Nobel Laureate Malala Yousafzai responds to the murder of Mashal Khan for “blasphemy” by claiming that Muhammad “never advised his followers to ‘be impatient and go around killing people.'”
Is this statement likely to make any Muslims turn away from the idea that “blasphemers” should be murdered? No. And this is because, as is so often the case with statements of this kind, it’s factually false. Islam mandates death for non-Muslim subjects of the Islamic state who mention “something impermissible about Allah, the Prophet (Allah bless him and give him peace), or Islam” (‘Umdat al-Salik, o11.10), and such laws are based upon passages in the Hadith and Sira in which Muhammad orders the murders of people who have insulted him.
These include Abu Afak, who was over one hundred years old, and the poetess Asma bint Marwan. Abu Afak was killed in his sleep, in response to Muhammad’s question, “Who will avenge me on this scoundrel?” Similarly, Muhammad on another occasion cried out, “Will no one rid me of this daughter of Marwan?” One of his followers, Umayr ibn Adi, went to her house that night, where he found her sleeping next to her children. The youngest, a nursing babe, was in her arms. But that didn’t stop Umayr from murdering her and the baby as well. Muhammad commended him: “You have done a great service to Allah and His Messenger, Umayr!” (Ibn Ishaq, 674-676)
Then there was Ka’b bin Al-Ashraf. Muhammad asked: “Who is willing to kill Ka’b bin Al-Ashraf who has hurt Allah and His Apostle?” One of the Muslims, Muhammad
bin Maslama answered, “O Allah’s Apostle! Would you like that I kill him?” When Muhammad said that he would, Muhammad bin Maslama said, “Then allow me to say a (false) thing (i.e. to deceive Kab).” Muhammad responded: “You may say it.” Muhammad bin Maslama duly lied to Ka’b, luring him into his trap, and murdered him. (Sahih Bukhari, volume 5, book 59, number 369)
Likewise Islam QA calls for death for blasphemers, using both Qur’an and Hadith to make its argument. “The scholars
are unanimously agreed,” the site explains, “that a Muslim who insults the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) becomes a kaafir [unbeliever] and an apostate who is to be executed. This consensus was narrated by more than one of the scholars, such as Imaam Ishaaq ibn Raahawayh, Ibn al-Mundhir, al-Qaadi ‘Iyaad, al-Khattaabi and others.”
“Watch | ‘We have forgotten our values. We are not representing true Islam’: Malala Yousafzai condemns Pakistani student’s murder,” ANI, April 15, 2017:
The Prophet never advised his followers to “be impatient and go around killing people”, Yousafzai added.
Condemning the murder of a university student, Mashal Khan, over allegations of blasphemy, Nobel Laureate Malala Yousafzai urged state institutions and political parties in Pakistan to shun their silence, take a stand and bring justice to the victim and his family.
According to The Express Tribune, Malala said in a video message on Facebook after talking to Mashal’s father over the phone, that some Pakistanis have forgotten the message of peace given by Islam. “This was not just the funeral of Mashal Khan, it was the funeral of the message of our religion Islam,” she said. “This is an incident filled with terror and fear,” Malala said.
She added that the Holy Prophet (PBUH) never advised his followers to “be impatient and go around killing people”. “We have forgotten our values. We are not representing the true Islam,” she regretted.
Malala said people complain about the presence of Islamophobia in the West and that the western nations were “maligning our names”. “No one is maligning the name of your country or religion. We ourselves are bringing a bad name to our country and religion,” she stressed….
About that, Malala is absolutely right.
IQ al Rassooli says
Malala is either very STUPID or the usual Muslim DENIAL about their depraved CULT of Muhammad
Irrespective of Race Colour Nationality Culture Tradition or Gender every Muslim and every CONVERT to Islam is Sharia compliant hence every Muslim exhibits the following Characteristics~
Obscene levels of Hatemongering Warmongering Racism & Intolerance
compounded with Depraved and unconscionable degrees of Mendacity Duplicity Hypocrisy Disloyalty Vileness Mercilessness & Ungodliness
In a nutshell Muslims represent the lowest logical, moral, spiritual and judicial levels in humanity
IQ al Rassooli
Kafir & Proud!
AnneCrockett says
I vote denial. And the denial is abetted by every “It’s a religion of peace, and they will kill us if we say othewise” politician and clergyman out there.
mortimer says
Malala is well-meaning. SHE JUST WANTS GIRLS TO GO TO SCHOOL.
PLEASE STOP MALIGNING MALALA.
Let her blather about Islam. She is clueless about the JIHAD DOCTRINE. Malala doesn’t want to learn what Islam is.
Real Islam is inconvenient to Malala’s purpose of getting girls to school.
Jack Diamond says
She meant well donating her prize money to Hamas (UNRWA).
Northern Virginiastan says
UNRWA = UN Rocket Warehousing Authority
Waltg says
Mortimer: Malala has an audience, due to her own experience. It is essential that when someone like her, with a global audience, puts historically untrue claims out to that audience, that the falsehoods Must be challenged. If she’s actually THAT ignorant of her own religion’s origin and history….then it behooves her to remain silent until she-s knowledgeable enough to speak credibly on the subject. There is always the possibility that she knows full well that she’s spouting unadulterated B.S., but she engages in taqiyya….permitted deceit (lying) to advance the cause of Islam. Or….she could be blinding herself from the truth…which, if she was to face it head-on would require her to reject Islam entirely…if she possesses any integrity. Regardless….untruths like those she’s propogati g should always be challenged.
gravenimage says
All too true, Jack.
Carolyne says
Could anyone tell me one thing this girl did to help girls in the Muslim world go to school other than say it? She went to her father’s girls school, got shot in the head, was taken to England to get the best medical care, which is not available in barbarian Pakistan and is now living on donations and guarded every minute of the day. She is very fortunate that those people whom Islam wishes dead were available to take care of her.
The Nobel Prize has become a joke. It was given to Jimmy Carter as, so one of the judges said, a “Kick in the knee” to the US. Obama got it for things he might have done in the future but he accomplished nothing except damage to this country. This silly girl got it because she was shot.
BTW stating the truth is not maligning anyone,.
martin says
Get stuffed she has lied from day one over here.
She spits on the help we have given her and lies, lies and lies.
A very deceitfull but typical muslim.
Shane says
I truly despise those politicians like W. Bush, Obama, and many European pols who state the nonsense that Islam is a religion of peace, and that the word “jihad” does NOT mean holy war. I wish that politicians would tell the truth about Islam and deal with the consequences!
Jeanette says
They apparently have much to gain by betraying their own people (their own people in Bush’s case, anyway).
SDN says
I won’t attack her intentions. I’m not in her mind so I won’t make any vote on this. When it comes to Islam if we are to make thoughtful, legitimate criticisms like Robert did we should avoid making malicious anti-Muslim generalizations like yours.
IQ al Rassooli says
SDN
I do not generalize since you cannot REFUTE a single one of the adjectives I used about Muslims
You are obviously very comfortable with Muslims GENERALIZING their HATRED for every human being who is NOT a Muslim
Again the Double Standard used by ALL apologists for Muslims and Islam
Every Muslim is the Eternal and Mortal ENEMY of every Infidel/ Kafir/ non Muslim on Earth
Please prove me WRONG!
IQ al Rassooli
Kafir & Proud!
Jeanette says
Bingo!
SDN says
Prove you wrong ? Fine !
Do you sincerely believe that every Muslim on a planet is a total jihadist ? Don’t you think Muslims may be sincere, although misguided, when they claim “Islam is a religion of peace” ? Don’t you think a casual Muslim’s indignation to a terrorist attack may be genuine ?
I don’t have any double standard. In fact I’m being consistant: just because Muslims generalize against non-Muslims doesn’t mean we are to legitimate to do so against Muslims.
Once again nothing but malicious anti-Muslim generalizations from you.
Carolyne says
In that case, SDN, you will never criticize anyone’s statements because you “Can’t get in their head?”. That’s kind of silly, isn’t it?
SDN says
You seem to have misread my message. I was talking about gratuitously impugning malicious intentions to people not whether any statement they make is true or false.
Marcello Luciano says
I think she is stupid . They just set her up to make her a hero against Taliban ,but she is not. She is a teenager, from a poor village , that even does not have her high school diploma, and all of a sudden she started giving some great speeches and making historical comments !!!! Did not people ever noticed that she is fake ?
