Spencer, who owns the site and could effectively silence you – by either deleting your posts or banning you – is part of this conspiracy – even though he’s not silencing you. Hmmmmmmm…….
“Remember being called a “Truther”? Wear the Truther label like a Badge of Honor.”
Boy, you don’t get sarcasm, do you? Remember how “Little John” – Robin Hood’s second-in-command – was consistently represented as a *large* man? Little John, large man? See where I’m getting at? For all your bluster and accusations about “truth” and close-mindedness, you’re just as close-minded as the people you decry, since you’re not after the truth, you’re after confirmation.
“The Medical Establishment kept us from the true Healers by labeling them as Quacks and their medical disciplines as Quackery and it worked.”
That was what Steve Jobs thought and what caused him to delay seeking actual medical treatment for the cancer that ultimately claimed his life.
“The CIA came up with the “Conspiracy Theorists” to discredit those who challenge the Official Government Narrative and it works and has also morphed into the labels “Truthers” and “Preppers”.”
Hold it right there. Don’t you *dare* try to conflate Preppers/Survivalists with “Conspiracy Theorists”. There’s a difference between learning how to live from the land and/or going off the grid and claiming 9/11 was an inside job or the war in Iraq was about oil. Don’t you f***ing dare to slander survivalists by associating them with tinfoil hat nutbars like yourself.
Mirren10 says
”Talk about grasping at straws…”
Yes. I really don’t, *don’t* understand this desire to believe in ridiculous conspiracy theories, at the expense of common sense. Those inclined will twist *anything* to suit their very silly agendas, even a word or a phrase.
Jack Diamond says
I wish someone were paying me, is anyone else a paid Agent of the Disinformation Agent Attack Team, and where can I join?
and does it have anything to do with the shape-shifting Lizard People Illuminati conspiracy? I can’t keep it all straight.
Does it feel better to blame your own and let Islam and Muslims off the hook?
28,000 attacks later? Disgraceful, despicable, and deranged. The 3D’s. 3D People.
Mirren10 says
”and does it have anything to do with the shape-shifting Lizard People Illuminati conspiracy? I can’t keep it all straight. ”
Oh, I *know* !
I can’t figure out whether we should be forging alliances with the Lizard People, *against* the Illuminati, or whether it should be the other way around …
On the other hand, the ‘NWO’ will doubtless take all these difficult decisions out of our hands, because, of course, there is a world wide conspiracy to control all ‘slave peoples’ (aka you and me ), into a passive voting bloc who will, without reservation, vote into power all the wicked cabal who will, *without reservation* immediately destroy their very own power base.
Of course ! How could I have ever have thought otherwise ? 🙂
David M says
Angemon I’m not saying the fire chief was involved, he merely heard & saw the explosions going off in WTC 7, realised it was being imploded, then told everyone to get out. It’s there on the film, you can’t deny it.
Trico I was aware of all those things, the asbestos, the insurance, etc, thanks. We have both researched 9/11, unlike the people on here who are buying the government story. It’s too close to them as Americans to accept their government was involved in 9/11. They probably have never seen film of WTC 7 falling before. How can anyone watch it fall & not realise it was brought down by controlled demolition? If it fell from fires it would have fallen asymmetrically, not the clean way it fell in the video.
H
Angemon says
David M posted:
“Angemon I’m not saying the fire chief was involved, he merely heard & saw the explosions going off in WTC 7, realised it was being imploded, ”
Oh, he realized it was being imploded? Citation needed.
“then told everyone to get out. It’s there on the film, you can’t deny it. ”
Unless you linked the wrong video, the fire chief doesn’t say the building was being imploded. And what kind of logic is that? Explosion = building was being imploded? Is that what they’re teaching in firemen school these days? “Listen up maggots because I’m only going to say this once: if you hear and/or see an explosion it’s because the building is being imploded”.
gravenimage says
“Truther” David M wrote:
No explosives in WTC 7 eh? That’s not what the fire chief Daniel Negro says at 0:22 of this video: “clear the area, the building is going to blow up” right after an explosion.
………………………….
This is ridiculous. What he means is ‘clear the area, stat! the building is gonna blow! it is not safe’, not ‘explosives were planted in Building 7 by the Illuminati and Mossad in order to make Islam look bad’. Good grief.
gravenimage says
Trico wrote:
I believe they are paid Agents making sure your 9/11 narrative goes no where. DAT Agent=Disinformation Attack Team Agent.
They work in teams and gang up on you, belittle you, aim to discredit and silence you so you do not bring awareness to those innocently unaware.
…………………………………
None of the 9/11 conspiracy theorists have been “silenced” here–both Trico and David M and the assorted others who show up here are still posting, and their comments have not been removed.
