Has the whole world lost the ability to think clearly? The question of whether or not Islam is violent and destructive is not answered by shootings at a mosque, but by examination of Islam’s texts, teachings, and history. If Islam is violent and destructive, it doesn’t become peaceful and constructive when some psychopath murders innocent people at mosques. I have stated repeatedly that these shootings would be used to shut down all criticism of jihad mass murder and Sharia oppression, and here we see that happening in real time.
“Tradie is fired for calling Islam ‘violent and destructive’ in the wake of the Christchurch mosque massacre – as he insists he was just trying to have an ‘intellectual conversation,'” by Paula Ahillon, Daily Mail Australia, March 27, 2019 (thanks to The Religion of Peace):
A tradie was fired four days into a new job for calling Muslims ‘violent and destructive’ the day after the Christchurch terror attack.
Thomas Knight-Wagener lost his job at Placemakers Albany, north-west of Auckland, after making the comments.
Knight-Wagener, originally from Kaitaia, told the NZ Herald he was ‘having an intellectual conversation’ with his new colleagues about Islam.
He mentioned reports he had read about crimes committed in the United Kingdom by Muslims, following a conversation about the mosque attacks.
On the Wednesday after the massacre he went into work only to be told by his manager that he had been assigned to another job.
Knight-Wagener claims the manager had fired him because ‘something was said on Saturday about the Christchurch shooting’.
He told the publication that one of his colleagues was offended by his comments.
‘I elaborated on the current state of the UK in regards to the growing Islamic community and the crimes against the people in these communities,’ Knight-Wagener said.
‘I said no swear words and was not abusive or aggressive in my manner. I was simply stating facts, of which no one wanted to hear obviously.’
But Knight-Wagener admitted that he was flippant when making his comments and regretted them immediately….
Infidel lives matter says
“If the freedom of speech is taken away, then dumb and silent we may be led, like sheep to the slaughter.” ― George Washington
CRUSADER says
Excellent quotation to remember and to recall to mind at most occasions these days…
Lesley Ward says
Unfortunately the NZ Prime Minister a lefty has gone stone cold bonkers, all but trying to convert NZ peoples into Islamic followers on the back of this attack!!! WHY is it that all the Western politicians seem to ignore the hundreds of similar attacks weekly (as close as the Phillipines in the last couple weeks), by MUSLIMS against Christians? WHY are they racing to support, appease and co-opt our laws, culture and civilization to Islam? WHY more importantly are WE the people NOT standing up to them and demanding that the West take notice of history, of Islam’s violent past and continued violence, and making a stand against this violent ideology???
fredoniahead says
People aren’t going to stand up when they’re as ovine and as stupid as the NZ PM. The man got fired after a fellow employee was “offended” by facts. When a society breaks from reality it can’t have much time left.
Darko R. says
It was just Filipinos that week – it was Christian Nigerians as well. Not a sound from mainstream media of course being sickening sycophantic hypocrites .
gravenimage says
+1
ninetyninepct says
Send Placemakers Albany thousands of e-mails demanding to show that Thomas Knight-Wagener and ask how much they are going to pay him for unjust dismissal.
gravenimage says
Agreed. Here is their contact information:
https://www.placemakers.co.nz/contactus/
elee says
“Freedom of speech” is a western concept, Muslims never experience it. Remember how the Prophet set people to killing poets who dissed him? It’s so ironic to hear fools talk about “Islamic democracy.”
mortimer says
“The sword is raised due to the strength of faith.” – Maulana Mufti Khabeebur Rehman Qazi
Those who know nothing of Islam pretend that Islam counsels against war. Those [who say this] are witless. Islam says: Kill all the unbelievers just as they would kill you all! Does this mean that Muslims should sit back until they are devoured by [the unbelievers]? Islam says: Kill them, put them to the sword and scatter [their armies]….Islam says: Whatever good there is exists thanks to the sword and in the shadow of the sword! People cannot be made obedient except with the sword! The sword is the key to Paradise, which can be opened only for the Holy Warriors! There are hundreds of other ayahs and hadiths urging Muslims to value war and to fight. Does all this mean that Islam is a religion that prevents men from waging war? I spit upon those foolish souls who make such a claim.” – Ayatollah Khomeini
“Killing the infidels is our religion, slaughtering them is our religion, until they convert to Islam or pay us tribute.” — Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, 2005
According to Mohammed, original Islam is jihad.