Jeanette says
In fact, she is much like Mohammed was. He probably had “help,” too.
CraigAustin says
These guys approach incest like it is an Olympic event, after 1400 years of cousin/sister breeding program it is no wonder they are taking decades to copy a 75 year old American invention.
TruthWFree says
You know Islam!
TruthWFree says
Tried to post this on “Why Islamic States Don’t Defeat Terror” alrassooi, I agree with almost everything you say but I do not think Muhammad made it up as he went along…some maybe, but not all. For a religion like Islam to have lasted 1400 years makes me believe Muhamt this on mad had a supernatural encounter. Per my readings, Robert Spencer, The Truth About Muhammad, Mo thought he was possessed by a demon upon his first encounter with the being in the cave in 610 AD. He then had the Satanic verses documented in the Quran where the allah god tells him Satan fooled him in agreeing to other gods with the Meccans. I am a Christian and Islam and Christianity cannot both be true. The allah god of the Quran says he has no sons and denies Jesus Christ’s divinity and death on the cross. These are lies against the Gospels. The hate filled violent exhortations in the Quran against unbelievers are 180 degrees opposite Jesus Christ’s teachings of love and forgiveness in the Gospels. Jesus says in John 8:44 that Satan is the father of all lies. In my opinion, Muhammad would have been the greatest LIAR in all history if he made it up. The allah god of Islam is SATAN in my opinion….but in either case, LIES.
Jeanette says
I agree that Satan is likely Allah in disguise.
And I wonder if Islam might turn out to be the Antichrist, rather than an individual.
In which case, if we ever “kill” Islam, we’ll have to stay on guard, as according to Revelation, it will come back to life!
Waltg says
Well, Jeanette, IF that is the case…one ‘could’ theorize that the demise of the Ottoman Empire in the early 20th century was the ‘death’s…and what we’ve seen on the past few decades is it’s ‘resurrection!
MTMLA says
I don’t understand why Malala became so famous and even received a Nobel PP. Just because she took a bullet in her head for going to school..But the stupid woman still defends the terrible cult and the criminal pervert prophet that orders his followers to enslave women and treat them like s–t. I don’t care to listen to her or see her. She gets on my nerves with her lies. Not very bright.maybe she knows if she tells the truth she’ll be killed. I read somewhere that she lives in England now….
Michael Ray says
Malala is a notable public figure. It is her job to lie for islam. It is her means of jihad.
mortimer says
No… she just wants girls to go school. She knows very little about Islam. She’s trying to make friends of the jihadists, but I believe that’s pointless.
StacyGirl says
She’s old enough to read and understand. Are you saying that she’s never read the Qu’ran and Hadiths? As a public advocate for Islam, she must be accountable. She is the perfect victim that allows idiots to believe there are good Muslims and bad ones; Muslims follow Islam which is always evil. Don’t apologize for the apologist.
TheBuffster says
StacyGirl – “Muslims follow Islam which is always evil. Don’t apologize for the apologist.”
I agree that Islam is evil. But it isn’t true that all Muslims follow Islam. If you read a lot of apostate testimonies you’ll find out what a variety of former Muslims believed about their religion when they were Muslim. You’ll find that a lot of people who consider themselves Muslims haven’t read the Koran and know even less of the story of Muhammad’s life. They have a hodge-podge idea of what the religion is about. Some know more than they want to know and engage in a lot of evasion and denial.
Now, we could say that a person who follows a set of beliefs that are incompatible with the Koran and the Traditions of Muhammad isn’t really a Muslim in any meaningful sense, but I’m sure a good many such people are counted as officially Muslim when we’re told there are over 1.6 billion Muslims in the world.
Jeanette says
TheBuffster,
But apostates are no longer Muslims by definition, so of course they are not following Islam.
Anyone who does not follow Islam/the Koran is not a Muslim.
Muslims follow a book which commands them to murder all of us non-Muslims.
It’s really very simple. Evil, but simple.
Don Foss says
I almost always agree with you, Mortimer. I watched two documentaries on Malala. Close to 2 hours total. Never saw her once pray or get into the qur’an. Her father, who is a prominent figure in girls’ education (he owns a girls school) and probably should have been the award winner (except he didn’t take the bullet or get the news) never did either. Only in her acceptance speech for the Nobel Prize did she mention Islam and Muhammad, and I got the strong impression people got to her and used her as a tool to try to ease the kuffars worries and concerns about Islamic doctrine. As far as her comment, I believe she is only being used as a tool by outside Islamic organizations.
gravenimage says
Even nominal Muslims feel the need to whitewash Islam for the Infidels. We see this all the time.
Jeanette says
” As far as her comment, I believe she is only being used as a tool by outside Islamic organizations.”
That makes her dangerous, like the rest of the Muslims. They area either killing non-Muslims, or they are letting the other Muslims kill for them.
ermom says
TAQIYYA, Malala. Shame on you.
The cognitive dissonance this abused young woman exhibits is amazing.
mortimer says
And the JIHADISTS will continue to prove that Malala’s wishful thinking and self-constructed version of Islam is WRONG!
gravenimage says
Actually, ermom, this is extremely common. Even when Muslims are the victims of Islam, they feel duty-bound to defend it at all costs.
Tara says
This is the truth. And this is the problem.
Carolyne says
I find it difficult to take a person who has one big long eyebrow seriously. Could someone send her some tweezers? BTW, her hair isn’t covered. She must be stoned immediately.
R Russell says
Taqiyya. They cannot help it. It is part of their religion.
mortimer says
A lot of well-meaning Muslims are in denial because they don’t like terrorism, but terrorism is actually a part of jihad.
jayell says
A ‘good muslim’ is supposed to emulate his Prophet. According to accounts of his teaching and his life, he was NOT ‘well-meaning’. Therefore, how can followers of his be ‘well-meaning’? Also Malala seems to have a problem with selective misunderstanding. She praised Allah for making her well after the infamous attack; strange, because I don’t think he’s ever been employed by the UK’s NHS or funded it, and I’m not sure how many UK taxpayers would want to be known as ‘Allah’. And readers here might like to know that, according to
one of our Teaching unions, there is a ‘Malala Day’ in (I believe) June of July. I suppose the next step is to grant her honorary Roman Catholic membership and canonise her.
RationalVoice says
She would need a few verified miracles to become a Roman Catholic Saint.
Stopping the tens of thousands of killings every year by zealous Muslims around the World would be a good place to start and I know she would like to do that !
Malala is a good person, I can sense that, but she would be, even if she had no religion at all.
She is one Muslim I would be happy for her to live in the UK as long as she likes but Malala come on this site and explain to us the terrible hate filled instructions in the Qur’an and the other Islamic texts which are so shocking to non Muslims throughout the World.
jayell says
If you look at the facts surrounding Malala’s rise to fame, you may notice that she was the victim of an attempted murder whilst basically attempting purely to better HERSELF in the face of cultural/religious opposition. There is no evidence that she was involved in any activity specifically on anyone else’s behalf as opposed to her own at that time, therefore it would appear that she was NOT in any way consciously or subconsciously sacrificing herself on anyone else’s account other than her own. Indeed, there would seem to be a huge question mark as to whether any consideration of ‘sacrifice’ came into the frame at all. The pursuance of personal self-interest per se is not normally viewed as an adequate basis for the elevation of a person to any kind of veneration or celebrity status. This sort of attention can only be properly justified if the person receiving the attention or veneration then proceeds to act in a way that will that will properly negate the reasons/conditions that led to his/her attempted demise and subsequent elevation, and that means having the necessary intellectual inegrity and courage to openly identify the factors that caused the situation irrespective of how these might relate to the person concerned. It is no use being a martyr to a cause that clearly deliberately and by virtue of its very nature virtually destroyed you, if you then continue to promote that cause in any way. It is furthermore entirely reprehensible if you not only fail to denounce the ’cause’ (because of any historical personal affiliations you might feel) but seek to misrepresent it in a fraudulently ‘positive’ way that will allow it to continue to and create yet further harm to others in the future. The suggestion that Malala might stop ‘tens of thousands of killings every year by zealous muslims’ is, I’m afraid, quite absurd, since the ‘zeal’ driving the murderous acts of these ‘zealous muslims’ is written into the intellectual fabric of the creed that these muslims are following, and for Malala to stop that would mean that she would have to denounce the cause of the ‘zeal’ – i.e., islam. She has done no such thing, and, judging by her actions and pronouncements to date, would appear to be unlikely or incapable of doing anything of the like.
