“The incident itself was sparked by the circulation of a rumor within the village’s Muslim population that church officials were installing a bell. This led to villagers with extremist views to incite the village’s Muslims to attack the church.”
That’s not “extremist views,” that’s mainstream Islam. Islamic law forbids the subjugated People of the Book (Jews, Christians, Zoroastrians) to make public display of their religious festivals, including the ringing of bells. The dhimmis “are forbidden…to ring church bells or display crosses…recite the Torah or Evangel aloud, or make public display of their funerals or feastdays” (Reliance of the Traveller, o11.5 (6).)
If they violate these laws, they can lawfully be killed.
Meanwhile, why were three Christians arrested? Were they helping to destroy the church? Or were they arrested because Egyptian authorities were engaging in a bit of victim-blaming and targeting the Christians who fought back? The latter possibility is much more likely.
“Police arrest 17 suspects in Coptic Church attack,” Egypt Independent, December 24, 2017:
Security forces in Giza arrested 17 people on Saturday on suspicion of participating in the mob of hundreds which stormed the Church of al-Amir Tadros (Prince Tadros) on Friday in Giza’s Atfeeh area village, Kafr al-Waselin.
Giza security sources said that arrested suspects will be prosecuted on accusations of thuggery, vandalism, rioting, and stirring sectarian strife between Muslims and the minority Coptic Christians.
Among those arrested, 14 were Muslim, and three were Christian.
The Archbishop of Atfeeh said on Friday that a mob gathered outside the church at noon on Friday, chanting hostile slogans demanding the demolition of the church, before storming the site.
The incident itself was sparked by the circulation of a rumor within the village’s Muslim population that church officials were installing a bell. This led to villagers with extremist views to incite the village’s Muslims to attack the church.
Police sources said that after Friday prayers, approximately 80 local Muslims moved towards the church, threatening to destroy the church if the bell was installed.
The mob smashed chairs, destroyed much of the church’s interior contents, and assaulted Christians who were present, before security forces were able to step in.
An official source at the Giza Security Directorate revealed that the church was established in 2002 after an agreement between the village’s Muslim and Christian populations, on the condition that it would be a small building for prayer, without a crucifix on display, not a dome, a bell, or a beacon….
PRCS says
“villagers with extremist views”
Those being what, exactly?
Westman says
It’s time to face the facts that too many villagers who can’t survive in the larger cities are simply of low intelligence for which education is of little use. How can intelligent people form a mob to to destroy, maim, rob, and kill for a rumor? They don’t. The smart ones leave for the big cities and leave the rest behind.
I’ve denied it to myself for years, and cannot continue the charade that Islam does not have an incredible number of mentally incompetent and modern-competition-incapable people. It seems for that segment, physicality and violence are the substitutes for mental capability. And they are a constant embarrassing rebuttal to the image sold by CAIR, OIC, and other Muslim apologists.
gravenimage says
Westman, Muslims do this in big cities, as well. This has more to do with Islam than with small towns.
Westman says
I don’t see that in the economic centers of the large cities. It may happen in certain districts or no-go zones but not in the business or residence zones of the affluent. There is a demarcation between the college-educated men who plan and carry out a 9/11 and Muslims that will stupidly go on a mob rampage over an unconfirmed rumor. The 9/11 hijackers would laugh at them. People don’t seem to know there is a serious social pecking order in the ME, Islam not withstanding. For a quick analysis, ask any Iranian from the ME.
gravenimage says
Westman, I was thinking of the mob destruction of the museum and library in Cairo, the pregnant woman stoned to death by a mob right outside the high court in Lahore, and the woman rumored to have “blasphemed” murdered and set on fire by a mob in the middle of Kabul. There are other examples, as well.
It’s probably worse outside the cities, but it is pretty bad right in the cities in Dar-al-Islam.
mortimer says
Agree with GI. You have merely to attend an Al Quds Day event to witness the extent of ignorant Jew hatred among Muslims. Christianophobia is number two as Hamas said in the past: “First the people of Saturday, then the people of Sunday.” (This is a genocidal slogan.)
