One side is fighting a war that has been going on for 15 years, and it is weary of it. The other side is fighting a war that has been going on for 1,400 years, and is resolved not to give up. Even if temporary gains are made, the jihadis will not be eradicated from Afghanistan. The Taliban can afford to play a waiting game, knowing that the Americans will leave sooner or later. If Trump really wanted to weaken the Taliban, he could start a propaganda campaign to challenge its premises — but that would be “Islamophobic.”
“Taliban condemn Trump’s decision on Afghanistan war, vow ‘jihad’ will go on,” Reuters, August 22, 2017:
…”Instead of continuing of war in Afghanistan, Americans should have thought about withdrawing their soldiers from Afghanistan,” Taliban spokesman Zabihullah Mujahid said in a statement issued hours after Trump’s televised speech on U.S. policy in Afghanistan and South Asia.
Mujahid said “as long as there is even one American solder in our country”, the Islamist insurgents would “continue our jihad”.
Lucia Bartoli says
Some (not fake) news has reported that the upper echelons of Taliban are already speaking with our U.S. officials. How is this contradiction happening? I truly hope our POTUS just drones these animals into infinity. Doing them a BIG favor so they can go to their version of their paradise/allah hight away.
gravenimage says
Lucia Bartoli wrote:
Some (not fake) news has reported that the upper echelons of Taliban are already speaking with our U.S. officials. How is this contradiction happening?
…………………….
There have been “talks” with the Taliban before. They just use it to regroup or gain other concessions. Just look up “Taqiyya”.
ROY WILSON says
Agree they need to be cleaned off the face of the earth once and for all
clap says
Even if there were no American soldiers in Afghanistan, the Taliban would still jihad.
Wellington says
Mission creep. Again.
There may be some tactical victories here and there but there will be no outright winning. Can’t win a war if you can’t even name the enemy. The enemy is Islam——-all of it.
Smack Daddy says
I agree but how does he avoid the MSM shit storm if he states Islam is false and we are going to educate the Middle East?
Wellington says
Understandable question you ask, Smack Daddy. Here’s my answer: The MSM, no matter what Trump says or does, will always hit him with another shit storm. So, screw the MSM and simply state the truth of things, i.e., that Islam is rotten to the core and is a mortal enemy of freedom.
The truth is a powerful ally, often not short-term but always long term. Trump, for whatever reason or reasons, is deviating from the truth that Islam, all of it, is putrid. He himself said back in March of 2016, “I think Islam hates us.” He didn’t say that some Muslims hate us. No, he got it right then, dead center and all that. But now he is surrounded by people who simply don’t grasp just how iniquitous Islam is. I think Bannon did but he’s gone now.
And the fundamental problem remains, irrespective of the MSM or anyone else who can’t see the light. The light here being that all of Islam is horrible. A la Ataturk, Islam is the absurd theology of a seventh-century Bedouin, it is a rotting corpse which poisons our lives. Put another way, and with a 21st century update, America and all the West, all of the free world (N.B., Islam has never had anything to do with freedom and never will), needs an American President who gives a new Evil Empire Speech which recalls what Ataturk said. Trump, though a vast improvement upon Obama and Hillary, is, I’m sorry to say, not the man who can duplicate what President Reagan said back on March 8, 1983 about the Soviet Union being an Evil Empire.
And remember the shit storm that the MSM hit Reagan with back then when he spoke the truth? Even worse now if Trump should speak the truth about Islam. But Reagan was right. Time for Trump to be right too. Sadly, I don’t think this will happen. Should. But I don’t think it will. So, the best-disguised and longest-lived form of evil ever, Islam, will continue posing as something good. Thus, still much, much trouble ahead.
Just about the worst thing that can be done is not properly identifying evil. And if Islam is not evil, then nothing is evil.
I rest my case.
gravenimage says
Disturbingly, Wellington, for the first time in his Afghanistan speech Trump left out “Islamic” in talking about terrorism.
Daniel Triplett says
Trump needs a Reagan Berlin Wall moment.
I agree, just tell it like it is. That’s why we elected the man.
Daniel Triplett says
But an “Evil Empire” -caliber Speech delivered in front of Congress or the EU assembly would be even more compelling.
bob says
Wellington, I couldn’t of put it better myself! You know your history and have a great knowledge of the evils of Islam. now more than ever before more and more people need to educate themselves to the world threat that Islam is. God bless you Wellington!
