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Hugh Fitzgerald: The Saudis and the Killing of Jamal Khashoggi (Part One)

Oct 16, 2018 7:52 am By Hugh Fitzgerald

Jamal Khashoggi, a well-known Saudi journalist, went to the Saudi Arabian consulate in Istanbul on October 2 to fill out some paperwork pertaining to his marriage — he was in the process of divorcing  his Saudi wife so that he might then marry his Turkish fiancé. He entered the building  at 1:14 p..m., and has not been seen since. His fiancé had been waiting outside the consulate for what was supposed to have been a short visit; when he failed to appear,  the police were summoned. The Saudis at the consulate claimed not to know what had happened to Khashoggi. From Riyadh, Crown Prince Mohammad bin Salman insisted that Khashoggi left soon after visiting the consulate. King Salman assured President Trump that his government had nothing to do with Khashoggi’s disappearance. Now the Saudis have decided to tell their latest version of the truth. They claim that Khashoggi died during an “interrogation gone wrong.”

On that same day, October 2, fifteen Saudis arrived in Istanbul in the morning, and departed, on two different flights, the same evening. Or at least that’s the story. There are videotapes of Saudis arriving at the airport, but to complicate matters, it seems that some of those videotapes are five years old. Meanwhile, the Turks claim to have proof that Khashoggi was killed inside the Embassy. They say they have tapes on which the alleged audio evidence is particularly strong, according to officials.

“You can hear his voice and the voices of men speaking Arabic,” a source told the Washington Post. “You can hear how he was interrogated, tortured and then murdered.” CCTV cameras provide videotapes of a black van that left the Saudi Consulate that afternoon and went to the home of the Saudi Consul General. The Turks initially claimed the body was dismembered with a bone saw; among the Saudis who arrived that day was an autopsy expert well-versed in such dismemberment. The world media is of course titillated by the story: what did they then do with the pieces? Burn them, so that nothing was left but ashes and bone? Would the ashes have been flushed down the toilet? Would the pieces of bone have been cut up into ever smaller pieces that, divvied up among the 15 Saudis, could be disposed of discreetly around Istanbul or even at the airport, or packed in diplomatic pouches and flown to Saudi Arabia? Or did they bury the body in the garden of the Consul General? No one yet knows, but the “Pulp Fiction” and “Goodfellas” aspect of all this is riveting.

But let’s get back to what this killing demonstrates. It demonstrates that Saudi Arabia has only contempt for the outside world, and no intention of changing its brutal ways no matter what others think. All sorts of Western big shots have now pulled out of the “Davos in the Desert” three-day economic summit to be held in Saudi Arabia in early November. Among them are Richard Branson, the CEO’s of Viacom and Uber, the heads of JP Morgan, Blackstone, BlackRock, the owner of the Los Angeles Times, the creator of the Android Mobile Device, the creator of Crispr, and many others. This will have little effect on the Saudis. If Western companies want to engage in virtue-signaling, and lose billions in investments, both in and from Saudi Arabia, the Crown Prince can live with that. Besides, there is always China, ready to sell weapons to the Saudis (as Trump has noted), and to make, and receive, Saudi investments.

The killing may, however, have a salutary effect on the American government’s view of Saudi Arabia. The Saudis were largely protected during the investigation of the 9/11 attacks; 15 of the 19 hijackers were Saudis, but through it all, Saudi Arabia remained our “friend” and ally. They sold us their oil at the market price, doing us no favors, but because Saudi Arabia was the “swing” producer, and when, purely for reasons of economic self-interest, the Saudis raised or lowered production so as to lower or raise the price of oil, we were always naively grateful. The Saudis have a stake not just in current oil revenues, but in maximizing the value of  the billions of barrels they have in the ground. They are not doing us favors. They calculate their ideal price for oil, at any time, based on the likely effect on consumers, who may switch to other sources of energy, and on energy producers, who if the price is high enough may search for new oil supplies or extract oil already found, using innovative techniques. The Saudis cannot forget fracking, and what that did to oil prices.

When the Saudis allowed American troops to be based on on Saudi soil, this was presented as doing us a favor, though it was the Americans who were protecting the Saudis, not the other way round.