The IQ among Muslims is generally low because of first cousin marriages and uncle-niece marriages over 50 generations.
gravenimage says
Thanks Mortimer.
Also, re IQ–it does not just seem to be just genetic, but is also subject to exposure to a decent education, especially at a young age–something Islam does not provide.
Avspatti says
Maybe if they would stop marrying their cousins . . .
cyrus basile says
is true hahahaha bravo
Westman says
I hear you Graven.
The Cairo Museum was bombed rather than mob sacked if I remember correctly? Lahore, Pakistan has grown about 400% since 1980 which means there are many pooly educated people from the countryside that have moved in and are also poorly integrated; bringing their backwardness with them. And the mob killing of Farkhunda Malikzada, in Kabul, Afghanistan due to the planted claims of a evil corrupt Imam? You’re right on. The entire country is a mob under the direction of clerics.
gravenimage says
Westman, certainly it is true that Muslims in general are poorly educated.
Still, I think this has more to do with Islam than with simple lack of education. After all, you don’t in most cases find as much violence in non-Muslim countries, even when the education level is very poor.
In any case, I hope apart from contemplating such atrocities that you are having a wonderful Christmas.
Westman says
Hi Graven. I see the education problem from another perspective, that is, the Imams don’t want the umma educated, especially women since that reduces their power. I see the ignorance in Muslim countries as self-imposed by Islam, in defiance of government reforms, and at its worst in outlying areas that have mostly tribal concerns.
I hope your Christmas was also memorable and spent with loved ones.
Strangely, though Agnostic, I could take no more of commercial Xmas. I turned off the commercial stuff, watched a Nativity play, a movie about the Life Of Christ, and found a Christmas music presentation from the Mormons. Then the wife and I discussed how Christianity laid the foundation that has given us a great life. It finally felt like Christmas.
ronyvo says
grave: I agree with you that the Islamic violence is due to Islam rather than lack of education. A mere reading of the Koran would clearly vouch for that. Islam is criminal and should be treated as such.
Karen says
Westman, your recount of your feelings about the true Christmas touch my heart. Merry Christmas to you and your wife (Westwoman), and a Happy New Year! ?
gravenimage says
Westman wrote:
Hi Graven. I see the education problem from another perspective, that is, the Imams don’t want the umma educated, especially women since that reduces their power. I see the ignorance in Muslim countries as self-imposed by Islam, in defiance of government reforms, and at its worst in outlying areas that have mostly tribal concerns.
…………………………….
This is *certainly* true, Westman.
More:
I hope your Christmas was also memorable and spent with loved ones.
…………………………….
We’re having a great time, thank you. We treat Christmas as a season, and celebrate through Epiphany.
More:
Strangely, though Agnostic, I could take no more of commercial Xmas. I turned off the commercial stuff, watched a Nativity play, a movie about the Life Of Christ, and found a Christmas music presentation from the Mormons. Then the wife and I discussed how Christianity laid the foundation that has given us a great life. It finally felt like Christmas.
…………………………….
That sounds lovely. While I tend to avoid the most commercial aspects of the season myself–it’s been a few years since I’ve been to a mall, and I’ve never seen the appeal of getting in line on Thanksgiving day for Black Friday sales, there are actually many parts of the secular Christmas celebration that I love.
Christmas trees, Santa Claus, Christmas lights and decorations, pinatas, decorated shop windows, Christmas songs–secular as well as sacred–all sorts of Christmas foods, including eggnog and Christmas cookies–all wonderful stuff.
One of the things I so love is that people are free to celebrate Christmas in any way they want–or not observe it at all, if they so desire.
All of this freedom, of course, is threatened under Islam.
gravenimage says
Thanks, ronyvo.