“Narrated Abdullah ibn Umar:
I heard the Apostle of Allah say: When you enter into the inah transaction (become businessmen), hold the tails of oxen (become cattlemen), are pleased with agriculture (become farmers), and give up conducting JIHAD, Allah will make disgrace prevail over you, and will not withdraw it until you return to your ORIGINAL RELIGION.” – Sunan Abu Dawud Book 23, Number 3455
So conducting jihad is the ‘original religion’ of Mohammed. Mohammed is the ultimate authority on Islam.
gravenimage says
Important quotes, Mortimer–thank you.
CogitoErgoSum says
Meanwhile, saying that Christianity is violent and destructive will get you a big yawn.
Crusades Were Right says
…or perhaps a job with the British government writing letters to Christian asylum seekers?
[youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAoC8yqk–g&w=853&h=480%5D
CogitoErgoSum says
True, or maybe even get you Employee of the Month award and a pay raise.
mortimer says
Jesus is ‘The Prince of Peace’. How does that make Christianity ‘violent’.
CogitoErgoSum says
Mortimer, in the minds of some people Christians cause violence because their religion forces Muslims to then have to fight them … because their very existence is an insult to Islam.
gravenimage says
Grimly true, Crusades Were Right.
DHazard says
So if Muslims are victims of terrorism then no one can ever criticize Islam again? The left is going to exploit this tragedy for years. Right now they’re using it to try and sweep the internet clean of rational voices, and they’re getting away with it. Oddly it is the New Zealand thought police that are the racists. It is an admission of the inescapable fact that Islam is an extremely violent religion and Western democracies are adopting Muslim blasphemy laws de facto.
Incidents like Christchurch muddy the waters enough that thought looters can appear and then do as much damage as possible.
Ric says
This man’s firing is only the beginning of the loss of freedom of speech; not only in New Zealand but the entirety of the West’s faux-Democracies. Freedom of Speech, the First Amendment or in some nations the Charter of Rights will soon dissipate for those daring to speak the truth about Islam and its nihilistic, tenets of intolerance, Jew-Hatred or loathing for Western culture from A to Z. If the massacre had taken place in a church or Synagogue, the response, by comparison, would be deafening.
Islam is not only a Cult of Death but a Cult that thrives on victimization; hence, one whose once had the right to speak freely will now face condemnation, persecution, prosecution, and branded an Islamophobe. Moreover, Muslims shall never lose their freedom of speech rights, thus will freely castigate, spew Jew-Christian-Hatred with no fear of discipline, civil or judicial.
somehistory says
“admitted that he was flippant”
*******************************************************************
Why should someone be forced to be *respectful* when speaking of islam? islam is undeserving of respect. It only deserves condemnation and reviling.
So, he was flippant…since he told the Truth…it wouldn’t have mattered how he said it; being a non moslim and not approving of the violence and destruction committed by moslims.
How many nations are left in the world where it is still allowed to tell the truth about islam without being fired…or worse? Must be a very short list.
James Lincoln says
somehistory asks,
“How many nations are left in the world where it is still allowed to tell the truth about islam without being fired…or worse? Must be a very short list.”
Poland and Hungary, yes.
The United States, possibly – depending upon the situation.
European pagan says
He didnt do anything wrong, he said only his oppinion. He didnt kill anyone. And yes, islam is violent.
gravenimage says
New Zealand: Man fired for calling Islam “violent and destructive” after Christchurch mosque massacre
…………………….
Knight-Wagener was quite right–Islam *is* violent and destructive. Unjustly firing this man does not change this.
More:
The question of whether or not Islam is violent and destructive is not answered by shootings at a mosque, but by examination of Islam’s texts, teachings, and history. If Islam is violent and destructive, it doesn’t become peaceful and constructive when some psychopath murders innocent people at mosques.
…………………….
So true–but logic is increasingly rare these days.
And Placemakers Albany is a DIY hardware store–it sounds similar to Home Depot or Ace Hardware in the US, or B&Q or Homebase in the UK–not the sort of place one would expect to be particularly “politically correct”.
