A question just as relevant as “how Islamic is Islamic State?” is this one: why should any such question anger Muslims and a leading Muslim group? This perpetual defensiveness and victimhood posturing, and the shutting down of legitimate discourse actually shows that these Muslim groups share much in common with the Islamic State’s doctrine, which also holds to the idea of the immutability of Islamic texts and Islam’s death penalty for blasphemy.
The bestselling author courted controversy in 2014 when he wrote that “The grim truth is that sanctions can be found in the Qur’an, in the biographies of Mohammad and in the histories of early Islam for much that strikes the outside world as most horrific about the Islamic State”.
It is indeed the grim truth, and these “angered” Muslim groups should accept it as such, while announcing their intention to work honestly with the West and abandon such the seventh-century barbarism that is encoded in the Sharia. But they do not do so for good reason. The overwhelming majority of organized Muslim groups in the West have links to jihad terror organizations, so their hypocritical, manipulative, and supremacist “anger” should be expected.
“Group Angered by Brit Documentary Asking, ‘How Islamic is Islamic State?’”, by Jack Montgomery, Breitbart, May 19, 2017:
British historian and broadcaster Tom Holland’s latest documentary, ‘ISIS: The Origins of Violence’, has angered leading Muslim organisations.
Prior to its broadcast on May 17th, Holland said the question his Channel 4 documentary sought to answer was “basically this: just how Islamic are the Islamic State?”
The bestselling author courted controversy in 2014 when he wrote that “The grim truth is that sanctions can be found in the Qur’an, in the biographies of Mohammad and in the histories of early Islam for much that strikes the outside world as most horrific about the Islamic State”.
How Islamic is Islamic State? The trailer for my attempt to answer that question, on @Channel4 tomorrow at 9 pm: https://t.co/QWiUefEyI8
— Tom Holland (@holland_tom) May 16, 2017
The documentary begins in Paris at the site of the Bataclan massacre, where 89 people were tortured and killed.
It then wends its way eastward, past Vienna – “Muslim armies came this far twice,” Holland reminds the viewer, pointing out a town “where they massacred everyone” – to Istanbul.
The historian suggests that the idea of jihad as holy war first took hold in the Islamic world after the Arabs failed in their first attempt to conquer the city, then known as Constantinople.
He describes how these first invaders were elevated to the status of martyrs, visiting a shrine established to honour one of them after it fell to the Turks in 1453.
Constantine XI during the Fall of Constantinople: “As my city falls, I will fall with it.” pic.twitter.com/wm1lEJaWQk
— Darwin’s Finch (@FinchesofDarwin) May 1, 2017
Istanbul was the seat of the caliphs, who served as the Prophet’s direct successors, for hundreds of years under the Ottoman sultans – until the empire was defeated by Britain and her allies during the Great War, and overthrown by the Turkish nationalist Mustafa Kemal Atatürk.
“I have no religion, and at times I wish all religions at the bottom of the sea,” he once said. “My people are going to learn the principles of democracy, the dictates of truth and the teachings of science. ”
Atatürk, although best known in the West for his persecutions of the Armenians, also implemented a series of aggressively secular policies designed to confine Islam to private life, and abolished the caliphate.
But the idea survived in the Arab world, Holland claims, inspiring Osama bin Laden and, ultimately, the foundation of the present-day caliphate under Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi.
Hostile reactions to #OriginsOfViolence
– my information is Jewish
– slavery’s not so bad
– I’m biased because I’m gay
– Islam is tolerant— Tom Holland (@holland_tom) May 18, 2017
Holland visits an ancient Christian monastery in northern Iraq, just miles from the borders of the Islamic State, occupied by a bare handful of monks and priests who tell them their faith has no future in the area, but they remain out of a sense of duty.
Holland contrasts the Christian monastic tradition with that advocated by the Prophet: “Our monasticism is jihad in the cause of God. Our monasticism is the crying of ‘Allahu Akbar!’ on hilltops.”
@PymPurnell @burnculture Did you watch the section in the heart of the Yazidi shrine? It was all about the role Muhammad plays in ISIS fantasies.
— Tom Holland (@holland_tom) May 18, 2017
The historian explores the plight of the Yazidis, visiting the shattered city of Sinjar and the holy shrine at Lalish, in the Kurdish mountains.
He describes how, unlike the Christians and Jews whose status as “People of the Book” can allow them to survive under Islamic rule as second-class citizens, provided they pay a special tax called the jizya, the Yazidis are exposed to slavery, forced conversion or death.