Elisa Naibed says
Sorry, Westman, but your speech is just blah-blah gnangnan! The heart of the problem is Islam and its message of hatred towards the rest of the world that Muslims must enslave and kill, as explained in the Qur’an. Whether the muzz is endowed with a certain intelligence or not, this message remains the same!
Westman says
You’re quite entitled to a one-fits-all. I do, however, think that the more intelligent are able to detect that there are intrinsic inconsistencies and reasons to doubt. And some of them, as evidenced by their comments here at JW, are able to escape despite youthful indoctrination.
Guy Forester says
It is a bit complex, but I think that you will find that if a big mob action occurs in a larger, more cosmopolitan city in a muslim country, it was most likely sanctioned by the government.
If any kind of mob gathers in an area inhabited by the ruling families and their supporters, the mob is quickly, and often violently dispersed. The organizers can end up at next week’s chop-chop square display.
The smaller towns may work similarly, but with more volatility. I can guarantee you, that as soon as more than 3 Copts headed to a mosque, the local cops would be there in great force, shoot first, and not even bother to ask questions.
J D S says
Once again and one more of thousands of reasons yo show that Islam is what it is…..biased and unyielding…..Compare how they are treated in the U.S. when it comes to building or repairing churches vs how Christians are treated in their countries. Wonder why the useless UN don’t weigh in on this…oh..because the UNis useless when it comes to important things. Islam ..most intolerable!
Peter says
Add to that the Islamic belief that bells scare away angels.
Westman says
And other low-intelligence ideas.
“They changed a prayer bead into a bell!”
“Uh…what bell? All I see is a trashed church.”
“It got bettah”.
Karen says
Seriously? That’s hysterically funny. I put that on the same intellectual level as camel urine being a refreshing health drink and black dogs being satanic. Mohammad seemed to target the most visible accessories of his rival religions (bells, music, art) and turn them into objects of offense.
mortimer says
Dhimmis who break the Sharia dhimmi laws or the break the Pact of Omar have become HARBI KAFIRS (enslaved nationals who are considered to be at war with Islam).
A dhimmi who thus breaks the Pact to live submitted under the rules of Islam becomes MUBAA (licit for vigilantism). Any Muslim may plunder, rape or kill a rebellious DHIMMI … his life, property, person and honor are all no longer protected.
mortimer says
No, JB, bad ideology. The people are no worse than you.
gravenimage says
Mortimer, people who adhere to an evil creed are indeed worse people than those who do not. It was just the same with Nazis.
Islam is an ideology, not a natural state.
CRUSADER says
This whole Dhimmi – tude has to go !
Manny says
It’s just sickening. What Muslims do to non-Muslims is sickening. Islam is sickening.
Karen says
“….that the church was established in 2002 after an agreement between the village’s Muslim and Christian populations, on the condition that it would be a small building for prayer, without a crucifix on display, not a dome, a bell, or a beacon….”
So, it’s just barely a church. Gee, thanks for the mere ‘tolerance’. Is this the standard set by that fabled civil rights hero, Mohammad, who set all the slaves free, elevated women to equality, and hugged all the infidels?
No, no, no, to Sharia in the West.
gravenimage says
Egypt: Security forces arrest 14 Muslims and three Christians over jihad attack on church
…………………..
See–Egypt really is “moderate”. After all, after Muslim attacks on Christians in places like Pakistan, they just arrest Christians.
God, I hate Islam.
LeftisruiningCanada says
“not a dome”
They outlaw Christians from using the traditional domed architecture of the Eastern churches, because islam also uses domed structures in their mosques.
This is a feature that the muslims originally copied from the Eastern churches.
Such is the mentality of islam.
gravenimage says
Yes–Muslims take from us, then not only claim it s their own, but if they can prevent us from using our own inventions.
Islam is parasitic.
Peter says
And any imam who incited this rabid crowd into action, what will their punishment be ?