Farooq O'Brien says
“As long as there is one American soldier in Afghanistan”??? This is not the point. These mujihadeens consider the entire world their “country”! Exterminate them like the vermin they are! No apologies needed. Issa Allahu Akbar
John A. Marre says
We couldn’t eliminate the Taliban before. What makes Trump think we’ll wipe them out this time? new Taliban are being spawned all the time. Taliban is not a race or an ethnicity. It is a group of terrorists, recruited among MUSLIMS!
Smack Daddy says
MOAB after MOAB after MOAB…
Larry says
After MOAB after MOAB after MOAB after MOAB……………
Daniel Triplett says
Or just use nukes for the speed and efficiency.
Gary says
Jihad: a struggle or fight against the enemies of Islam: he declared a jihad against the infidels | [mass noun] : the importance of jihad as a uniting force.
• (also greater jihad) the spiritual struggle within oneself against sin.
But wait?! The Western Media keeps stating that terrorism has absolutely nothing to do with Islam?!!
And if someone is making their “struggle” personal… “within oneself” isn’t murdering innocent men, women, and children a sin?!
Islam: A Fabricated “Religion of Peace” by a murdering Pedophile.
Ren says
Muslim jihadist don’t need Trump to continue “their jihad”. They have done so for over 1000 years for they are the children of Muhammad, a pedophile, a thief and a murderer, an example for all muslims.
Guest says
That’s precisely why we need to stay. They won’t stop and eventually they would attack America if we left them alone
Wellington says
Stay for how long? Forever? Why not call out Islam, all of it, for the malevolent ideology which it surely is and cordon off the Islamic world as far as possible from the rest of mankind?
I think the “staying” approach is not working. It’s merely a tactical approach at best. And what good is tactics without strategy and, in military speak, grand strategy?
Winning should be the goal. I aver that as long as Islam, all of this effing religion, is not accurately described for the monumental evil ideology that it is, winning is not possible.
And I want to win. Big time. Especially against the longest-lived malevolent ideology of all time, hiding behind that religious veil as it does.
Your turn.
Linde Barrera says
To Wellington- I really appreciate your eloquence and truthful logic regarding Islam and history. How come you aren’t one of President Trump’s advisers? Stay fit and brainy, dear Wellington.
Linde Barrera says
To Wellington- I really appreciate your eloquence and truthful logic regarding Islam and history. How come you aren’t one of President Trump’s advisers? Stay fit and brainy, dear Wellington.
Wellington says
Thanks for your gracious comment, Linde.
Daniel says
To Wellington – I agree with you that this is a tactical strategy but Trump has said over and over from the time he started running for president that you never reveal a long term strategy especially in military matters. I as well agree with you the Islam is the enemy but if we left Afganistan it would create yet another vacuum such as the one filled by ISIS in Iraq when numb skull Obama plunged the knife in our backs by allowing more Islamist Trojan Horses to come to America. What is needed and will never happen is for the western world, I.E. Europe, North America, and Australia to declare Islam satanic and or toxic to the furtherance of the Human race and begin the process or outlawing, weeding out, hunting down and deporting all Islamic cultures in the west. Tear down every mosque. This includes jail time for people who are native and convert to Islam. Like I said it will never happen. The only thing anyone can hope and pray for at this point is the return of the Lord Jesus Christ for His bride. To anyone who does not know Him, all hope is lost.
Wellington says
Daniel: I have no problem at all with Special Forces operating in Afghanistan now and again to take out the extra bad guys (or in so many other Muslim nations) but I’m not a big fan of just more conventional forces in a country like Afghanistan, though I think it could be a damned if we do, damned if we don’t situation. Often times life leaves you with no good option.