The alliance with Saudi Arabia continues until today. When the Saudis bomb Yemeni civilians indiscriminately, our government says nothing. After all, the Saudis are waging a proxy war against Iran, and that is reason enough for the Americans to keep quiet. But now we have a moment of high drama, conflicting tales, and Murder Most Foul. Had the Saudis managed to lure Khashoggi back to Saudi Arabia, they could have promptly jailed him for 10, 20, 50 years, or even life, and there would have been only a feeble bleat of protest, but nothing like what has happened after his murder in Istanbul.

It’s the cinematic aspect of the whole thing: the tape of Khashoggi walking serenely into the consulate, unaware of any danger, with his fiancé waiting outside. He is never seen again. We see those grainy shots of 15 Saudis who arrive at the airport, on two different private planes, that same day, and who have apparently been recorded — the Turks say they have the tapes — interrogating, torturing, and killing him. Those same 15 Saudis leave that evening at two different times, on two different planes. The whole thing is straight out of Hollywood.

Crown Prince Mohammed (MbS) is often thought of as a proponent of major change. Yes, women can now drive in Saudi Arabia, thanks to the Crown Prince. Yes, the cinemas, closed in 1979, have reopened, thanks to the Crown Prince. Yes, the forward-looking Crown Prince has made big plans for building three new Saudi cities from scratch: one an Economic City for businesses, especially high-tech companies and start-ups, another for Entertainment, and a third intended to be a Muslim-friendly Tourist City, so that the Saudis and other rich Arabs can spend more of their money at home. With the help of a small army of Washington lobbyists, on whom Saudi Arabia spent $27 million last year, and on media consultants from all over, the Crown Prince has been presented as the young reformer of a sclerotic system, and many in the West have accepted this carefully-cultivated image.

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Filed Under: Featured, Hugh Fitzgerald, Saudi Arabia Tagged With: Jamal Khashoggi


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Comments

  1. Hindu American says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 7:59 am

    Excellent write up, RS. Most folks on the liberal side will ignore the fact that Jamal Khashoggi was an islamist and member of the muslim brotherhood, hobnobbed with osama bin laden, traveled through Afghanistan with the taliban, and was the nephew of a well known arms dealer Adnan Khashoggi. The Turks are not clean in this affair either. They are in a way, complicit. Now they are milking the saudis (for cheaper loans and oil). These guys are cut from the same cloth.

    • Terry Gain says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 10:38 am

      This is their role model. The media’s outrage is amusing.

      https://wikiislam.net/wiki/List_of_Killings_Ordered_or_Supported_by_Muhammad

    • Mac-101 says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 11:22 am

      So is there any support for to the claim that Khashoggi was plottin/did plot to kill the Crown Prince? Also why did he need a divorce? Can’t you just text her three times and say you divorce her? Dat’s a heck of a lot easier!
      .
      Lastly, I do NOT like the Saudis, but I’d rather have them on our side for now than empower the Muslim Brotherhood to take over; or the Crown Prince throw in with the Chi-Coms. If I was an immoral bloodthirsty scum like the Saudis I’d seriously think about goin RED than DEAD. Of course when the Chi-Coms rule the world it wouldn’t be Purdy for these Moon worshipers either!

      • gravenimage says

        Oct 16, 2018 at 4:40 pm

        Mac, with all respect, the vicious Saudis are *not* on our side.

        • Mac-101 says

          Oct 16, 2018 at 9:22 pm

          Of course they are NOT. However they work to defeat us long term, not short term as the Muslim Brotherhood. Also THEY know the Chi-Coms would eat them alive and spit em out. In 10 moe years the Red Chinese will own Africa. They are already settin the pieces in place.
          .
          I find it amusing that the world media, especially the American one are out to destroy the Royal Family when we ALL know the end result. CAN YOU SAY Libya WITH mega bucks?
          .
          This is especially ironic when there appears to be some softening of their Wahhabis and they appear to have worked with Israel for several years now. So for Israel and Jews world wide it would be best to keep the status quo for now.
          .
          I can fully see the Chi-Coms movin in and the Russian supporting the Shia and once they control ALL the ME and Africa, eradicating them ALL! It would be child’s play with modern weaponry and Biological agents. Each country has already murdered over 100 million of their own people in the 20th century. How many people live in Africa and the ME?