Speaking to Abu Sayyaf, a Salafi cleric and leader of the Jordanian Jihadi Salafist Movement, Holland is told that shariah does not allow for the Yazidis to live under the jizya.
“The same rules do not apply to the Mushrikun,” he states. “No jizya. Nothing. Either Islam or death.”
Thanks to those who watched #OriginsOfViolence. Do please keep the #Yazidis in your thoughts. They have been victims of attempted genocide.
— Tom Holland (@holland_tom) May 17, 2017
Shiraz Maher, a senior research fellow at the International Centre for the Study of Radicalisation at King’s College London, tells Holland that the Islamists perpetrating acts of violence do indeed “regard themselves as doing God’s work”.
He explains that “Beheadings, crucifixions, these are all things that are discussed within the context of the Islamic punishment system … Islamic State would say that they are implementing these punishments as they’ve understood them from the texts”.
Holland and Maher agree that the “vast majority” of Muslims would regard the group’s actions as “monstrous” – but Maher also agrees that the idea of Islam being destined to conquer the world “has always been present within a strain of Islamic thought”.
So good to get a mixture of ignorance, self-pity & casual anti-semitism vomited up onto my timeline. https://t.co/cV9QmBCE9l
— Tom Holland (@holland_tom) May 18, 2017
The documentary angered a number of British Muslims, in particular the Muslim Public Affairs Committee (MPACUK).
The MPACUK, a verified organisation which describes itself as “the UK’s leading org for empowering Muslims to focus on intelligent political activism to demand our rights”, took particular issue with the fact that Holland had consulted Israeli experts for the programme.
Holland appeared unmoved, however, and accused the group of harbouring anti-Semitic attitudes.
Honestly, Britain’s Muslims deserve so much better than to have sinister clowns like @MPACUK claim to represent them…
— Tom Holland (@holland_tom) May 18, 2017….
Beagle says
Graeme Wood expressed it quite well in 2015.
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/
“The reality is that the Islamic State is Islamic. Very Islamic. Yes, it has attracted psychopaths and adventure seekers, drawn largely from the disaffected populations of the Middle East and Europe. But the religion preached by its most ardent followers derives from coherent and even learned interpretations of Islam.”
Of course ‘British’ Muslims throw tantrums when questioned about anything. It’s been a very effective tactic for decades.
BC says
“empowering Muslims to focus on intelligent political activism to demand our rights”
An admission that Muslims have special rights which are not subject to British law.
The only rights Muslims should have in UK are the same as those as every other citizen has.
RationalVoice says
I watched and recorded this. The presenter was clearly frightened being actually there so I admire his courage. Yes, Daesch is Islamic as they follow the book “religiously” which is why “religion” of any kind is a pernicious hangover from a barbaric age.
I watched another documentary about Lancaster Castle in England where the treatment inflicted on people of a different faith (Catholicism in this case) even surpassed that of Daesch.
The tortures used by “Christians ” on other “Christians” and the purpose made instruments of torture were described in detail were truly shocking .
Hang, drawing and quartering was a slow form of execution where the unfortunate victim had his entrails ripped out why still alive and burned in a fire while he had to watch. I can’t think that the Jesus of the Gospels would have approved but no doubt the Protestants of the time( 16th and 17th Century) would have found some suitable quotes from the Old testament to justify it.
These practices were still on the law books up until the end of the 19th century although not practiced by then, but partially up to 1817.
I thought the madness of this kind of thinking was consigned to the history books but the activities of Daesch or Islamic State in 2017 show very clearly that the mental disease of religion is still with us and should be eradicated wherever the worst aspects of it are practiced !
gravenimage says
More Tu Quoque. It is not Christians enslaving and murdering people now.
During the period from 1584-1646–a sixty-two year period ending three hundred and seventy-one years ago–fifteen Catholics were executed in Lancaster for their faith. This is of course appalling.
It is also a long time ago, and there is nothing in Christian teachings that supports this kind of barbarism–just the opposite, in fact.
The estimated death toll just at the hands of ISIS–excluding other Jihad groups–is 33,000, over just the past few years.
This is not about “religions”–Islam itself teaches the tenets that the Islamic State has imposed.
Donald R Laster Jr says
That is called inconvenient history and facts.
BC says
Surpassed? I do not think so. You had better examine the atrocities of ISIS more closely
David A says
“The mental disease of religion” is an ignorant phrase, that can only be resecued by subscribing to the mental disease of humans which afflicts all groups, religious or not. The gosepel of Christ was not responsible for the evil of the church. The teachings of Krishna did not precipitate the violence of some political Hindus. Indeed, a strong case can be made that Christians, Hindus, Buddhists and others of religion and due to their religion, we’re leaders in the fight against Tyranny and Goverment power. OTOH, the history of godless statism is the most violent repressive history.