I don’t believe tearing down mosques in the West is necessary (and the legalities involved would entail a whole new set of laws and judicial decisions), but I am certain that accurately describing Islam as a heinous belief system is crucial. Once this would happen, a person could be a Muslim in a free society much as one can be a Marxist, anarchist, KKK member, Neo-Nazi, etc., but that Muslim would know that he is an object of opprobrium as the others I mentioned are. Free societies can tolerate those who would end freedom but only if such people are properly characterized as adhering to a heinous belief system, which then results in ostracism, marginalization and obloquy which in turn protects freedom. Of course, just as with any other freedom-crushing ideology which is permitted to exist in a free society, those believing in such an ideology must be punished to the maximum under the law for trying to fulfill dictates of their creed which are in violation of the law. No exceptions here. Prosecute a Muslim for having more than one wife (even if he does it secretly). Prosecute a Muslim for using violence to silence a critic of Islam. And so on.
Not being religious in the least, I’m sure you’ll understand that I don’t have the fervor that you do about Jesus, but as I have written before here at JW if every Muslim would wake up tomorrow a devout Christian (or Jew, Hindu, Buddhist, et al.) the world would be extraordinarily better off. No other major religion (nor virtually any minor religion) is a mortal threat to liberty as Islam is. And the largest coalition of non-Muslims as possible is the optimum way to go respecting combating what Islam intends for us all. Thus I welcome Christians, Jews, Hindus, Buddhist, Sikhs, Taoists, agnostics, atheists, etc. being all on the same page where Islam is concerned.
Thanks for your reply. Take care.
gravenimage says
Islam needs to be *isolated*. We cannot reform this vicious creed.
mgoldberg says
they would continue their jihad even if we leave completely. That’s because the Jihad is directly at the entirety of the planet. And that’s why we have to discuss the Jihad, what it means, and get rid of the false notion of Islamophobia, and detail the actual bigotry of Islam, and it’s history, and it’s theologic basis and it’s eternal quality that cannot be changed.
Geoffrey Britain says
THE problem is NOT jihadist terrorism. As many now know, THE problem is the political correctness that prevents the West from identifying the enemy and of taking the steps that will defeat that enemy. As all here know, Islam itself is the SOURCE of Islamic terrorism. Eliminate the Taliban, ISIS, al Qaeda, Hamas, Hezbollah, etc. etc. and in time, Islam will simply raise up more proxy agents of conquest.
Enough attacks, the fall of Europe and perhaps a few nuked Western cities and the enemy will finally be acknowledged. Once that occurs, defeating Islam can be easily accomplished. And, without nuking the entire ME, which after all would not eliminate the threat outside the ME.
The way to gain the leverage needed to dissuade an enemy is to attach intolerable consequence to the actions you want to deter.
Islamic terrorist groups consist of two primary components; jihadist warriors and the fanatical Imams and Mullahs who recruit and indoctrinate Islam’s cannon fodder.
Young jihadist recruits are psychologically dependent upon the promise of paradise and its rewards. 72 virgins is a huge incentive to young men forced by their ‘religion’ to practice celibacy.
So, use Islam’s own dogmatic beliefs against them. ALL Muslims accept that Allah himself has declared in the Qur’an that an unclean Muslim may NOT enter paradise. Any contact with any part of a pig renders a Muslim unclean. That condition remains until an unclean Muslim participates in a special cleansing ritual. Thus, a Muslim slain in battle or executed in an unclean manner is permanently banned from entrance into paradise.
This tactic has already been proven during the Spanish American war against Muslim ‘insurgents’ in the Philippines.
Hollow point ammo that encapsulates a chamber of dried pigs blood would by their own beliefs… effectively ban slain jihadists from paradise. Once this becomes known, recruitment will start to decline.
Execute captured jihadists, Imams and Mullahs by drowning them in a transparent, acrylic vat filled with pigs blood. Strip them naked, drown them alive and upload a video of the execution to a special website for viewing. No paradise for the executed. That will kill recruitment and put the proverbial fear of Allah into them. Recruitment will plummet.
Islam itself only values one thing and one thing only, Islam’s survival. Islam places extraordinary importance upon its ‘holy sites’. Islam has never lost even one and Mecca is of such importance that Muslims are obligated to bow down in prayer 5 times a day facing Mecca. It is also mandatory that if at all possible, a Muslim make pilgrimage to Mecca at least once in their lives.
Given that reality, hold hostage the continued existence and survival of Islam’s holy sites to the cessation of terrorist attacks. So every time there is an attack, Islam loses another site. Once they are convinced through a demonstration that we are serious, they will consider it an intolerable consequence. I suggest starting with a retaliation that destroys Islam’s Dome of the Rock in Jerusalem. That will convince them.