The idea that anyone who stands against Jihad is ergo a “DAT” agent is ludicrous. We are people who believe that Jihad is a serious threat, and that those who deny Jihad and instead blame it on America are *not* helping.
More:
I believe there are several DAT Agents here. You should be able to figure who they are. as They attack everything you say and will discredit any “proof” you offer up. When you were told Building 7 came down because of the weight of burning debris on the roof , that has to be a DAT Agent. No one can be so utterly clueless.
…………………………………
Anyone who is not “clueless” believes–what? That the someone set thousands of pounds of somehow undetected explosives in Building 7? That flying planes into office buildings should have no effect on their functioning as normal? What, exactly?
More:
Yesterday Robert Spencer came out with an article on 9/11 and Iran’s complicity. In the article, Robert Spencer espoused the Official Government Narrative, 19 Hijackers and 3 Commercial Airplanes.
…………………………………
Oh, no! Robert Spencer is “in on it”! How *dare* he oppose Jihad, when he could instead be blaming it on–who? The Illuminati? Opus Dei? The Skull and Bones Society? The Hasty Pudding Club?
Definitely a bigger threat than ISIS and Boko Haram…sarc/off
More:
So David, you will only frustrate yourself trying to convince those who don’t want to be convinced and are actively working against you. If anyone tries to join your narrative, they will also be attacked.
Remember being called a “Truther”? Wear the Truther label like a Badge of Honor.
…………………………………
Wear that tinfoil hat as a “Badge of Honor”, as well…
More:
There are a bunch of reasons why 9/11 happened. . Little known is that the World Trade Center had been condemned for Asbestos Contamination in early 2001 before Larry Silverstein officially took ownership… Of course, the never ending War on Terror which started the systematic loss of Freedom and Privacy was another big reason…
…………………………………
In other words, there *is no Jihad threat*. There should be no War on Terror because the only terrorism is from our own people. The real cause of terrorism is to save Larry Silverstein some bucks on that costly asbestos clean-up. It’s not like it has anything to do with Islam wanting to murder and subjugate us. Good God.
Dean says
Bin Laden didn’t intend or expect the buildings to crumble but it was not an inside job. The heat of the burning fuel oil caused the collapse and that is verifiable scientific fact. It was a jihad bonus and nothing more. It surprised everyone but there is a published scientific study in you care to read it. Though i doubt you will read it since conspiracy theories are so much more fun.
Rick Spencer says
Dean… Why did WTC7 collapse? There was no burning fuel. But, dear Dean, burning kerosene (jet fuel) can never be hot enough to affect the stability of steel. Nowhere, besides WTC 1 and 2, has a towering inferno led to a collapse of a steel core high rise building. Nowhere on the plant, ever. The towers were imploded by nano-thermite explosives. The planes flying into them had SFA to do with the collapse of the 2 towers.
Take time to watch this:
https://youtu.be/IYUYya6bPGw This is a MUST WATCH video!
(Oops! I provided the incorrect YouTube link in my response to Luke!)
Angemon says
Rick Spencer posted:
“Dean… Why did WTC7 collapse? There was no burning fuel. ”
Like I pointed out:
“But, dear Dean, burning kerosene (jet fuel) can never be hot enough to affect the stability of steel. ”
Citation needed.
“The towers were imploded by nano-thermite explosives.”
Citation needed. Do you know the kind of work and effort it takes to implode a building? How long it takes to prepare everything? How the building is stripped to its barebones? Must have been quite an amazing feat – teams of demolition expertgoing around and stripping the building, drilling holes, planting explosives, all without interfering with the busy daily activity.
David M says
Bin Laden was never charged with 9/11, look it up. You know why the charges were dropped against Bin Laden by the FBI? Because there was no evidence against him.
Angemon says
David M posted:
“Bin Laden was never charged with 9/11, look it up.”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/27/AR2006082700687.html
“You know why the charges were dropped against Bin Laden by the FBI? Because there was no evidence against him.”
Citation needed. Oh, and where the charges dropped because of lack of evidence or was he never charged to begin with?
gravenimage says
The appalling David M wrote:
Bin Laden was never charged with 9/11, look it up. You know why the charges were dropped against Bin Laden by the FBI? Because there was no evidence against him.
………………………….
Proof that this scum is not just a 9/11 denier, but a denier of Jihad in general.
I have asked him before: are *all* 28,000+ Jihad terror attacks since 9/11 also perpetrated by the civilized West to smear Muslims? Or are the others–somehow–different?
If the former, what id David M doing here at Jihad Watch at all? Just spouting apologia for Muslim savagery.
