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Exposing the role that Islamic jihad theology and ideology play in the modern global conflicts

UK: Man arrested for “malicious” social media post about New Zealand shootings

Mar 17, 2019 2:00 pm By Robert Spencer

This man was apparently arrested for “making reference and support for the terrible events.” Approving of a massacre is disgusting, and if he was calling for or approving of violence then there is no justification for that. At the same time, this report says: “Social media firms and some news outlets have been criticised for sharing livestream footage of the attack and failing to address far-right extremism on their platforms.”

Calling for or justifying a massacre of innocent people is one thing. But that “failing to address far-right extremism on their platforms” is quite another. For years now, Leftists and Islamic supremacists have insisted that opposing jihad mass murder and Sharia oppression of women and others constitutes “far-right extremism.” So it is likely that those who will be shut down will not be limited solely to people such as this “24-year-old from Oldham” who was “making reference and support for the terrible events.” It will include foes of jihad terror.

“Christchurch shootings: Arrest over ‘malicious’ social media post,” BBC, March 16, 2019 (thanks to Lookmann):

A man has been arrested in the UK on suspicion of making a malicious social media post about the attacks that killed 49 people at mosques in New Zealand.

Greater Manchester Police (GMP) said the post was “making reference and support for the terrible events”.

The arrested man is a 24-year old from Oldham.

GMP said where “people cross the line, we will take robust action, which may include arrest and prosecution”.

The force said: “This is a very difficult time for people. The events in New Zealand have reverberated around the world.

“Many people are in deep shock and are worried. It is at times like this that, as a community, we stand together.”

Brenton Tarrant, a 28-year-old Australian who described himself as a white supremacist, has been charged following the attacks during Friday prayers.

Social media firms and some news outlets have been criticised for sharing livestream footage of the attack and failing to address far-right extremism on their platforms….

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Filed Under: Featured, free speech, United Kingdom Tagged With: Greater Manchester Police (GMP)


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Comments

  1. Jay says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 2:10 pm

    So…..apparently free speech is now dead/illegal in the U.K.! NOT no go zones, not rape gangs, not unfettered illegal immigration and welfare fraud, terrorist attacks, not crime and murder against Jews and Christians, etc.
    Not that I agree with the post, but put it in perspective to the Muslim invasion of England and their loss of soverignity and national identity! PM Churchill is not resting easy today!
    God save the queen!

    • Els van Heijningen says

      Mar 18, 2019 at 4:46 pm

      Sad. The same here in The Netherlands.

  2. CRUSADER says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 2:17 pm

    New Zealand mosque shooting suspect ‘changed completely’ after traveling to Europe, other countries, family says….

    Authorities said the suspect traveled to the Balkans in the past three years and toured historic sites while studying battles between Christians and the Ottoman empire. He visited Serbia, Montenegro, Bosnia and Herzegovina, and Croatia, in late 2016, Bulgarian Chief Prosecutor Sotir Tsatsarov told Reuters. He made a trip to Bulgaria, Romania and Hungary last November.

    In 2017, he traveled to France, Spain and Portugal, Reuters reported.

    https://www.foxnews.com/world/new-zealand-mosque-shooting-suspect-changed-completely-after-traveling-to-europe-other-countries-family-says

    (VIDEO of religious leaders reflect — jew, muslim, christian discuss…
    ….Global Social Action / Holocaust Center – Genocide Education Center )

  3. CRUSADER says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 2:20 pm

    Bottom Line:

    The more the censorship against discussing REAL ISSUES
    (such as Tommy Robinson has been attempting to achieve by speaking out)
    continues in the Politically Correct environment,
    the more likely angst will let out….

    For the world to come to terms, it will come at odds with what Free Speech truly is.

    Silencing is not a Solution.

  4. Diane Harvey says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 2:27 pm

    “Calling for or justifying a massacre of innocent people is one thing”

    Huh?

    Muslims are forever calling for the deaths of the infidels!

    • CRUSADER says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 2:35 pm

      Militant Muslims certainly do, and yet their “Speech” is protected.

      Many mosques preach this devilish drivel.

      • J. Chambers says

        Mar 18, 2019 at 10:31 am

        Brita see what’s happening all around them concerning Muslims but are not allowed to comment on it? Since when did the UK become a totalitarian state?

    • Savvy Kafir says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 4:29 pm

      Yes, they are. Lots of them. Lots of Muslims living throughout the West call for us to be slaughtered — as do many True Believers in the Muslim world. And more than a few act upon that calling, or attempt to. And little is said about it by our “leaders” or the mainstream media, who would rather pretend none of this is happening.

      • jCotrim says

        Mar 18, 2019 at 3:43 am

        Perhaps we need to create a religion to do free speech. Anyone against it will be FreeSpeechFobic and will have to go to jail.

    • tim gallagher says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 9:35 pm

      I agree, Diane, and they’re not just calling for non-Muslims to be killed, but over and over again Muslim terrorists actually carry out such murders, as in the Manchester attack on concert goers, the attack on innocent people at the Bataclan theatre in Paris, the Muslim murderer mowing down all those innocent people with that truck in Nice, and on and on the death toll goes. I dislike this double standard where the media and the authorities tear into the far right for their hate speech and the occasional appalling act such as the action of this guy in New Zealand but, after every Muslim terrorist attack, they will say, oh, but this murderous attack has nothing to do with genuine Islam which is peaceful. They seem to make excuses for Islam and give it a free pass. I agree with your comments, CRUSADER and Savvy Kafir. People have to be allowed to tell the truth about Islam’s nature as Robert Spencer and some others do or otherwise we are never going to deal with it successfully. People in Hungary, the Czech Republic, and Poland seem to know the truth and are acting on it.

      • CRUSADER says

        Mar 18, 2019 at 3:28 am

        BRAVO !!

