Andy Ngo was attacked by Antifa Leftists, and Islamic apologist C.J. Werleman says it’s because he is “anti-Muslim,” i.e., he opposes jihad terror.
Anti-fascists (you know, like Second World War veterans) attacked him not because of his race or sexual orientation, but because he's a Muslim hating fascist who panders to and promotes white supremacists. https://t.co/aJmak1GkhA
— CJ Werleman (@cjwerleman) June 30, 2019
Ok, in no way am I endorsing or condoning violence in the above tweet or anywhere else. I'm merely explaining why Andy Ngo was attacked.
— CJ Werleman (@cjwerleman) June 30, 2019
Actually, C. J. Werleman is a fascist who has long promoted violence against those whom he hates, likens the fascist thugs of Antifa beating up a journalist to the heroes who fought Nazism. In reality, it was the Nazi Brownshirts who engaged in street violence as Antifa does today.
Werleman isn’t the only one:
I’d argue what the fear mongering he’s done against Muslims plus the work he’s done to discredit hate crimes, helped create an atmosphere of violence that vulnerable people all have to live through just for being who they are. This is bad, but he’s guilty of worse.
— Aymann Ismail (@aymanndotcom) June 30, 2019
Police have received information that some of the milkshakes thrown today during the demonstration contained quick-drying cement. We are encouraging anyone hit with a substance today to report it to police.
— Portland Police (@PortlandPolice) June 29, 2019
Here’s @donlemon glorifying criminal enterprise Antifa, which today led to the hospitalization of my client @MrAndyNgo with a brain bleed. He was targeted because he consistently reports on their activities and calls out their violence. It was not the 1st time they assaulted him. https://t.co/lc0s5q4AMY
— Harmeet K. Dhillon (@pnjaban) June 30, 2019
— Andy Ngô 🏳️🌈 (@MrAndyNgo) June 29, 2019
This is the Left today, not just vilifying and defaming people who oppose jihad violence and Sharia oppression of women and others, but actively targeting them for violent attacks. The Brownshirts have returned.
“Journalist Andy Ngo Attacked At Portland Rally. He’s Reportedly Sustaining Injuries,” Daily Caller News Foundation, June 30, 2019:
Journalist Andy Ngo, who covers Antifa activity, was attacked at a Portland rally Saturday and has reportedly been admitted to the hospital.
Masked individuals attacked Ngo at a rally in Oregon, throwing what appeared to be milkshakes at him and punching him, according to footage of the attack.
Ngo is an editor for Quillette who describes himself as “hated by [A]ntifa” on his Twitter profile. He recorded the aftermath of the day’s events on social media. The video showed Ngo with scars on his face in addition to what appeared to be swelling….
nicu says
antifa are the real fascists with Islam !
mortimer says
Andy Ngo is a hero of democracy and freedom of conscience.
Antifa are the real fascists. They are vigilante thugs like Hitler’s brown shirts.
J D S says
Muslims have no right to say FEAR MONGERING is the problem..Read my earlier post..They have used FEAR from the beginning to promote their FAKE religion and FAKE God.
Grayhound Fancier says
The thugs are masked. They act like brownshirts. Why are they not arrested the minute they show up with their face covered/commit any act of violence?
del says
“antifa” is fa.
somehistory says
On the video, made by a guy named Ryan, the masked terrorists…and yes, they are terrorists…seemed to be so proud of themselves. So, why not show their faces? Cowardice and not wishing to be arrested for assault.
Why do the authorities allow these lawless people to go about with their faces hidden? If they walked into a bank or a courthouse, city hall, etc., they would be made to take off their face coverings.
Why are they allowed to go with hidden faces…and hence, concealed identities…on the street, esp when they are engaging in mob violence?
Mac-101 says
Because these Antifa Scum are the Elite Globalist Brown Shirts! They are to instill fear so no one will stand up against them. When you do THEY use the courts to bust you and take ALL you have! THEY will murder Billions of us once THEY gain total power!
Angemon says
“THEY will murder Billions of us once THEY gain total power!”
I recall a German Youtuber that covers this sort of issues – the rise of the far left, islam in Germany, etc. – mentioning that, on a street protest some Antifa members demanded to know his name. When he asked why, they told him “so we can get you on the kill list” He asked “you’re planning on killing me? and they answered “once we’re in power”.
Mac-101 says
These Scum are just doin the Globalist dirty work and a few of their supporting agencies are
financed by the International Terrorist Soros’ NGOs.
.
There are a multitude of Globalist sites which state that only 500million will be left on the earth. This is BEFORE Automation and Robotics! The Elites consider Humanity a scourge upon the Earth since THEIR Father, Satan, rebelled against G-d because G-d favored humans.
.
As a backup, every time Progressives gain power THEY murder Millions with their KILL lists since THEY have ALL the opposition infiltrated and have their organization membership lists. THEY are of Satan. Murdering tens of millions of babies prove that!
t. says
It’s been a long time I didn’t see any comments of yours on this site, Mac-101!
Mac-101 says
t.says, thanks. I comment a couple times a week. I try skimmin it daily. Way to depressing seein Western Civilization bein sold out to these Satanic Scum by the very people These Islamist hate the most! My apologies for restating the obvious over and over.
.
However I fell the End Times be a-comin and Islam will be used by the Globalist Scum to control the masses and it fits Revelation perfectly. If I help one soul be strong during the Tribulation it will be well worth it. Perhaps I can save mine along the way. Peace Brother!
Angemon says
Two things:
1 – I’m certain he was not attacked by “Second World War veterans”. I mam also certain that “Second World War veterans” would consider his attackers to be the ones in the wrong here.