This is how you attach intolerable consequence to Islam.
It is my belief that the resurgence in Islamic terrorism in the 20th century is essentially reactive. Some consciously and most subconsciously sense that Islam’s 7th century theology cannot survive another century of the modern world’s cultural intrusion. It matters not that it is inadvertent. The modern world is a mortal threat to Islam’s continued existence. We can wait them out if we can isolate them and intolerable consequence is the way to do that with the least amount of bloodshed.
Savvy Kafir says
Even if all violent jihadi attacks & insurgencies ended, we would still have stealth jihadis & demographic jihadis living among us, gradually bringing about the Islamization of the West. That is the greatest threat we face.
D Austin says
Insurgency attacks are impossible to stop in a free society. Many vulnerable infrastructure targets open to attack to wear down a population.
Geoffrey Britain says
I am arguing that achieving deterrence by attaching what for them is intolerable consequence… to insurgent attacks is the answer.
Recruitment will plummet when jihadists know that if when they are slain, executed and buried that it will be in an unclean manner that prevents entrance into paradise. Again, this is using their own beliefs against them. And those beliefs are unchangeable, given that their entire theology rests upon the foundation that Allah has declared that belief.
Once they are convinced through a demonstration, fanatical Imams and Mullahs will not risk their holy sites. It is far too imbued into their power structure. The Dome of the Rock, the City of Qom and Mecca have inestimable importance to Muslims.
Geoffrey Britain says
It’s certainly a serious threat and in the long run, arguably the more serious. Stealth jihad and migratory jihad can be addressed through legal measures. Again political correctness is the primary obstacle to doing so.
gravenimage says
Geoffrey Britain wrote:
Thus, a Muslim slain in battle or executed in an unclean manner is permanently banned from entrance into paradise.
This tactic has already been proven during the Spanish American war against Muslim ‘insurgents’ in the Philippines.
……………………
Geoffrey, if you are referring to General Pershing, I’m afraid this is a myth.
Geoffrey Britain says
“Geoffrey, if you are referring to General Pershing, I’m afraid this is a myth.”
Allah has declared in the Qur’an that an unclean Muslim may not enter paradise. Not even one comma in the Qur’an can be changed, as fallible mankind cannot ‘correct’ (revise) what INFALLIBLE Allah has proclaimed. Revise the Qur’an and you implicitly declare Muhammad to have either been a liar or deluded in repeatedly declaring that, Allah through the archangel Gabriel dictated Allah’s direct testimony for Muhammad’s transcription with Gabriel making sure Muhammad got ever word, comma and period exactly right. Reject that claim and Islam’s theological foundations collapse because a liar or deluded person cannot be a prophet.
It was an officer under Pershing’s command that came up with the strategy of burying slain Muslim insurgents in graves with dead pigs. That is well documented and the insurgency started to lessen shortly after that tactic was employed.
Daniel Triplett says
The General Pershing story is true:
http://www.frontpagemag.com/point/267616/new-york-times-reported-using-pigs-fight-muslim-daniel-greenfield
Demsci says
Thank you so much for that link!
The enormity! Claiming almost total absence of proof, when somewhere there really was proof.
These fact checkers certainly had me fooled, when they so confidently asserted that the story had no foundation in reality.
But even the fact-checkers were mistaken, because of prejudice or laziness. And now they are found out! They simply OMITTED evidence to get to a story that harmed president Trump! WITH that intention I suspect!
Thanks to Daniel Greenfeld they of necessity must be more careful in future. I hope their lies of omittance embarrass them a lot and eat away their credibility.
“Fact checkers, HAH!”
Daniel Triplett says
Yes Demsci, this is another example of the efficacy of the Left’s propaganda machine. They have 99.9% of the Western World believing President Trump buffooned himself, losing credibility due to a story he referenced that happens to be true.
I just watched a clip of a UK morning show bullying under duress even the Right-wing Nigel Farage (DJT’s friend) into erroneously saying our President was wrong with the General Pershing reference.
Snopes and other so-called fact-checkers obviously have an ideological bent, as with Facebook, Twitter, Google, etc.