      • Rod says

        Mar 18, 2019 at 8:04 am

        Hey Tim, speaking of murderous attacks, when’s the next mass shooting in the Land of the GunNuts? There’s usually one or two a week, isn’t there? The internet tells me there were mass shootings in the USA on 13th, 14th, 15th, 16th, March, and two on 17th March. But we MUST always remember that Muslims are the people who are violent.

        Didn’t I read just yesterday that ALL of the terrorist attacks in the USA in 2018 were carried out by white supremacists – 50 dead. BUT it’s Muslims who are violent, of course.

        I had a “discussion” with one of your Muslim hating friends recently, who claims to have studied history. Strangely, he seems unaware that the Second World War, the Holocaust included, was significant as horrendous violence committed by non-Muslims. Ditto WWI, the Civil War, etc., and all the atrocities Christians have committed against Christians for centuries. I could go on.

        Perhaps Mr Spencer should do some research and write a book based on facts?

        • WPM says

          Mar 18, 2019 at 8:30 am

          What mass shooting ,that is the killing of more then one or two persons at one shooting incidents have occurred on March 13,14,15,16 in America ?? What is the connection with these unnamed shootings with white supremacist ,has Robert Spencer or anyone here on Jihad watch made excuses or encourage white supremist actions any where in the world? Is there gun violence in America ,yes ,is it connected with regular crime and gang violence unrelated to any religious terrorism yes ,is regular crime violence connected with terrorism no. What is your point ,is Robert Spencer making excuses for regular crime violence or saying regular crime violence or non-religious wars of WW1 the American civil war ect., were connected to Christianity call for violence in its books; or Jihad violence?

        • J. Chambers says

          Mar 18, 2019 at 10:54 am

          Rod,
          You mention the religion inspired violence of the middle ages without drawing the parallel involving the Muslims that applies to today. You appear to have taken a rather large bite of the media offered apple.
          As far as the violence happening in the USA, if several large cities death tolls were taken out of the picture, the gun violence would be one of the lowest in the world. Those cities are all run by liberal Democrats. Corollaries can be made that you seem to have missed.

        • tim gallagher says

          Mar 18, 2019 at 5:59 pm

          Well, Rod, you go right on thinking that there isn’t a huge problem with Islam, and that Islam is no worse than any other ideology. The point I was making is that there are innumerable Muslim terrorist attacks which go on almost every day throughout the world. I say there are far more such MUslim terrorist attacks than attacks by Christians, Buddhists, right wing people or individual nutjobs such as that guy Paddock in Las Vegas who shot so many people. Therefore I conclude that there is a massive problem with islam and Muslims in any non-Muslim country. I think there have been close to 40,000 MUslim terrorist attacks throughout the world since the 9/11 attack in 2001. The Koran calls for Muslims to “kill the non-believers wherever you find them” and calls often for violence against non-Muslims. No other ideology that I know of (well maybe Nazism and Communism) is full of such calls for murderous violence against people who aren’t part of their evil cult. And I am talking about the present situation, I am interested in protecting non-Muslims from Muslims right now. I don’t give a rat’s arse about long past history. I’m interested in policies for current times. For the reasons I’ve indicated, I believe that Hungary, the Czech Republic and Poland are on the right track. Japan is also on the right track. They keep Islam out. As for shootings in the USA, I live in Australia. America’s gun problems are something I wouldn’t have a clue about. Islam is a problem for all of us who have let this evil ideology into our countries. You go on living in your Islam defending fantasy land. Maybe one day, you’ll be caught up in one of the endless Muslim terrorist attacks as you go about your business. I don’t want any people that I value to be killed in Muslim terrorist attacks or affected by Muslim rape gangs or any such barbaric activities. So I say keep Islam out. And yes, we must remember that Muslims are far more violent people than most others because, unfortunately, it is the truth..

        • gravenimage says

          Mar 18, 2019 at 9:18 pm

          As usual, “Rod” wants all of the ‘filthy Infidels’ here to ignore the horrors of Jihad terrorism–all 34,000+ of them, just since 9/11.

        • tim gallagher says

          Mar 18, 2019 at 11:28 pm

          Thanks for the correction, gravenimage. I haven’t checked on the number of Muslim terrorist attacks lately so I said around 40,000. Probably won’t take them long to reach that mark. I didn’t know that Rod was someone who comments regularly. I’ve noticed lebel and that other Muslim whose name I can’t even recall now that you and other commenters used to argue with. I honestly cannot comprehend how anyone doesn’t see, after so many Muslim terrorist attacks,( so many more than, say, Buddhist terrorist attacks) that there is actually a problem with Islam. And the moral equivalence line, that, oh, you know, we’re all as bad as one another and Muslims are no worse than any other bunch of people, defies belief. Thanks, CRUSADER, for the Bravo!! Thanks WPM, Boromir’s Horn and J. Chambers for getting stuck into Rod’s idiotic garbage.

        • gravenimage says

          Mar 18, 2019 at 11:44 pm

          Tim, I wasn’t really correcting you–your estimate is not far off at all. A horrifying figure, in any case–especially given how many of these Jihad terror attacks have multiple victims.

          Yes, “Rod” shows up here periodically–not as often as the equally egregious lebel, but with a very similar schtick, especially in his hatred of America.

          And I agree with you about the good posts from CRUSADER, WPM, Boromir’s Horn and J. Chambers–as well as yourself.

        • tim gallagher says

          Mar 19, 2019 at 6:30 pm

          gravenimage, thanks for your comment. I wasn’t bothered at all about you giving a more accurate figure. It was good information. The other Muslim character, apart from lebel, that I was trying to remember the name of, was someone with a name like “itace” or “Ignace” or something like that. He used to get into some big fights with many people here at Jihad Watch.