The masters of the attack dogs that gave those orders will never be brought to task, for doing so would bring under scrutiny the undeniable connection between the imams’ hateful sermons and the violence perpetrated thereafter, a correlation that is witnessed every Friday in numerous places around the globe.
The viperous head of the snake remains untouched, free to commit the same hateful crimes next Friday.
MFritz says
And the 14 muslims will be released soon? Most likely…
WESTPAC Spy says
That’s generally how it works. The authorities tell the Christians if they don’t drop all the charges, and no doubt leave town. they’ll never see those three Christian hostages again.
gravenimage says
Probably so.
CRUSADER says
Indeed. Islam has borrowed from other cultures and examples — Muslims take credit for this where they can get away with doing so — shamelessly self-promoting while putting down others’ work — then Islam turns around to say no one has a right to copy what the Muslims have done, only to convert/revert…. Insane and Inane, but that’s Islam…
which is lame!
What a poor example for humanity to follow.
Time to either reform Islam completely or give it up entirely…
Whatever one eventually does, nonetheless… —- never give into it!
WPM says
The usual, Friday,s pray of hate at the Mosque mindless violence towards nonbelievers at conclusion of service. The same story plays at around world nothing to do with Islam!
lebel says
“If they violate these laws, they can lawfully be killed.”
Really? you can kill Christians for ringing churchbells? please provide a source for this specific statement.
WESTPAC Spy says
http://www.answering-islam.org/NonMuslims/rights.htm
” Sheik Najih Ibrahim Ibn Abdulla summarizes the purpose of the Jizya. He says, quoting Ibn Qayyim al-Jawziyya, that the Jizya is enacted:
“…TO SPARE THE BLOOD (of the Zimmis), to be a symbol of humiliation of the infidels and as an insult and punishment to them, and as the Shafi`ites indicate, the Jizya is offered in exchange for residing in an Islamic country.” Thus Ibn Qayyim adds, “Since the entire religion belongs to God, it aims at HUMILIATING ungodliness and its followers, and insulting them. Imposing the Jizya on the followers of ungodliness AND OPPRESSING THEM is required by God’s religion. The Qur’anic text hints at this meaning when it says: `until they give the tribute by force with humiliation.’ (Qur’an 9:29). What contradicts this is leaving the infidels to enjoy their might and practice their religion as they wish so that they would have power and authority.” ”
In addition to paying the jiizya, to avoid having your blood spilled (i.e. killed) the zimmi must be humiliated That means abiding by all the oppressive rules one’s Muslims masters impose on you. When it comes to the practice of religion that includes:
“2)
Zimmis are not allowed to pray or read their sacred books out loud at home or in churches, lest Muslims hear their prayers.
3)
Zimmis are not allowed to print their religious books or sell them in public places and markets. They are allowed to publish and sell them among their own people, in their churches and temples.
4)
Zimmis are not allowed to install the cross on their houses or churches since IT IS A SYMBOL OF INFIDELITY.
5)
Zimmis are not permitted to broadcast or display their ceremonial religious rituals on radio or television or to use the media or to publish any picture of their religious ceremonies in newspaper and magazines.
6)
Zimmis are not allowed to congregate in the streets during their religious festivals; rather, each must quietly make his way to his church or temple.”
Violate any of the rules and your life is forfeit because that is considered an act of infidelity i.e. rebellion against Muslim ruling authority. The Muslims are obligated by Islam to oppress non-Muslims; you can be killed for reading your Bible aloud because by breaking the rules you are refusing to be oppressed. That means you have violated the “contract of protection.” Church bells? You’ve got to be kidding.
gravenimage says
lebel is no doubt pretending that he is not familiar with the Pact of Umar, the ur document of dhimmitude:
We shall not build, in our cities or in their neighborhood, new monasteries, Churches, convents, or monks’ cells, nor shall we repair, by day or by night, such of them as fall in ruins or are situated in the quarters of the Muslims…
We shall not manifest our religion publicly nor convert anyone to it. We shall not prevent any of our kin from entering Islam if they wish it…
We shall not display our crosses or our books in the roads or markets of the Muslims. We shall use only clappers in our churches very softly. We shall not raise our voices when following our dead…
https://sourcebooks.fordham.edu/source/pact-umar.asp
And if anyone in the community breaks the dhimma–or is even rumored to have broken it–then all are fair game for Muslim violence.