        • Mac-101 says

          Oct 16, 2018 at 10:08 pm

          In addition, if the Turks are tellin the truth that they have an audio of the entire thing and an I-Phone watch will NOT transmit through the Embassy walls into the parkin lot, did the Turks send him in with a super wire up his butt to record everything knowin he would be dealt with harshly? Perhaps he even acted up so THEY could tape it and use it against the Crown Prince?
          .
          Also surely the SA Intel would be smart enough to destroy the watch immediately or send it out the back door to be tracked recorded elsewhere . This is just so crazy! If the SA Intel Agencies are this stupid perhaps they need to contract it out to the Mossad. LOL!

      • Ren says

        Oct 17, 2018 at 11:27 am

        Mac-101 – you and Hindu American are so right. I do not feel sorry for this evil JK.
        He wanted to assassin MBS. I am glad MBS is the ruler of SA.

        • Mac-101 says

          Oct 17, 2018 at 2:39 pm

          It’s really hard to know what is the truth, impossible in fact. But if this was recorded it was NOT by an I-Watch. He either had a state of the art wire up his butt or a Muslim Brotherhood Bro was inside and set up the Crown Prince.
          .
          Muslims murder Muslims and Infidels daily, why so much outrage now? Especially when one considers this Prince is SUPPOSEDLY attemptin to modernize SA and has a good workin relation with Israel’s Defense and Mossad.
          .
          So why are the Elite Globalist and MSM workin this so hard when they ignore so much else? SA is as much a temporary friend of Israel as you can git in the ME. Why do THEY want to destroy Israel?

        • gravenimage says

          Oct 17, 2018 at 9:14 pm

          I doubt very much that Khashoggi was out to assassinate the Saudi prince. His being critical of the royal family was likely enough.

    • gravenimage says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 4:40 pm

      A small point, Hindu American, but the author of this piece is Hugh Fitzgerald, not Robert Spencer.

    • Paul Klee says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 11:18 pm

      So why didn’t Hugh mention this? Has he gone daft? Given the choice between the Muslim Brotherhood and MBS, I’ll take MBS.

      • gravenimage says

        Oct 17, 2018 at 9:16 pm

        No, Hugh Fitzgerald has not “gone daft”. This is part one of several pieces–he is not apt to mention every particular in each piece.

    • Ren Ostertag says

      Oct 17, 2018 at 11:22 am

      Agree with you 100 %. This J. Kashoggi was not a nice person at all.

  2. christianblood says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 8:05 am

    America’s pro-Saudi and dollar-worshiping SATANIC neocons are covering for their head-chopping, barbaric (Saudi=ISIS) allies!

    https://sputniknews.com/world/201810161068928459-pompeo-king-investigation/

    • Hari Singh says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 4:31 pm

      The Saudis have one virtue, the hate the Iranians. With the elimination of Iraq the only Arab nation capable in the Middle East in stopping Iran’s Shia Revolution is Saudi Arabia and they are a poor second.If the Western allies could have the Soviets as allies in WW2 well then the Saudis will have to do as well. Politics stinks.

      • Mac-101 says

        Oct 16, 2018 at 9:24 pm

        Well said. The Saudis work at destroyin us Long Term, The Shia short Term.

  3. Rob Crawford says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 8:10 am

    You believe Erdogan? Why?

    • christianblood says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 8:14 am

      Rob Crawford

      I know what the murderous, head-chopping Saudis are capable of!

      Saudis=ISIS! More below:

      https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DnnnOAKWsAE1cN1.jpg

      • Rob Crawford says

        Oct 16, 2018 at 8:20 am

        Erdogan supported and profited from ISIS; so, again, neither side is particularly credible.

    • Rob Crawford says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 8:18 am

      And note that the link about the Saudis supposedly saying it was an interrogation gone wrong says nothing of the sort. It says two unnamed sources say the Saudis are going to make that claim. No doubt Ben Rhodes’ Iranian fiction operation has chimed in on this.

      No, I don’t particularly like the Saudis, but there’s no reason to buy Turkey’s claims, either. Their claims are the sensationalistic crap that the Arab street laps up like it was manna from heaven.