        • Rod says

          Mar 20, 2019 at 1:13 am

          I think I understand. Violence committed by non-Muslims doesn’t really count as violence. Or it’s attributable to quite acceptable motives. Like insanity (or love of guns – same thing really), or “regular” crime or gang violence. Not “real” violence, you see! Glad we’ve cleared that up.

          And the Second World War, which engulfed the world, from the centre of European civilisation, to remote regions of Asia, to the jungles of New Guinea, somehow doesn’t indicate that non-Muslims can be violent, to an almost incomprehensible degree. 80 million dead (give or take 5 million). But repeat after me “Muslims are violent”.

          Robert Spencer making excuses? Is he? Who cares?
          40,000 Muslim attacks since 9/11? What a coincidence – it’s estimated that 40,000 Americans died by gunfire in 2018 alone. And the number is increasing. Nothing to do with a society with a big problem with violence, I suppose. Keep your focus on the Muslims.

          By the way, refuting what I say by implying what I don’t say and don’t believe is really a bit childish. Isn’t it? But then, this is the Spencer disciples club, and you have to defend your ideas somehow.

        • gravenimage says

          Mar 20, 2019 at 1:40 am

          The dishonest “Rod” wrote:

          I think I understand. Violence committed by non-Muslims doesn’t really count as violence. Or it’s attributable to quite acceptable motives. Like insanity (or love of guns – same thing really), or “regular” crime or gang violence. Not “real” violence, you see! Glad we’ve cleared that up.
          …………………………

          What absolute claptrap. Who here has said any such thing? What a straw man argument.

          *Of course* non-Muslims are capable of violence, and Jihad Watch condemns violence.

          Pretending that there is any threat in the world today like the threat of Jihad is ludicrous, though.

          More:

          And the Second World War, which engulfed the world, from the centre of European civilisation, to remote regions of Asia, to the jungles of New Guinea, somehow doesn’t indicate that non-Muslims can be violent, to an almost incomprehensible degree. 80 million dead (give or take 5 million). But repeat after me “Muslims are violent”.
          …………………………

          The idea that since Fascists were violent seventy years ago that we should ignore the threat of Jihad terror today makes no sense.

          Besides, “Rod’s” implication that the West ignored the savagery of Fascism during WWII is *quite* false. Does he think we have forgotten that it was the free West that *defeated* Fascism?

          More:

          Robert Spencer making excuses? Is he? Who cares?
          …………………………

          Notice that the mendacious “Rod” is incapable of pointing out one thing that Robert Spencer has said making excuses for violence. No surprise there…

          More:

          40,000 Muslim attacks since 9/11? What a coincidence – it’s estimated that 40,000 Americans died by gunfire in 2018 alone. And the number is increasing. Nothing to do with a society with a big problem with violence, I suppose. Keep your focus on the Muslims.
          …………………………

          Of course, most of these Jihad terror attacks had multiple victims–is “Rod” pretending that 9/11, say, had a single victim? What rot.

          And it is quite possible to be against violence on multiple fronts–but “Rod” pretend that it is not.

          Also, Jihad terror is not a constant–it is *mushrooming* as more and more Muslims flood into the West. “Rod” does not want us to notice that.

          More:

          By the way, refuting what I say by implying what I don’t say and don’t believe is really a bit childish. Isn’t it? But then, this is the Spencer disciples club, and you have to defend your ideas somehow.
          …………………………

          “Rod” has never once that I have seen said *anything* critical of Jihad terror in all the years he has been posting here–nor does he here.

          The idea that this is immaterial is obviously absurd.

        • tim gallagher says

          Mar 20, 2019 at 4:21 am

          Very good refutation of Rod’s garbage, gravenimage. I have to say, you have more patience than I do with the way you take the time to argue with these types of people and refute their rubbish. Maybe you will change some of these people’s minds. Personally, I believe that there have been so many Muslim terrorist attacks around the world, so much trouble with barbaric Muslim rape gangs, and other delightful Muslim practices like marrying off underaged girls, honour killings, etc ,that everybody should be able to see that there is clearly a problem with Islam. I consider that anyone who thinks Islam is no worse than any other religion or ideology and that there really is no problem with Islam and that the followers of Islam are no worse and no more murderously violent than followers of other ideologies, you know, people who want to spend their time trying to defend Islam, are really not worth wasting time on. Although I suppose arguing with them can polish your intellectual skills. They are certainly part of the problem and they help endanger all of us non-Muslims, the people I am interested in keeping safe from Islam, our clear and bloodthirsty enemy. I guess I think that some people are too staggeringly dumb to waste time on. I suppose occasionally some of these people do wake up and see how evil Islam is.

        • Rod says

          Mar 20, 2019 at 9:50 am

          Graven image, I’ve pointed out before that your problem with English comprehension makes exchanging ideas difficult. But I’ll try once more.

          Let’s look for a moment at the 40,000 gun deaths in the USA in 2018. Some 60% may be suicides, so about 16,000 Americans were killed by other Americans last year. And nearly as many the year before, etc., etc. Since 9/11 the total must be, conservatively, near 200,000. Then add the numbers killed by knives, clubs, bare hands. Then add the numbers of non-Americans killed by US made bombs, missiles and other weapons. (That will be quite a large number).

          Now tell me why you are so obsessed with Muslim violence, when the USA is such an extraordinarily violent society, and is daily getting more so? Aren’t your priorities a little distorted?

          Now let’s look at your last post –
          I have not said Muslims are not capable of violence.
          I have not said we should ignore the threat of Jihad terror.
          I have not “implied” that the West ignored the savagery of Fascism during WWII (where in god’s name did you get that idiotic idea from? I lived through WWII. Did you?)
          I am not “pretending” that 9/11 had a single victim. (Also idiotic I’m afraid, and an equally pointless comment).
          I am not “pretending” that it is not possible to be against violence on multiple fronts.