That lebel is sneering at this on a story where Muslims attacked a church where Christians were rumored to be installing a bell shows how shameless he is.
Infidel says
Charmaing bastards… They hate Christians with a vengeance and yet beg to get into Christian countries..
Ibrahim itace muhammed says
mr Spencer, we having educating you that terrorism is a creation of evil United States through fascist evil Zionist state of Israel and Saudi Royal family to serve hegemonic agenda of evil United States. It has nothing to do with Islamic jihad taught and practiced by Prophet Muhammad. Eg, Boko Haram fighters in Nigeria include Christians as one captured Boko Haram commander was found to be a Christian and said many of his fighters are Christians. This is exactly what has happened in Egypt in this incidence you have reported. So, be honest and separate grains from chauf.Thanks
WESTPAC Spy says
I’m sorry. I’ve just have to say it. You’re an ignoraus. Terrorism isn’t a result of any US policy. It’s a result of Kemal Ataturk abolishing the Caliphate in 1924. That’s why Hassan al Banna founded the godfather of all terrorist groups in 1928. And precisely because only the Caliph can order jihad against the unbelievers that they needed a Caliph.
Surah 3:151
“WE WILL CAST TERROR INTO THE HEARTS of those who disbelieve for what they have associated with Allah of which He had not sent down [any] authority. And their refuge will be the Fire, and wretched is the residence of the wrongdoers.”
Surah 8:12
“[Remember] when your Lord inspired to the angels, “I am with you, so strengthen those who have believed. I WILL CAST TERROR INTO THE HEARTS of those who disbelieved, so strike [them] upon the necks and strike from them every fingertip.””
Sahih al-Bukhari – Book of Fighting for the Cause of Allah (Jihaad)
(122) Chapter: “I have been made victorious…”
” Narrated Abu Huraira:
Allah’s Messenger said, “I have been sent with the shortest expressions bearing the widest meanings, and I HAVE BEEN MADE VICTORIOUS WITH TERROR (cast in the hearts of the enemy), and while I was sleeping, the keys of the treasures of the world were brought to me and put in my hand.” Abu Huraira added: Allah’s Messenger has left the world and now you, people, are bringing out those treasures (i.e. the Prophet did not benefit by them).”
(I don’t give out “verses” as the “verse number varies by publisher, and even by different editions by the same publisher)
How do you and the other Muslims expect to educate anybody, Ibrahim, when you and the other Muslims who try to defend your miserable creed demonstrate you’re the ones who are the most ignorant about Islam? Just about anybody here knows more about Islam than you. You Muslims are the original crybullies. It’s always the fault of somebody else when you resort to what is clearly, by your own sources, is “divinely ordained violence. It’s never your fault is it? That’s how children think. And, based on your explanation, Muslims. But I repeat myself.
No, your twisted mind is a product of Islam. Your hatred of Jews is a product of Islam. the fact that you Muslims are constantly falling for the most obviously stupid conspiracy theories because you are irrational is a product of Islam. (right, there are Christians in Boko Haram; and they too want to drive the Christians out of Northern Nigeria. How stupid are you?) And even your twisted logic, where Muslims only become violent because somebody (especially the “evil joooz”) makes you is a product of Islam you perpetual infant.. And terror has everything to do with Islam. Your Allah commands it, and your “prophet” bragged about how he was made victorious by it.
