Australian Grand Mufti Ibrahim Abu Mohamed and “a group of other senior Muslim figures” said that Morrison’s remarks “which infer that the community is collectively culpable for the criminal actions of individuals and should be doing more to prevent such acts of violence.”
This is a common dodge, but it has no substance. Morrison isn’t saying that the Muslim community is “collectively culpable for the criminal actions of individuals.” He is simply being realistic, in a way that the Muslim leaders are not, about the fact that mainstream Islamic texts and teachings incite Muslims to commit acts of violence against non-Muslims. This doesn’t make the Muslim community collectively responsible for jihad activity, but it does give them a responsibility to address those texts and teachings and work honestly to find ways to minimize their capacity to incite violence.
Instead, however, they are whining and claiming victim status, a strategy we have seen Muslim leaders apply only about fifty million times in the last decade: “These statements have achieved nothing to address underlying issues, but rather, have alienated large segments of the Muslim community.”
Yes, ok, but jihad violence, combined with your dishonesty in the wake of that violence, alienates large segments of the non-Muslim community.
“Australia PM, Muslim leaders spar over his terror comments,” AFP, November 21, 2018:
Australian Muslim leaders on Wednesday said they would boycott a meeting with Prime Minister Scott Morrison after he said they needed to do more to halt terror attacks in the country.
Morrison singled out Muslim community leaders as having a “special responsibility” to counter “the radical and dangerous ideology of extremist Islam” following a terror attack in Melbourne earlier this month that left two dead.
“They must be proactive, they must be alert and they must call this out,” Morrison said, adding that he would hold a roundtable meeting with Muslim leaders this week to discuss the problem.
But Australian Grand Mufti Ibrahim Abu Mohamed and a group of other senior Muslim figures rejected the invitation in an open letter to Morrison on Wednesday.
The men said they were “deeply concerned and disappointed” with comments by Morrison and other ministers “which infer that the community is collectively culpable for the criminal actions of individuals and should be doing more to prevent such acts of violence”.
“These statements have achieved nothing to address underlying issues, but rather, have alienated large segments of the Muslim community,” they said in the letter, which was published by Australian media.
The letter prompted a tweetstorm from Morrison, who accused those behind the boycott of “continuing down a path of denial” and making their communities “less safe and more vulnerable”.
“We all have responsibilities to make Australia safe, and that means making sure Muslim communities do not become infiltrated with this dangerous ideology,” he tweeted….
In their letter the Islamic leaders, who head community groups in several Australian states, said they would attend a later meeting with Morrison if their “views and concerns will be genuinely respected”.
Ron Blower says
They ARE “culpable”; these “leaders” of the Muslim Cultural Jihadii and should be called out on their culpability instead of it being hinted at WHICH I applaud, even so.
jule says
It most certainly is NOT a common dodge in a community where a BOOK called THE RELIGION in QUR’AN/HADITHS instructs people to act that way since 600AD and if leaders do not today take control and still affirm that all in those writings are WORDS of ALLAH for even today, then they all should e locked up or kicked out of the country. We will not live in their Islamist country. Islam cannot live in ours as it instructs its people to destroy the host. They think we are so stupid as to say…go ahead, live out your destruction of us? Only our leaders, for money, seem to think its OK. In US, it is UNCONSTITUTIONAL to allow anything to try to destroy America or persecute Jews. Muslims are not persecuted for believing in Allah, but they will be for believing Allah wants us all destroyed or dominated.
Jay says
The most important and easiest thing to do is ban the Koran. It is a vile, vicious book ( definitely not a religious book) about hate , killing etc. It has no redeeming qualities and would be banned from all libraries if it wasn’t called a religious book. Islam is a fascist ideology, under the guise of religion. It is an ideology of conquering others by force….not contributing to society. Ban the Koran….at the very least…do not permit children under 18 to read it or hear its dangerous words They are words of hate and killing. Return Muslims to their Islamic countries.This is war . Don’t be naive. Declare your country to be a Judeo Christian country…just like the Islamic countries do. The Muslims belong in Islamuc countries. not Christian countries.
gravenimage says
If the Qur’an were banned, it would just criminalize people like Robert Spencer who are trying to educate people about the threat of Islam. I’d be in prison myself, since I own several translations of this foul book.
jule says
I really don’t mind at all having a Christian, Buddhist, Jewish, Hindu, Native American Great Spirit, whatever or agnostics or even atheists as long as they leave me alone. But Islam is completely different. It is Supremacist, Bigoted, Totalitarian dictator Political Theology, all composed as a mask to hide the real Warlord culture of Conquest/Control. (Ruthless control via fear and terror of their own populations) And they call that Warlord Culture Allah’s one and only True religion of submission (to their leaders) The Qur’an should never be preached in US Mosques to incite and spread bigotry. Not in a free country. Their doctrine destroys Freedom and we have NO obligation to allow it or white Supremacists, Nazigroups or KKKlan. Those are not FREE groups. They do not promote Freedom…just the opposite. And those are facts that can be proven in a court of law. It would uphold our values to kick them all out.