Jack Diamond says
Procedural. 9/11 was not considered a law enforcement matter, as bin Laden’s earlier attacks had been by the Clinton administration, for Bush it was a military matter. Otherwise the FBI would have charged him, just as they did for WTC 93, the African embassy bombings, and the Cole which Clinton considered, alas, law enforcement matters, crimes, not acts of war. As a military matter It wasn’t necessary for the FBI to charge him with a crime. There never was any question of his guilt, which he readily admitted to.
gravenimage says
Rick Spencer wrote:
Hi Luke…
Any thinking person would strongly agree with you that ‘9/11’ was indeed an INSIDE JOB! There is no way that the 2 aircraft could have caused the towers to collapse. No way!
Think JW people… THINK! How the !@#$% did Building 7 collapse?
……………………………
Building 7 collapsed because it had huge amounts of debris from the fallen tower on its roof.
But reason and logic–and information from engineers and scientists–means nothing to these tools. Their basic stance is that this must have been done by bad old Americans–or perhaps Israelis?–to make Islam look bad.
The other thing they never explain is how the Illuminati–or is the Masons?–are responsible for all 28,000+ Jihad terror attacks just since 9/11. Somehow the Jews are burning Jordanian pilots to death in the Islamic State, are kidnapping Nigerian schoolgirls and using them as sex slaves, and are running down celebrants in Nice.
Moreover, these creeps are happy to think their own people have no trouble mass-murdering their fellow citizens, but cannot believe that Islam–that actually openly has the slaughter of Infidels as its tenet–could *possibly* be responsible.
They believe that all evil flows from the free West, and that vicious Muslims are just being made to “look bad”. They never ask why Muslims *take credit* for Jihad–unless, of course, they think this is all the work of the CIA or George Bush, as well…
David M says
Gravenimage, you quoted me about Bin Laden never being charge with 9/11, but instead of addressing it you merely launched into an insult. Was he charged with 9/11? Yes or no, answer the question. Still looking for the DNA of the 1100 people in the towers are they? Right.
Then tell me how office fires & kerosene produced rivers of molten steel in the pile for weeks afterwards, because I’m interested to know. And I also want to know why they found zero furniture, computers etc in the pile.
For your information, I am as anti-Islam as anyone, but the fact is the authorities are using Islam as a weapon against us. All those other attacks were legitimate Islamic attacks, 9/11 however was a false flag using Islam as a front. Why did Bush invade Iraq after 9/11 & not Saudi Arabia when Iraq had nothing to do with it.
Carolyne says
Yeah, Rosie O’Donnell thought that steel wouldn’t melt, either. God, I’d hate to be in her company.
The buildings collapsed because of structural damage to their main supporting systems;. Damage both from fractures and extreme heat.
gravenimage says
Luke wrote:
Sorry but I’m not buying it. 2 problems:
1. This is as big a pretext for war the world has ever seen. Ever. Instead they trumped some weak garbage about Saddam. Not to retaliate against SA is treason if this is true.
2. Having seen the overwhelming evidence that 9/11 was an inside job…
……………………………
Uh huh. Jihadists are just fine, but our own government murdered 3,000 of our people to make Islam look bad. Oh, and Luke thinks not retaliating against Saudi Arabia was treason, but somehow has not trouble believing that they would slaughter their own citizens. Wouldn’t *that* be a considerably greater treason?
Does Luke also believe that all 28,000+ Jihad terror attacks were also pulled off by–who? Larry Silverstein? Mossad? George Bush? I’m so sick of these Truthers.
David M says
Fact: the two towers turned to dust mid-air, so that everything inside them became no more. No more furniture, no DNA of the 1100 people inside them….nothing. Something beyond office fires from kerosene was at work there. Debris shot outwards & UPWARDS from the towers, so it wasn’t just gravity at work. Numerous explosions observed in the towers, Look up “the dancing Israelis” who knew it was going to happen, which means MOSAD was involved too. No film from the 80 cameras at the Pentagon of a plane hitting (it was a missile).
Compare WTC 7 falling to that of a controlled demolition, they are identical. NORAD being stood down, Silverstein admitting to pulling the building. Freedoms trashed afterwards (The Patriot Act) followed by an illegal invasion of Iraq which had nothing to do with it,
To summarise, it was the CIA, Saudi funding, MOSAD, with Dick Cheney pulling the strings, & accomplices such as Rice, Bush, SIlverstein & Giuliani.
Baucent says
“To summarise, it was the CIA, Saudi funding, MOSAD, with Dick Cheney pulling the strings, & accomplices such as Rice, Bush, SIlverstein & Giuliani.”