JW_Reader says
The end of Islam is not very far. Religion of peace is falling apart in pieces.
Benedict says
“To be sure, fundamentalist Islam will be very dangerous for some time to come, and all of us, after all, live only in the short term; but ultimately the fate of the Church of England awaits it. Its melancholy, withdrawing roar may well (unlike that of the Church of England) be not just long but bloody, but withdraw it will. The fanatics and the bombers do not represent a resurgence of unreformed, fundamentalist Islam, but its death rattle.”
Theodore Dalrymple: When Islam Breaks Down – CJ
Savvy Kafir says
That sounds like very wishful thinking. Islam is poised to conquer Europe in the next few decades, via the Demographic Jihad. Meanwhile, terrorist attacks in the West are becoming more and more common. And Islamists everywhere are becoming more and more uppity.
Benedict says
– and barren feminists, abortionists and gays are preparing the way.
gravenimage says
Jihad is spreading. The idea that it is actually fading away seems unlikely, I’m afraid.
Geoffrey Britain says
Islam is the fastest growing ‘religion’ in the world. Most of that is due to high birth rates but a substantial amount is conversion.
John A. Marre says
Islamic State is Islamic, IE, based on Islam. It’s what awaits the world if it doesn’t wipe out this sickness.
Donald R Laster Jr says
Islamics invade and take over countries using different tactics, The very Islamics that complain about ISIS and violent Islamics will side and support them in private since they support what they are doing. Deception is a fundamental part of Islam.
utis says
If ISIS isn’t islamic, then why don’t we hear of massive demonstrations against it in the muslim world? Why are there no mobs chanting “death to ISIS?” Why aren’t muslim countries waging jihad against ISIS?
Islam is dormant one generation, violent the next. Sooner or later some “scholar” or “mystic” wakes up the sickness that is jihad. The muslim world’s tolerance of ISIS is a blatant admission of its islamic purity.
Walter Sieruk says
Some dreamers hope to do away without little military force such brutal and deadly Islamic terror entities such has ISIS be “reforming Islam.” By such a “hope” they that they really don’t understand the basic nature of Islam.
So on the topic of a reformation within Islam, a very different yet possible valid and true view on this had been explain by the Christian, Nabeel Qureshi ,who was in the past was a Muslim .He wrote in his book which is entitled ANSWERING JIHAD wrote about the suggestion “that Islam needs a reformation .What they may not realize is that radical Islam is the Islamic reformation. This might sound shocking, but consider: Just as the Protestant Reformation was an attempt to raze centuries of Catholic tradition and return to the canonical text, so radical Islam is an attempt to raze centuries of traditions of various schools of Islamic thought and return to the canonical text of the Quran and Muhammad’s life. This desire to return to the original form of Islam can be seen not only in the words of Sayyid Qutb, but also in his method. He focused almost entirely on references to the Quran. it is true also of the Muslim Brotherhood and ISIS today, whose publications and proclamations are punctuated by references to the Quran and hadith literature. Radical Muslim organizations are explicit in their aim to reform Islam.” page 75. Further on pages 79,80 the author makes his case clear by writing that “Radical Islam is the Islamic reformation . The endeavor to modernize Islam and make it relevant to the twenty -first century is called progressive Islam. Progressive Muslim thought leaders, though few in number and limited in influence are present and are working to recreate Islam’s religious framework from within. Indeed, that is what it would take for Islam to become devoted to peace – not reformation but reimagination. “
Donald R Laster Jr says
While I agree with most of your text Islamic have been practicing Islam for 1400 years and have been following the teachings of Islam. Islam presents different aspects as part of its taking over countries and societies. ISIS nor any of the other violent Islamic groups are not seeking reform of Islam back to the text of the Qur’an, they are simply following explicit violence the Mohammad said to use in the Qur’an. Other Islamics use other explicit, but different, instructions from Mohammad in the Qur’an to accomplish the goals of Mohammad’s theocracy. What people have to understand is that Islam is foreign State or Country working to conquer the world. It is calling Islam a religion that helps to allow Islamic to achieve their goals of world domination.