WESTPAC Spy says
Seriously, Ibrahim? You actually think that there are Christian Boko Haram commanders and fighters. And they’re blowing up churches and kidnapping Christian schoolgirls and forcing them to convert to Islam? Because Boko Haram’s stated goal is to drive Christians out of Northern Nigeria. And you think Christians want to help with that. You’re really going to fall for that? What Islamic propaganda newspaper or website told you that?
No rational human being could fall for that. But then, you are a Muslim.
And, no, the Christians didn’t help the Muslims destroy the church. The police arrested the Christians as hostages. They always do, ignoramus. To force the other Christians in the village to drop any and all charges against the Muslims, and concede to whatever demands the Muslims make on them.
Again, the Egyptian police always do that whenever Muslims commit violence against Christians.
gravenimage says
The twisted Ibrahim itace muhammed wrote:
mr Spencer, we having educating you that terrorism is a creation of evil United States through fascist evil Zionist state of Israel and Saudi Royal family to serve hegemonic agenda of evil United States.
…………………………………………
Let’s parse this, shall we?
The United States and Israel are responsible for persecution of Christians in Dar-al-Islam, done on the basis of dhimmitude in Islam, which predates the existence of the US by 1200 years, and of modern Israel by over 1300 years.
Moreover, Americans and Israelis are able to affect what happens in a small town deep in the Muslim world, in a place that has no more than an estimated 6-20 surviving Jews in the whole country. Uh huh…
More:
It has nothing to do with Islamic jihad taught and practiced by Prophet Muhammad.
…………………………………………
Given that Ibrahim itace muhammed *himself* has said that everyone who fails to submit to Islam can be murdered, that Infidels can be enslaved, and who looks forward to the genocide of the Jews, I’d like to see exactly how this is different.
Of course, Ibrahim itace muhammed will never say.
More:
Eg, Boko Haram fighters in Nigeria include Christians as one captured Boko Haram commander was found to be a Christian and said many of his fighters are Christians.
…………………………………………
Uh…right. Even though the head of Boko Haram has vowed to kill all Christians.
More:
This is exactly what has happened in Egypt in this incidence you have reported. So, be honest and separate grains from chauf.Thanks
…………………………………………
So–let’s get this straight: all of the Muslims in this town are actually Christian, and they are attacking Christians for building a church, something only Muslims would take issue with on Islamic grounds.
And why would these bad Christians do this? No doubt to make Islam look bad. Perhaps in addition the victims were really Muslims, so, far from this being a Muslim attack on Christians, it was an American and Israeli Christian attack on Muslims building a glorious new mosque!
I think everyone here is quite capable of “separate grains from chauf”, thank you very much…
Ibrahim itace muhammed says
poor Ignorant westpac spy, you cannot understand the Quranic styles. The term “Ruuba” doesn’t mean terrorism by way of indiscriminate killings of innocent non-muslims. It means within the context that Allah will caste fear in the minds of combatant unbelievers confronting Muslim forces. It is part of military tactics Allah is teaching Muslims. that is why Prophet Muhammad said war is a deception, Eg you give an impression to confronting enemy that you have superior weapons. United States and defunct Soviet Union used it during Cold War.
WESTPAC Spy says
No, I understand perfectly. In the ahadith Muhammad taught that anyone who equipped a jihadi or took care of his family while he was gone shared in his reward. Such a person had just as great a reward as the jihadi himself.
By the same token anyone who equips a non-Muslim fighting Muslims also has just as great a “reward.”
That means western taxpayers funding non-Muslim forces are not “innocent” in the eyes of Islamic jurists.
Seriously, dude, learn your religion. It’s not just in the Quran.
gravenimage says
Ibrahim itace muhammed has already said that anyone who fails to submit to Islam is not innocent, and can be killed. So who are these “innocent non-Muslims” he’s referring to?
WESTPAC Spy says
Hey, here’s a thought. Why don’t you tell the terrorists that they don’t understand the term Ruuba. Because they think it means the same thing I do.
As long as they think the word means what I think it means, I’m right about your religion and you’re wrong.