Hell, why leave out the rest; Vladimir Putin, China, George Soros and Elton john. They all had a motive. Well maybe not Elton.but this is a conspiracy theory facts aren’t necessary.
gravenimage says
More claptrap from another “Truther”, this one posting as “David M”:
Fact: the two towers turned to dust mid-air, so that everything inside them became no more. No more furniture, no DNA of the 1100 people inside them….nothing.
…………………………………..
This is, of course, absolute bullsh*t. One can see how deep the debris was after the towers’ collapse. One can see, moreover, that the debris was *hardly* all “vaporized”–one can plainly see the outer structure of the towers, huge chunks of concrete and girders, and paper and other effects that fell for blocks around.
One can, in fact, find many of the WTC artifacts in the 9/11 museum:
http://www.911memorial.org/blog/tags/911-artifacts
The idea that there were no human remains is also completely false–one of the primary–and grimmest–tasks of recovery was to collect such remains, and to identify them via DNA testing–the very procedure “David M” says was not possible.
More:
Something beyond office fires from kerosene was at work there. Debris shot outwards & UPWARDS from the towers, so it wasn’t just gravity at work.
…………………………………..
Actually, this happens in any building collapse. Like so many “Truthers”, “David M” also understands nothing about elementary physics.
More:
Numerous explosions observed in the towers, Look up “the dancing Israelis” who knew it was going to happen, which means MOSAD was involved too. No film from the 80 cameras at the Pentagon of a plane hitting (it was a missile).
…………………………………..
Of course! How long would it take for “David M” to blame the Jooooooooos? Actually, the “Dancing Israelis” canard has been soundly debunked. I suppose he will also tell you that all the Jews who worked in the WTC got secret phone calls from Mossad on 9/11 telling them not to go to work–this is another common “Truther” claim. How to explain all the Jewish names in the toll of the dead? Who cares? “Truthers” cannot be expected to deal with, y’know, actual facts.
In contrast to the bogus claim above, Muslims *actually were* celebrating the fall of the towers. This is hardly to imply that they knew about the attack ahead of time; just that they were all too happy to hear about Jihad against the ‘filthy Infidel’:
http://www.breitbart.com/big-journalism/2015/12/02/trump-100-vindicated-cbs-reports-swarms-on-roofs-celebrating-911/
More:
Compare WTC 7 falling to that of a controlled demolition, they are identical.
…………………………………..
Yes, because why would there be any problem with a building having the debris from the enormous twin towers weighing down its roof? sarc/off
More:
NORAD being stood down,
…………………………………..
The military being loath to shoot down civilian airplanes is obvious proof that the CIA, Mossad, Condi, and ol’ George Bush brought down the twin towers with airplanes–or, no, wait–controlled explosives–or, no, wait–the dark arts of Dick Cheney…
More:
To summarise, it was the CIA, Saudi funding, MOSAD (sic), with Dick Cheney pulling the strings, & accomplices such as Rice, Bush, SIlverstein (sic) & Giuliani.
…………………………………..
Et tu, Rudy?
Does “David M” also believe that all 28,000+ Jihad terror attacks since 9/11 were also pulled off by George Bush? Was it George who ran down celebrants in Nice? Was Larry Silverstein the guy shooting up the Pulse Nightclub in Orlando? Was it Condi who gunned down Christmas party-goers in San Bernardino? Was it Dick Cheney at the Bataclan–or was he the guy who kidnapped all of those schoolgirls in Nigeria? Is Rudy Giuliani the dude responsible for all that carnage in the Islamic State?
Boy, those evil Americans and Jews are certainly doing a lot to make Muslims look bad…
Angemon says
David M posted:
“Fact: the two towers turned to dust mid-air, so that everything inside them became no more. ”
Fact: they didn’t. They *fell*.
“To summarise, it was the CIA, Saudi funding, MOSAD, with Dick Cheney pulling the strings, & accomplices such as Rice, Bush, SIlverstein & Giuliani.”
Where are the hijackers and their driving ideology in that story?
Carolyne says
No, Red Skelton. Oh yeah, he was dead at the time.
