My article in PJ Media on a much-misunderstood topic:
The Qur’an says that Christians and Muslims worship the same God (29:46), and so does the Catholic Church. The Irish Catholic newspaper recently considered this question and offered an argument from authority, which is the weakest of all arguments: Christians and Muslims worship the same God because the Catholic Church’s Second Vatican Council says so in the documents Lumen Gentium and Nostra Aetate. But a closer examination of the evidence shows this to be false.
Besides the obvious differences regarding the Trinity, the crucifixion, and the divinity of Christ, there are deeper differences that are often overlooked.
- Free will. There are numerous passages of the Qur’an, as well as indications from Islamic tradition, to the effect that not only can no one believe in Allah except by his will, so also no one can disbelieve in him except by his active will. “And to whoever God assigns no light, no light has he” (24:40).
The issue of free will versus predestination has, of course, vexed Christians of various sects for centuries, as different biblical passages are given different weight in various traditions. Calvinism, of course, in its pure form is notorious for its doctrine of double predestination, the idea that God has destined people for hell as well as for salvation. But this position is largely unique to them in the Christian tradition, which generally holds that God desires all men and women to be saved, and gives them the means to attain this salvation. The idea that God would create men for hell is in total conflict with the proposition that God “desires all men to be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth” (1 Timothy 2:4), and that he “takes no pleasure in the death of anyone” (Ezekiel 18:32).
The situation in Islam is, on first glance, even worse, with the Qur’an’s testimony on this, as on other matters, appearing to be hopelessly contradictory. The Qur’an, says the Qur’an, is “nothing but a reminder to all beings, for whoever of you who would go straight; but you will not do so unless Allah wills, the Lord of all Being” (81:27-29). Those who would “go straight” — follow Allah’s straight path — cannot do so “unless Allah wills.”
The Qur’an goes significantly further than that, into a more or less open determinism: “If Allah had willed, he would have made you one nation; but he leads astray those whom he wills, and guides those whom he wills; and you will surely be questioned about the things you have done” (16:93). Even though everything is in Allah’s hands, even the decision of the individual to obey him or not — for he leads astray those whom he wills, and guides to the truth whom he wills — human beings will still be held accountable for the things they have done.
Allah even sends people to hell based not on their deeds, but solely upon his fiat: “And if we had willed, We could have given every soul its guidance, but the word from me will come into effect: I will surely fill hell with jinn and people all together” (32:13).
The Qur’an repeats this idea many times: Those who have rejected Allah do so because he made it possible for them to do nothing else. And indeed, given the fact that in the Islamic scheme of creation and salvation, human beings are the slaves of Allah, not his children, the rejection of free will is not altogether surprising. Allah tells Muhammad that “some of them there are who listen to you, and we lay veils on their hearts so that they don’t understand it, and in their ears heaviness; and if they see any sign whatever, they do not believe in it, so that when they come to you they dispute with you, the unbelievers saying, ‘This is nothing but the fairy-tales of the ancient ones’” (6:25-6).
There is much, much more. Read the rest here.
Liz says
Thank you for this! We are working on addressing this right now with the local Bishop (who is participating in interfaith dialogs.)
Your book with Daniel Ali – Inside Islam: A Guide for Catholics 100 Questions and Answers has also been a huge help. Shocking that the Catechism is making this so much harder when it should be obvious to everyone that God and Allah are NOT the same.
CRUSADER says
The truth about Muhammad the Prophet of Islam (Jay Smith)
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Wj2wCrGw1EY
Truth Triumps says
Great Hindu Sage Vyas predicted about Muhammad, 5000 years ago. It is Very clear and arguments are only Waste of Time.
http://www.faithfreedom.org/muhammad-predicted-in-bhavishya-purana/
Muhammad Predicted in Bhavishya Purana
Lavéritétriomphera says
These so called monotheistic religions as Catholicism, protestantism and Islam have at least a point in commun. Their radical followers use the threat of eternal enfer if someone dares to deny “insolently” the veracity of their convictions.
gravenimage says
The followers of Islam will kill you.
St. Ferdinand III says
Allah means the Lord in Arabic NOT God.
Who was the ‘Lord’ of Mecca during Moh’s lifetime? Baal.
What is Baal – the moon cult.
Baal was the Lord God of Mecca and Moh’s family his caretakers.
So go back to the very basics. Moslems worship a celestial deity not God.
Go back to the OT and Baal worship – the Canaanites, Hittites and most other Near Eastern cults worshipped the moon (based on Babylonian precedence).
So Robert, you missed the most important difference.
Moslems do not worship God whatsoever, but an impersonal moon deity, right out of the Copper-Bronze age.
Robert Spencer says
Not so. Allah does not mean Lord in Arabic.
J D S says
Anyone with research ability can trace Muhammad’s idiotic writings, sayings etc…(He actually wrote nothing, he was ILLITERATE) back to the Old Testament and paganism .