WESTPAC Spy says
Here’s another thought. It’s precisely because the Palestinians understand the command the commands to commit terror as meaning indiscriminately kill non-combatants that they deliberately target Israeli women and children. Any Jew of any age is a legitimate target.
You know, the evil Zionists you hate so much.
And do remember Beslan? Were the children in that the Chechens slaughtered in that elementary school combatants?
And I’ve read the writings of Al Zawahiri and Bin Laden. They’re not stupid men. They cite considerable religious authority for everything they did. Including flying planes into office buildings where there wasn’t a single combatant. But they didn’t consider them innocent.
Why don’t you go explain to those people how ignorant they are about Quranic terms?
Otherwise you’re a joke.
Ibrahim itace muhammed says
westpac, you lied. it is fascist evil Zionist state of Israel that targets palestinian women and children on daily basis .Check UN report on Human Right abuses by the evil state of Israel. why you people do not want talk about such atrocities being committed by evil Zionists?
gravenimage says
Is Ibrahim itace muhammed admitting that he was in favlamor of the atrocity at Beslan? It would not surprise me.
And, of course, Israel does not target women and children. In fact, they go to great lengths to protect them, despite cowardly Jihadists using them as human shields.
Anyway, Ibrahim itace muhammed has said that Infidels do not have any right to defend against Jihad.
WESTPAC Spy says
Thanks for demonstrating you’ve been lying all along, Ibrahim.A UN report? You might as well ask me to look at an Organization of Islamic Cooperation report. Who do you think is writing those reports if not the largest voting block in the UN, fool, if not the largest voting block at the UN? It’s the OIC. You obviously believe that propaganda but then you’ve got a sick, twisted mind. Because that’s the only kind of mind Islam can produce. I understand perfectly what the Quran says and I didn’t believe a word you said. And and in typical Islamic fashion you had to lie to cover for your co-religionists. And I knew I could expose you.
It just goes to show how the “moderate Muslim” is a myth. You may not be a terrorist, but you’re on their side.
Despicable.
Yes, gi, Israel does not target women and children. Israel goes so far as to call people by cell phone or landline and tell them to leave a building if they’re going to target it. And then Hamas will force them to stay inside for the propaganda shots of their dead bodies.
As far as Hamas is concerned a child’s life is worth no more than a tweet.
Hamas will use hospitals as command and control centers so that if Israel targets it there will be plenty of dead bodies. They us UNRWA schools as arsenals.
Hamas commits war crimes every day. The first principle of the Law Of Armed Conflict (LOAC) is distinction. Combatants must distinguish themselves from non-combatants. Hamas, and other cowardly Islamic “fighters” deliberately do the opposite. They deliberately use non-combatants as human shields so when Israel hits a target they get the propaganda shots.
And gullible. irrational fools like Ibrahim fall for it. Just like groups like Hamas knew they would.
So, yes, it’s safe to say he supports suicide bombers in Jerusalem and the atrocity at Beslan.
,
WESTPAC Spy says
“why you people do not want talk about such atrocities being committed by evil Zionists?”
Because it’s pointless, you witless fool. Look at my earlier post.
“Just about anybody here knows more about Islam than you. You Muslims are the original crybullies. It’s always the fault of somebody else when you resort to what is clearly, by your own sources, is “divinely ordained violence. It’s never your fault is it? That’s how children think. And, based on your explanation, Muslims. But I repeat myself.
No, your twisted mind is a product of Islam. Your hatred of Jews is a product of Islam. the fact that you Muslims are constantly falling for the most obviously stupid conspiracy theories because you are irrational is a product of Islam. And even your twisted logic, where Muslims only become violent because somebody (especially the “evil joooz”) makes you is a product of Islam you perpetual infant.. And terror has everything to do with Islam. Your Allah commands it, and your “prophet” bragged about how he was made victorious by it.”