David M says
Graven Image, you mentioned physics, tell me how aluminium planes flew straight through concrete & steel towers with no resistance. Planes doing speeds they weren’t capable of at that altitude, being driven by novice pilots who couldn’t have pulled it off. Tell me why there was molten steel pouring out of the towers, & molten steel channels in the pile for weeks afterwards. Tell me why there were so many explosions in the towers. Tell me why WTC 7 fell at free fall. Tell me why the 9/11 commission members themselves said they were being lied to & the investigation was a farce. Tell me why the debris was illegally removed before it could be investigated. tell me why Bush & Chaney didn’t want an investigation. Tell me why there is no film of a plane hitting the Pentagon & tell me why a plane was allowed to hit the Pentagon. And you are wrong, they couldn’t find the DNA for 1100 people in the tower at all, & the debris that hit the ground was WAY short of what should have hit the ground, The towers turned to dust mid-airm that is a fact.
gravenimage says
More from “David M”:
Graven Image, you mentioned physics, tell me how…
…………………………
Here’s the article from Popular Mechanics debunking all of these conspiracy canards:
“Debunking the 9/11 Myths: Special Report”
http://www.popularmechanics.com/military/a49/1227842/
More:
And you are wrong, they couldn’t find the DNA for 1100 people in the tower at all
…………………………
This is ongoing:
“Families of more than 1,000 victims from 9/11 may finally get closure as scientists hope DNA tests will unravel remaining unidentified bone fragments”
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-2624062/Scientists-hope-DNA-tests-bone-fragments-finally-reveal-identities-1-000-victims-9-11.html
What does “David M” think happened here, anyway? That there are 1,000 missing people who were never in the Twin Towers? What is he claiming happened to these people? Were they all MOSAD (sic) agents?
Yet more:
The towers turned to dust mid-airm (sic) that is a fact.
…………………………
No, it’s not. Here’s a picture of the debris:
http://drjudywood.com/articles/why/whypics/19_flattened.jpg
There are, in fact, hundreds of these pictures, and hundreds of thousands of New Yorkers and others who have personally seen the rubble. This is, clearly, far more than dust. How can “David M” think we have not seen these images?
Still no indication of whether “David M” thinks that Westerners are responsible for all the Jihad terror attacks all over the world. And if he *does* believe this, why is he here at Jihad Watch at all?
David M says
Graven image, so the towers didn’t turn to dust eh? The biggest piece of furniture they found was half a key pad. So 1100 bodies & all the furniture simply disappeared. So you tell me how & why they just disappeared.
http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjqh8_ilonOAhWGVZQKHaygAIQQFggbMAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.veteranstoday.com%2F2013%2F04%2F01%2F911victims%2F&usg=AFQjCNG0Q92Sa2vv6Ed997PykoZfc9NzoA&sig2=uR9tZTyH5YauAdnDhH6CDQ
Sam Hawkins says
David M, kill yourself.
David M says
Well that’s not very scientific Sam. You answer the questions I asked, if you can. What happened to all the bodies & all the furniture? I’ll be waiting.
” In every building collapse in history, all of the victims’ bodies have been recovered more or less intact. That is because falling buildings crush human bodies. They do not shred them into tiny pieces, or cause them to vanish into thin air.
Yet on September 11th, 2001, the most famous “building collapses” in history somehow caused the bodies of more than 1,000 victims to magically disappear. Not even a shred of skin, a fragment of fingernail, or a shard of bone from any of these bodies was ever recovered, despite meticulous “sifting and bucketing” efforts. “
linnte says
You didn’t mention the Thermite particles found in all debris, including building 7.
Angemon says
Oh, look, David M is linking to “Veterans Today, a website that spares no criticism of US-aligned Israel and Saudi Arabia but seemingly runs out of criticism when it concerns Russia or Iran – is Ismail Salami, an Iranian, still on the board? That would explain why they share contributors and commentators with Iran’s Press TV. Did you know that VT is very popular among the pro-“palestinian” folk?
Here’s a piece from today, which I believe to be an accurate representation of VT’s official narrative:
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2016/07/23/protocol-vii-universal-war/
Don’t these people know “The Protocols of the Elders of Zion” was debunked as a forgery decades ago? Anyway, it should be no surprise that someone who tries to push the “Protocols” nonsense would claims that 9/11 was a false flag and run all manner of nonsense to back it up, Iran meddling or not.
Funny how people like David M assume that the government is always lying to them because they have an hidden agenda but never apply their scepticism to anything that agrees with them…
Lloyd Miller says
Can we try focusing on the fact our elites are bought and paid for by Muslim / OPEC moneybags? All this discussion about the “ins and outs” of Islam are beside the point. Our leaders are compromised by the enemy. Logic and facts about Islam means nothing to them.
underbed cat says
Maybe the redacted pages will show some of the 9/11 hijackers made a visit to the windy city…suburbs, another hub of the MB with money and credit and powerful persons. That would be no surprise.
Dave says
This story is is being overlooked with all the insanity in the news, in the middle of the hot summer at the start of the national conventions. There is more coverage on whether or not Trump and Pence make a cute couple or not.