          Do you see a pattern emerging here? Now why are you “pretending” that I hold such views? Is that the way to have a rational discussion? Is it perhaps something to do with bigotry, fanaticism?
          You don’t have to answer. But I would ask you and your fellow contributors to think about these matters a little more deeply.

        • gravenimage says

          Mar 22, 2019 at 10:19 pm

          “Rod’s” claims that I lack English comprehension because I counter his bs is ludicrous. And he has no interest in exchanging ideas with Anti-Jihadists here–he just hopes to undermine concerns about the terrible Jihad threat.

          And even if Americans were as violent as he implies, this is at best Tu Quoque. The violence of Americans or any other Infidels does not render the threat from ravening Jihadists any the less.

          And the threat from Islam is not static–save for a few hijackings and of course the terrible Jihad terror attacks on Israel, they hardly existed here just twenty years ago.

          But now, with increasing Muslim immigration, they are *mushrooming* in the West. And it is not just Jihad murder, but also other rampant crimes–including “No Go” Zones and mass rapes.

          And “Rod’s” claims that gun violence is increasing in the US is mistaken at best, mendacious as worst:

          “Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak”

          https://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2013/05/07/gun-homicide-rate-down-49-since-1993-peak-public-unaware/

          Rates are, actually, down 49%.

          Would that we could say the same for Jihad violence. And “Rod” says nothing about Islam’s ultimate purpose, which is to force the submission of all Infidels to brutal Shari’ah law. The violence of Jihad is not random–it has a very clear purpose, as “Rod” no doubt knows.

          And “Rod’s” only stance here has been to minimize the threat of Islam, and to sneer at good people who are concerned about it. *Ugh*.

        • gravenimage says

          Mar 22, 2019 at 10:40 pm

          Tim, the vicious Muslim apologist you are thinking of is Ibrahim itace muhammed. He used to post here all time, but has decamped for short periods before, and seems to have done so again now.

          The unintentionally amusing thing about so many of these “defenders of Islam”–including the above–is that he actually affirms so many of the horrors of Islam, including in his case child marriage, rape in Jihad, the imposition of brutal Islamic law, and the mass slaughter of Infidels.

          And thank you for your kind words, Tim. For the most part, I refute this apologia for savagery not in order to argue with these creeps–most of whom are unlikely to change–but in order to expose their bs for other readers here.

          It is tedious, but, I think, important, lest readers here–especially casual ones–think that these trolls represent Jihad Watch views.

          And I agree–I do think that more people are recognizing that there is something *very* wrong with Islam. Just seeing all of its horrors is damning enough, even for many of those who don’t fully understand that Islam itself teaches this barbarism.

          There is still a lot of denial over Islam, though–a lot of people just don’t want to see how evil it is, and what a threat it represents to us.

          I always enjoy reading your posts, Tim.

      • Leon Degney says

        Mar 19, 2019 at 2:17 am

        Tim 40,000 Islamic attacks on Non-Muslims since 2001 equates 3.9 plus, almost 4 EVERY HOUR since 2001. Possibly a slightly higher figure because we are only 3 months into the current year. I agree with your re your comment about what has happened in the past we should be concerned with the here and now. The ratbag powers that be just CANNOT for some obscure reason get it through their thick sculls that curbing the right of people to speak against Muslim atrocities and the inhumane treatment of their females and making it a crime to speak out, while simultaneously holding Muslims up to be the victims in ALL circumstances whether they are the perpetrators or the actual victims as was the case in NZ, can only lead to more atrocities such as we have recently witnessed there. You are totally correct in that the countries who are not admitting Muslims are free of Jihad killings and Islamic atrocities generally. How much longer can this go on before there is all out war. The abysmal treatment of Tommy Robinson by the UK establishment should be enough to show the world just how far the globalist elites are prepared to go to stifle free speech and freedom of expression.

        • tim gallagher says

          Mar 19, 2019 at 6:22 pm

          Thanks for your comment, Leon. Yes, it is amazing that everyone doesn’t see the problem with islam and terrorist attacks and , as you say, “inhumane”, barbaric attitude to women, etc. And you’re right that I’m sure Hungary, Poland, Japan, etc aren’t suffering from Muslim terrorist attacks at concerts or on promenades like in Nice, because they don’t have Muslims there to commit the attacks. Keeping Muslims out is the only solution that I can find. Too late of course. Our countries have sleepwalked into this trouble by importing large numbers of Muslims with incompatible values. It is very troubling where it could all end up. “Ratbags” is probably a good way to describe some our pathetic political leaders. I forgot to thank abad and James( down below) for their comments.

        • gravenimage says

          Mar 22, 2019 at 10:41 pm

          +1

    • abad says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 10:00 pm

      True that.

      And how do we know they were not “meeting and praying” (orchestrating) for an attack on Jewish New Zealanders? Or Christian New Zealanders?

      What Moslems are presently doing to the Philippines isn’t bad enough – they want to drag New Zealand into the mix.

      smh

    • James says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 10:09 pm

      ““Calling for or justifying a massacre of innocent people is one thing”

      Huh?

      Muslims are forever calling for the deaths of the infidels!”

      And plenty of them go further, and kill for for their great prophet Baphomet, “the perfect man”. But those events are ignored by the MSM. Murder of infidels is totally OK – unless the murderer is a kaffir.

  5. Ruth says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 2:27 pm

    Gateshead institute & Politico have started that the shooter declared to be a Socialist, supports Communist China and detests Conservatism. Not far right !!