J D S says
If Muslims as a whole don’t scream yo the top of their lungs, on street corners in the streets, on radio, tv, social media and all media outlets, that the acts. (They are CRIMINAL acts) that Muslims are committing are criminal acts and are not what they want to see in their religion and are going to work to remove them, then any words spewed from their mouths , other than the aforementioned is wasted, useless talk..
Older Canadian says
This new PM has alot to learn.
Walter Sieruk says
With all the Muslim violent crime mayhem and even actions of Islamic terrorism what else are the citizens of Australia as well as the government officials of the nation of Australia supposed to think as to the answer he often ask question “Is Islam a actually a peaceful of violent religion.” ?
By the violence instructed the the Quran and the violent actions of many Muslims any rational person will come to understand that Islam is ,indeed a religion of violence and death.
As about the use of the term “extremist Islam ” spoken by the prime minister of Australia it should explained that the terms as “extremist Islam’ and “Radical Muslim” as well as “Islamic extremist” is misuse of terms terms “Moderate Muslim” are actually Western terms and not that well known in the Islamic Middle East. This is because what In the Islamic mindset in the Muslim Middle East as well as in Indonesia and other Muslim controlled country what the non-Muslims of the Western nations view as “radical and “extremist” the Muslims of those places in the world see as “Normal” and even Devout and committed to the Cause of Islam”. Likewise they view those who Westerns see as “Moderate Muslims” those of the Islamic worldview and non-devout and non –committed Muslims. The violent jihadists even see them as “hypocrites.” Therefore, this explains the jihadist chant of those jihad-minded Muslims in different Islamic terror organizations. When they chant out loud “Death to infidels and hypocrites.” Meaning Death to people who and not Muslims and people who are non- jihadist Muslims.
tim gallagher says
Walter, you’re right to point out this confusion with many political leaders, including Prime Minister Scott Morrison, where they keep saying it is only “radical Islam” or “extremist islam” that we have to worry about. I don’t know whether they know the truth, which is that all of Islam is a problem, all of Islam has a very nasty attitude towards all non-Muslims, but feel they can’t tell the truth, or lack the courage to tell the truth, but it is annoying. I think that maybe these Muslim leaders, who won’t meet Morrison, are showing what their true attitude is. I believe that they support Muslim terrorism because it is basic Islam. I believe that, when it comes to Islam, it is them or us. The Muslims are our enemies. Islam is incompatible with our western values. I wouldn’t waste my time talking to these Muslim leaders anyway because they’d only lie all the time. I wish our political leaders would wake up.
vlad says
+ me
Terry Gain says
I believe that, when it comes to Islam, it is them or us.
……….
More importantly this is a basic tenet of Islam. For the first 1350 years Islamic conquest was spread by terror. It is now being spread by invasion and propaganda. The goal is still conquest and those who pretend that Islam is just another religion are a greater threat than bin Laden.
tim gallagher says
Terry, I say that it is them or us, when we are dealing with islam, because I believe that Islam is completely incompatible with all the values of our western societies. And Islam is always going to be trying to impose its barbaric garbage on us. It is an aggressive enemy. That’s why I believe that all non-Muslim countries need to ban Muslim migration. It’s so stupid to keep importing this obvious trouble. This should be so obvious by now. Of course, our societies now have to try to deal with the Muslims that have (so foolishly) been let in. This is what Morrison is trying to do. It seems like a difficult problem for politicians to deal with everywhere in the world. You’re right about the danger presented by people who pretend that Islam is just another religion. Thanks for the + me, vlad.
Angemon says
Good – never apologize and, instead, double down.
Ernie says
Islam has a lack of self-critical-abilities , because it supercedes all and everything outside ” islam “. ” Grand Mufti ” Ibrahim Abu Mohamed , and ” a group of other senior muslim figures ” are waging “holy”-war , JIHAD , and fighting the KUFAAR . The Kufaar must bend , not the Ummah , because the Ummah represents Islam ( wich is perfect and always right , because it is the DEEN of Allah ) . How dare the filthy unbelievers point out the responsabilities of the Ummah and its leaders ! Well , this is PURE FASCIST IDEOLOGY, and any reasoning with muslims is futile/a waist of time and energy . Angemon is right : NEVER APOLOGIZE AND , INSTEAD , DOUBLE DOWN .