Georg says
What is more gruesome than Saudi Arabia’s endeavor of jihadist terror and dawa promoting the spread of Islamic hatred is the conspiracy in the West to place KSA beyond the realm of the people’s understanding and will.
If one lets in a beast, knowing its miserable nature, he is more responsible for its terror than the beast as his discretion results in preventable destruction.
The terror attacks of September 11 and the stirring bloodbath in Europe are the result of a beast allowed in by government with contempt for its people.
It is therefore dire the contempt be removed.
duh swani says
A vote for Hillary is a vote for Saudi Arabia…cozy as two bugs in a rug…
Carolyne says
Hillary Clinton is bought and paid for by Saudi Arabia.
underbed cat says
I recall after 9/11 the President Bush, ended sakat payments (money collected from Islamic charities in the United States which also funds terrrorism. I recall after the election of Obama that he allowed sakat payments to again be allowed, it may have been after second election.
Trico says
“the next American administration must make a searching reevaluation of our relationship with Saudi Arabia, and stop treating enemies as allies.”
Good luck with that!
–
Stealth Jihad aka Civilized Jihad: “We Now Have A Muslim Government”. https://mainerepublicemailalert.com/2016/07/18/we-now-have-a-muslim-government/
–
Gee Hadd, Spokesman and Director of CAIIR, Council Against Irrational and Irritating Religions.
–
ploome says
maybe that is why Dubya has started drinking again///obviously drunk in Texas
underbed cat says
I don’t expect the redacted pages of the 9/11 Commission to ever be released by the group that has subverted the current administration ….without a lot of pushback…if we make it to the election and get Trump then maybe…. the next 4 could be very chilling unless there is an awakening and we survive islamic rage that surely could happen hopefully prepared.
steve brown says
Why didn’t Bush attack Saudi Arabia instead of Iraq ? Why did Bush give the Saudi Harvard students a private jet back to Saudi Arabia when all US Flights were grounded. I hope ”We the people” wake up to what the Bush family is about.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TnHnjmCYjy4
Dean says
The result of unlimited government is an almost universal requirement that politicians sell a little piece of their soul day after day. To rise to the top as did Bush means that he was totally compromised and could only rationalize but not prove on any decision that he truly represented the best interest of the Republic and Americans. His family has a very dirty history when it involves the Saudis and post 9/11 changed nothing. Nothing should surprise us.
Carolyne says
I have heard many times about Bush flying Saudis back to their desert homes after 9/11 but have never seen proof of it. Is there proof?
gravenimage says
Yes, Carolyn–here’s part of the story from the Daily Mail:
“Why were Saudi royals with ‘links to 9/11’ allowed to leave the U.S. without being quizzed by the FBI?”
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2115127/Why-Saudi-royals-links-9-11-allowed-leave-U-S-quizzed-FBI.html
For what it’s worth, I don’t think George Bush actually thought at the time that the Saudis had any links to 9/11. It was just that he was used to doing favors for the Saudi royals, and just thought it would be embarrassing and inconvenient for them to wait and have to go through normal channels to get a flight out, which would take days.
None of that excuses his dispensing special favors for them–and this is confirmed all the more by information that came out later about the actual Saudi connections to 9/11.
gravenimage says
This story is appalling–I am also appalled that so many posters on this thread have used this as an excuse to spout calumny against Americans, or even to blame us for murdering our own people on 9/11.
When did we get so many trolls here at Jihad Watch?
Havoc says
Isn’t hiding Saudi involvement rather like “aiding and abetting” the enemy ?
.
Maybe, GFB isn’t just a dimwit – maybe, he’s a traitor?
gravenimage says
Who is GFB?
linnte says
Graven, maybe George “F+++ing” Bush? hahahaha! And just to clarify about my 9/11 feelings. In no way do I think the purpose of 9/11 was to make Muslims look bad by our Gov. Muslims perpetrated this crime all by them selves. They make them selves look bad all the time without any help! Their purpose was to strike terror into our hearts.
Sometimes I feel like I need to pinch myself to see if what is happening in the world is real. And to think just a year ago I was only worried about, well, I can’t remember what I was worried about it was so insignificant!
Glad I have this blog to learn from. And Roberts new book on Iran is excellent!
gravenimage says
Thanks, Linnte. I need to get Robert’s new book!
UNCLE VLADDI says
Re: “The report also mentions a CIA memorandum that “discusses alleged financial connections between the September 11 hijackers, Saudi Government officials, and members of the Saudi Royal Family. This memorandum was passed on to an FBI investigator; yet “despite the clear national implications of the CIA memorandum, the FBI agent included the memorandum in an individual case file and did not forward it to FBI Headquarters.” Why?”