  6. eduardo odraude says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 2:29 pm

    The chief characteristic of immigration policy should be that, without mentioning any particular religion, the policy institutes a moratorium on immigration from any nation that does not protect freedom of speech and freedom of religion. The policy could make exceptions for dissidents, oppressed minorities (if they respect freedom of religion and speech), and perhaps for scientists. The immigration policy described would cut immigration not only from Islamic nations, but also from China and perhaps even from Europe, and would impose new global pressures to provide stronger protections for free speech and freedom of religion. Since the proposed immigration policy would not mention any particular religion, it would not provoke huge First Amendment controversies and thus might not be politically impossible.

    • CogitoErgoSum says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 3:19 pm

      Yes, but if I lived in a nation that does not protect freedom of religion and freedom of speech I would want to get out too. Sort of a Catch-22 going on there. I think you may still have to look at a person’s religion and if your religion is against freedom of religion or freedom of speech, you are not allowed entry for permanent residence. Sorry for fans of freedom of religion, but I don’t see how that can last when one of the religions given freedom is determined to take away the freedom of all other religions. Stifling one religion would help ensure the survival of freedom of religion for all …. as much as possible. Realistically speaking, it would be extremely hard to do and probably by the time people see the need to do it, it will be too late. I can’t see any alternative except allowing Islam slowly to take over or openly passing laws against it … because its end goal is to make the world submit to it.

      • eduardo odraude says

        Mar 17, 2019 at 4:59 pm

        “Yes, but if I lived in a nation that does not protect freedom of religion and freedom of speech I would want to get out too.” — CogitoErgoSum

        Ok but that sounds a bit like in responding to my comment you read too quickly. Part of what I said: “The policy could make exceptions for dissidents, [and] oppressed minorities (if they respect freedom of religion and speech)…”

        You suggest we should start discriminating on the basis of religion, and you say, “Stifling one religion would help ensure the survival of freedom of religion for all …. as much as possible. Realistically speaking, it would be extremely hard to do and probably by the time people see the need to do it, it will be too late. ”

        Precisely because what you propose is “extremely hard to do” — in fact essentially impossible in the US because of our legal traditions — I proposed in my 2:29 pm comment an immigration policy that might be politically possible because it would not mention any religion but could still slow or stop Islamization, and also put real pressure on China, Europe, and the Islamic world to do a better job protecting freedom of speech.

        • eduardo odraude says

          Mar 17, 2019 at 5:01 pm

          I only meant to italicize “politically possible” — not the rest.

        • CogitoErgoSum says

          Mar 17, 2019 at 8:21 pm

          Eduardo, yes, you are right. I should have read more carefully.

    • Savvy Kafir says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 4:38 pm

      We can make this a lot simpler, by permanently banning all immigration from all Muslim-majority countries — except for non-Muslim refugees trying to escape persecution. And if our political “leaders” and the public in general understood the threat posed by Islam, that is exactly what would happen. Just before the mass deportations begin.

    • gravenimage says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 10:02 pm

      eduardo odraude wrote:

      The chief characteristic of immigration policy should be that, without mentioning any particular religion, the policy institutes a moratorium on immigration from any nation that does not protect freedom of speech and freedom of religion.
      …………….

      The problem with this, Eduardo, is that many who came to the US were escaping just such nations because they wanted the freedoms they could not have there.

      Of course, Muslims mostly want to crush the freedoms we have here.

    • Leon Degney says

      Mar 19, 2019 at 2:22 am

      How about “Freedom of Speech and “of / from” Religion”.

  7. CRUSADER says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 2:30 pm

    “Crocodile Tears are stoking dishonesty and hatred…
    (Dhimmirat) Democrat Party becoming a Godless political party….
    There is nothing more important you could do UNTIL you have prayed…”

    — Pastor Jeffrees

    Muslims are being looked upon as terrorists…
    We need to focus on white nationalists…
    It is hurtful to talk about Islamic terrorists….

    — Dr Afridi

    (Original hate is Anti-Semitism)
    “We have been targeted by Islamist terrorists…
    …part of what they are trying to destroy are the communities of faith….”

    — Rabbi Cooper

  8. somehistory says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 2:32 pm

    The “wild beast” and the “false prophet” have sent their soldiers out with swords drawn, looking for the ones without the “mark.”

    Those without the “mark of the beast” are being targeted, esp those who dare speak the Truth about the beast, its image and the false prophet.

    This guy in the U.K. has been “suspected” of writing things in support of the shootings in NZ. What exactly did he write? Was he really supporting the shooter, or was he comparing what the guy did to what moslims have been doing for years?

    If he wrote in support of the guy’s evil deeds, then that is cause for censure. If he was comparing, that is a totally different issue…but will not matter to those fighting against the Truth.

    • underbed cat says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 3:07 pm

      Agree good comment.

      • somehistory says

        Mar 17, 2019 at 4:07 pm

        underbed cat

        Thank you.

  9. Terence says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 2:40 pm

    What about all the massacres of Christians
    In no Nigerian . Egypt . Etc hundreds massacred no media news

    • VRWC member77 says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 5:02 pm

      “The force said: “This is a very difficult time for people. The events in New Zealand have reverberated around the world.

      “Many people are in deep shock and are worried. It is at times like this that, as a community, we stand together.”

      Well I would say “The force” have just proven themselves to be full blown racists as I haven’t heard them express any shock about the OVER 100 NIGERIANS MURDERED by the FULANI ISLAMIC TERRORISTS in the past two weeks. Apparently “The force” over in Britain value people who have lighter complexions than Nigerians. That is quite disgusting considering the fact that Nigeria is much closer to “The force” over in the UK than New Zealand.

  10. underbed cat says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 2:51 pm

    In a culture that follows slander law of sharia that may include repeating sura’s and has criminalization of offensive speech affecting muslims, for the non muslims, arrest is the result. The irony is it only flows one way. The Quds day parade is one example of no offense that is offensive to non muslims but chanted in Arabic. Offensive signs calling for death of Jews/ Christians or atheists may or may not get the same result.