      • christianblood says

        Oct 16, 2018 at 8:28 am

        Rob Crawford

        You are right, along with the US, France, UK, Qatar and Saudi Arabia, Erdogan supported ISIS and Al-Qaeda terrorists that are fighting in Syria against Assad and let hundreds of thousands of them get through his border to fight their jihad against Assad. However, Erdogan changed his course when he was stabbed in the back by the US by instigating a Gulenist/Islamist Coup against him in the summer of 2016! More below:

        https://www.globalresearch.ca/erdogans-checkmate-cia-backed-coup-in-turkey-fails-upsets-global-chessboard/5538735

    • Hari Singh says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 4:33 pm

      Old Cossack saying,”Put your faith in two things, God and the sword. Put your faith in God in your heart and the sword in the Turk.”Erdogan is a slick customer, beware.

      • Mark Swan says

        Oct 16, 2018 at 10:28 pm

        Absolutely Hari Singh.

        The Media has played this-up to rattle President Trump—let us hope
        he does not feel a need to get involved with this, in any way.

    • gravenimage says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 4:48 pm

      According to CNN, the Saudis are admitting to this murder:

      “Saudis preparing to admit Khashoggi was killed”

      https://www.cnn.com/videos/world/2018/10/15/jamal-khashoggi-saudis-statement-interrogation-damon-nr-vpx.cnn

  4. LB says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 9:21 am

    HOLD UP! I’m not following this story because I don’t care (Saudis vs Turks, both are equally repulsive), but this part got me intrigued:

    “…he was in the process of divorcing his Saudi wife so that he might then marry his Turkish fiancé”

    Are you saying he couldn’t have done it with a tripple-talaq? But then again, he may not have been a muslim. Look at him: neatly trimmed mustache and goatee. If that’s the case, then killing a non-muslim journalist who can potentially leak vital info is a no-brainer for the Saudis. Anyone got more info on this?

    • LB says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 9:24 am

      Also, if he’s a muslim he would’ve just taken his fiance as a second wife no problem. So yeah, definitely not a muslim.

      • Terry Gain says

        Oct 16, 2018 at 10:41 am

        Sure. He’s a Muslim Brotherhood operative, but definitely not a Muslim.

        • LB says

          Oct 17, 2018 at 1:11 pm

          Did not know he had MB ties. I stand corrected.

    • TWG says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 4:20 pm

      LB
      moslem females are forbidden to marry non moslems. He is (was) either a moslem, or a very recent convert to ‘something else’.

    • gravenimage says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 5:00 pm

      Khashoggi was a Muslim–he had links to the Muslim Brotherhood, in fact.

      • LB says

        Oct 17, 2018 at 1:09 pm

        I see. Thanks for the info. Still though, why didn’t he just either tripple-talaq his first wife or simply took his fiance as a second wife? Why go through the infidel divorce process filled with tedious paperwork that usually tends to favor women? He could be secular and just a muslim in name (he definitely looks secular), but that doesn’t fit if he has muslim broderhood ties (which explains his non-muslim look given that MB agents are disguising as Westerners).

        This leads me to the only logical conclusion that his original motive for going into the Saudi consulate — divorcing his wife — is false.

  5. Renate says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 10:15 am

    As much as I wish that this is all just one big lie that Erdogan has perpetrated to make the Saudis look bad, if Khashoggi walked into the Saudi consulate and never walked out again, who else would have been in the consulate besides Saudis?

    • Terry Gain says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 10:45 am

      The Saudis look bad all by themselves.

      • Renate says

        Oct 16, 2018 at 2:36 pm

        After this turn of events, I think you’re right.

  6. vlparker says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 10:30 am

    Sounds like MbS is learning from Putin. Take out your journalist critics.

    “The killing may, however, have a salutary effect on the American government’s view of Saudi Arabia.”

    I hope so. It certainly should. If so, it’s a win-win for the US, since Khashoggi was a muslim brother.

    https://www.frontpagemag.com/point/271613/media-forgets-mention-jama-khashoggi-was-muslim-daniel-greenfield

    ” The Saudis were largely protected during the investigation of the 9/11 attacks; 15 of the 19 hijackers were Saudis, but through it all, Saudi Arabia remained our “friend” and ally.”

    Thanks to Bush perfidy.