It has always been in the nature of human societies to fabricate heroes (and heroines) on the one hand, and demons on the other, to positively or negatively justify their social agendas, no matter how much said heroes/heroines/demons/agendas fail to stand up to logical scrutiny. In the UK we see this sort of thing all the time with, for example, publicity around politicians and the royal family. Promoting Malala suited some peoples’ agenda so long as you don’t start asking too many questions.
Carolyne says
Jayelle, I agree with what you say. This girl, as far as I know, was going to school to educate HERSELF at her father’s school and she was shot in the head. I know of no altruistic act on her part to “Educate girls,” although her father apparently did so. She obviously is not educated in Islam or she would not make such stupid statements.
She was in the wrong place at the wrong time which turned out to be, for her celebrity, the right place at the right time.
No one should be shot in the head for no reason, but this happens every day in Pakistan and she is not remarkable for it.
Terry Gain says
Mr. Spencer
The link to Islam QA says the page no longer exists.
Jack Diamond says
Try https://islamqa.info/en/14305; for a much more detailed ruling:
http://www.muftisays.com/blog/Seifeddine-M/3016_17-09-2012/ruling-on-one-who-insults-the-prophet-peace-and-blessings-be-upon-him.html
Westman says
Amazing how hideable sources disappear if they make Islam look bad at a critical moment.
This will fill in nicely: https://islamqa.info/en/20327
In Islam, blasphemy is a form of apostasy, and the official punishment for a Muslim apostasy is death.
I hope Malala has a security detail to protect her from the Muslim “brothers”. Her innocent ignorance speaks well for her character yet places her at risk.
Alarmed Pig Farmer says
The Infidel habit of refusing to check into the factual truth and acknowledge it is so well established that taquiyya is bold know. Unapologetic, without fear. One could even get prosecuted and either be ruined or jailed for telling the truth about Islam now. Not only is the truth in poor taste, it’s dangerous. Jesus was resurrected on Easter, but there will be no resurrection for Islam, partly because it was never widely spoken in the first place. Sure, John Quincy Adams, Churchill and other notables took a stab at it, but even they were largely ignored.
Don Foss says
Ever notice how they always tell us to “get to know” Muslims in our communities or talk with a Imam about your questions? They never tell us to read the actual scripture.
dumbledoresarmy says
Which is an interesting contrast with Christianity, because Christians *always* tell inquirers to “read the Gospels”.
Jeanette says
Yet another detail in which Christianity is the opposite of Islam. And Islam is always opposite in such bad ways.
gravenimage says
Very true.
Blurb1000 says
Islam, the the religion for misunderstanders… and a “religion” who actually is a recipe for retarded people for world domination.
My God, I’m so embarrassed over our governments. Who vote for these peoples?
Don Foss says
Malala should spend more time reading her faith’s scripture than reading The Guardian newspaper in the UK where she has to reside now to save her from taking another bullet in the head for wanting equality.
Jaladhi says
One is tempted to ask her which Quran is she reading or read?? Perhaps she has a revised and sanitized and totally full of lies Quran which she and our Western leaders are reading and come out with such stupid lies!!
Jeanette says
That would be the whitewashed “Give Them Enough Rope to Hang Themselves” Koran.
Don Foss says
Sheesh….where to begin? Verses all over the place proving her a liar and a tool. “Moderate” Muslim leaders in the UK have obviously gotten her to use her platform to spread taqiyya. Good job, Malala. Why aren’t you doing that from your own country?
mortimer says
Mohammed preached vigilantism: “Whosoever among you sees an act of wrong should change it with his hands. If he is not able to do so, then he should change it with his tongue. If he is not able to do so, then with his heart, and this is the weakest of faith.”
The Koran teaches religious vigilantism by mob “Let there arise from you a group calling to all that is good, enjoining what is right and forbidding what is wrong. It is these who are successful.” (Koran 3:104).
Malala is WRONG-O.
The concept of hisbah in Islam originates from Islam’s foundational texts. It is an obligation placed on every Muslim to call for what is good or right and to prevent or denounce what is bad or wrong and then to CHANGE THINGS HIMSELF with violence and intimidation.
INTIMIDATION IS NORMATIVE ISLAM, rather than an aberration.
Westman says
Very true. When we read the aggressive words of the Quran, Hadith, and fatwas, the claim of “no compulsion in religion” sounds as out of tune as chalk screeching on a blackboard.
Compulsion BY Islam on both the “brothers” and the kafir is normative. Islam and too many of its followers just can’t keep their Allah-justified tongues and hands to themselves while “forbidding”. Malala’s scars should be ample proof.
waltg says
Westman….that passage “No compulsion in religion” was from the early days in Medina….after he and his followers were forced to flee Mecca, and the Medinans generously took him in. As he grew successful in caravan raiding, and his followers and army grew, he eventually subjugated all of the tribes connected to Medina, and forced most of the Jewish tribes out….or exterminated them. Can anyone spell ‘GENOCIDE”?
The often ignored ‘law of Abrogation” comes into play throughout the Quran. Anytime he had his god ‘allah’ say something or make a pronouncement that contradicted a previous ‘immutable’ decree from ‘allah’…..the later statement cancelled out….or abrogated….the previous one.
TheBuffster says
Ah, but Westman, Islam gives the unbeliever *3* choices! You can convert to it or, if you are a Christian or a Jew, you can pay the jizya and be permitted to live as a subjugated and humiliated dhimmi (as long as you keep paying and obeying the rules of subjugation), or you can choose to die. See? Choices everywhere! Islam is so very generous in that way!
And, of course, when the unbelievers are in the majority and have the upper hand power-wise, and offering these three choices just isn’t practical, then it’s to the Muslims’ best advantage to say “There is no compulsion in religion”.
gravenimage says
Very true, Mortimer.
30 cash Mir cheated Jesus says
Archimedes, Alexander, Thomas,Mani they are creators of Islam around 314 BC and 400 ad. Allah is 3.14 265 BC. If you have commonsense, you would leave Islam.
gravenimage says
What?
TheBuffster says
What?
TheBuffster says
I’m as baffled as you are, Graven.
MTMLA says
Sorry, but you don’t make a lot of sense. Clarify your ideas,please.
somehistory says
The last part of her statement is the only true part. It is extremely sad that when she was taken away to have surgery to save her life, they couldn’t have surgically removed islam from her as well.
no_one says
She is young. She doesn’t realize the truth. And the truth is:
Christ is risen!
Hristos Voskrese!
Hristos Anesti!
Carolyne says
But she believes what she says is as true as you believe “Christ is risen.”
abad says
Malala Yousafzai is a fraud and like Obama, should have her Nobel Peace Prize revoked.
Muslims are not the best source to learn about Islam.
Happy Easter to everyone at JW, He is Risen!
MTMLA says
Malala took a bullet when she was doing something the pious muslims didn’t agree with, aka a woman getting an education. She received a Nobel Peace Prize for it ( Why??) Will the victims of San Bernardino massacre, the Bataclan massacre, the Charles Hebdou massacre, the ones slaughtered in Nice and all the other victims of murderous Islam receive a NPP also? How about the victims who survived the attacks? Shouldn’t they receive a prize also? What makes her so special? And even worse, she continues lying and defending islam and the perv. prophet.
Jack Diamond says
The blasphemy charge extends to all the “prophets” (in Islam beginning with Adam, and disparaging Adam is also considered disparaging Muhammad since it is his prophetic lineage): “Whoever curses a prophet, kill him” (found in al-Tabarani and al-Daraqutni traditions).
As for saying anything impermissible directly concerning Muhammad there is simply no question as to whether Muslims are required to “go around killing people.” They are.
“Defaming the Prophet is a kind of kufr. If that is done by a Muslim then it is apostasy on his part, and the authorities have to defend the cause of Allaah and His Messenger by EXECUTING the one who defamed him. {emphasis mine}. If the person who defames his is a non-Muslim living under a treaty with the Muslim state, then this is a violation of the treaty and he must be executed.”
https://islamqa.info/en/14305
Fatawa, “Ruling on one who insults the Prophet” (linked above):
“The scholars are unanimously agreed that a Muslim who insults the Prophet becomes a kaafir and an apostate who is to be executed.
al-Tawbah 9:64-66 clearly states that mocking Allaah, His verses and His Messenger constitutes kufr, so that applies even more so to insulting. This verse also indicates that whoever belittles the Messenger of Allaah is also a kaafir, whether he was serious or joking.