  11. Niemoller says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 2:55 pm

    While Muslims are mourning over the horrible terrorist attack in New Zealand, why don’t they also do the decent thing and apologize in the name of Islam for the three jihad mass murders of 120+ Christians in Nigeria and Mozambique this week, and the 3000 missing Yazidi girls who were determined this week to have been murdered by Muslims?

    • Terry Gain says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 3:30 pm

      Well of course Muslims don’t have to apologize for the murders committed by Muslims who emulate Muhammad. Their idiot Leftist protectors just lie about Islam being hijacked.

    • abad says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 10:04 pm

      They won’t ever apologize for crimes committed by their brethren.

      And failing to apologize is a sign of pure evil.

      Then they wonder why they are not welcome in western countries.

      • Carolyne says

        Mar 18, 2019 at 12:28 am

        They won’t ever apologise because the murder of non-Muslims is encouraged in the Koran. It is not a crime.

  12. somehistory says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 3:44 pm

    The families of the dead are impatiently waiting to bury the victims.

    One of these is a small boy, three years old. One report said that when the shooting began, he ran toward the shooter, most likely thinking it was just a ‘video game’ like he played with his older brother. His father and brother ran is different directions.

    This little boy is a victim of human evil. It is sad that he died. It is also sad that had he lived, he would have learned to hate all those not like him. That is the reality of islam.

  13. Seth says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 3:52 pm

    The enemy is not just Islam. The greater enemy is those with power who import and impose upon the West adherents of an alien, evil ideology, and punish those who resist.

    • abad says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 10:05 pm

      +1

  14. Ole Pederson says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 4:25 pm

    Is there any quote so we can see what the guy actually posted? If not, it could have been anything!

  15. george whyte says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 4:46 pm

    I Predicted the Christchurch Mosque Massacre https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pawij9XrZjQ

  16. Ashley says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 4:50 pm

    I could use some help here.

    It is my understanding that Brenton Tarrant was posting his ramblings and intentions on some site, 8chan. Who monitors this site? I did a soft dig to discover that all sorts of sordid shit is posted on 8chan…porn, child abuse, etc.

    It is also my understanding that Tarrant was encouraged to follow through with his attack by other 8chan members.

    A social media post supporting this horrific attack after the fact is unseemly, but I don’t think criminal. The idiot should be tossed from the platform…but arrested?

    Egging Tarrant on to commit these atrocities IS criminal, IMO.

    I know nothing about this 8chan community. Is it deemed a social media outlet? The Dark Web?

    Any insight/input would be appreciated.

    Thanks!

    • gravenimage says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 6:49 pm

      Ashley, there are individual “boards” at 8chan, and little oversight from ownership, except to say, “do not post, request, or link to any content illegal in the United States of America. Do not create boards with the sole purpose of posting or spreading such content.” Of course, many of the NZ posts did just that.

      Here’s more, from Wikipedia:

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8chan

      There has also, as you note, been child porn reported on 8chan.

    • eduardo odraude says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 7:18 pm

      People making comments explicitly and specifically supporting illegal violence should face some sort of punishment. If a comment is at all vague or hypothetical, though, it should be protected speech. I don’t know what sort of punishment would be proportionate for internet comments that explicitly call for violence. I think it depends on the circumstances and exactly what was said.

      People sometimes think virtual internet reality is not reality and anonymous comments are not real comments. But instigating illegal violence is instigating violence, and should be punished by the law, unless we want to live under mobs, thugs and dictators (we don’t).

      By now, we all know too well that many people, perhaps sometimes even ourselves, when on the internet and anonymous, uncage the scoundrel lurking within and say things never said when not anonymous. Perhaps most people tend, at times, to behave a little less responsibly when anonymous. That’s a downside of the internet. It creates a society-wide anonymous interaction in which hatred and nastiness and carelessness, among other vices, are unleashed, where people need not be polite or decent or humble in expressing their opinions and listening to the opinions of others. On the other hand, the internet has created an often uncensored source of information available nowhere else.

      In any case, I’m sure lawyers and judges could find comparable pre-internet examples that would provide guidance as to what punishment would be reasonable and proportionate.

      • eduardo odraude says

        Mar 17, 2019 at 7:34 pm

        Criticism of Islam, however, should not be confused with calls for violence or acts of violence against Muslims. Criticism of Islam should be protected speech, just like criticism of Christianity or any other religion. Those who seek to censor open discussion of Islam actually are in part responsible for violence against Muslims. Was it not John F. Kennedy who said something like “if peaceful resistance becomes impossible, then violent resistance will become inevitable.” So all the leftists seeking to censor any criticism of Islam are indirectly producing circumstances where violence may become inevitable.

        It should be kept in context, too. The lowest possible documented estimate — indeed too low, even by BBC standards — is that there have been some 35,000 deadly jihad attacks in the name of Islam since 2002. See thereligionofpeace.com

        Again, the lowest possible estimate of the number of deaths from those attacks is 100,000, and many more injured. Probably the real number is 5 or 10 times higher. Why? Because thereligionofpeace website is extremely careful in counting and prefers to undercount rather than exaggerate. The New Zealand attacks certainly deserve condemnation. And so does the ongoing jihadist holocaust against non-Muslims around the globe.

        • gravenimage says

          Mar 18, 2019 at 9:21 pm

          Good posts, Eduardo.

  17. gravenimage says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 6:35 pm

    UK: Man arrested for “malicious” social media post about New Zealand shootings
    ………………..

    This is borderline.

    But yes–if this, as is likely, extends to those who merely oppose Jihad terror, then it is deeply alarming.