2 – In any other scenario, a gay Asian getting attacked by masked people would be lauded, by the likes of Werlman as evidence that America is a “white supremacist” nation . That’s the fatal flaw within intersectionality – all minorities are equal and must support one another until they find themselves at odds over specific issues. Since Mr. Ngo didn’t act the way his attackers expected him to based on his physical features – because they’re not the racist ones, you see, they simply think that race, skin colour and sexual orientation must dictate what you think and how you act – he was moved into a different group – he went from being a minority and therefore unable to do any wrong into being a “fascist” and an ally of “white supremacists”, thus becoming a valid target.
This is a disturbing development, but the next logical step after the milkshaking.
somehistory says
Angemon
“Second World War veterans”…the ones still alive, are fairly old. WW2 was over 74 years ago and the least anyone would be who “served” would be, if they joined in 45, lying about their age, would be 91.
The idiot liar making that claim doesn’t believe people can think or add. Even if any guys were only 16 in 1945 would make them 90 years old. I didn’t see any guys that old in the mob, much less, throwing cement at the reporter.
Angemon says
If I were a WWII veteran, I’d feel insulted by being compared to Antifa’s cowardly thugs.
somehistory says
Since there are so few left to feel anything, I feel insulted on their behalf. My father was in the army during that war.
don vito says
This is Civil War in the West, this is how moslems and marxist intend to gain power over civil society, one neighborhood, one segment of western society at a time. Piecemeal, slowly, criminally. Attack people that show antifa and allies, as they truly are. Truth is suspect. The whole West must be captured by the delusional narrative of the left/liberal/progressive/marxist/moslem/ manmade climate change bunch. To subdue a free and free thinking people and civilization.
Mac-101 says
So True. Just look at who finances these scum! International Banksters. Our future is a nightmare compilation of 1984, Animal Farm, Brave New World and Revelation ALL mixed together!
.
These Neo Bolshevik Scum will murder Billions once THEY gain total power over THEIR NWO!
strange quark says
Add Fahrenheit 451 to your list.
Mac-101 says
I usually include it. The Google memory HOLE is REAL! History is constantly rewritten and abolished!
Walter Sieruk says
The hooligans who make up Antifa might say that he a a strong belief in values and that their ideas are the correct ideas yet their violent uncivilized behavior tell otherwise. In other words, the actions of the Antifa members by their own violent actions disprove any claim that they have made about “goodvalues” and “good ideas.”
So those brutal ruffians of Aftifa who viciously attacked Andy Ngo are , somewhat of ,a reminder of the 1979 movie which is entitled TIME AFTER TIME .In which the hero in that movie said “The first man to raise his fist is the man who has run out of idea’s” So those of Antifa and other of the radical left are those in this cultural war are those men who “have run of Idea’s”
PRCS says
Remember what brought Ngo to prominence:
This video of a Portland State University Muslim explaining the death penalty for apostasy:
https://twitter.com/MrAndyNgo/status/857469487909490688
Ngo was fired for accurately reporting that.
Mac-101 says
A True Hero! Risking Death to speak Truth to Power!
gravenimage says
Appalling, PRCS. Thank you for that information.
C T says
Just like one could oppose the USSR and support the people imprisoned in the gulag system, one can oppose Islamic theology tenets while loving Muslims.
People are not the mind prisons into which they are born.
Battle says
Lord bless Andy Ngo.
gravenimage says
+1
Georg says
Leftist political strategy has evolved from intimidation to libel/slander, conspiracy (as with Spygate), the dissolution of our border and violence. It’s now clear they are involved in an assault of America, Americans, and Americanness. The worst among the world are hoping for the success of Antifa and the Democratic Party.
Mac-101 says
I wonder how much scum like C.J. Werleman git paid to actively work to destroy Western Civilization for their Globalist Puppet Masters/Bankrollers?
Alarmed Pig Farmer says
George Soros has a lot of admirers.
Mac-101 says
So does Satan. He should be charged as a Domestic and International Terrorist and deported to Hungary. Or even Russia. Putin would know what to do with him!
lebel says
“Ok, in no way am I endorsing or condoning violence in the above tweet or anywhere else. I’m merely explaining why Andy Ngo was attacked.
— CJ Werleman (@cjwerleman) June 30, 2019”
This is basically the Christchurch thread.
In that thread discussing the murder of over 50 men, women and children, everyone sought to also “explain” why it happened. The shooter was pushed into this by the Western Governments who were hard enough on Islam. Most of course, IN NO WAY, we condoning violence.
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2019/03/new-zealand-murders-repercussions-and-perspective
” If Western leaders did their part to deal honestly with islam’s violent jihad agenda then certain folks wouldn’t feel compelled to take matters into their own hands so drastically. “
Angemon says
I think you need to look up the meaning of “equivalence”. Unless, of course, if you were going for the false kind. If so, congratulations…
lebel says
Calling out hypocrisy is important. Jihadwatchers are outraged when they get a taste of their own medicine except in the Christchurch case it was mass murder and here someone got roughed up.
Angemon says
“Calling out hypocrisy is important.”
There’s no “hypocrisy” here.
“Jihadwatchers are outraged when they get a taste of their own medicine”
Uh, what? Can you point out to the parts where:
A) – Andy Ngo posted on JW
B) – Andy Ngo defended the Christchurch shooter
BTW, if calling out hypocrisy is important, how about you start with yourself?
Angemon says
OK, OK, I realize you possibly lack the self-awareness level to analyze your actions, so let’s start with Werleman, who said of the Christchurch massacre: “ The Christchurch mosque terrorist is a direct product of Australia’s mainstream political discourse.“. Why aren’t you calling him out on this? After all, if you’re trying to equate the brutal attack on Andy Ngo with the Christchurch attack and calling out hypocrisy you could start by asking Werleman why isn’t he saying the attack on Ngo is the result of America’s mainstream political discourse…
Lydia Church says
Calling out hypocrisy???
A ‘taste of their own medicine’?
Do you know how hypocritical that sounds?
muslims go around butchering others, especially Christians constantly.
Then, some psycho goes in and does the Christchurch shootings.