This is why the comparing the deviation of the Roman Catholic Church’s practices from the Biblical teachings, Martin Luther’s attempt to correct the teachings, and the creation of the Protestant Churches, to what is going on with Islamics is not an accurate comparison. Islamics are following what Mohammad taught regardless of their using violence, deception, or the other things Mohammad said could be used to force Islamic rule and the exclusive worship of Hubal on the world. Remember, the god of Islam is Hubal (Baal) the moon god, chief god of a pantheon of 360 gods. The word “allah” is a contraction of two words Arabic “al” (the) and “ilah” (god), it is not a name.
(Noticed I was mistyping the al as il from the copy of the text I had. “allah” still simply means “the god”)
Walter Sieruk says
Since today is Armed Forces Day it’s therefore very appropriate to site the wisdom of the first Constitutional President of the United States of America, George Washington, who had, so well explained “To be prepared for war is one of the most effectual means of preserving peace.” Moreover President Washington stated that “However pacific the general policy of the nation may be ,it ought never be without an adequate stock of military knowledge for emergencies.”
Furthermore, with this post- 9/11 USA it should likewise be remembered that one very good way to defeat the jihadists who compose the many brutal and deadly Islamic terror entities ,such as al Qaeda, ISIS, the Taliban, is by the means of a very strong power of US military might. As Thomas Jefferson had declared “With every barbarous people …force is law.”
ibrahim itace muhammed says
Mr Spencer,you and Mr Holland are mischiefmakers and islam’ s haters.we have been saying Isis view on Islam is perverse.it was sponsored by Jews to display the desired picture the evil jews and filthy christians have been painting on islam.we have been telling Mr Spencer that he is not bringing some thing new against islam.such lies had been there for long
gravenimage says
Apologist for savagery ibrahim itace muhammed wrote:
Mr Spencer,you (sic) and Mr Holland are mischiefmakers (sic) and islam’ s (sic) haters.
……………………………..
How *dare* Robert Spencer or any other Infidel point out that Islam is violent? Don’t the “filthy Kuffar” realize that this is Haram under Shari’ah?
Note that “mischiefmakers” is straight out of the Qur’an–Verse 2:191–which contains the line, “mischief is worse than slaughter”. In other words, this is a *threat*.
More:
we (sic)have been saying Isis view on Islam is perverse.it (sic) was sponsored by Jews to display the desired picture the evil jews (sic) and filthy christians (sic) have been painting on islam (sic).
……………………………..
Right–never mind that Jews cannot even enter the Islamic State, and that it is run entirely on *Islamic* principles.
Moreover, ISIS is not unique–every other Jihad group adheres to the same tenets, those of orthodox Islam.
muhmmed *himself* has justified violent Jihad against the Infidels, as well as all the horrors of Shari’ah, such as murdering gay people and rape victims.
Even more:
we (sic) have been telling Mr (sic) Spencer that he is not bringing some thing new against islam.such (sic) lies had been there for long (sic)
……………………………..
*Of course* this is nothing new–Islam has been this savage for 1400 years now.
That is the whole point–Westerners used to recognize Islam as a threat–now, given “political correctness”, they often do not.
Notice that, as has always been the case, ibrahim itace muhammed does not bother to say what Robert Spencer says that is incorrect–because he cannot cite anything.
He just doesn’t want anyone warning the Infidels–they might wake up and fight back, and muhammed can’t have that…
jayell says
Excellent demolition of yet
another example of unconvincing, self-righteous, spurious claptrap from a Friend of the Prophet who has strayed onto territory where he does not belong. Nothing to add, apart from the observation that Mr. Muhammed clearly reveals his lamentable level of intellect not only in a total lack of substance in his argument but also in his descent into offensive, intemperate sub-football-hooligan vocabulary with knee-jerk references to ‘evil Jews’ and ‘filthy christians’ in place of anything that might resemble intelligent, reasoned argument. Mr. Muhammed should realise that, in posting on Jihad Watch, he is attempting to perform in a league that is somewhat above his capabilities and, should he wish to express his sentiments further, I would recommend the purchase of a can of aerosol paint and an area of of blank wall in a location such as Teheran, Islamabad or Cairo.
Baucent says
It’s a laughable idea to suggest the Jews have sponsored antisemitic ideas in ISIS to make muslims look bad.
gravenimage says
Absolutely, Jayell and Baucent.
And Jayell, thank you for your kind words.
Jack Holan says
The PC thing in the West is only part of it. It’s the Mind-Set or Mentality of the Western Mind. How many generations has it been since WW2. In that War there was debachery & savagery on a greater scale than today. The Public accepted Our Men to do whatever it took until unconditional surrender. Somehow the leaders of this country think that just as in WW2 they can reform the Shinto Religion and command authority and power there is exists One huge major difference. When we won the war we defeated the Emperor their representation of the Shinto G-d. McArthur insisted he relinquish all authority and power to a civilian Democratically Elected Government and not Top-Down from the Emperor.