Your prophet was right. All war is deceit. But who was he fighting when he said it? Arabs. I don’t know if you’re an Arab. But you’ve been Arabized, Ibrahim itace Muhammad. Your prophet was talking about deceiving you. And you’ve been thoroughly deceived.
We’ westerners aren’t so easily fooled because we’ve learned to believe a word you say. And you’ve proven me right.
WESTPAC Spy says
*We’ve learned NOT to believe a word you say.*
gravenimage says
Good posts, WESTPAC Spy.
Bill C. says
Under Sharia law Christians and Jews are permitted to follow their faiths as non-Muslim subjects that agree to ‘willingly pay’ the Jizya or tribute in exchange for protection and safety, and are subject to all Islamic laws. Non-Muslims are not allowed to testify against Muslims in court (Qur’an verses 3:110, 4:141). Among the laws they are regularly accused of breaking are blasphemy of Islam or Muhammad and Ghiba (slander). Ghiba means to mention anything concerning a Muslim that he would dislike, “whether about his religion, body, everyday life, self, disposition, property, son, father, wife, servant, turban, garment, gait, movements, smiling, dissoluteness, frowning, cheerfulness, or anything else connected with him”. (‘Umdat al-Salik, r2.2) It doesn’t say anything about these ‘disliked’ statements having to be true or false only that one has to dislike it being exposed or alleged. (Reliance of the Traveller r2) “One must go on jihad at least once a year. One may use a catapult against them when they are in a fortress, even if among them are women and children. One may set fire to them or drown them. If Jews and Christians are enslaved, their marriage is revoked. One may cut down their trees and must destroy their useless books. Jihadists may take as booty whatever they decide.”
WESTPAC Spy says
I’m sort of sorry Ibrahim hasn’t come back. I enjoyed setting an ambush for him and seeing him walk right in.
In case you don’t want to slog through the whole mess, and in terms even Ibrahim might be able to understand if he were remotely rational, I mentioned two verses of the Quran where Allah talks about striking terror into the hearts of the unbelievers. Indeed, one commands it. And then how in Sahih al Bukhari in the Book on Fighting in the Cause of Allah how Muhammad says “I have been made victorious through terror.”
Of course, I’m just an ignorant infidel, and he corrected me:
“poor Ignorant westpac spy, you cannot understand the Quranic styles. The term “Ruuba” doesn’t mean terrorism by way of indiscriminate killings of innocent non-muslims. It means within the context that Allah will caste fear in the minds of combatant unbelievers confronting Muslim forces.”
I went to explain how per the Islamic sources it isn’t just for the battlefield, and there is no such thing as an innocent non-Muslim. So we went back and forth, and I demanded to know why he was lecturing me about how I was getting it wrong, and not those who were targeting among a whole laundry list of non-combatants Israeli women and children. If terror tactics are only to be used on the battlefield against combatant non-Muslims then they’re getting it wrong.
After a little more back and forth he admitted I was right all along:
“westpac, you lied. it is fascist evil Zionist state of Israel that targets palestinian women and children on daily basis ”
Exactly. Because of the “fascist evil Zionist state of Israel” all Jews are legitimate targets as far as Muslims are concerned. And indiscriminate terror tactics can be used against all of them. Even women and children.
Ibrahim, that is what I was saying all along. I’m glad you finally admitted that deep down you always agreed with me.
gravenimage says
And yet, Ibrahim itace muhammed has said in the past that any Infidel who does not submit to Islam is “fighting Muslims”, so his supposed distinction is a false one.
He has also said that Infidels have no right to defend themselves against Jihad, even by speaking out against it.
WESTPAC Spy says
“poor Ignorant westpac spy, you cannot understand the Quranic styles. The term “Ruuba” doesn’t mean terrorism by way of indiscriminate killings of innocent non-muslims. It means within the context that Allah will caste fear in the minds of combatant unbelievers confronting Muslim forces.”
Muslims say the funniest things, don’t they?