And now muslims get a taste of their own medicine, a very… VERY small one.
And then some fool comes on saying one guy got the tables turned on him, as if it was a one time thing, and that in a situation that has exactly NOTHING to do with Christchurch!
The problem with muslims, (ONE of the MANY) is that they lump everyone else together. You have muslims… and non muslims. That is it for them. All they see is an ‘infidel.’ Jew, Christian, atheist, conservative, gay, porn star, or charity worker. They just see that one… big… label.
Total ignorance!
gravenimage says
The appalling dishonest lebel wrote:
This is basically the Christchurch thread.
In that thread discussing the murder of over 50 men, women and children, everyone sought to also “explain” why it happened. The shooter was pushed into this by the Western Governments who were (sic) hard enough on Islam. Most of course, IN NO WAY, we condoning violence.
………………………..
Of course, Jihad Watch said *nothing* condoning the attack on the Mosque in Christchurch–in fact, Robert Spencer referred to the attack as “savage and heinous”.
Then, saying that Anti-Jihadists are getting a “taste of their own medicine” with the beating of Andy Ngo when no one here has ever said that they have violently attacked others is just grotesque. But then, what else would we expect from lebel?
Norger says
“Then, saying that Anti-Jihadists are getting a “taste of their own medicine” with the beating of Andy Ngo…”
Yeah, I don’t get this at all. So if you call attention to the connection between Islamic theology and Islamic terrorism that’s somehow equivalent to violence? Utterly bizarre “reasoning.”
Lebel fancies himself as a morally superior being. What rot. Keep posting you tool.
gravenimage says
True, Norger.
Alarmed Pig Farmer says
I saw Andy Ngo for the first time on FNC about a month ago. He seemed like a sharp guy, but I couldn’t help think he’s taking a risk. Taking on those two outfits, the Jihadis and the Antifa, you’ve got the two world’s takeover systems, both inherently violent. The Moslems and the Commies.
C T says
“Taking a risk.” It’s what courageous people do.
TheBuffster says
The only alternative to taking a risk is to submit.
gravenimage says
+1
Kay says
It was premeditated assault. There’s video of them handing out cups of quick concrete to throw. I don’t understand why it’s allowed. The Antifa group has a name and a website and ads for positions paying $25/hour.
Greyhound Fancier says
The Portland OR mayor and police do little or nothing to stop antifa. They allow them in the streets masked, looking for a fight.
gravenimage says
You are right:
“Ted Cruz seeks federal action against Portland mayor after antifa attacks journalist”
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2019/jun/30/ted-cruz-seeks-probe-ted-wheeler-portland-antifa-a/
Kay says
Good for Ted Cruz! I hope something comes of his call.
gravenimage says
Me too, Kay.
Carol the 1st says
Cruz is looking very good these days. But can CNN possibly be wrong? – they also compare Antifa to WWll freedom fighters (3:22+). Here’s an interview with Ngo about seven weeks ago
Antifa Is Creating ‘No-Go Zones’ in US Cities: Andy Ngo on Sky News
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3wVYJyb_O4
Abraham Fox says
ANTIFA = George S0R0S. Why is this billionaire thug allowed to finance and promote hate groups like this. And it is not the only disruptive group financed by him.
Mac-101 says
The only reason I can think of is this Soros Scumbag is THEIR man in front of the Curtain with the Goldman Sacks THEIR people who maintain “Respectability” while THEY dismantle Western Civilization to create THEIR Orwellian nightmare.
.
As much as Soros has destabilized the ME and made Israel’s security perilous, why hasn’t at least the Mossad dealt with him? Part of a nefarious Satanic plan?
gravenimage says
Antifa seriously injures journalist Andy Ngo, Islamic apologist CJ Werleman calls Ngo “Muslim hating fascist”
…………………………..
Just repulsive. And the idea that WWII vets fighting fascism were ganging up to attack a physically small and slight man who didn’t even fight back is just calumny against those who *actually* defeated the brutal Nazis.
Here’s more about the disgusting CJ Werleman and his calls for violence against those he disagrees with:
“Atheist Islamic apologist CJ Werleman calls for violence against his political opponents (and Robert Spencer)”
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2017/01/atheist-islamic-apologist-cj-werleman-calls-for-violence-against-his-political-opponents
TheBuffster says
Graven, I don’t think Werleman was saying that literal WW II vets were beating up Ngo.
He said: “Anti-fascists (you know, like Second World War veterans) attacked him not because of his race or sexual orientation, but because he’s a Muslim hating fascist who panders to and promotes white supremacists.”
He’s saying the Antifa thugs are anti-fascists, just like the WWII soldiers who fought the Nazis.
These so-called anti-fascists are a bunch of fantasy-deluded, role-playing, self-glorifying children who fancy themselves as heroic fighters against the likes of Hitler and Mussolini. And yet they’re acting like Brown Shirts.
gravenimage says
TheBuffster wrote:
Graven, I don’t think Werleman was saying that literal WW II vets were beating up Ngo.
……………………..
Buffster, I knew that Werleman wasn’t saying that Ngo was beaten up by WWII vets–but he implied that this is *just* the sort of thing that WWII vets did, which is disgusting slander.
mortimer says
So denouncing jihad fascism and jihad terrorism is now officially called ‘fascist’.
It used to be called ‘FREEDOM-LOVING’.
Apparently, today’s Leftards do not love freedom. We assume that Leftards love slavery, sadism and brutality. Today’s Leftards have much in common with Islam.
Kay says
Reports say there were 200-300 in the Antifa group. I’m not sure how many picked up the concrete “milkshakes, ready to harm someone or something they knew little about.
Most seem to be self-righteous followers who are ready to do evil and believe they are good.
It’s very scary.
It’s made worse that the police, guided by the chief-mayor do nothing and the media presents these incidents as if they are arguments that got out of hand instead of planned violence.