    • Leon Degney says

      Mar 19, 2019 at 4:13 am

      There is plenty in the UK and indeed, the world in general, to be deeply alarmed about. Have you seen where the UK Attorney General has trumped up charges against Tommy Robinson. They have invented a crime that was not even alluded to in the initial charge of contempt of court which were thrown out and he was released The new charges he now must answer on the 22nd March is one of causing *anxiety to the Muslims who were sentenced, in that they felt unsafe entering and leaving court because they feared mob violence* because Tommy Robinson was live streaming outside the court. Has anyone ever heard or experienced a situation such as this in a first world country. The fact that it took five months for these charges to be incubated and hatched tells a story in my opinion. The UK is absolutely doomed, a basket case on life support from which, under current circumstances there can be no recovery.

      • gravenimage says

        Mar 19, 2019 at 6:12 pm

        Yes–very disturbing.

  18. eduardo odraude says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 6:44 pm

    The only kind of speech that should face punishment is speech explicitly supporting illegal violence. If someone posts comments in support of the New Zealand massacre, whether before or afterwards, I think that person’s violence-supporting speech can reasonably be censored and/or punished.

    • gravenimage says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 6:52 pm

      Agreed, Eduardo.

  19. Indiana Tom says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 7:14 pm

    A man has been arrested in the UK on suspicion of making a malicious social media post about the attacks that killed 49 people at mosques in New Zealand.

    GMP said where “people cross the line, we will take robust action, which may include arrest and prosecution”
    Yes, even if this means pulling our policemen off serious knife, assault, theft, and rape crimes.

    • eduardo odraude says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 7:55 pm

      Police should not be devoted to people who are merely criticizing Islam. But police can reasonably be devoted to people who explicitly and specifically call for illegal violence, whether on the internet or not.

      Unfortunately, we have heard how in the UK police are used against people who are merely criticizing Islam. It is remarkable how many intelligent people do not get the importance of maximizing free speech, how many are prepared to normalize restrictions to it. There is always a rationale, and the rationale is almost always wrong. In this area, Europe, which in some ways is more civilized than the US, is barbarian. And Europe as an open society may die in the next generation or two because of that one failing.

      • eduardo odraude says

        Mar 17, 2019 at 7:57 pm

        Europeans need a free speech law as robust and expansive as the First Amendment to the US Constitution.

        • gravenimage says

          Mar 17, 2019 at 8:05 pm

          +1

  20. kji says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 10:34 pm

    The Antichrist is already here, all of you Christians and any of you even remotely associated with the morals of Christianity are already being rounded up, and you will be punished by the Antichrist and his attack dog, Islam.

  21. na says

    Mar 17, 2019 at 11:24 pm

    America is collapsed and its medias are also collapsed.now Facebook is a terrorist book. See Russian news channel RT now a days very popular than any US media. Cause of American collapse is proxy. Mr x has proxy in Iran. Mr y has in Afghanistan. So US is divided. And they have a prater Turkey they are also not reliable. Turks declare them self “our mat ancestors were sex slaves. so 90 % Turks are son of bit*****chs. We were the sex slaves of Roman trade. In 1913 Greek slapped on our face . We cried for freedom”. But sometimes they “We are champions”.
    But the truth is first.

    • gravenimage says

      Mar 17, 2019 at 11:28 pm

      RT is very pro-Iran. I’m not sure I’d tout them.

  22. Jayell says

    Mar 18, 2019 at 2:04 am

    “Many people are in deep shock and are worried. It is at times like this that, as a community, we stand together.”

    Which ‘community’?

  23. UNCLE VLADDI says

    Mar 18, 2019 at 4:48 am

    “Right-wingers” is the totalitarian gangsters’ main dog-whistle against all gang-resistant individuals.

    All “leftists” are gangsters, bent on total control over everyone else; their ultimate goal is slavery.

    COMMUNISM is predicated on the zero-sum notion that, “While only groups of people as a whole strive to improve their lot from hope, so individuals within those sacred groups will also, contrarily, work to improve only their own lots – which is called GREED!”

    In other words, in Communist “thought,” if and when people work as individuals to only improve their own lives, such “selfishness” can only be achieved at the direct expense of the collective whole!

    To most sane, rational human individuals who aren’t so enamored of idolatrous gang rights supplanting their own basic human rights, however, it’s obvious that this government-speak is a false paradigm, as any and all groups must consist of individuals.

  24. Felix Quigley says

    Mar 18, 2019 at 7:08 am

    Gravenimage who comments on Jihadwatch along with another person comes out unopposed (By anyone I could see) in favour of censorship. This is her/his full comment:

    “UK: Man arrested for “malicious” social media post about New Zealand shootings
    ………………..

    WRITES GRAVENIMAGE MOST SURPRISINGLY
    QUOTE”This is borderline.

    But yes–if this, as is likely, extends to those who merely oppose Jihad terror, then it is deeply alarming.” END QUOTE
    https://www.jihadwatch.org/2019/03/uk-man-arrested-for-malicious-social-media-post-about-new-zealand-shootings?fbclid=IwAR2Sl_RLo0FZZrGb1ZZIQ8RKPnWyYFjBlZ5BeBvNz2-tU21PkXBQpv0jA5k

    I say on behalf of my website http://www.trotskyist.org and in direct and TOTAL opposition to this position of Gravenimage…

    We in the socialist/communist/trotskyist movement and in opposition to all forms of repression are for total and complete opposition to censorship in all forms, and we call to our colleagues in the anti Jihad movement to do the same.

    Therefore and thereby in total opposition to the calls for censorship by this person Gravenimage who I am afraid is masquerading as a person who opposes Jihad BUT IS OBVIOUSLY NOT BECAUSE THIS CALL FOR CENSORSHIP BY GRAVENIMAGE IS REALLY A JIHADIST SUPPORTING CALL.

    ABOVE…the important issue with Gravenimage is when she/he says that “This is borderline”.