With regard to the Sunnah, Abu Dawood (4362) narrated from ‘Ali that a Jewish woman used to insult the Prophet and say bad things about him, so a man strangled her till she died, and the Prophet ruled that no blood money was due in this case. This hadeeth clearly indicates that it was permissible to kill that woman because she used to insult the Prophet.
If it is said ‘Can we not forgive him, because during his lifetime the Prophet forgave many of those who had insulted him and he did not execute them?’ the answer is: the Prophet sometimes chose to forgive those who had insulted him, and sometimes he ordered that they should be executed, if that served a greater purpose. But now his forgiveness is impossible because he is dead, so the execution of one who insults him remains the right of Allaah, His Messenger and the believers, and the one who deserves to be executed cannot be let off, so the punishment must be carried out.
———————–
“the judgment of the Shari’ah regarding someone who curses or disparages the Prophet. QADI ‘IYAD IBN MUSA AL-YAHSUBI, one of the greatest of the Fuqaha of the School of the ‘Amal of the Ahi al-Madinah (given precedence over all the Madhhabs by Ibn Taymiyya) DECLARED:
“Know that all who curse Muhammad, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, or blame him or attribute imperfection to him in his person, his lineage, his deen or any of his qualities, or alludes to that
or its like by any means whatsoever, whether in the form of a curse or contempt or belittling him or detracting from him or finding fault with him or maligning him, the judgment regarding such a person is the same as the judgment against anyone who curses him. HE IS KILLED as we shall make clear. This judgment extends to anything which amounts to a curse or disparagement. We have no hesitation concerning this matter, be it a clear statement or allusion…all this is the consensus of the ‘ulama’ and the imams of fatwa from the time of the Companions until today.
In the ‘Book of Muhammad’, the companions of Malik have told us that he said that whoever curses the Messenger of Allah, or any other Prophet, be he Muslim or kafir, is killed without being asked to repent. Ibn Wahb related related from Ibn ‘Umar that a monk made a verbal attack on the Prophet, (and) ibn ‘Umar asked, ‘Why did you not kill him?’
http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?77506-Those-who-insult-the-Prophet-(-SAW)
Peter says
Ma-La-La-Land disinformation for Useful Idiots.
Islamic mirror says
• (Qur’an 33:50). He assassinated those who criticized him and executed them
o Criminals are considered as Hero by masses. Mosques, library and school built in their name (Google mumtaz Qadri) “Ulema will organize marches; create unrest, terror in hate producing seminaries and mosques
Guy Macher says
A silly young woman, surrounded by sycophants. If Islam is all about love, why do her fellow Muslims have a fatwa on her life? Why did she receive her life-saving medical help from the West, and not from Muslims? More importantly, why do Western leaders listen to this ignorant and stupid Muslima?
Charli Main says
This “girl” and her family have been sucking off the British taxpayer for years. She HAS MADE NO EFFORT TO INTERGRATED INTO BRITISH SOCIETY. She constantly whines about how proud she is of Pakistan, her Pakistani culture and Islam while millions are spend on protecting her and her family.
She continues to live like a Paki, dress like a Paki and behave like a Paki so why doesn’t she **** off back to Pakistan. ??
Oh yes, I forgot, if she did go back to her wonderful country, her beloved Pakis would put a bullet in her head.
IQ al Rassooli says
Malala is a Muslima, hence~
Irrespective of Race Colour Nationality Culture Tradition or Gender every Muslim and every CONVERT to Islam is Sharia compliant hence every Muslim exhibits the following Characteristics~
Obscene levels of Hatemongering Warmongering Racism & Intolerance
compounded with Depraved and unconscionable degrees of Mendacity Duplicity Hypocrisy Disloyalty Vileness Mercilessness Ungodliness & invariably BLAME Others Syndrome (because Muslims are Peaceful and never do WRONG)
In a nutshell Muslims represent the lowest logical, moral, spiritual and judicial levels in humanity
IQ al Rassooli
Kafir & Proud!
vladkoval says
http://www.albawabhnews.com/2340712
25 January 2017 Egypt
On the picture: Coptic woman holds the poster with text in : We support the right for Copts to Civil Marriage And Divorce.
I already told you that Coptic clergy imposed (through muslims) the ban of divorce and next marriage. And many (millions) Copts of Egypt protest against it.
But the man standing next to the woman is holding even more curious poster: NO TO MAFIA OF CHANGING RELIGION
Let me exp[lain you what is Mafia of changing religion in Egypt.
If some Copt wants to divorce he can actually do that if he converts to other christian denomination. But he needs to get a certificate from his denomination that he is no more a member of this church. This certificate is not given for free!!!
It costs up to 100 000 egyptian pounds – 5000 USD, it’s not a mistake – 5000 USD for leaving!!!
That’s why they will never recognize the right to marry and divorce freely for their “flock”. They make money from the ban!
Seeing this nonsense every muslim immediately is inflamed by the wish to convert to …this nonsense
And this is my message to the Coptic clergy of Egypt and other clergies of MENA:
DEAR DAMNED CLERGY – GO BACK TO THE HELL WHERE YOU CAME FROM AND WHERE YOU BELONG !!! YOU SNAKES, LEAVE THE EARTH AND FLY TO THE MOON FOR GOOD TAKING WITH YOU YOUR SANTA-CLAUS ROBES !!!
Jeanette says
The Coptic Christians are not making an forcing the entire world into a permanent black abyss called “Islam.”
The Muslims are.
I think you’ll find that most of us here are more concerned about the butcheries, rapes and murders by Muslims than we are about Coptic Christian divorces.
Waltg says
Right on, Jeannette.
Waltg says
Whips, sorry…JEANETTE
Jeanette says
No problem – you can’t imagine how many spellings and spoken versions of Jeanette I answer to!
And when I was a kid, people confused my sister Janis and me, so I answered to Janis, too.
Waltg says
Jeanette…between autocorrect run amuck and my large thumbs trying to type on a 2″ x 2″ keyboard…it’s a wonder if anything from me is remotely understandable.
gravenimage says
vladkoval, I’m not sure why you are spamming criticism of the Copts all over Jihad Watch right now. I have a few quibbles with Coptic doctrine myself, but that pales in comparison when the persecution they are facing. The Copts are *victims* of Islam, as are other Christians.
waltg says
Gravenimage said:|vladkoval, I’m not sure why you are spamming criticism of the Copts all over Jihad Watch right now. I have a few quibbles with Coptic doctrine myself, but that pales in comparison when the persecution they are facing. The Copts are *victims* of Islam, as are other Christians.”
Right on the money!
vladkoval says
Gravenimage, you are right that offtopic spamming is not the solution.
But the only reason why I did it is not to troll someone, but just to draw attention to the problem I do not see someone knows about, I do not see even the discourse on that topic in English-language Internet. While Matthew 19 is one of the most focused place in Arabic-language Internet.
I myself found out it just some weeks ago. And am still shocked.
Muslims always say about Matthew 19: Christian God hates sex and wants people to become monks, no divorce etc (who can accept this word let him accept it – the word of celibacy). And not only Copts but also other Othodoxes and Catholics do everything to confirm that nonsense.
You can say that there are many preachers in the West who are very reasonable about Matthew 19. Yes. In the West! But be sure, nobody knows them in the East. The East creates really mad image of Christianity.
Of course, muslims kill non-muslims not due to divorce. Of course, the problem is not in the very divorce of MENA Christians. But why not to deprive muslims from this reason of criticism? Be sure: millions moderate muslims, who in fact would be glad to leave Islam (I guess), really are afraid of Christianity which they think is like MENA “Christianity” with its divorce bans, monkery-over-marriage preference doctrines, etc. Thus, insted of being smart and win – we are losing. Because as long as we are not focused on the things that smear the image of Christianity (and first of it is dilemma of Matthew 19, wether someone likes it or not) – we will be losing. But who cares about it in a secular state? Almost no one, since it is a secular state. But had the state always been secular? Nope. There were wars and revolutions for the sake of secularity in Europe. Who remembers Russian Orthodox thinker Vasily Rozanov (1852-1918)? – whose works are word in word remind me current Coptic protests against the clerical laws. It was Rozanov who said back in 19th century that most of the clericals in Russia are in fact latent homosexuals, and they create the laws and books destroying the country, and the best solution is to burn all their books, because they ban divorce, and banning divorce is the best way to destroy marriage. – That’s how secularity came to hapless Russia – through millions of deathes, not by the mercy of clericals. (and I am really shocked such astuff is still in force in MENA).