CRUSADER says
Uncle Orwell, once again, nails it with Big Brother:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kh7X3JAKOLs
tim gallagher says
I’m in Australia, so the memorial service yesterday in New Zealand received a lot of TV news coverage. There was a MUslim man in a wheel-chair, (I think his name was Ahmed or something similar) who had been at the mosque when the shooting took place (his wife was killed) and the man said that he doesn’t hate the killer and forgives the killer and he said something like Allah tells us to forgive or something similar, ( I didn’t watch it all) and I thought, well that sounds more like what a Christian would say, and not what I believe Allah says. Maybe Allah might say something like that about other Muslims, I don’t know. I also thought, well, it could be that the man was lying and spreading disinformation. I get the feeling that Islam seems to say endless different and completely opposite things. There’s the story here today at Jihad Watch where the Malaysian leader, Mahathir, is saying Islam doesn’t preach violence. What do people here( who know plenty about Islam’s true nature) at Jihad Watch think? I am sure that Islam is endlessly violent(certainly far more violent than any other religion) and the huge number of Muslim terrorist attacks are Muslims just following the calls for violence in the Koran. As I said, the Muslim in the wheel-chair in New Zealand sounded very much like a Christian, not like what Muslims generally sound like. I thought, well, maybe he was actually a decent, forgiving man in spite of being a Muslim. A rarity I’d say. They usually seem to be all about revenge. Then again, no one could talk about revenge at the New Zealand service, so maybe he was lying about his forgiveness. Trying to put the non-Muslims back into the foolish position of believing Islam is peaceful, etc. This report about this man losing his job for telling the truth is a shocker, though not a surprise in these times.
CRUSADER says
Muslims who want peace in their life and in the lives of others throughout the world should just convert en masse to Christianity. That’s the only viable solution.
The others who remain in Islam would be the fully devout, jihad supporters, and they should be called out and lined up….
tim gallagher says
I agree, CRUSADER. That is always my own attitude towards the people who are Muslims and say they want to reform Islam. I always think that Islam can’t be reformed and turned into something peaceful,(after all, it’s meant to be the word of god and perfect,etc) so those people should pack up and leave Islam. I agree with what you say that it is the “only viable solution”. Of course, there is that big problem that Muslims who live in Muslim countries can’t leave islam or they’d be killed as apostates. And how sick and pathetic is that: that you can’t leave Islam or you are under threat of death. I was struck by the Muslim guy at the New Zealand ceremony because it sounded so much like what a Christian might say and not what a Muslim would say. He was probably lying.
CogitoErgoSum says
Tim, I have wondered about this too. Many Muslims do seem to have a more forgiving outlook on the world and they just ignore the more hateful verses in the Quran. Could this be because there were many Christians who reluctantly switched their religion to Islam rather than be killed or pay the Jizya in humiliation? A large number of these reluctant converts had accepted the teachings of Christ about love and forgiveness and secretly wanted to hang on to those teachings. They actually liked their religion and felt guilty about rejecting it so they compensated by turning Muhammad into what Jesus had been to them — the perfect man of peace. They didn’t bother to study the Quran too closely either because they were not educated and couldn’t read Arabic. This helped to soften the harshness of Muhammad’s true message and these people passed along their modified understanding of Islam to their children. No way to really prove that, I suppose, and I may be totally off the mark but it’s something to think about.
tim gallagher says
Thanks for the comment, CogitoErgoSum. You could be on to something with your theory about the more peaceful, forgiving Muslims, maybe, having had a Christian background. It certainly seems possible. Of course, this New Zealand ceremony was a huge event with a big crowd and many political leaders in attendance, so this Muslim man certainly wasn’t going to get up there and say how he wanted revenge. So maybe he was lying. It was a great opportunity to spread disinformation. Islam does seem to be all over the place. For example, there is also that supposedly peaceful branch of Islam, Sufism, which I don’t really understand because of all the calls for violence in the Koran. All those calls for violence seem hard to ignore. I’m trying to think of some of the pleasant Muslims I have come across, mainly people who have served me in shops or in health care. There have been half a dozen who, on that very superficial level, did seem very pleasant. Of course, that is such a superficial level that it doesn’t count. I don’t know any Muslims very well. I distrust them and am not likely to get to know them at any deeper level. I have worked with a few Muslims years ago. As I said, I don’t trust them. I remember one man I worked with and, back in 2001 when the New York towers were attacked, he said it was a shame about the innocent people, but then proceeded to say that America deserved it or something like that. I didn’t get into an argument with him (there were plenty of left wingers there who probably agreed with him) but I thought from then on what a scumbag he was. Generally, I think it is them or us when it comes to Islam. Much of what they believe in is barbaric ( child brides, honour killings and so on) and totally incompatible with our values. And I’m sure that almost all of them are always going to be pushing to impose Islam on everyone.