No!,…Christians and Muslims can’t be worshiping the same God. Muslims do not believe that Jesus was and in the Messiah..just a prophet..do that proves they don’t worship The one true God.
St. Ferdinand III says
Al Lah does not mean God – certainly not in the Judeo-Christian sense. Islam or Submission is of course a celestial cult.
Al Lah means The Chief Deity (not God in the Western tradition) and references the Deity, often called the Lord of Mecca, at the time of Muhammad – namely Hubal or Baal. Al Lah means The Deity, the Lord or the Highest idol of Mecca. It has nothing in common with the immanent, Catholic God of Christianity. This is propaganda of the worst variety.
Al Lah is related to Al Lat Allat, the name and title of multiple goddess worshipped in pre-Islamic Arabia, including Allat (Sun) Al Lah’s consort, along with Manat, wife of Allah or Hubaal (Nemesis) and the youngest female deity Uzza (Venus).
We also have the ‘Satanic verses’ where Muhammad makes a deal letting those who do not want to worship Hubaal or Al Lah, keep worshipping the popular cults of Allat, Manat and Uzza.
Al Lah is thus completely different than the Christian ideal of God, and of course Moslems reject the Trinity, the divinity of Christ and the Gospels, so obviously the cult of Muhammad does not worship the Christian idea of God.
Islam is a celestial cult. History, archaeology, make that clear.
gravenimage says
St. Ferdinand III, Robert Spencer is a scholar of Islam. Your belief that you need to lecture him ion these subjects is quite mistaken–please read the article above.
Joe says
Despite the Islam story, there wasn’t a Mecca while Mohammed was alive.
Allah comes from the names inside the rocks. There are more than one name. Mohammed, who lived while the rocks were being transported from Petra to Mecca chose, Allah over the other names, because he wanted Islam to have only one God.
If Allah has a meaning, today, that meaning was invented either during or after Mohammed. As mentioned, Allah was (or is) the chief name inside the rocks. Everything after that is an invention.
In addition, Arabic was a new language that functioned only on a primitive level at the time of Mohammed. At that time, it would likely be impossible to have both the words “Lord” and “God” in Arabic. The language just didn’t have enough time to become so defined to make the distinction. For example, the diacritics were not invented, yet.
If you look at the Korans that were written before or during Mohammed’s time and in Arabic, they don’t have diacritic marks.
gravenimage says
There is only one scholar who makes a case for Petra–a rather weak one at that.
FYI says
“The messenger of allah said ‘the most hated of men before allah on the day of resurrection
and the most wretched,and the man most hated to me,will be a MAN who was called MALIK AL AMLAK{“King of kings”} for there is no king but allah”
SAHIH MUSLIM VOL 5 HADITH #5611
So we have…
A MAN who is called “king of kings” despised and hated by the muslim god.
Only Jesus Christ has that title.Revs 19:16
The muslim Arab god allah who calls himself “the BEST of deceivers” k3:54
The adversary of Jesus Christ in the Gospel is the great deceiver or satan.
allah,the champion deceiver’s enemy in the koran,is a man called the King of Kings.
Why should al lah hate the “king of kings”?
Isn’t allah the one who claims to be God?
allah is the diabolus simius Dei:it is pretty clear.
islamic apologists will try{desperately}to hide or deny this by pathetically fiddling the Arabic or by telling you MALIK AL AMLAK refers to{..as I once was laughably told..} alexander the great or somebody.Ludicrous!
It is obvious al LAH can NEVER,EVER be equated with the Christian God and anyone who does that is equating Christ with antiChrist and is a LIAR.
Someone like Mr Bergoglio,the great promoter of this heresy.
No true pope would subvert Christianity by preaching such an egregious error
CRUSADER says
Iranian muslims are converting to Jesus Christ
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uRCq_RoDyRo
Ramin Parsa
Walter Sieruk says
This absurdity is the result of the lying Islamic propagandists, that even pope Francis, takes part in , the more fool him. For the god of Islam is not the same god as the God of the Bible
For the God of the Bible is not really Allah the god of Islam. To explain, through the passing of time it has become widely accepted that the word “Allah” is just the Arabic word for God. This started when truth compromising Bible “translators” substituted the word Allah where the word God should have had been uses in the Arabic translation of the Bible. Furthermore, in the glossary in the book ASSASSINS! By Dr. Haha Lung it defines Allah as the “Pre-Islamic Lunar god : the god of Islam. “ Likewise, in the book entitled INSIDE ISLAM by a former Muslim who is now a Christian, Reza F. Safa on pages 22, 23 it reads “In pre-Islamic times both Allah –worship and Baal-worship involved the worship of the sun, the moon and the stars which h defines them as astral religions. [Which are condemned in the Bible, Second Kings 23:5] The crescent moon, which was the symbol of moon worship, is also the symbol of Islam.” In conclusion the Islamic god, Allah, is not the God of the Bible.