Mac-101 says
I doubt if many of these scumbags would have any difficulty turning on the GAS in the FEMA Camp shower rom on Irredeemable Deplorables!
gravenimage says
FEMA is a disorganized federal agency, but they are *not* running death camps.
Mac-101 says
Of course not. THEY did git and spent 350 million to build FEMA Camps back some years ago. Reported in a couple Financial Magazines a few years ago analyzing the companies financial security. . Where did the money go?
.
Extermination/Detention centers can be thrown up VERY quickly! History has proven that!
gravenimage says
Mac, FEMA camps have trailers for natural disaster victims. The claim that people are being exterminated there is baseless.
There are threats that we genuinely face without making stuff up.
James Lincoln says
mortimer says,
“Today’s Leftards have much in common with Islam.”
Yes, VERY much.
mortimer says
Here’s a sensible twitter response to the idiotic CJ Werleman:
Nick PappasVerified account @NickAPappas · 9h9 hours ago
Replying to @cjwerleman
“Equating those bratty, privileged wannabe radicals to the memory of people who stormed Normandy, fought at Iowa Jima, and so forth is what’s truly insulting.”
CJ Werleman accused Andy Ngo of being a ‘white supremacist’. AN EXAMPLE OF LEFTIST ABSURDITY!
gravenimage says
For those not familiar, here is some work by Andy Ngo, on the Islamization of Britain:
“A Visit to Islamic England”
https://www.wsj.com/articles/a-visit-to-islamic-england-1535581583
Muslim2019 says
Surah 2:251, “So they defeated them by permission of Allah , and David killed Goliath, and Allah gave him the kingship and prophethood and taught him from that which He willed. And if it were not for Allah checking [some] people by means of others, the earth would have been corrupted, but Allah is full of bounty to the worlds.”
Stop the racists, Islamophobes etc in their tracks.
gravenimage says
Talk about projection!
Andy Ngo is physically small, and did not even fight back–and he was attacked by a horde of Antifa thugs, yet “Muslim2019” is trying to pretend that the assailants are “David”, and that the non-violent Ngo is “Goliath”.
“Muslim2019” is calling for mobs to attack those who dare expose the threat of Islam.
CogitoErgoSum says
Muslim2019 would have no problem throwing the first stone since Andy is gay and having a crowd of other Muslims cheering and joining along in the bloodshed would make it extra special for him (or her). Andy has been judged as guilty and the penalty for him is death. Andy is a condemned man and if the Muslims can’t kill him themselves they will have Antifa murder him for them.
TheBuffster says
““Muslim2019” is calling for mobs to attack those who dare expose the threat of Islam.”
As all totalitarian governments encourage their minions to do. Dogmatic, authoritarian minds see nothing wrong with siccing violent mobs against dissidents. Anyone who peacefully speaks truth to their power is considered dirt to be swept away.
Norger says
THIS is just perfect. So that ugly assault we saw on video was God’s work (sorry, I meant “Allah’s work) was it? Bet you said the same thing about 9/11.
Lebel, you getting this?
lebel says
Norger, sounds like Christchurch thread. As I stated on that thread, Jihadwatchers are perfectly capacble of seeing through that kind of reasoning when applied to them but absolutely incapable when applied to Muslims
Norger says
WTF are you even talking about?! This is theological justification for violence you fool. “Christchurch thread” my ass.
gravenimage says
lebel is lying again, claiming that Robert Spencer is calling for violence.
Lydia Church says
And then this clown Aymann!
“I’d argue what the fear mongering he’s done against Muslims plus the work he’s done to discredit hate crimes, helped create an atmosphere of violence that vulnerable people all have to live through just for being who they are. This is bad, but he’s guilty of worse.”
Huh?
Let’s correct this piece of garbage…
“I’d argue what the fear mongering the left and Aymann have done against counter-jihadists plus the work they’ve done to discredit islamic hate crimes, helped create an atmosphere of violence that vulnerable people all have to live through just for being who they are. This is bad, but Aymann’s guilty of worse.”
James Lincoln says
Lydia Church,
Very accurate, my compliments.
Lydia Church says
And why does it feel like we never run out of work correcting and educating the fools out there?!
But this is what it has come to. The Left thinks it is justified to physically attack someone… just for DISAGREEING with them! If that is not fascist, then nothing is! It is Orwellian to the core.
And the left doesn’t even see how deranged they are! The future is not looking good.
“In reality, it was the Nazi Brownshirts who engaged in street violence as Antifa does today.”
Yes, they are the new brownshirts of the day, that is exactly it!
I’m sure nazi’s beat up journalists who did not meet the proper propaganda model either… no one was off limits to them.
The hypocrisy of it all, they are the fascists and they want to use fascist tactics against those they falsely label as ‘fascists,’ and they don’t get it. Does it get any more insane? I don’t want to ask…
rbla says
We have local authorities refusing to protect American citizens from violent mobs. How many are old enough to remember 60 years ago when President Eisenhower sent in the National Guard to protect Black children in Little Rock? Time for Trump and Barr to take similar action.
Georg says
If our CIA hadn’t recently been headed by a communist voter, but acted against enemies foreign and domestic, Soros ought to have been dealt with as (this term is overused and therefore losing its meaning) an existential threat to the United States. He is nothing less than a malignant foreign adversary involved in fomenting sedition and insurrection engaged in undermining our democracy. His penance for amassing a windfall through ruining the Bank of England and damaging other economies through rent-seeking tricksterism is to gift the world our United States. That cannot be allowed to happen. Soros is desperate to dig himself out of his legacy with a final diabolical crescendo where he becomes the chief totem of narcissism through ethno-communist destruction of the free world.
libertyORdeath says
Not sure if its been mentioned yet but there was another group of “Second World War soldiers” who fought against fascism that are more akin to antifa than the ones alluded to in that ignorant post – the Red Army.