    We on our website invite you to go back and check on what Gravenimage is saying is borderline. This is actually atrocious and disgusting.

    The point about this is that the position of Gravenimage is without any ambiguity. Gravenimage is FOR censorship and that raises the question is Gravenimage not a very big DANGER TO US ALL?

    • Ernie says

      Mar 18, 2019 at 8:59 pm

      Not Gravenimage , but YOU and your fascist agenda , ” Felix Quigley ” , are a VERY , VERY BIG DANGER TO US ALL .

    • gravenimage says

      Mar 18, 2019 at 9:59 pm

      Felix Quigley wrote:

      Gravenimage who comments on Jihadwatch along with another person comes out unopposed (By anyone I could see) in favour of censorship. This is her/his full comment:

      “UK: Man arrested for “malicious” social media post about New Zealand shootings
      ………………..

      WRITES GRAVENIMAGE MOST SURPRISINGLY
      QUOTE”This is borderline.

      But yes–if this, as is likely, extends to those who merely oppose Jihad terror, then it is deeply alarming.” END QUOTE
      https://www.jihadwatch.org/2019/03/uk-man-arrested-for-malicious-social-media-post-about-new-zealand-shootings?fbclid=IwAR2Sl_RLo0FZZrGb1ZZIQ8RKPnWyYFjBlZ5BeBvNz2-tU21PkXBQpv0jA5k

      I say on behalf of my website http://www.trotskyist.org and in direct and TOTAL opposition to this position of Gravenimage…
      ……………………..

      Felix Quigley is in “TOTAL opposition” to considering inciting violence to be an issue? No surprise there.

      I have always said that I am a free speech absolutist *save* for inciting violence. *If* this was a genuine inciting of violence–rather than just persecuting those who oppose Jihad terror–then this is indeed an issue.

      For instance, I have no problem with Felix Quigley’s ugly and dishonest comments here–I just think he should be countered with the truth.

      And who is this unnamed other person? Who knows?

      Clearly, Felix Quigley only takes me on because I regularly oppose his desire to see us all crushed under the horrors of Communism.

      More:

      We in the socialist/communist/trotskyist movement and in opposition to all forms of repression are for total and complete opposition to censorship in all forms, and we call to our colleagues in the anti Jihad movement to do the same.
      ……………………..

      This is, of course, just grotesque. The idea that Communism is opposed to censorship could not be more grimly laughable–Communism is and continues to be one of the most oppressive of all tyrannies.

      More:

      Therefore and thereby in total opposition to the calls for censorship by this person Gravenimage who I am afraid is masquerading as a person who opposes Jihad BUT IS OBVIOUSLY NOT BECAUSE THIS CALL FOR CENSORSHIP BY GRAVENIMAGE IS REALLY A JIHADIST SUPPORTING CALL.
      ……………………..

      Uh…right. I’m supporting Jihad by saying that inciting violence is a bad thing–including incitement to Jihad violence. How does that work, exactly?

      More:

      ABOVE…the important issue with Gravenimage is when she/he says that “This is borderline”.

      We on our website invite you to go back and check on what Gravenimage is saying is borderline. This is actually atrocious and disgusting.
      ……………………..

      How is coming out against inciting violence “actually atrocious and disgusting”? Is it because Felix Quigley knows that Communism cannot be imposed on its victims without violence? *Ugh*.

      More:

      The point about this is that the position of Gravenimage is without any ambiguity. Gravenimage is FOR censorship and that raises the question is Gravenimage not a very big DANGER TO US ALL?
      ……………………..

      The implication that incitement to violence is what free speech is all about is just grotesque.

      This coming from a Communist really does not surprise, though.

      In an 1848 newspaper article, Karl Marx wrote:

      “there is only one way in which the murderous death agonies of the old society and the bloody birth throes of the new society can be shortened, simplified and concentrated, and that way is revolutionary terror.”

      And here is Leon Trotsky:

      “The dictatorship of the Communist Party is maintained by recourse to every form of violence.”

      and

      “Under all conditions, well-organized violence seems to him the shortest distance between two points.”

    • gravenimage says

      Mar 19, 2019 at 6:27 pm

      Good posts, Boromir’s Horn and Ernie.

  25. Jayme says

    Mar 18, 2019 at 7:22 am

    Anyone that calls for violence should be arrested and I don’t care who they are be it a citizen or a reporter or to the higher ups pms/presidents etc.

  26. WPM says

    Mar 18, 2019 at 7:27 am

    Gravenimage is against people threating people on line with violence if that was why that person was arrested for we do not know. ,As far as your posting the rest of your communist cheerleading you should be free to post it ,like the people of the flat earth society can post there beliefs on line.

    • gravenimage says

      Mar 18, 2019 at 10:01 pm

      Thank you, WPM. Agreed.

    • Leon Degney says

      Mar 19, 2019 at 4:27 am

      It would be good to know what this person posted. At least then it would give us some idea of just how draconian the laws supposedly controlling what can and cannot be said are. But I doubt they will do us the courtesy.

      • gravenimage says

        Mar 19, 2019 at 6:29 pm

        Yes–I wish we knew exactly what it was he said.

  27. pearl says

    Mar 18, 2019 at 1:34 pm

    While I think it’s wrong to applaud or cheer for violence of any kind, I also think that it is insanity to criminalize insensitivity. People have a right to their opinions. And criminalizing the sharing of information is just one more step on the road to totalitarianism. The NZ govt is a complete autocracy and deserves to be overthrown.

    • Leon Degney says

      Mar 19, 2019 at 4:30 am

      In my opinion, given half a chance Adhern would be a dictator .Just as would A.O Cortez in the US congress.

      • gravenimage says

        Mar 19, 2019 at 6:31 pm

        The above happened in the UK, not New Zealand.

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