Well, excuse me for the twisted post, but in short: sexual component of criticism against Christianity (and it is groundless component) will outweigh millions of abstract dogmatic components (like Trinity or Single Allah etc). That’s all. And it’s sad.
Jeanette says
Good grief, there must be dozens of versions of Christianity (Protestants) that don’t ban divorce, and don’t burn people alive for ANYTHING!
gravenimage says
vladkoval, while I absolutely agree with you that people should be able to leave bad marriages, I don’t believe for a minute that this is why Muslims are slaughtering Christians. And most Protestants allow for divorce, yet Muslims are targeting them, as well.
And Islam condones forced marriages and “Honor Killings” for women who try to leave abusive marriages. The idea that Muslims are offended by coercion in marriage does not, I’m afraid, bear out.
Ren says
Malala looks kind of kind, but gosh she is stupid. Muhammad never advised his followers to “go around killing people… Sounds like she has never read the quran. Claiming then to be a true muslim is ludicrous.
Asma Sultana says
Exactly
David says
Malala is not a bad person, merely delusional.
Asma Sultana says
Another moderate Muslim! Taking opportunity from the world and playing the victim card as all the Muslims are doing. I was sympathetic to her, but no more. She is old and educated enough to fathom the truth, to know Islam her own religion. It took me only 13 years to feel disgusted about Islam. How can someone promise 72 virgins after death and offer wine afterlife? Whereas love or having romantic relation before marriage is forbidden in this lifetime or having a glass of wine is forbidden in Islam and KILLING? Oh …
Islam mother of all religion when it comes to killing.
Malala: if you know how to read, then read Quran once again before you open your mouth! I feel pity for you now!
gravenimage says
I am glad you were brave and decent enough to leave Islam.
james.mich says
If Mohammed was not the author or transmitter of the Koran, or not of the violent passages, then maybe he didn’t advise his followers to go round killing people. But if he was its author or transmitter, and was the author or transmitter of those passages, then he did rather more than “advise” his folllwers to go round killing people.
Carolyne says
Indeed. He “Went around killing people,” himself.
Jeanette says
And he raped a lot of little girls between murders.
Jeanette says
Muslims either use an “Operators Manual” that commands them to kill all non-Muslims, or they don’t.
All we need to know is the answer.
And we do know it.
Waltg says
Ultimately….there really is no such thing as an “extremists muslim” or a “moderate muslim”….all there is….is “observant muslims” versus “non-observant muslims”….and, to the observant muslim, the non-observant muslim isn’t really a muslim at all…he/she is a hypocrite….an apostate…no better than an Infidel….and we see how THOSE fare in most countries with muslim majorities….or even large muslim MINORITIES.
Bsrat says
When u get brainwashed from a young age reading the Qur’an in Arabic but never understand the true meaning of what’s been thought and is expected of every follower. Even the scholars don’t agree on the interpretation of what’s written in the Qur’an and to top it off there are authentic and weak narations where does it stop.
Malala is no different to all the Muslims and others who like to pass islam as a religion of peace, Muhammad is the perfect example when he raped a 9 year old.surely nothinh good can come out of this kind of person. Islam is just a borrowed religion and based on Arabic culture.
gravenimage says
Bsrat wrote:
When u get brainwashed from a young age reading the Qur’an in Arabic but never understand the true meaning of what’s been thought and is expected of every follower. Even the scholars don’t agree on the interpretation of what’s written in the Qur’an…
…………………..
Bsrat, most Muslims understand all too well what their foul creed demands. That’s why so many Muslims support Jihad.
Darryl Kerney says
the link to IslamQA is not working,
typo error ?
or have they decided to sanitize it ?
Troybeam says
She is young, not so innocent yet spreads lies she may have been told, either way she’s 100% wrong.
Monty says
I disagree. She is right. Mohamed commanded killing, not advised it. No amount of lipstick can change the Islamic pig.
Val says
I feel sorry for Malala. Such a confused person. She is correct to pursue an education but not in a satanic madrassa where she was apparently brainwashed in the past. I hope that she will study Muhammad’s behavior intensively for the rest of her life. No need to even read any of Muhammad’s meaningless utterances. Muhammad’s behavior will inform Malala as to who Muhammad was a messenger from.
gravenimage says
Her father’s school is pretty secular–by Pakistani standards, at least…
Donovan Nuera says
I wasn’t like the Swede elite at her Nobel Peace Prize ceremony tried to correct her “misunderstanding” of Islam…..
Demsci says
It seems to me the prevalent reactions to the sort of apologetics of Islam is an “either/ or” “black or white” one.
One reaction, say the “black” one, is the in my view absolute correct analysis of Robert. And our belief in THAT Islam. It is supported by so much evidence, both in scriptures; Quran-Hadiths-Sira and in Tafsir and practice of Islam and especially in results of many polls about and actual statements and behavior or of hundreds of millions of Muslims.
But there is also the other “white” one, by well meaning but ignorant Western citizens and politicians, that believes apologists for Islam like Malalah. And this seems in part to be because an all anti-democratic very supremacist, hostile analysis of Islam seems to be too much to stomach for all too many Western citizens and polticians, and also too dangerous to them.
Because in a “black” portrayal of Islam they see as”painting with one brush all Muslims”, even those Muslims who are so ….. “nice”. Nice as in: Peaceful, service-oriented in shops and healthcare, civil service, including police, “reasonable politicians”, good neighbors, loving parents, innocent children, people like Malalah …
Moreover; wide recognition of “real black” Islam would inevitably lead to dimishing freedom of religion and discrimination of Muslims in Democratic nations. And there indeed are laws and even treaties that forbid that! National and International.
The list of nice behaving Muslims is endless and the mismatch with the barbaric 7th century anti-democratic supremacist, hostile ideology seems simply too huge. Which seems to be why so many Western citizens shut their minds to even hearing about this malevolent Islam.
it is as if they feel they have no choice BUT to believe the apologists of Islam and disbelieve the counterjihadists.
But once I read an article of Mordecai Kedar, an Israeli professor/ expert on Islam in which he said that “Islam was a smorgasbord” and anyone can take from Islam’s table whatever suits his/ her needs/ desires and leave on it that which is unwanted.
Maybe that can be seen as the “grey” picture of Islam? Because it can be accepted by “fence-sitters” while at the same time this “grey” picture still means Islam is very dangerous and on this account there could and should be “mild discrimination” of Muslims and “mild diminishing of their freedom of religion”
and that could at least be the start of a solution-process, which now seems so stuck.
Jack Diamond says
Islam is a smorgasbord for whom? Muslims? Only if they are not following their “deen.” This is not another kind of Islam you are talking it about, this “white” Islam, it is simply less Islam as opposed to more Islam. That is your grey area.
Let’s be clear. “It is not for a believer, man or woman, when Allah and His Messenger have decreed a matter that they should have any option in their decision. And whoever disobeys Allah and His Messenger, he has indeed strayed in a plain error.” s. 33:36. “Do you then believe in some parts of the divine writ and deny the truth of other parts? What, then, could be the reward of those among you who do such things but ignominy in the life of this world, and on the Day of Resurrection? They will be consigned to the most grievous suffering.” (s. 2:85). This is no smorgasbord to pick and choose from.
Allah does not like believers asking questions either. “O ye who have believed, do not ask about things which, if they are shown to you, will distress you…a people asked such things before you, then they became disbelievers.” (s. 5:101-102)
I will quote ex-Muslim Ali Sina, who is succinct on this subject:
“You are either a ‘good’ practicing Muslim or a bad wishy-washy Muslim. It’s the latter group that the westerners have misnamed moderate Muslims. As far as Muslims are concerned they are ‘hypocrites.’ Not surprisingly, the ‘moderates’ also confess being hypocrites. They will tell you they believe in Islam but they are not good Muslims. In the back of their minds however, they plan to become ‘good’ Muslims once they have done all the ‘sins’ and enjoyed life enough.