PRCS says
The ‘reformers’ must first convince 1 billion+ other Muslims to believe Qur’an can be reformed.
gravenimage says
As ex-Muslim Bosch Fawstin says, some Muslims are just better than their religion.
CRUSADER says
Ever see the movie, “Silence”, whereby the Christianity held close is publicly refuted but privately held closely inside, where the soul is?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57O9riSjfYw
CRUSADER says
Tim, remember that the Sufis were called upon by Salah ad-Din to try their hands at swinging blades down on the necks of captured Templars, after the battle of the Horns of Hattin, 1187.
tim gallagher says
Thanks for the comments and video, CRUSADER, PRCS and gravenimage. PRCS, I don’t believe for one second that Islam can ever be reformed. Its content is set in stone in a manner of speaking. MUslims surely believe it is the final revelation from god and unalterable. Personally, I only have the time of day for the people who have left islam, such as Nonie Darwish, Wafa Sultan and the others. CRUSADER, I didn’t know that information about the “peaceful”!!! Sufis. I certainly doubted whether they could be genuinely peaceful. gravenimage, I haven’t heard of Bosch Fawstin though what he says there is a good way to put things. Some people are better than their religion. I always say that the good Muslims are somehow that way in spite of being members of Islam, in spite of its evil content. The fact that some people can turn out that way is a good thing. I suspect it doesn’t happen very often.
gravenimage says
Agreed, Tim.
Bosch Fawstin is a brave ex-Muslim cartoonist who is known for his Anti-Jihad series of books “The Infidel” (also known as “Pigman”). He is a very talented guy.
Here is just one of the articles here on his work:
“Pigman vs SuperJihad in The Infidel #3, On Sale Now”
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2017/12/pigman-vs-superjihad-in-the-infidel-3-on-sale-now
tim gallagher says
gravenimage, thanks for the information about Bosch Fawstin. It’s always good to hear about another fighter against Islam. From the covers of his comics, he looks to be a very talented artist. I guess he’d be facing threats of death from Muslims who are enraged about his work. They’re always enraged, aren’t they.
gravenimage says
Thanks, Tim.
In fact, Bosch Fawstin just put out a book of the death threats he has received, which is both horrifying and actually very funny.
Here’s his website:
https://fawstin.blogspot.com/
Michael Copeland says
for tim gallagher:
“Violence is the heart of Islam” – Ayatollah Yazdi
elee says
Good thread Tim Gallagher & CES.
Remember that the Muslim scripture got put together after the fat dwarf’s death by people with their own agendas. They burned anything that didn’t agree with their views of eternal truth.
Also note that there are indeed (“abrogated”) passages that urge toleration, kindness and peace. They tend to occur in chapters of the scripture marked as “Revealed before hegira” or “Revealed in Mecca.” Some Muslims designate themselves as “Mecca Muslims” to signify their preference for peace and toleration of others. This is emphatically non-scriptural—see Koran 33:5; 33:37; and 2:106.
Note a nuance of current Muslim dialogue: when, for example, Turkish officials proclaim their allegiance to “Medina,” this is understood as a repudiation of the abrogated verses that urged kindness compassion and toleration.
tim gallagher says
Thanks for the comments, Michael and elee. What an appalling quote for any ideology to have said about it, that violence is the heart of it. I consider that accurately sums up Islam. elee, I’d heard about the way Islam changed into something far more violent later. That was sort of what I was getting at when I said that I find that Islam seems to be all over the place. It seems chaotic. But, as you say, it was put together by a bunch of “people with their own agendas”. Christianity, for example, has different branches, but they all are peaceful, at least as far as I know. But I think the violent and barbaric aspect of islam generally seems to be dominant. I’ll keep my eye out for the “Medina” terminology. I would love to see all our non-Muslim countries say, nope, we’ve had enough of Islam, it doesn’t matter what you Muslims say about Islam being “peaceful” or that it can be reformed, we believe Islam will always cause us endless trouble ,( far more trouble than any other creed) so we’re shutting all Muslim immigration down. Of course, it’s too late for many countries which already have lots of Muslims there. I keep thinking that Hungary, Poland, the Czech Republic and Slovakia are on the right track, along with Japan who don’t seem to have many Muslims. Not enough people seem to be waking up in most of our countries..