Mirren10 says
” Morrison isn’t saying that the Muslim community is “collectively culpable for the criminal actions of individuals.” ”
No, but he should be.
But kudos to Morrison for at least calling them out on their responsibility.
” This doesn’t make the Muslim community collectively responsible for jihad activity, but it does give them a responsibility to address those texts and teachings and work honestly to find ways to minimize their capacity to incite violence.”
I disagree. Any muslim who accepts the evil mohammed as ‘the perfect man for all time’, and accepts the koran, *is* ‘collectively responsible for jihad activity.’ How can they *not* be ?
If, for example, I was a Satanist, and a group of Satanists were arrested for sacrificing another human being to Satan, how can I then turn around and say this is not my responsibility, because I was not personally involved in the murder ? I have accepted the tenets of Satanism, I support it, so because I didn’t happen to be there when my fellow Satanists carried out the tenets of their ‘faith’, there is no moral way *I* am not complicit. And so it is with muslims. they revere the evil mohammed, they accept the directives of the foul koran. They are *complicit*. To say anything else is sheer sophistry.
”This doesn’t make the Muslim community collectively responsible for jihad activity, but it does give them a responsibility to address those texts and teachings and work honestly to find ways to minimize their capacity to incite violence.”
How, exactly ? If they believe the koran is the immutable word of ‘allah’, for **all time**, how can they then work to minimize the verses that incite violence and hatred ? If they do that, they are basically saying they don’t believe their koran is the word of ‘allah;, no ?
Either they believe in their foul koran, or they don’t. If they don’t, they need to apostasise. If they do, then no amount of polite suggestions that they ‘work honestly to find ways to minimize their capacity to incite violence’, will have any traction whatsoever.
It seems to me that until everyone who is not a muslim accepts it is an either/or situation, we are totally fucked, because there is no way one can be equivocal. Submit, pay the jizya, or die. I’ll die first, and take as many of them with me as I can.
tim gallagher says
A very good post, Mirren10. I agree with you when you say that you can’t see how Islam can be reformed because it (with all its foul calls for violence and murder of non-Muslims, etc) is the immutable word of the vile concept of god that Muslims believe in. To me, these calls for Islam to be reformed and turned into something pleasant and non-violent always seems like pie in the sky. I can’t see how it could ever happen. Also, I believe most Muslims do know the content of the Koran in all its nastiness and, as you say, Muslims need to leave the whole foul ideology of Islam, if they can see how evil it is. I believe most Muslims do have a nasty attitude towards non-Muslims. They are bound to have a pretty bad attitude towards the hated infidels. They may not all carry out violent actions but they all have a nasty attitude towards non-Muslims and they all want to impose Islam. Also, as you mention, I can’t believe any group of people can find such an evil character as Muhammad is their idea of a perfect man and someone whose behaviour should be imitated. I agree with all the comments you make in your post.
Terry Gain says
Mirren10
Your comment is so good that after I read it I scrolled up and was surprised not to see my name.
🙂
Joe Z. Wales says
There is no “Extremist Islam”. There is but ONE Islam.
FYI says
Perhaps the muslims should pay the equivalent of a Jizya tax to the infidels….make sure they pay for any damages,any terrorist threats etc..
Ernie says
That certainly would be fair , FYI .
kouldb says
Well that’s just too bad for the Muslim community & it’s leaders. Because aside from a few vapid, impotent SJW’s. The rest of us Aussies stand firmly with our Prime Minister. All the way! In fact, as of today 22nd. November 2018. Scott Morrison’s government is now looking at introducing new legislation that would allow for the deportation of extremists, hate preachers & terrorists back to where they were born; or where their parents were born; or even to where their grandparents were born. How do you like that?! This is Straya. We don’t mess around with people who come seeking refuge, are given it & who then use those privileges & freedoms as weapons of mass destruction against us. It’s also one of the main reasons we’re not singing the UN’s Migration Pact that would make immigration a human right. So, the Muslim community & it’s leaders can either choose to be part of the solutions, to the problems they created. Or, they’ll just have to accept whatever we come up with, which we think is fair. This is our country. And we will govern & rule it for the benefit of our people. The majority. Not the vocal & entitled minority who wishes to establish a Sharia caliphate: They are not in Britain. We run things differently here!
Down Under Observer says
Here, bloody here.
vlad says
Ossies (and all other Western Countries) ought to get out of the UN altogether, repudiate all UN “obligations” and stop any payments for any/all UN organisation.
That should make Soros sorry for stuffing up the best civilisations that ever existed, but albeit their freedoms make them vulnerable to attack from within.