Muslims are not free to choose. They should obey Allah and His Messenger. “And it behoves not a believing man and a believing woman that they should have any choice in their matter when Allah and His Messenger have decided a matter; and whoever disobeys Allah and His Messenger, he surely strays off a manifest straying.” (Q. 33:36)
It is not up to Muslims to decide what is good for them. This decision is already made for them and all they have to do is to obey, even when they don’t like it. “Fighting is ordained for you, even though it be hateful to you; but it may well be that you hate a thing the while it is good for you, and it may well be that you love a thing the while it is bad for you: and God knows, whereas you do not know.”(Q. 2:216)
Islam can be distilled in its name: ‘Submission.’ Allah knows best. Therefore man must accept his command, blindly and unwaveringly.
See also 16:89 and 39:23,
Such as We send down for those who make division, Those who break the Quran into parts. Therefore, by the Lord, We will, of a surety, call them to account,(Q.15: 90-92)
there is none that can alter the words of Allah.(Q. Q. 6:34 )
There is no changing the Words of Allah that is the Supreme Triumph. (Q.10:64)
And recite that which hath been revealed unto you of the scripture of your Lord. There is none who can change His words, and you will find no refuge beside Him. (Q. 18:27)
How can one claim to believe in the Quran and disregard all these warnings?
The good Muslims are those who follow the Quran and the examples set by Muhammad and become terrorists.
The bad Muslims are those wishy-washy Muslims who don’t practice Islam completely, don’t read the Quran, don’t pray and rarely, if ever, go to mosque.
The ugly Muslims are those who know the truth about Islam but lie about it.
Reforming Islam is impossible. It is either a dilution or a ruse. Jihad is based on two pillars, war and deception. I don’t want anyone to be fooled by the soothing promises of Muslim reformers. Moderate Islam does not exist. It’s a myth.
I do not trust Muslims who are against Sharia. I do not understand them. What they say does not add up. I don’t know what they are up to. I do not trust people who say, I am a follower of Muhammad, but I do not follow Muhammad. There is something fishy, something dishonest and hypocritical about their claim.
If you are a Muslims, be a Muslim. I don’t agree with you but at least I know where you stand and where I should stand to be safe from you. But if you are a Muslim and against Islam and the Sharia, I don’t trust you. You are either a fool or a crook.
Either be a Muslim and do as Muhammad said or leave Islam and don’t become a shield for the terrorists. Don’t muddy the waters. Don’t mix among the enemy and pose as a friend. This is the same tactic that Palestinians use in war. They mix among civilians and innocent children to make it difficult for their enemy to target them. You are causing confusion. You provide a protective shield for the enemy. I am not writing this for you. I know you are not going to change. You are a deceiver. I am writing this for the non-Muslims so they do not fall into your trap and don’t provide for you free podium to deceive them.
Islam cannot be reformed. They tried it in every imaginable way. The Mu’tazelis tired it, the Sufis tried it, hundreds of old and new schools tried it and they all failed. If you cannot stomach the Sharia, why do you want to keep Islam at all? Islam belongs to the toilet of history. Dump it and flush. Get rid of it and don’t fool yourself with this nonsense. Accept the truth. Yes truth matters. Islam is a lie. Muhammad was a mentally sick conman. Get over with it and stop this ridiculous farce of reformation.”
http://alisina.org/?p=773
It’s not our job to save Islam from itself or find a way for Muslims to remain Muslims and be innocuous. It’s our job (aside from ultimately separating ourselves from them) to tell them what will be tolerated and will not be tolerated in our midst. There, I just “reformed” them.
Demsci says
Thank you Jack, for responding so seriously.
You wrote that Ali Sina wrote to a Muslim or even all Muslims: “I am not writing for you, you are a deceiver”. I am writing this for non-Muslims.”
Likewise, I am not writing the above for any Muslims nor for any Political Corrects. I am not writing this to get Muslims off the hook. And Islamic reform is totally impossible as far as I am concerned.
Jack, if we are so stuck so long now in our democracies, is it not time for some creative thinking of our own? I desire above all else a genuine democratic majority solution that also works. I abhor a dictatorial solution.
What will it take to get a majority to even “discriminate mildly against and diminish mildly the freedom of religion of Muslims in Democratic Nations, while those nations do this while still Democratic?!
As far as I know Ali Sina AND Robert Spencer will confirm that it is a tenet of Islam that “Islam, or the Quran, is clear”. The Quran itself says so. No Muslim will contradict this, and no staunch Political Correct either, even if they are atheists or Christians.
It is perhaps for the wise infidels to get the well meaning ignorant fence sitting other infidels on their side to declare that Islam is not clear, like Mordecai Kedar wrote.
And take as their evidence the outlets of all these apologetic Muslims and political corrects, lying or ignorant as they are, as you and I know, up to and including the heads of state of big Democratic Nations, like Bush, Obama, Cameron, Rutte, Hollande, up to Hillary Clinton and ALL the republican competitors of Donald Trump in 2016 (even Cruz).
And it goes on and on; even Daniel Pipes and Ryan Mauro of Clarion project, our supposed allies, even they keep differentiating among Muslims. What do you MAKE of all that? Does it not make you almost desperate?
UNLESS … you hold all of them to their words, positions AND present our own massive evidence (of the true nature of Islam) and that of the actions of ISIS and all Muslim governments in power. And when you present such clearly widely different interpretations of same text then you make the conclusion that this IS what is interpreted of the corpus of Islam, somehow or other, truthful or logical or not.
And once you have presented this case, you might add; and how can a “corpus”that has not been changed one iota for a 1000 years even BE CLEAR?” Does it not get more unclear with passing time? Like for the question: Is it still prescriptive or only descriptive by now? Such old texts do not fit the times we live in now.
and are thus a receipe for disaster, in this case, of one religion only, Islam, and not of any other religion. And clinging to this disastrous religion in a democratic nation, THAT is what we must hold Muslims accountable for. But only in a mild way, so as to get a majority in parliament to do at least this much. Now? Parliaments do nothing, or almost nothing.
Demsci says
And Robert always, for a long time now, from time to time, makes these jokes like;
“even now as we speak, persons like John Kerry, or the Pope, or this or that Islam apologist, is flying to the place wherever a case of “misunderstanding of Islam” is reported to “set them straight.”
And he should continue with those jokes, but don’t you see that that is much more than a joke? It massively indicates that there is so profound DIFFERENCE in at least spoken interpretation of the “holy texts of Islam” in essential parts of them.
Waltg says
Demsci: Robert Isn’t ‘joking…and his statements DON’T show a differing interpretation of Islamic teachings. He is pointing out the danger, And, yes, the outright STUPIDITY of the ‘useful idiot’s…the kaffir apologists for Islam who’ve bought into the outright LIE about Islam being a ‘religion of peace….and the corresponding propaganda coup that the ‘extremists somehow DON’T represent Islam…or that they’re not truly ‘muslim’.
Other than the Taqiyya designed to kill us infidels into a fatal stupor….there is remarkable agreement on the essential to tenets of Islamic history and teaching…Islamic hegemony, dominance through infiltration OR violence, Sharia…etc.
Mohammed’s actions and directives to his followers specifically regarding the consequences of ‘insulting himself or Allah are historically clear, when one follows the ‘law of abrogation he set down as dictated by allah…that any directive from Allah that contradicts a precious Sarah….abrogates the earlier one and henceforth only affirms the later one. Mohammed’s later actions and directives clearly show this unambiguously, and your attempt to cast doubt or ambiguity where none exists is suspect.
Jack Diamond says
“What will it take to get a majority to even “discriminate mildly against and diminish mildly the freedom of religion of Muslims”?”
Freedom of religion does not or should not include the right to practice or promote or enable jihad war and the sharia sedition of free societies. By not tolerating either we impose a new interpretation of Islam for them, descriptive not prescriptive….or else.
That’s how it should have been, but wasn’t. That’s how it should be.
Islam is very much a declaration of war against non-Muslim mankind and an obligation to subjugate everyone under Allah’s laws, meaning the subversion and overthrow of man-made laws (including the freedom of religion). And that makes it a political movement. Are people in denial about that, are they willfully blind? Sure. Are some in league with our enemies? Yes. Does the sanctified place lying and deceiving the infidel has in Islam make it impossible to trust most anything Muslims say to us as a consequence? Absolutely. Despite the slow learning curve are many people learning the truth, often the hard way? Yes, more so the common folk than the sheltered elites, maybe even a democratic majority.