THESE PEOPLE ARE TRAITORS AND SHOULD BE ARRESTED AS SUCH PRONTO.
Peggy says
Angemon says
July 18, 2016 at 11:24 am
duh swani posted:
“If you mean the insults to Peggy, your words give JW a bad name…It’s hard to defend abuse…”
Not sure what insults are you talking about – my mention of tinfoil hat? That’s nothing compared with the bitter, repeated invectives I have endured from her. In any way, mentions of tinfoil hat are perfectly apt when someone insists on the nonsense of “war for oil”.
==================
The way you talk to me is insulting. You are arrogant and always try to discredit my posts hoping you will make me look silly. It’s obvious.
Now you try to defend yourself by saying that I am horrible to you.
Angemon, it’s you from the very beginning who has been rude to me. My replies to you are only a reaction to the way you spoke to me first.
I took you cr@p for a while and then retaliated so don’t lie about who set the tone. It was you.
I really don’t understand why you keep engaging with me if I am so horrible to you.
Is it because you have a need to lash out as someone and I seem like an easy target to you? I am not.
Angemon says
Peggy posted:
“The way you talk to me is insulting. ”
Lol! That’s both hilarious and sad, coming from you, with your history of going well out of your way to insult me. And I mean actually insult, not this “I don’t like the way you’re talking to me, I’m insulted” special snowflake nonsense.
“You are arrogant and always try to discredit my posts hoping you will make me look silly. ”
Again, hilarious – didn’t you wrote a post to me that was something along the lines of “how do you like to have your words thrown on your face”? Also, demonstrably false – I only respond to a small subset of your posts, so drop the Drama Queen hyperbole act.
“Now you try to defend yourself by saying that I am horrible to you.”
“Horrible” is an understatement, as it can be seen in your posts.
“Angemon, it’s you from the very beginning who has been rude to me. My replies to you are only a reaction to the way you spoke to me first.”
Nope – it’s the other way around. You couldn’t stomach that I criticized Putin and Russia and you started going after me for it. And you can’t stomach criticism of any kind, hence why you immediately regress into this whiny, pathetic, snivelling self-pity parties. “Oh, Angemon is a big meanie, he’s going after me”. I guess to you, anything goes – just as long as it’s not actually addressing and rebutting my arguments…
“I took you cr@p for a while and then retaliated so don’t lie about who set the tone. It was you.”
Whoa, you’re projecting so hard you could rum powerpoint presentations a mile away…
“I really don’t understand why you keep engaging with me if I am so horrible to you.”
This is exactly what crosses my mind every time I see you lying about me and claiming I’m persecuting you, as well as every time you go out of your way to interact with me.
“Is it because you have a need to lash out as someone and I seem like an easy target to you? I am not.”
Again, more nonsense about persecution – like I said, as long as it’s not addressing and rebutting my arguments, anything goes for Peggy…
Peggy says
gravenimage says
July 19, 2016 at 12:19 am
Peggy wrote:
Don’t fool yourself. Coalition forced did spill plenty of innocent blood too. Have you seen Wickileaks footage of some of civilian killings? I have.
………………………..
Yeah–that’s the problem–the perfidious West.
GI, I didn’t say that that was the problem. I am only saying that innocent blood was spilled and for what? I hope you are not saying that coalition forces didn’t spill any innocent blood? Telling the truth is not unpatriotic. It is what it is.
More:
Saddam was not a jihadist. He was a dictator but Muslims can’t cope with democracy and need a dictator like Saddam. While the likes of Saddam, Gadaffi etc were in power that region was ruled with a firm hand and we didn’t have a situation like we do today.
………………………..
Bringing down that plane over Lockerbie was, no doubt, proof that Gadaffi was not a Jihadist. That plane must have been full of Islamic terrorists…or not…
==============
That was a terrorist attack. I am not disputing that but the fact still remains that while these dictators were in power we didn’t have a tsunami of Islamists invading our shores.
We have far greater problems now that they were removed.
Please don’t think I am defending any of them. All I am saying is that we should have left them alone to do with their people as they were doing for centuries. Muslims need dictators. They can’t cope with anything else.
Angemon says
Peggy posted:
“Telling the truth is not unpatriotic.”
What “truth” is there in saying that the war in Iraq was to get oil and money for the globalists to swim on?
“Please don’t think I am defending any of them.”
Oh, this is rich…
gravenimage says
Peggy wrote:
gravenimage says
Peggy wrote:
Don’t fool yourself. Coalition forced did spill plenty of innocent blood too. Have you seen Wickileaks footage of some of civilian killings? I have.
………………………..
Yeah–that’s the problem–the perfidious West.