  7. Terry Gain says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 10:49 am

    The Media’s outrage over the killing by KSA of Khashoggi, a Muslim Brotherhood operative posing as a journalist, is amusing given that Saudi Arabia routinely kills homosexuals for the “crime” of being homosexual and the fact that Islam’s perfect man and role model was a mass murderer.

    • gravenimage says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 5:12 pm

      All of this is hideous. The Saudis did not murder Khashoggi because he was a pious Muslim–which he was–but because he was critical of them.

      • underbed cat says

        Oct 17, 2018 at 12:41 am

        He then would be critical of islamic law… which is considered slander, which carries a death penalty at times..I think he was aware it could happen but didn’t expect it, it is very oppressive and half the country is unaware it is making inroads in the U..S. and dangerous.

        • gravenimage says

          Oct 17, 2018 at 9:24 pm

          Not necessarily. I have seen nothing to indicate that Khashoggi had a problem with Islamic law. I think he mostly just wanted his own faction in power.

  8. cjk says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 11:19 am

    Sure the Saudis are murderers, but so are the Turks. In this case they killed an enemy of the USA. Everything considered the USA should do absolutely nothing about all this. The Turks are a far greater enemy anyway. We owe these people nothing

    • vlparker says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 12:22 pm

      We should declare that both are Islamic supremacist states and neither one is an ally of the US.

      • gravenimage says

        Oct 16, 2018 at 6:09 pm

        Spot on, vlparker.

  9. Buraq says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 12:10 pm

    Every 20 minutes, 500 sq meters of photo-voltaic panels are added to the US stock. The largest employer of new jobs in the US is in the energy field of renewables. Recently, the price of one unit of power in the US generated by renewables dipped below the unit price of conventional power generation.

    The Saudis and their oil are on the way out. Technology is making them outdated. These clowns will soon be back to treading their way across sand dunes with their camels when the oil bubble really bursts.

    • gravenimage says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 6:10 pm

      The Saudis are also running out of oil.

    • peter says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 11:13 pm

      For the sake of non muslim world I pray that day will come very soon God willing that is !

  10. FYI says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 12:36 pm

    well,I’m sure he’s now with allah and his “prophet”,perfect mo the merciless, in the Arabic-only speaking paradise where muslims go.

    It must be awkward to discover the truth about koran 3:54:that allah is the “best of deceivers”
    What must that be like..

    “You thought you were certain to go to some carnal paradise.That’s funny! muhammed had the same delusion..there was a BIG clue in the name…”the BEST of deceivers” haha..you’ve been had!
    TALAQ!(3 times)”

    • Thubten says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 6:33 pm

      “You thought you were certain to go to some carmal paradise “
      That should be “camel paradise “ FYI

  11. Raja says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 12:45 pm

    The US president called the incident “some rogue elements might be involved in the killing”. Does raise more questions than answers.

    The Saudis have been a holy cow for a long time, in spite of their involvement in Sep 11 terror and mass murder, they are still untouchable in terms of their clout.

    When will the world look seriously into alternate energy and cutting them to size? As of now, Trump has lost a golden opportunity to discipline the Saudi kingdom.

  12. Guy Forester says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 1:46 pm

    First, thanks to all of you that included the info of Kashoggi being a MB operative, and related to the notorious arms dealer, who is an uncle.

    I strongly suspect that AK crossed someone, and it is not the criticizing of MBS that was the real reason for offing him. Since the Turks appear to have been well aware of what was transpiring, and no doubt the CIA/FBI and US military intelligence, this guy was a marked man. Maybe it was double dealing arms and procuring them for the Houthi rebels, or Iran, or anti Saud factions in the KSA. The only reason Turkey is putting pressure on the KSA is to most likely squeeze some baksheesh out of them to prop up the economy since the collapse of the Lira.

    Otherwise, here is my take on how this will play out:

    The hit squad are most likely trusted members of the Saud or a closely related clan. Since there is no such thing as a free and independent press, and the courts are sharia derived, there will be no open and independent investigation or trial.

    In my opinion, this will end up one of two ways:
    1. King pardons the team in the name of compassion after an appropriate blood money offer is accepted by the family, wife, and fiancé. Of course, they will probably be advised to accept as it will help ensure a long and healthy life. BTW, this is legal and accepted in the KSA.