There should be no toleration of jihad or Islamic supremacism for Muslims in the West. With severe consequences, not mild discrimination, for those doing so. Shut down mosques, deportations, arrests, and consequences for individuals and countries involved from overseas, just to start with. Muslims can choose sides in how they behave. Remember, “darura” (necessity) means Muslims aren’t obligated to fight when they cannot win. Their Inshallah fatalism can work in our favor, too. It has in the past. We just have to know what we stand for, and won’t stand for. That’s the real problem here.
And yes, since jihad and sharia=Islam not tolerating either is effectively putting an end to Islam in the West. True Muslims will want/need to go elsewhere.
That advice and a dollar will buy you some gum.
Demsci says
It seems to matter to me how my fellow citizens view it and can be persuaded to view it, not just how we Islamo-aware people ourselves view it.
If these statements of the peacefulness and benevolence and innocence of Islam are 100 % lies and realitydenials, even THEN they constitute of necessity an interpretation of Islam and all Muslims and influential political corrects who utter them can be held accountable for what they utter for the record.
And when the apologies, whitewashing of Islam is taken together with the facts we already possess, that can lead to the conclusion that obviously the source of these widely differing interpretations, both so vehemently argued, is itself MULTI-INTERPRETABLE.
And combined with the 100’s of millions bad interpretations that can be shown, that that means this ONE RELIGION, ISLAM, is VERY DANGEROUS. And since religion is a choice, it can be pointed out that supporting that religion unconditionally is irresponsible behavior.
Demsci says
Jack, you said: “We just have to know what we stand for, and won’t stand for. That’s the real problem here”
Totally agreed. And I want to increase the numbers of civilians who realize this and choose wisely and support all necessary laws and actions.
The problem remains with the “WE”. That WE should be 51 % agreeing on meaningful measures.
Now, are we going to wait for that majority to form within our citizens/ politicians/ parliament? With the risk that we wait too long, what with the Islamic immigration and procreation?
Or are we going to compromise for now, when that at least gives us that majority to at least gets us started? Again; I abhor dictatorial measures and as a matter of course I think most of us abhor a conflagration of violence.
TheBuffster says
Jack, that is a gem of a post. It deserves a wider readership than it can get in this one thread. It really does.
gravenimage says
Demsci wrote:
Moreover; wide recognition of “real black” Islam would inevitably lead to dimishing freedom of religion and discrimination of Muslims in Democratic nations. And there indeed are laws and even treaties that forbid that! National and International.
…………………………
Muslims can worship as they like in the West–it is when they demand being able to oppress women and Infidels and wage violent Jihad that they run afoul of our civilized laws.
There are no international treaties in the West that guarantee the imposition of Islamic law and the slaughter of unbelievers.
Waltg says
Gravenimage: the simple truth is that Muslims VANNOT worship without acknowledging that the Quran, the Hadith, the Sarah..AND the example of their ‘prophet’s .ALL mandate the eventual hegemony of Islam, the subjugation of EVERY person, whether through persuasion, through force, through death….to Islamic rule. For Christians and Jews…there are three options….conversion, the acceptance of a precarious and humiliating 2nd class status, or death. To the adherents of other religions…and atheists…there are only TWO options….conbersion or DEATH!
These are inseparable from the “rwligious” aspects. Islam is only ‘religion’s peripherally, what it is in reality is an intolerant, totalitarian ideology that purports to control every aspect of life…from birth to grave…and is thus utterly incompatible with the concepts of democracy…freedom of thought, freedom of speech, freedom of religion, freedom of association, equality of all citizens, etc. By masquerading as only a religion, they take advantage of the very freedoms they strive to destroy. Perhaps it’s time we redefine “freedom of religion” to eliminate any belief system that mandates violence to anyone.
Waltg says
LOL…not VANNOT…meant CANNOT. Wish we could edit posts.
Demsci says
Hi, GI,
Waltg answer explains a bit what I talked about. In that we in time may redefine our definition of freedom of religion. I was absolutely not talking about any now existing limit to the freedom of religion of Muslims. If anything our laws are indeed very generous.
What I meant to convey was that it is now still absolutely forbidden by law, and I might add, a big taboo, to discriminate any person on grounds of religion. And this includes criteria for immigration. Even Trump has not yet dared to institute a real ban on Muslims, based on their professed religion. Yet that is what so many of us, and I, desire so much, it is what not only Geert Wilders wants, but also the late lamented Pim Fortuyn. But such de facto discrimination seems totally impossible, forbidden.
And we may dream about a future in which finally democratic majorities will enact rigourous measures, but right now they even absolutely refrain from ANYTHING, they do NOTHING. And mild discrimination and mild retraction of freedom of religion concerning the followers of this ONE RELIGION, ISLAM would at least be a beginning. It is what might sound reasonable to that much needed majority that alone can enact new laws. As it has been noticed that when the freedom party wins in the elections/ polls, that centre-parties in Holland slightly change their positions for the better, but only slightly.
Yet a majority in population, parliament, politics refuses us ANY treatment of Muslims that is discriminatory. For so long now. It seems for forever. How to break the stalemate? I voted for Wilders to put pressure on parliament, but what I want as well is some sort of compromise which gives “us” a majority in parliament to finally do something.
waltg says
Problem is, Demsci….that every one of your ‘so-called gray muslims’…..is always ripe for radicalization, when an iman points out to them from the Quran, the hadiths, and the surah….the TRUE teachings and example of Mohammed, their founder.
Such ‘gray muslims’ would then be faced with the fact that in Mohammed’s eyes, they were FALSE MUSLIMS, HYPOCRITES, no better than infidels…..condemned to hell for their disbelief in ‘allah’.
Presto…..they’re then forced to, in all intellectual integrity…..to abandon and repudiate islam entirely…..leading to their own death sentence for apostasizing, losing family and friends…..OR….they acknowledge the truth of the Iman’s showing them from their immutable books…..and presto, you have a freshly minted ‘radical muslim’….presenting a danger to whatever country in which they reside.
What is your solution to THAT?
Demsci says
Yes, I am fully aware of that problem, and my solution is only very limited; namely holding Muslims accountable for their choice of this very problematic, dangerous religion when they are citizens of a Democratic Nations. And to monitor Muslims and prosecute them when even slightly possible. Woefully inadequate, granted.
But it might get us started and going in the right direction. And I don’t see the harm in striving for this first step in our democratic nations, I;ve seen nothing better in practice so far. I even don’t see any alternative that is going to work. Continually the centre parties in my Holland proclaim that Geert Wilders has no solutions. All the solutions that he proposes they shoot down. I am at my wit;s end, really.
Jack Diamond says
It’s easy to get discouraged. How must have Churchill felt as a lone voice in the wilderness. Wilberforce had to be on his deathbed to see the Slavery Abolition Act.
We all do what we can but see through a glass darkly. The election of Trump, whatever he does or doesn’t achieve, is an indication the American people, a significant portion, do not want jihad killers brought into this country and are dubious about Islam. Just looking at a typical Huffington Post puff piece about Islam and the comments section shows just how savviness about Islam has seeped into the American conversation. An awful lot of people have sussed Islam and the Qur’an and the example of Muhammad. Not enough, but there is cause for optimism. So, you know, be of good courage and be not dismayed….
Waltg says
Well, Demsci, I fail to see how your ‘solution…parrial as it is….will accomplish anything in the long run I assume you’re aware that they pursue differing strategies as their population base increases…tjat they practice violent jihad…militarily…or through terrorist acts…and ALSO ‘cultural or ‘soft jihad…through emigration…or mass migration…coupled with multiple wives…many children…spomsoring relatives, etc. A great many also drain the host country’s resources…through welfare (and welfare fraud), using and overloading educational and medical resources, etc. So what’s your solution when they achieve sufficient numbers to sway elections…to be elected in sufficient numbers to government…and push legislatively for Sharia law provisions? What do you do then? At some point….either a mass exodus from Islam must happen (unlikely…given that it carries a death penalty in muslim majority countries) or an abrogation of some Democratic rights…involving a massive push out of our countries of ANYONE subscribing to an ideology devoted to the destruction of our cultures…our freedoms…our rights….not to mention the forced conversion or death of anyone not one of them.