Chand says
Geoffrey Britain says: “Hollow point ammo that encapsulates a chamber of dried pigs blood would by their own beliefs… effectively ban slain jihadists from paradise. Once this becomes known, recruitment will start to decline.
Execute captured jihadists, Imams and Mullahs by drowning them in a transparent, acrylic vat filled with pigs blood. Strip them naked, drown them alive and upload a video of the execution to a special website for viewing. No paradise for the executed. That will kill recruitment and put the proverbial fear of Allah into them. Recruitment will plummet.”
Ha! Ha! Sounds great! But the pigs will have to be killed and bled live, in the video. Otherwise how will they know it really is pig’s blood?
But the main problem with the second tactic is that Jihadis are very hard to capture.
More……….”Given that reality, hold hostage the continued existence and survival of Islam’s holy sites to the cessation of terrorist attacks. So every time there is an attack, Islam loses another site. Once they are convinced through a demonstration that we are serious, they will consider it an intolerable consequence. I suggest starting with a retaliation that destroys Islam’s Dome of the Rock in Jerusalem. That will convince them.”
This might have the opposite effect, which will be a godsend to the Jihadis. It will prove to ordinary Muslims that the world is against their religion and they will willingly take up Jihad in larger numbers.
gravenimage says
Taliban condemn Trump, vow to “continue our jihad”
………………..
When have pious Muslims ever done anything else?
davej says
Afghanistan: 24 hours after we leave it will be like we were never there. This is a proxy fight against the war that Islam has declared on the whole world. They have been fighting it for 14 centuries and are not going to stop now. Seventeen years is nothing to the believers in this demonic ideology. They have the patience of a rock and the intelligence and goodwill of a retarded zombie. All Islamic infrastructure should be nuked – sorry but you started this shit.
Demsci says
Quite right, and as Robert noted in the article. So the factor time is introduced in the ongoing debate of, say, Islam’s, and Muslim’s war for global supremacy, against all infidels.
But this is the 21st century. Development accelerates, as shown in “Moore’s law”, of doubling capacity and or speed every 18 months with technological devices and software, procedures, and what not. History is ever more elaborately and effectively investigated, reported and disseminated. I read books about what great innovations are coming; like the internet of things, hyper intelligent machines, like Dr. Watson, and Artificial Intelligence (self learning machines!) as a whole.
Oh, I know, Muslims also get hold of the improved articles and methods. However, with all these new developments, in the hands of Democratic Nations, among them Israel, I wonder if …
Time is NOT on the side of the Muslims?
I wonder if at least some of these new developments are not really threathening to Islam???
Might not some intelligent Muslims begin to worry? Even about the staggering growth of Artificial Intelligence? which in theory ALSO could move towards global supremacy! (This may be indeed WORSE than the Islamic one).
In Homo Deus of (Israeli) Yuval Noah Harare, Islam is characterized as “having nothing to offer to mankind in the future (at least nothing unique)”. It’s followers seem to think the “best of times” were far back in time, in the time of prophet and right guided caliphs. In contrast so many of us have the attitude of “the best is yet to come”. And new mass movements can appear, when the time is ready, which can swamp the tired old religion of Islam. In a very short time.
We can also simply keep asking Muslims AND TALIBAN: any idea when “Allah” finally will institute Judgement day”? Is n’t he long overdue? How long will you keep waiting? Forever? (I am sorry if I embarrass Christians with this question).
Chand says
davej says: “All Islamic infrastructure should be nuked…….”
Happy dreams!!
underbed cat says
If the migration continues, the mosque building continues, the pretense that Islam is a normal religion, ie not violent continues, the military diversity includes enemies continue, the left war against America continues, the BLM attachment to the MB continues, the lies continue, the attacks on our police continues then nothing that happens in Afghanistan will change….it will only get worse and as the uninformed pass legislation to create hate speech and criminalize free speech of facts, cities and states will pop up with muslim leaders it, it is the plan, unless there is a national education, someday they will pull off the jihad of no return. This is my concern, the doctrine laws have to be understood so the false assumptions of how to fight the enemy that has no national borders don’t take ours. We won’t be fighting a country with terrorist, we will be fighting the ummah, world wide islamic soildiers and some have very bad weapons as they have been assisted.
stan lee says
It is just as well that they take their stand, they are absolutely distrustful even if they promised to be peaceful and unthreatening to people who see life differently than the Taliban.