GI, I didn’t say that that was the problem. I am only saying that innocent blood was spilled and for what? I hope you are not saying that coalition forces didn’t spill any innocent blood? Telling the truth is not unpatriotic. It is what it is.
………………………………
Innocent people have been killed in every war, no matter how just.
We have never targeted innocent people, but try to leave non-combatants unmolested. More and more, we have been fighting with one arm tied behind our backs, with suicidal rules of engagement.
It is apologists for savagery, typically, who excoriate Israel and the West for any stray bullet, but give Jihadists a free pass for *deliberately* targeting civilians, non-combatants, and even children.
By these lights, we had better just roll over for any savagery, since *any* defense might conceivably result in the spilling of innocent blood. Too bad we didn’t just let Hitler march across Europe unopposed…
More:
Saddam was not a jihadist. He was a dictator but Muslims can’t cope with democracy and need a dictator like Saddam. While the likes of Saddam, Gadaffi etc were in power that region was ruled with a firm hand and we didn’t have a situation like we do today.
………………………..
Bringing down that plane over Lockerbie was, no doubt, proof that Gadaffi was not a Jihadist. That plane must have been full of Islamic terrorists…or not…
==============
That was a terrorist attack. I am not disputing that but the fact still remains that while these dictators were in power we didn’t have a tsunami of Islamists invading our shores.
We have far greater problems now that they were removed.
………………………………
There have been a lot of factors involved in the recent rise of Islam–the fall of dictators has only been one aspect.
The re-Islamizing of the Muslim world, Saudi and other oil money, state sponsorship of Jihad terror, and foolishess in the West, not the least of which insane immigration policies that have allowed Muslims to flood into the civilized world. Western denial over the Jihad threat is extremely dangerous.
One of the worst things that has happened in the West is a failure of our confidence. Part of that, in fact, is our excoriating ourselves over *any* aspect of war that is not pristine on our part. Demanding that we not defend ourselves unless we can guarantee ahead of time that not a single non-combatant will be harmed is, in fact, part of the problem.
Some dictators have served as a very partial brake to the Jihadist urges of their people. I never advocated the removal of Gadaffi, and think that Bashir Assad–as appalling as he is–is likely much better than what would replace him in Syria.
More:
Please don’t think I am defending any of them. All I am saying is that we should have left them alone to do with their people as they were doing for centuries. Muslims need dictators. They can’t cope with anything else.
………………………………
Peggy, the idea that Muslim leaders have prevented Jihad “for centuries” is, I’m afraid, quite mistaken. More often, the head of Muslim states waged violent Jihad against us.
The phenomenon of the (semi) secular dictator in the Muslim world is fairly recent–often these dictators took over on their nation’s gaining independence, and they were often influenced by Leftist, especially Communist, ideology. Certainly, this was the case with Ba’athists and Pan-Arabists like Saddam Hussein and Muammar Gadaffi.
These types of dictators did not really exist before the early-to-mid 20th century, and many not until after WWII.
Those remaining may, to an extent, serve to quell Jihad in their people. But quite often, they just urge them to wage Jihad *elsewhere*, especially against the ‘filthy Infidels’.
SuchindranathAiyerS says
I did not need to see these partially released and partially “redacted” pages to know that the US-NATO-Sunni Axis forged by Nixon, Yamani and Kissinger and that has drievn and directed wars, carried out 9/11.
Carolyne says
Nixon, Yamani and Kissinger? How about the Presidents/Secretaries of State since then? Innocent? Barrack Hussein Obama is just continuing the takeover of the US by Islam which has been occurring for years, perhaps unknowingly, perhaps not. But in Obama’s case, knowingly and intentionally because he is a Muslim himself.
gravenimage says
SuchindranathAiyerS wrote:
I did not need to see these partially released and partially “redacted” pages to know that the US-NATO-Sunni Axis forged by Nixon, Yamani and Kissinger and that has drievn (sic) and directed wars, carried out 9/11.
…………………………….
What, *another* 9/11 “Truther”? And now he believes that Richard Nixon–who died seven years before 9/11–was responsible?
DefenderofIslm says
There is no smokeing gun in the report at all
gravenimage says
DefenderofIslm wrote:
There is no smokeing (sic) gun in the report at all
……………………………..
Is DefenderofIslam back? And more illiterate than ever, I see–unable even to spell “Islam” correctly. That’s pretty impressive in its own way…
Manuele says
THE ONE BOWING KISSING THE SAUDI KING HAND SHOULD KISS THE KING’S STINK ASS AS WELL. NOTHING BUT FILTH. FILTHY MUSLIMS, FILTHY ARABS