    2. Enemies of the House of Saud will instead be named as the perps, and after a show trial, quickly sent to Chop Chop Square. Since dead men tell no tales, the affair will be swept under the rug.

    • gravenimage says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 7:25 pm

      No, the US is not whacking journalists–not even those with Muslim Brotherhood ties. Just calumny.

      • Guy Forester says

        Oct 17, 2018 at 12:58 am

        I suspect that although the US would not and did not participate in the disappearance of AK, intel people probably knew something nefarious was in the pipeline. Overall, I see no compelling reason for the US to get involved in these Muslim v Muslim vendettas, clan wars, tribe wars, and Sunni v Shia wars.

  13. yoseliani says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 2:41 pm

    Khashoggi was a member of the terrorist organisation , the Muslim Brotherhood. So good riddance.

    • Ren says

      Oct 17, 2018 at 11:38 am

      Yes Yoseliani – good riddance!

  14. PATRICIA KOENIG says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 3:29 pm

    I don’t know why anyone cares that a Muslim was killed by another Muslim in a Muslim country.

    • gravenimage says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 7:33 pm

      Khashoggi–for good or ill–was a columnist for an American newspaper.

      • Jasmine says

        Oct 16, 2018 at 10:47 pm

        Khashoggi was a MB journo- list for a yellow rag, in my opinion. The saudis execute foreigners in their country (Filipino domestics) for witchcraft (Christianity). Routinely. Homosexuals executed. Whatever caused this atrocity, it’s not outlier behavior and the devil is in the details. No need to be distracted by this cover for something bigger.

        • gravenimage says

          Oct 17, 2018 at 11:32 pm

          I didn’t say this was outlier behavior–it is grimly perfectly Islamic.

      • underbed cat says

        Oct 17, 2018 at 12:18 am

        I wonder how much SA or the similar 56 countries in the U.N., invests in American media…they need the to clear up misconceptions about the the true nature of the ideas they promote and often carry out…that puts the ideology in a bad light….that even their lawyers can’t hide. They need to continuously move toward the goal of removing the west from civilization, religion and a sticky constitution of freedoms, free speech and law and to claim U.S, is now a new caliphate. Unless we wake up to the true doctrine sharia. If a jihadist magazine claims Las Vegas, that cannot be accepted because isis said it, it is better if no one believes it….and the national security is forbidden to say it. A detergent so to speak, or the MB.speak. An illusion just like the words, peaceful, tolerant or justice.

    • Midniterider says

      Oct 17, 2018 at 8:29 am

      I waiting to care,but……………………………………..No,guess I don’t and won’t.

  15. Sam says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 10:00 pm

    Well the only thing I do not get is Saudis can not be that stupid to kill a reporter in their embassy in another country. I know that they are getting away with a lot of crap like funding the Islamic agenda and mosques in US but this is a crime so obvious that would not be expected by any government except ISIS as they want to advertise their terror.

    Something does not add up but I do not know what

    • gravenimage says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 10:04 pm

      They felt emboldened.

    • Mac-101 says

      Oct 16, 2018 at 10:11 pm

      Exactly. The Saudi Intel Agencies need contracted out to the Paki ISI or if they want a real professional agency to handle their work the Mossad. LOL!

  16. Lydia Church says

    Oct 16, 2018 at 11:26 pm

    Eagerly awaiting the details of exactly HOW it went wrong…..
    let me guess… he did not answer to their liking so they lost their tempers with
    1000 knives!

  17. underbed cat says

    Oct 17, 2018 at 12:26 am

    SA and Turkey rivals.

    • Guy Forester says

      Oct 17, 2018 at 1:03 am

      Arab v Turk rivalry that is centuries old. Saudi claim to the Islamic Holy places is a point of contention I am sure. The Turks, Persians, and Egyptians would all jump at the chance to roll into Riyadh, Mecca, and Medina. Unfortunately, they would need to roll through Israel to get there, and none of them are capable.

  18. Badger says

    Oct 17, 2018 at 11:00 am

    Nothing to do with me, or the British government I hope. Khashoggi was a member of the muslim Brotherhood, a friend of Bin Laden and an islamist. Why should I care what happens in this latest episode of Carry on Killing?

    And if we don’t sell them arms then the Russians and Chinese will.

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