NZBloke says
Islam is dualistic, so anything can be true. The best explanation is from Bill Warner:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YjBDDC4wVxk
tim gallagher says
Sorry, I missed your comment until now, NZBloke. Yeah, to me, islam seems chaotic and all over the place. But, mostly, it is almost always violent (always far more trouble and more dangerous for us than any other ideology), so, for me, I can only say, just keep it out of all our non-Muslim countries. It causes too mucht trouble. What did you make of the Muslim from the mosque who was saying he doesn’t feel hate and he forgives? I do suspect he was lying. Probably seething inside and wanting revenge but saying peaceful things for the audience at that ceremony. I’ve watched a couple of talks by Bill Warner on youtube over the years. He is excellent.
abad says
Islam – just like the liberal elite in the west – does not allow for clear thinking.
Instead, both Islam and the liberal elite tell you what to think, not how to think – because thinking on one’s own leads to certain punishment.
na says
Yes Islam in exaggerated like Man can not wear black dress, music is haram, Christian Monks(Eastern Christians) are son of Satan(Eastern God). Sharia is the ultimate way of life, If a non- muslim woman marry a Muslim then she should convert to Islam. They are just trying to go back centuries behind ,they believe, then only their 8th century imam Mahdi can come.
PRCS says
Note the article’s sleight of hand:
The headline:
Tradie is fired for calling Islam ‘violent and destructive’
The text:
A tradie was fired four days into a new job for calling Muslims ‘violent and destructive
Which was it?
CRUSADER says
Twitter, says David Wood, is fascist!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZYC-xEziYpQ
CRUSADER says
Always good to get a refresher. Forgot he had once been Muslim…
Bosch Fawstin is an American cartoonist. A self-proclaimed “recovered Muslim,”[1] he was born into a Muslim family from Albania and raised in the faith before leaving it in his teens, becoming an atheist.
His first graphic novel, “Table for One” was nominated for a Russ Manning Most Promising Newcomer award in 2004[2] and an Eisner award – Talent Deserving of Wider Recognition in 2005.[3] He is currently producing The Infidel featuring Pigman.
In 2015, he won a controversial contest advertised as the “First Annual Muhammad Art Exhibit and Contest”.[4]
elee says
I hope he’s safe.
gravenimage says
Yes–he’s both talented and brave.
Fritz says
One of Peter Jackson’s first movies is called “Brain Dead”. It’s about an zombie invasion. Looks like he foresaw the future. Leftist zombies have taken over NZ.
WPM says
At least the ones elected to govern the country. Too many sheep being lead by mad shepherds .
Elizabeth Thorne says
Bosch Fawstin’s book, Peaceful Death Threats, shows how peaceful some Muslims are. Shhhhhhh
gravenimage says
Yes–this book is deeply disturbing but also hilarious.
SuchindranathAiyerS says
New Zealand: Man fired for speaking the truth: This is like @facebook @Twitter @Quora , Canada, India or other depraved Commonwealth Countries who have submitted to Islam:
Adrian Rehak says
“…in the minds of some people…” Those same people, if their house was robbed, would be quick to realize it was their own fault because they owned a house. It’s always the victims fault isn’t it? To be absolutely clear so that no one can misunderstand, I’m being sarcastic.
Liz says
https://www.placemakers.co.nz/contactus/
Here’s the letter I sent to the company that fired him (comment to them instead of preaching to the choir here !)
Please don’t penalize Thomas Knight-Wagener for his comment that Islam is violent and destructive. Research into this shows that while of course most or many Muslims are peaceful and do not follow orthodox teachings, the ideology is destructive to women in particular and is intolerant towards other faiths wherever Islam is dominant – look at the history of Egypt, Turkey, Iran and the persecution there of non Muslims.
Please have a look at https://www.jihadwatch.org/2019/03/nigeria-muslims-burn-four-churches-and-28-homes-rape-and-murder-christian-woman-in-raids-on-christian-villages
And please check out http://www.thereligionofpeace.com for some stats on Islamic violence against non Muslims.
Please support freedom of speech !
gravenimage says
+1