Islam carries it’s own decentralized, interpreted (1400) years worth of idealogy and as the Kafur we are going to the leading Ruler of the Sunni, Wahhabi (extreme of extreme) ideological Islam selling them sophisticated weapons. They are not coming to us!
Donald R Laster Jr says
Obviously you are practicing the standard Islamic practice of deception. Have you reviewed the actual practices of Islam and its real history of depravity. All one has to do is to read the Qur’an and it will be clear that ISIS is following the teaching of Islam.
James says
What possible motive could Jews have for founding ISIS ? Do people in their right mind found bodies that are dedicated to their own destruction ?
gravenimage says
Muslims come up with this rot all the time–that if anything makes Islam look bad, it must be the fault of the “filthy Infidels”, especially the Jews.
Of course, when they are fully empowered they don’t care what the Kuffar think, and just openly revel in Islam’s savagery.
Donald R Laster Jr says
Which is what ISIS is doing and the Islamics in Turkey are doing.
David says
When Muhammad was murdered by his wives with poison! Muhammad did not leave a structure of leadership! So this is why Muslims burn,rape and kill each other & others!!! One group will say they are the true Muslim & other groups are not! Read Muammads bio and learn! Most Muslims don’t even know the koran! When anyone learns the truth about how islam got started & what islam is! Muslims will go nuts!!! Because Muslims don’t want persons to think! Just bend over! Islam got it’s start with satan kicking the shit out of Muhammad in a cave! And satan said read! Here is my book of mess, I have read the koran and it is a boring book! Read up on the five pillers of satans religion! Walking around a box chanting to a box that is empty! Satan is the box! Learn pre-islam of how it came together! Most people who say they are Muslim have know clue they are going to hell!!! But (up to you)! Then there are persons who will Muslims around with a ring in their nose and are zombies! Because Muslim cry we are victims of crimes we Muslims set up! Muslims are pro’s at propaganda!!! In the bio of Muhammad read the one chapter of ( Mecca to Medina)! And learn what Muslims do to people who disagree! A other book to read is The everlasting hatred the roots of jihad. By Hal Lindsey.
Sarah says
Great article. Thanks.
“The overwhelming majority of organized Muslim groups in the West have links to jihad terror organizations, so their hypocritical, manipulative, and supremacist “anger” should be expected.”
That statement says it all. Nothing more needs to be said really, except to add that as a result of this, we should not take seriously, anything those groups say and indeed, should be looking into changing our current legislation so as to deny them a platform to spread their hate without consequence.
After all, the Left wants to change legislation to deny a platform to spread what they view as hate, from a variety of sections of society, when discussing topics such as Islam. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander, I would have thought.
Its a shame that Trudeau and the Canadians didn’t provide fair, true equality within the confines of their new legislation. They want to ban Islamaphobia and decry it as hate speech – and they have very carefully created legislation that identifies and hones in on those two areas only, whilst deliberately ignoring the realization that their new legislation could have been used to also protect THE ENTIRE POPULATION as well, from the terror, injury and slaughter that we see comes from Islam.
Its nearly funny, you wouldn’t be able to swallow it, if it were written as a fictional story. The Muslims want to be protected from having to hear any truthful criticism of Islam whatsoever. The entire rest of the human race (all 6 odd billion of us) just want to be protected from being terrorized, raped, assaulted and slaughtered in the name of Islam. This whole mess is just ludicrous.
James says
If ISIS is “nothing to do with Islam”, what is the problem ? If, as is said, thousands of Muslims have protested against it, what can possibly be objectionable in asking how Islamic it is ?
Politicianphobia says
Trudeau is another Soros’ puppet. If you ever watch the interview with Soros– when asked how he felt watching all his jewish friends being taken away by the Nazis, he smiles and says it did not bother him. EVIL, just pure evil. It is 2017, stop with what Christians did hundreds of years ago, read what I bra him is saying now and understand that evil and madness exist.
Anne Smith says
I watched this programme and was pleased that the presenter and writer had managed to find authorised Muslim scholars to confirm pretty much everything which Jihadiwatch tells us.
It was a pity that the confirming views of these Islamic scholars were not given more prominence as they went a long way to rebutting the nonsense spouted by our ignorant politicians that “Islam is a religion of Peace”.
The programme was rather slow, which could have deterred some viewers and it would have benefitted from judicious editing.