It’s no surprise that the whitest and most privileged city in the U.S. has the largest turnout for antifa “protests”. It seems the more insulated you are, the more likely you are to buy into this garbage. I’m always curious as to why these soft, entitled brats don’t just head to one of the socialist “paradises” like China or Cuba where they can see what their firmly held beliefs are all about. I have no love for white supremacists but I can’t remember the last time I saw them cover their faces and resort to mob violence against individuals. First they come after conservatives and counter jihadists, next they may come for YOU!
Carol the 1st says
Off-topic but much is going on in China with democratically-minded citizens of Hong Kong congregating en masse in the streets. China wants extradition and this is going over very badly.
gravenimage says
I knew that China would not respect the rights of Hong Kong. I wish the British had not handed her over to the Communists.
Angemon says
The British are decent, law abiding people. In some cases, that’s a fault.
Jack Holan says
Fascists, Mussolini, Hitler, Franco, Hirohito, Lenin,Stalin, Krushnez, Brezhnev Mao. Its all the same. Antifa is the same as SDS. Accepting of other points of views with brass knuckles.
Mac-101 says
Yup, in the end follow da Money and POWER!
lebel says
” Yeah, I don’t get this at all. So if you call attention to the connection between Islamic theology and Islamic terrorism that’s somehow equivalent to violence? Utterly bizarre “reasoning.
Lebel fancies himself as a morally superior being. What rot. Keep posting you tool.”
I have decided to respond even though, like most jihadwatchers, you choose to insult (and thereby showing that your argument is rather weak).
IF jihadwatch only called attention to the connection between Islamic theology and Islamic terrorism then I would not call jihadwatch a hate site. But it doesn’t, its goal is to spread hate against Muslims.
Norger says
This is beyond rich. So, brazenly dishonest one, are you going to tell me that: (1) you are above resorting to insults; or (2) given the frequency with which you have resorted to “insults” on this site,you now concede your arguments are “rather weak?”
I’m not sure what part of my “argument” you consider “weak.” No doubt, you consider yourself morally superior to us dastardly JW readers, no? That’s not an argument, that’s the truth and you know it. Come on Lebel,be honest for once.
The only substantive point you made above was the conclusory statement (or “insult”) that the goal of JW is to spread hate against Muslims. That’s a bold statement. I’m calling you out on that. I know that you have cited a couple of obscure Hugh Fitzgerald posts that you claim call for “ ethnic cleansing.” Candidly, I never saw those posts before you called attention to them and I don’t interpret them the way you do. Apart from this, what is the factual basis on which you claim that the goal of JW is to “spread hate” against Muslims?
Keep posting, please.
lebel says
” So, brazenly dishonest one, are you going to tell me that: (1) you are above resorting to insults; or (2) given the frequency with which you have resorted to “insults” on this site,you now concede your arguments are “rather weak?”
When I insult, which is extremely rare, it is in response to ocntinue insults. Such as being called a sub-human.
I have tons of citations but not of them will mean anything to you because the object of the hate is Muslims. If I switched the Muslim for Jew, you would probably have a heart attack and then call for airstrikes on the author of said quote.
Norger says
OK, I get it. Different set of rules for you.
I don’t need tons of citations, I’ll settle for one. More to the point, I’ll settle for a single citation evincing my alleged “hatred” of Muslims, which is something you’ve now accused me twice on this thread.
That’s your ultimate trump card (pun intended) isn’t it?when you can’t win an argument on the facts or with reason and logic, you remain secure in the knowledge that everyone here is simply a sub- human “hater,” right?
Islam is an ideology. We have to be able to criticize bad ideas. You just can’t wrap your head around that, can you?
gravenimage says
How does calling attention to the connection between Islamic theology and Islamic terrorism “spread hate against Muslims”?
lebel says
“Acceptance of Jesus Christ as one’s Saviour as He is the Son of God who died on the cross for our sins.
All Muslims, Hindus, Sikhs, Jains, Buddhists, Shintoists, animists, atheists, Marxists and Jews will burn in Hellfire.”
LOL, precisely Chand but Cortez doesn’t mention this.
Kay says
lebel,
I’m not sure why you are on this site but I doubt that it is in order to seek Jesus.
Chand doesn’t speak for Jesus. He may be a troll or may simply be misinformed.
Jesus loves you and seeks you.
And you are free— to knock, to ask, to seek.
There may be better venues than JW however, if that is your aim.
Carol the 1st says
The first five paragraphs in the article below contest Chand’s erudite conclusion:
What is the “Condemnation” in the Gospel of John?
https://www.mit.edu/~rei/spir-john.html
Later there’s a line that makes me think of certain actors who avoid being forthright with their fellow man:
“And this is the condemnation, that light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For everyone who does evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed.” John 3:19-20
lebel says
“gravenimage says
Jun 30, 2019 at 6:49 pm
Will lebel say *anything* critical about the non-violent Ngo being assaulted? I won’t be holding my breath…”
In the spirit of the Christchurch thread would say that people do reach their I’ve-had-enough moments. As individual tolerances vary, some will reach their boiling point moment earlier than others. Of course violence is wrong but it is inevitable
P.S. I will admit that you were the most “moral” jihadwatcher on that thread even if you could not bring yourself to fully see what was being expressed.
Norger says
Really?! Violence against Ngo was “inevitable,” because people had reached their “boiling point” with him? Do tell, exactly what did Mr. Ngo do to bring these thugs to their “boiling point?” ? And exactly what was it about the “Christchurch thread” that had you so exercised? Can’t bring yourself to fully see what you just expressed above? Absolutely breathtaking hypocrisy and double talk.
lebel says
Yes, I was paraphrasing from the thread where the majority of jihadwatchers were calmly making excuses for mass murder.
Kay says
My recollection is that everyone was horrified by the horror of the mass murder.