This may not happen in MY lifetime…but certainly will in my children and grandchildren’s LIVES.
Waltg says
Sorry for my typos…between autocorrect and typing on a phone with my thumbs….well….
Demsci says
Hope Jack and Walt are right and I am wrong!
Meanwhile I think my strategy merely augments theirs and does not oppose it.
Just so you know, I think we Westerners insult and hold in contempt much MORE if we declare it UNCLEAR, VAGUE, MULTI-INTERPRETABLE, GETTING MORE OBSOLETE BY THE DAY, ALREADY VERY INCOMPLETE and downright gibberish for 20 % (said by Gerd Puin and others), so an insult to any God associated with it,
than we do when we honour Islam with being clear, coherent and consistent
And I remind you again what we are up against;
not only muslims, leftist people and parties and politicians who lie and deny. But also against all the republican candidates for office except Trump. And now in Trumps administration we are up against McMaster and even Jared Kushner who disagree with “our Steve Bannon”.
Renowned and by the left reviled supposed allies like Daniel Pipes, Ryan Mauro of Clarion Project, Sam Harris, they ALL embrace the wrong paradigm of distinction between “radical and moderate Muslims”.
Something I don’t do, I only aim to use the words and recorded positions of Muslims, leftists, political corrects and just naive people and politicians against themselves.. ust s
Demsci says
And Islam is a fabricated religion, from end 7th century onwards, initiated by khalif Abd Al Malik and successors, as books and programmes of Robert Spencer himself and Tom Holland and Jay Smith all clearly attest to. All these books I read and all these programmes I saw, as well as all David Woods excellent video’s. how can islam be clear, is all I say.
And I hope we here at least are OK with each other.
MTMLA says
I read about the slaughter of the Armenians in Turkey. Their “nice “, good muslim neighbors, who they thought were their friends, turned around and attacked them when the “right” time came. The rest is history, a not very pretty one, 1.500.000 Armenians slaughtered by the Turkish muslims, but the Turks deny the genocide…
Waltg says
MTMLA:
When have they EVER admitted culpability for their atrocities. It didn’t happen in mohammed’s day…or any day since.
Instead…they follow the “example” of their prophet…they blame the victims. They’d approach a settlement…demand conversion or submission…and when the tribesmen…naturally enough…didn-t want to give up their possessions/land….they “insulted and offended” the invaders…..so it was THEIR fault that they were slaughtered, their wives, daughters, children raped and enslaved….it’s NEVER the Islamic agressors’ fault!
gravenimage says
Malala: Muhammad never advised his followers to “go around killing people…We are not representing the true Islam”
……………………
Unfortunately, though a victim of Islam herself, Malala has whitewashed that vicious creed many times.
This is actually not at all uncommon; every Muslim feels they have to “defend” Islam, either through violence or Taqiyya.
Jerry says
“The Prophet never advised his followers to “be impatient and go around killing people.”
My first reaction to Malala is to be angry and disguted over such a stupid remark. But I have to remember she’s speaking as a muslim, she has no choice but to apply muslims’ twisted logic to the problem. It doesn’t bother her mind to insinuate goodness into muhammad despite the overwhelming evidence he was one of history’s most unsavory characters. There’s little value in saying he never advised his followers to “be impatient and go around killing people” when he himself robbed, killed, and tortured. Malala seems like a well meaning individual who chooses to see goodness in something that most normal people see as evil. But maybe that’s how she’s going to help us, by speaking as a musim to muslims.
Ray Bradbury said, “Insanity is relative. It depends on who has who locked in what cage.” From her point of view she’s doing the best she can. I can criticize her for not doing a 180 and becoming an atheist like me, but I’d be the narrow minded dumb one. If her mission is to be a peacemaker as a muslim speaking to muslims then I can live with that. There are worst things in life than a slightly misguided peacemaker. If I were locked in a cage with some nuts I doubt I’d be speaking normal every day talk myself. I have to try and put myself in her shoes and realize that her courage and troubles exceed my own, and that in her own way she is helping us. Maybe not as much as Spencer or Wilders, but helping. I respect her because she’s wise and intelligent and well meaning. I see her as doing the best she can with her present circumstances. And really, that’s all anyone one can do.
(Malala, leave islam. it’s insane.) Sorry, I had to be me.
Jerry says
Forget the italics. Total mistake, I wasn’t trying to be pretty. lol
Carolyne says
Jerry, a “Wise and intelligent” person would not say that Mohammed did not instruct his followers to “Go around killing people.” Only ignorant, brain washed people say stupid things like that. Wise? Ha! “Intelligent?” No way.
gravenimage says
Jerry wrote:
If her mission is to be a peacemaker as a muslim speaking to muslims then I can live with that.
…………………..
Unfortunately, Jerry, she is not preaching to Muslims–instead, she is whitewashing Islam for the Infidels.
waltg says
Gravenimage said:|vladkoval, I’m not sure why you are spamming criticism of the Copts all over Jihad Watch right now. I have a few quibbles with Coptic doctrine myself, but that pales in comparison when the persecution they are facing. The Copts are *victims* of Islam, as are other Christians.”
Right on the money!
gravenimage says
Thank you, walt.
waltg says
Jerry….just what ARE her ‘present circumstances’? She’s a student, she lives in Birmingham, UK….NOT in Pakistan. After her assassination attempt, some 50 clerics in Pakistan issued a fatwa AGAINST her assailants.
Bottom line, you do NOT promote TRUTH….by propogating a LIE, and her claims about the ‘true islam’ is just that…..either misinformed ignorance…..or a blatant lie, designed to whitewash islam for us infidels.
sidney penny says
You are a gem Robert Spencer for educating us infidels /kafirs
and doing it truthfully, without spin, and without hate.of Muslims.( Remember many are born into it and had no choice.)
How many more factually false.statements are there that are made by Muslims and non-Muslims?
How long will Westerners accept these falsehoods
sidney penny says
Many call Pakistan double face for saying toWest/USA we are fighting terror and then helping terror by supporting Taliban and other radical groups in Pakistan.
The Indians also call Pakistan double face for the same reason.
Malala Yousafzai a Pakistani has made this kind of statement before when she was attacked
dsinc says
Only an ex-Muslim will tell the truth about Islam.
Mahendra Singh says
Actually I am a little bot sick of this tramp. She made a fortune out of
her injury inflicted by her own people but recompensed thru Western
generosity. By the way what is real Islam? Is it something outside of
the Islamic Koran, or Hadiths?
MTMLA says
It seems to me that she acts very superior now due to the admiration and special treatment the lefties in the West granted her, and she acts as if she is an expert in the matter. I really don’t have a lot of patience to listen to her lies.She brags about Islam and Pakistan while getting all the help from the west and from a Christian nation.
Waltg says
Maybe…once she was healed…she should have been repatriated to her beloved country.
Carolyne says
And it doesn’t seem to occur to her that she is alive only because she had Western medical care. This care is not available in Muslim countries like Pakistan. They are ‘way too stupid. Had she stayed in Pakistan her treatment most likely be a glass of camel urine.
Emilia Dimitrova says
I’ve read the Korran. Malala lies!!
Carolyne says
Emilia, I doubt that this ignorant person has ever read the Koran. But maybe being shot in the head and losing some of one’s brain tissue would leave one a bit short.
garegin says
Why is it that all commies are ugly?
Dustin Koellhoffer says
Did this brainwashed fool ever actually read the Koran?
tony46 says
Malala, if you want to say that ISIS is heretic,….please just say it.
.
tony46 says
…..and then you will see how many followers you lose.
Carolyne says
And how long you live.
martin says
She started al taqiyya since she first got here.
UNCLE VLADDI says
Malala hasn’t learned a thing from her experience.
In fact, she’s a public shill for “extremist” islam.
http://tundratabloids.com/2015/12/108453/
http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/627121/Malala-Yousafzai-blame-Muslims-terrorism-ISIS
Very predictable, but disappointing, really.
SuchindranathAiyerS says
Malala is now an instrument of Islamic Camouflage.
SuchindranathAiyerS says
As per the Quran and Hadiths, Mahomet is the perfect man and all true Moslems must live as he did and do as he did. i.e. genocide, rape, sex slavery, pedophilia, extreme intolerance,, revenge lust etc. To disagree is blasphemy or apostasy. Both are punishable by death. No wonder a true Moslem tried to kill Malala