Guy Forester says
I am shocked, utterly shocked, I tell you!
After meeting some and having some run ins with Wahabi followers, it was clear to me that supporting the mujahideen in Afghanistan was every bit as stupid as Nixon normalizing relations with the PRC and Carter forcing the Shah to let Khomeni back. Who the hell was pulling these guy’s strings?
You and I, the average taxpayer foot the bills and fight the wars. Washington’s advice apparently fell on deaf ears.
By the way, I recently read a book written in the 1950’s by a Brit that served with a Gurkha unit in India on the border of what is now Pakistan and Afghanistan. His description of Afghanistan seems like it was written today, not 70+ years ago. These people refuse to change. We need to leave them to their own devices. The Paki ISI does not help, only makes matters worse.
Chand says
Guy Forester says:”The Paki ISI does not help, only makes matters worse.”
Correct.
The Paki ISI is a facilitator of Jihad, paid by the Saudis, the real Islamic State. A far worse, nightmarish scenario potentially awaits the world: JIHADIS ACQUIRING NUKES OR RADIOACTIVE MATERIAL OR SOME JIHAD-INSPIRED OFFICER PUSHING THE NUKE BUTTON!!!!
The ISI might just do that if push comes to shove for them in the future.
jewdog says
The trick is never to leave Afghanistan, but to transform it as the conquered state it is. Set up secular free spaces and invite in – and screen – those fleeing Sharia oppression, and anyone else interested in living a decent life. We won that country so let’s make it ours.
Demsci says
Great idea! Make it a 2-way-street; deport those who are really siding with the Taliban to them. And are shown to be that way. When conditions upon citizenship are formulated and screening control is in place.
Of course screening the incoming and the treasonous is immens difficult, but if it only works partially, the 2 zone-Afghanistan is a great idea. And when we think someone is genuinely on our side, no other obstacles to immigration must exist. Only conditions on citizenship, Of the “tolerant democratic zone” breach of which will lead to deportation, must be in place.
Isn’t it clear; when countries or “zones” are prohibited to deport anyone, that they then will hesitate much more with letting in the new immigrants?
Demsci says
But you can be sure that the PC, inhibited, myopic generals and most of the politicians and media, won;t even countenance this great idea.
ItsReallyQuiteClear says
Si vis Islam, para pacem. Si vis Islam para bellum.
That’s why continuing the same non-strategy in Afghanistan is the definition of insanity. And pretending that we’re taking the fight to them, as a preference to waiting for “them” to come here, while doing nothing to even recognize the acts, or the threat, in our own country, is insane. And what if “they” who may not be named, did come here? Would they suddenly stop being viewed as Taliban and be coddled as persecuted Muslims?
I don’t disapprove of the methods. I see no method in it.
Demsci says
If Trump had listened to Bannon, the now wasted money (and lives) would have been used much better. Due to his much better understanding of the Islamic threat than the understanding of the “generals”.
These generals presented Trump with some sort of false choice; In essence; fight on and even harder OR … leave and do nothing of consequence in Afghanistan, and thus choose for losing all what we have accomplished there and let thereby be the sacrifices in the past to have been in vain. And so on.
But that is according to Bannon and us a false choice, of generals who are myopic because of failure to understand the enemy and the scope of the threat, and who so even want to cooperate with people who really are enemies! Of our own ideology and civilization.
The money and most of all the lives of soldiers could be put to much better use for our protection than the myopic generals (Mathis, McMaster, Petraeus, …) propose. Nevertheless I wish them luck when they try it their way, maybe with a few crucial changes and better weapons.
Daniel Triplett says
If we want to pick a Muslim country to conquer and occupy, we should pick Iran, Pakistan, or Saudi Arabia–the greatest threats to the World.
But I say we recall all Allied personnel from Dar al-Islam, and let the UGM-133 Trident II do the talking.
willardy says
It must be something to spend your entire life fighting and making war and hiding and killing and hating in a desolate ugly desert…
I enjoy fishing, walks on the mountain trails, enjoying nature, camping in the green forests, bowling, swimming and so on. Please don’t bore me with your; aliakbar crap. Get a life.!