Carol the 1st says
I was as numb and unfeeling as you are Lebel when it came to vicious assaults on the “other”. I don’t recall shedding one tear – even for any possible MINO’s who happened to be present (a fair amount of ‘radicals’ in that neck of the woods but ho-hum, right Lebel?)
gravenimage says
lebel wrote, replyig to myself:
Will lebel say *anything* critical about the non-violent Ngo being assaulted? I won’t be holding my breath…”
In the spirit of the Christchurch thread would say that people do reach their I’ve-had-enough moments. As individual tolerances vary, some will reach their boiling point moment earlier than others. Of course violence is wrong but it is inevitable
………………………..
The idea that it is “inevitable” for gangs of thugs to assault a non-violent, nonthreatening man who has merely pointed out things like Muslims themselves saying that apostates need to be murdered is *sickeningly false*.
He is again blaming the victim–that this mob simply “reached the boiling point” over Ngo daring to tell the truth about Islam is grotesque.
More:
P.S. I will admit that you were the most “moral” jihadwatcher on that thread even if you could not bring yourself to fully see what was being expressed.
………………………..
Robert Spencer called the Christchurch attacks “savage and heinous”. Pretending that this is somehow support for the attacks is ludicrous calumny.
The only poster I can recall on that thread who actually condoned the attacks was christianblood–a troll who calls for the conquest and destruction of the West by Muslims. Pretending that he represents Anti-Jihadists here is absurd.
lebel says
For your info I paraphrased a post from the Christchurch thread to make a point:
“Emilie Green says
Mar 15, 2019 at 12:13 pm
Of course this is not surprising. When the people are ruled without their consent – as Merkel, Blair, Major, May several French presidents (going back to the 1970s) and the EU generally are doing (including all the resettlement agencies and their helpers (looking at you, Catholic Charities, UN) in the United States; Little Mogadishu in Minneapolis or Lewiston, Maine were purposefully created) – people do reach their I’ve-had-enough moments. As individual tolerances vary, some will reach their boiling point moment earlier than others.
”
As always we see that Jihadwatchers are perfectly able to understand concealed justification but only when the object is not Muslims
Carol the 1st says
Ludicrous for consistently and insultingly lizard-blooded lebel to play the “guilt-peddler” with non-muslims. One would think he’d caught something from:
1/ the Catholic Church, or
2/ listening attentively to the ‘wounded’ rallying cries of blood-lusting imams.
gravenimage says
lebel wrote:
As always we see that Jihadwatchers are perfectly able to understand concealed justification but only when the object is not Muslims
……………………..
I was able to track this post down–no thanks to lebel.
He pretends that everyone supported this post from a commenter who rarely posted here.
But lebel ignores *my* reply to the comment he posted:
gravenimage says
Mar 15, 2019 at 5:39 pm
There is no excusing this attack.
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2019/03/new-zealand-murders-repercussions-and-perspective#comment-2070375
So his pretending that everyone here at Jihad Watch has justified the attacks in Christchurch is *utterly* false, as he well knows.
Carol the 1st says
lebel’s type lacks any sound “moral”, “common”, or “literary” sense.
People’s emotions don’t generally firm up with something so solid as “hatred” until they’ve been directly punched in the gut. In the meantime we rely upon our emotions and survival instinct to direct our heads as to where our “steam” might need to build up in order to defend ourselves and what we need to protect. We also make warning noises called “venting” to prime our bodies and warn off predators so that hopefully serious confrontations do not become the end result. My cats know as much – growl, go eye to eye, think twice, back off – but never turn your back at too close range, then slowly saunter off to your own territory and live to fight any worthwhile fights another day. That is how *far* sane Western society has evolved.
Consider this and then take a look at what’s called the Islamic reality lebel (article below) and do try not to shed too many tears for collateral damage to any misunderstood muslims innocently hanging about:
https://www.raymondibrahim.com/2019/03/12/is-it-really-human-beings-doing-this-muslim-persecution-of-christians-january-2019/
lebel says
“WTF are you even talking about?! This is theological justification for violence you fool. “Christchurch thread” my ass.”
It’s normal, you cannot see it when applied to the object of your hate. Justification for violence was all over that thread but because it was Muslims you’re unable to see. Just like someone who explicitly calls for the forced removal of Muslims does not in your eyes call for the forced removal of Muslims.
Or you are lying to protect the site.
Norger says
Ahh, I’m simply a hater. Wow, that really put me in my place.
Are you not at all troubled that Islamic theology is used to justify extreme violence, including the mass slaughter of innocent civilians? Did anyone on the Christchurch thread justify that mass murder on theological grounds?
Newsflash for Lebel: (1) Hugh Fitzgerald never called for the forced removal of Muslims; and (2) the goal of this site is to call attention to the link between Islamic theology and Islamic terrorism, full stop.
lebel says
“Are you not at all troubled that Islamic theology is used to justify extreme violence, including the mass slaughter of innocent civilians? Did anyone on the Christchurch thread justify that mass murder on theological grounds?”
Of course it’s troubling and what does it matter the grounds for mass murder? on jihadwatch the excuse for mass murder is self-preservation and separationism.
Norger says
Glad you find it troubling. At last we agree on something. Theological justification for mass murder is particularly dangerous because it can and has been used for hundreds of years to justify some of the worst genocides in human history. There are few people more dangerous than those who believe that “ God” has commanded them to kill.And no, there is no justification for Christchurch. Or 9/11, San Bernardino, Pulse nightclub, Bataclan, Beslan etc. etc. Which do you truly believe is the more prevalent threat in today’s world; (true) “lone wolf” white supremacist nut jobs like the Christchurch shooter or Islamic terrorists? Of those two groups, which do you believe would be more likely to unleash a nuclear/chemical/radiological/biological attack in a major American city in the next 10 years?
Angemon says
“on jihadwatch the excuse for mass murder”
Odd whacko aside, you know – or at least ought to, if you were an honest person – that’s not what goes on around here.
gravenimage says
Jihad Watch has *never* called for mass murder. What grotesque calumny.
lebel says
“Islam is an ideology. We have to be able to criticize bad ideas. You just can’t wrap your head around that, can you?”