Older Canadian says
Congradulations to the people of Australia for voting in a person who has the intelligence to use commonsense.
sidney penny says
To avoid the impression that Muslims are collectively culpable for the criminal actions of individuals, maybe the Australian Prime Minister Scott Morrison could call upon Muslims individual and Muslims groups to ……
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2018/11/turkeys-religious-affairs-top-dog-important-area-of-cooperation-with-europe-is-efforts-to-eliminate-islamophobia
They could call upon Muslim individuals and groups to:
1. Focus their indignation on Muslims committing violent acts in the name of Islam, not on non-Muslims reporting on those acts.
2. Renounce definitively, sincerely, honestly, and in deeds, not just in comforting words, not just “terrorism,” but any intention to replace Western constitutions (or the constitutions of any non-Muslim state) with Sharia even by peaceful means. In line with this, clarify what is meant by their condemnations of the killing of innocent people by stating unequivocally that non-Muslim civilians, including Israelis, are innocent people, teaching accordingly in mosques and Islamic schools, and behaving in accord with these new teachings.
3. Teach, again sincerely and honestly, in transparent and verifiable ways in mosques and Islamic schools, the imperative of Muslims coexisting peacefully as equals with non-Muslims on an indefinite basis, and act accordingly.
4. Begin comprehensive international programs in mosques all over the world to teach sincerely, and again transparently, against the ideas of violent jihad and Islamic supremacism.
5. Actively and honestly work with Western law enforcement officials to identify and apprehend jihadists within Western Muslim communities.
Aussie Infidel says
I’m waiting for the day that Morrison and other politicians cease referring to the problem as “radical or extremist Islam”, and just use plain “Islam” – as it is written in the Quran and the other Islamic scriptures. Or would that be too Islamophobic? While there are ‘extremist Muslims’ who carry out these attacks, there is no such thing as ‘extremist Islam’. The same verses have incited devout Muslim hotheads to commit acts of violence against disbelievers for 1,400 years. The only reason our politicians are using these erroneous terms is because most of them are ignorant of Islamic ideology – or too gutless to call a spade a spade.
Of course, we can expect the imams and mullahs to deny this – they are masters in their art of Taqiyya. Muslim leaders might as well boycott a meeting with the PM to discuss the problem, because it would be a waste of time. They will never admit that Islam is a “radical and dangerous ideology,” or do anything to help stop it. That would be acting against the Islamic imperative of ‘conquering the world for Allah’.
Morrison tweeted, “We all have responsibilities to make Australia safe, and that means making sure Muslim communities do not become infiltrated with this dangerous ideology,” However, this “dangerous ideology” has been an integral part of All Muslim communities since their inception in the seventh century. This lying, deceitful attitude is so ingrained in the Muslim psyche, and their propaganda so all-pervasive, that most Muslims actually believe it.
There will never be peace while one solitary Muslim remains in a democratic society
Savvy Kafir says
Well said, Aussie Infidel! I agree with every point you made. Especially the last one. Ridding the West of Islam really has to be the goal. Anything less is a temporary fix.
Peggy says
I suspect that Morrison knows it’s Islam not radical Islam that’s a problem but can’t openly say it because it would cause a whole lot of problems.
As it is now the Muslim leadership is refusing to meet with him just for saying what he did. Imagine if he said it was Islam itself.
I think those leaders would incite their followers to step up the attacks because they are so insulted and it would be all ‘”our fault” for insulting them.
He has to fix it step by step. I’m prepared to give him a go. As long as he’s delivering he doesn’t have to say it all.
alex Reid says
FFS get real! Islam is wanting to take over the world. These “religious leaders” are simple extortionists. Islam is contrary to human decency. It violates basic Human Rights. – Fact. To hell with their “hurt feelings”.
Savvy Kafir says
Agreed! It’s a wonder to me that snyone gives a damn about the hurt feelings of Allah junkies. They are the enemy, and are constantly enraged about something or other.
infidel says
The PM should then drag these vile creatures by their vile beards and issue them an ultimatum.
Terry Gain says
This is a common dodge, but it has no substance. Morrison isn’t saying that the Muslim community is “collectively culpable for the criminal actions of individuals.” He is simply being realistic, in a way that the Muslim leaders are not, about the fact that mainstream Islamic texts and teachings incite Muslims to commit acts of violence against non-Muslims. This doesn’t make the Muslim community collectively responsible for jihad activity, but it does give them a responsibility to address those texts and teachings and work honestly to find ways to minimize their capacity to incite violence.
…….
I disagree. The ideology is vile and every Muslim is responsible for the daily carnage of an evil conquest ideology that claims it is a religion.
If we don’t have a Cold War with Islam, we will have submission or a Hot War.
tt says
I don’t understand … Those Muslim leaders this way actually make the entire Muslim community collectively responsible for jihad activity. Right?