I never said you can’t criticise bad ideas. I am talking about anti-Muslim hate prevalent all over this site.
Norger says
And now we get to the heart of it. From my standpoint, that is EXACTLY what you’re saying.
Since 9/11, we have been witnessing the constant and steady drumbeat of Islamic terrorism, all over the world. (If you want me to cut to the chase, I blame the Saudis). But anyone who dares to call out the connection between (hateful) Islamic theology and Islamic terrorism is somehow branded a “hater.” As Robert Spencer points out, this is a peculiar form of projection.
The problem posed by Islamic theology is not going to be solved by pretending the problem doesn’t exist or by branding legitimate critics as “hateful.”
And no, I don’t necessarily agree with every single thing that Hugh Fitzgerald (or Robert Spencer) has ever said, but you are just completely off base calling either one of them “haters.” This is one of the few sites that even dares to take an unflinching look at Islamic theology. I’m sure that even you understand that Robert Spencer is quite literally risking his life here; he is a good and fundamentally decent human being, full stop.
lebel says
“I don’t need tons of citations, I’ll settle for one. More to the point, I’ll settle for a single citation evincing my alleged “hatred” of Muslims, which is something you’ve now accused me twice on this thread.”
We both know this is a waste of time, but I’ll humor you:
“when, of course, it is all those who believe in Islam who must be treated as our enemies” Hugh Fitzgerald
Norger says
And this quote from Hugh Fitzgerald is evidence my hatred of Muslims exactly how?
lebel says
” Which do you truly believe is the more prevalent threat in today’s world; (true) “lone wolf” white supremacist nut jobs like the Christchurch shooter or Islamic terrorists? Of those two groups, which do you believe would be more likely to unleash a nuclear/chemical/radiological/biological attack in a major American city in the next 10 years?”
Islamic terrorists
Norger says
Then I’m at least somewhat perplexed. Honestly. You see the threat; how would you counter it?
lebel says
“And this quote from Hugh Fitzgerald is evidence my hatred of Muslims exactly how?”
Its not evidence of your hatred, it’s evidence of his hatred. A hatred which you refuse to acknowledge exists although you would immediately see it if the object was not Muslims.
Norger says
I’ll take your word for the accuracy of the quote. I also appreciate your uncanny ability to read my innermost thoughts.
If you’re asking whether I think “all Muslims” are the enemy, I don’t. But I do think there is a certain percentage of “true believers” in Islam (5%-25%) that hate me and consider me an enemy, based solely on my disbelief. THAT’S the hatred you refuse to acknowledge exists; or do you?
Kay says
Please listen to Bill Warner.
gravenimage says
Those who adhere to a creed that calls for the oppression and murder of non-believers have declared themselves our enemies. Acknowledging this is not a call for violence–it is pointing out Islam’s call for violence.
John says
Why, why, why is this event not reported by the media? What is wrong with our media that this goes unreported? It always happens. Our nations’ media is prejudiced, bias and one sided to the point of insanity. But still they believe they represent truth, justice and the American way. Hah, mental illness. Reminds me of Germany in the1930s. We had Nazi apologists then. Only the names of the haters have changed to liberals and Moslems. And sig heil has changed to Allah hu Akbar.
Kay says
I see that two other men also got beat up by Antifa in Portland on Saturday, one needed 25 stitches in his head. Apparently one or both of them were trying to assist a man in a dress who was also being harassed.
Carol the 1st says
Here’s one video. I believe at :11 we see the man who helped rescue him receiving blows to the head.
Conservative Treehouse Antifa viciously attack on elderly man with crowbar in Portland, Oregon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAMF9fXlsT4
gravenimage says
Appalling.
lebel says
“If you’re asking whether I think “all Muslims” are the enemy, I don’t. But I do think there is a certain percentage of “true believers” in Islam (5%-25%) that hate me and consider me an enemy, based solely on my disbelief. THAT’S the hatred you refuse to acknowledge exists; or do you?”
Clearly there is percentage of Muslims that have you and consider you an enemy based on your disbelief. I think these are the ISIS type guys and their followers. I believe the figure to be lower than 5%. I think it is a small fraction within the Muslim community. My evidence is the small number of people relative to the global muslim population who joined ISIS taking into account that some did so to fight Assad rather than for ideological reasons.
Norger says
This is interesting, to say the least. You apparently agree more with Hugh Fitzgerald’s view of the world more than you realize, albeit with less hyperbole. And no, I don’t consider the Hugh Fitzgerald statement you quoted to be “hatred.”
Unfortunately, “not currently engaged in trying to kill kafirs” does not equate, in my view, with supposed Islamic “moderation.” There are a whole host of “support activities” that go hand in glove with jihad terrorism, and the formation of active terrorist groups (of which ISIS is something like 1 in 5000) including, for example, providing financial, logistical and ideological support. It is not difficult, for example, to find direct and indirect statements of support for terrorism from prominent American Muslim leaders, e.g. Siraj Wahhaj. Here’s a fairly explicit one from an imam in my hometown; just imagine what he says when he’s not on video.
https://www.peaceandtolerance.org/2010/05/28/the-imam-and-the-governor/
There is absolutely no point in “reaching out” to people like this; they are our enemies.
As another, more recent, example, you will recall that Salah Abdelslam, one of the key players in the Paris terrorist attacks, was hidden for months by his supporters in Molenbeek. Much as I wish it were otherwise, the infection runs much deeper than the jihadis.
In any event, it appears to me that our main points of disagreement are:(1) the extent of the problem; and (2) what to do about it,
lebel says
“e.g. Siraj Wahhaj. Here’s a fairly explicit one from an imam in my hometown; just imagine what he says when he’s not on video.
https://www.peaceandtolerance.org/2010/05/28/the-imam-and-the-governor/
There is absolutely no point in “reaching out” to people like this; they are our enemies.”
Hmmm I don’t see any hatred here. He is simply talking about self-defense.
**this is what being on the other side feels like**
Carol the 1st says
No, “what being on the other side feels like” is having a rock thrown at your head – not having your head *under a rock*.
Norger says
I think you’re the one who said something like “in any other context you would immediately recognize hate..” oh never mind.
You know, I actually thought you were coming around until that one. Do you understand who and what you are defending here? You may not, so allow me to give you some factual context here of which you may be unaware. The “self-defense” on the part of the “brave woman” the good Imam was talking about was the attempted murder of several federal law enforcement officers by Aafia Siddiqui, the “Gray Lady” of Al Quaeda, close associate of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed (9/11 mastermind), the “most wanted woman in America” after 9/11. Who was arrested in Afghanistan, in possession of chemical weapons materials(hmmm wonder what that was about) and who is currently serving 86 years in federal prison after being tried and convicted of the attempted murder of the federal officers who brought her in. (And, not so coincidentally, whose release ISIS demanded at one point). Is THAT your idea of “self-defense?” (I seem to recall that you took particular umbrage at “calm justifications” for mass murders or are those concerns tossed aside when the erstwhile victims happen to be federal agents hunting a high profile target overseas in the wake of the largest terrorist attack ever on US soil?)
Or perhaps are you referring to the part where the good Imam exhorts the congregants to “pick up, the gun, pick up the sword, get out in the world and do your job…” wait a minute, he meant self-defense…Riigghtt.
Make no mistake about it, I am 100% on the other side of this one, and that feels just fine. From my standpoint, the boundary line between right and wrong, good and evil, purported “self defense” and attempted murder, is 100% crystal clear. Where do you stand?
Norger says
And as a P.S. if your point was to try to draw some sort of “tongue in cheek” false equivalence between Hugh Fitzgerald’s statement and those of this imam, you are,being silly, as well as missing the point I was making which is that “the problem” with Islam extends well beyond ISIS. Or did it hit too hard when you realized that your own views are closer to those of Hugh Fitzgerald than you care to admit?
*THAT is what it feels like to be on the other side*. Hope you felt it, if only for a fleeting moment.
gravenimage says
The idea that not reaching out to people who want to kill you is violence is just absurd.
gravenimage says
lebel wrote:
Clearly there is percentage of Muslims that have you and consider you an enemy based on your disbelief. I think these are the ISIS type guys and their followers. I believe the figure to be lower than 5%.
……………….
Firstly, this ignores the fact that the majority of Muslims even in the West want to impose Shari’ah law on us.
But let’s take his figure–despite it not being backed up–at face value. That would means that 90 million Muslims want to slaughter and enslave us world wide, and 150,000 want to do that just in Britain. He is demanding that we ignore this horrible threat.
Angemon says
“My evidence is the small number of people relative to the global muslim population who joined ISIS”
You’re implying that any muslims who haven’t join ISIS are, therefore, not in line with their version of islam, correct? If so, really? Did you write that with a straight face?
lebel says
Well…their version of Islam says that you have to join them or…you’re not really a Muslim. So yes if we are being technical. Of course there are extremists who have not joined ISIS.
Angemon says
“Well…their version of Islam says that you have to join them or…you’re not really a Muslim. ”
“join in” as accepting their brand as the one and only or physically travelling to their territory?
lebel says
“Then I’m at least somewhat perplexed. Honestly. You see the threat; how would you counter it?”
I think it is dishonest to say anything else.
I would counter it by focusing on the terrorists themselves and not a jihadwatch advocates increasing hatred against all Muslims. We need Muslims as allies and jihadwatch pushes them away and accuses them of taqqiya if they’re not extremists. I would acknowledge that multiple interpretations of Islam are possible rather than confining everyone to ISIS’s interpretation and reducing anyone who disagrees as a taqqita artists or an jihad enabler.
Also I would not destroy secular Muslim regimes that act as a bullwark against terrorism (Iraq).
Kay says
lebel, in your post here and your other posts, you aim to change the conversation of the thread and thereby to claim that JW is other than it is.
You are free to express your opinion on an article or to disagree with comments made, but what you do is not fair or honest.
Please instead respond to the article each time.
gravenimage says
lebel’s only purpose here is to distract from the threat of Jihad.
Angemon says
“and not a jihadwatch advocates increasing hatred against all Muslims. ”
Preposterous. JW never advocated that.
“We need Muslims as allies ”
How would one vet a muslim ally? And how many recorded instances are there of massive terror attacks being foiled thanks to a muslim “ally”?
lebel says
“and not a jihadwatch advocates increasing hatred against all Muslims. ”
Preposterous. JW never advocated that.”
When you say that everyone who believes in Islam is the enemy, its pretty clear.
For example, if a Muslim says “everyone who believes in Christianity is the enemy” I think you would consider that hatred.
Anyways, this is jihadwatch so it does not really matter how much evidence I bring forth.
Angemon says
“When you say that everyone who believes in Islam is the enemy, its pretty clear.”
Do you know what “advocate” means?
Carol the 1st says
Only an oblivious misogynist could ignore or stomach Sharia and any Sharia enabler belongs in his or her own territory victimizing only those who are deluded enough to imagine that such a cup of tea tastes sweet right down to the bitter, uncovered dregs.
Those muslims who know what a faulty deck of cards Islam is and stands upon would jump ship with alacrity at the first opportunity as they are unlikely to be stupid, hateful, and/or prevaricating. By their deeds and their choices do you know them.
gravenimage says
lebel is here on a thread where a mob of Jihad sympathizers savagely beat a non-violent journalist who dared expose a Muslim admitting that Islam calls for the murder of apostates, and he is pretending that Muslims are the victims–despite Jihad Watch *never* condoning violence, let alone calling for it.
Classic projection.