The words in brackets are my own. In addition other some other books that expose this little known truths are WHO IS THIS ALLAH ? by G..J.O.. Moshay also UNVEILING ISLAM by Ergun Mehmet Caner and Emir Fethi Caner and THE ISLAMIC INVASION by Robert Morey . There is also PHILISTINE by Ramon Bennett and ANSWERING JIHAD by Mabeel Qureshi
CRUSADER says
Jay Smith on the Fallacies of Islam
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RXtxWm4f49A
Walter Sieruk says
First, In the Bible it gives the account of the Prophet Elijah declared “If the Lord is God, follow Him; but if Baal be ,then follow him.” First Kings 18:21.[N.K.J.V.] In other words follow one of the other. Not both.
Second, many people say that the God of the Bible and the god of Islam are one the same. Is the majority always right? That’s not always the case. As an example the Christian pastor and scholar, Michael Youssef, who is also an Arab in his book entitled JESUS, JIHAD AND PEACE on page 69 informs the reader that “The name Allah comes from pre-Islamic times, and it corresponds to the Babylonian mane Bel or Baal. According to the Middle East scholar E.M. Wherry, pre-Islamic Arabs worshiped gods they called Allah. Both pre-Islamic Allah-worship and Baal –worship involved worship of the sun, the moon and the stars, which is why they are called astral religions. The crescent moon, the symbol of pagan moon worship, is also the symbol of Islam. It is printed on flags of many Islamic countries and placed atop minarets and mosques.”
Likewise, a former Muslim who is now a Christian, Dr. Daniel Shayesteh, who used to live in the Middle East but now he lives in America . In his book ISLAM AND THE SON OF GOD. On pages 7,8. Reads “Allah is the generic term for God in many Middle –Eastern cultures. Allah is identified as one of the 360 or so idols worshiped by the Arabian people for centuries before Muhammad was born. Many do not know that Allah was the good god of the Arabians. This explains the crescent moon found on minarets and mosques and the flags of Muslim nations. .. .Historic writings also identify Allah with Baal.” It’s also worth mentioning that the Bible condemns such astral religions. As in, for example, Second Kings 23:5.
Therefore, now in modern times, it may be rightly said “If Yahweh Lord of the Bible , be the one True God follow Him. Yet if Allah the lord of Islam be the one true god then follow him.” The case is very clear cut.
Walter Sieruk says
An error that is ignorant and foolish is also awful is that ,many times, it has been declared by a number of apologists for Islam, some are imams and mullahs and strangely enough, even some so called “Christian” priests and pastors, who don’t really obey the instruction of the Bible against such folly, as in Ephesians 5:11.II Timothy 3:16. Those “Christian” clerics have even made the outlandish claim that Christians and Muslim both believe in and worship the same God. So it stands to reason that it’s important to know if this claims valid and true or invalid and false. The facts are that the god of Islam or the Muslims is a single being. In great contrast the God of Christianity, of the Christians consists as the Trinity. By the Trinity it means that “Within the essence of the one True God there are Three Persons. Being God the Father. God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. Not three gods in one But Three Distinct Persons in One God. Being the Tri-Personal Nature of God, Matthew 3:13-17. Second Corinthians 13:14. . The Bible teaches, the Father is God, Galatians 1:1.The Son is God, First John 5:20. The Holy Spirit is God, Acts 5:3,4. Not three gods but the one and only Triune God.
As further explained in the Christian book MAJOR BIBLE THEMES by Lewis Sperry Chafer on page 39 which informs the readers that “Many believe that the doctrine of the Trinity in implicit in the use of the word Elohim, as the name of God which is in a plural form and seems to refer to the Triune God. “ Likewise, in the Christian magazine PERHAPS TODAY November/December 2013 on page 8 it reads about Genesis 1:1. “In the beginning God [this is the plural noun Elohim, meaning ‘more than one’] created the heaven and the earth.” Furthermore, a bit of a view of the inner workings of the Trinity together may be seen in that the God the Father raised Jesus from the dead. Romans 10:9,10. Jesus raised Himself from the dead, John 2:19,20. The Holy Spirit raised Jesus from the dead, Romans 8:11.The inner-workings of the Trinity of God may also be seen in the fact that the Father sanctifies, First Thessalonians 5:23. The Son sanctifies, Ephesians 5:26. Hebrews 2:11; 9:12,14;13:12.The Holy Spirit sanctifies ,Romans 15:16. Second Thessalonians 2:13. Getting back to the Bible book of Genesis. In Genesis 1:26 in reads “The God said let US make man in Our image , according to our likeness…” The words are the plural “Us” and “Our.” As in “We the Trinity” For the very next verse, 27, it further reads “So God created man in His own image…” In verse 26 it’s the plural “Us” and “Our” to the singular “His” That is Three Persons in One God. In addition, in the New Testament in Matthew 28:19 It further reads the Jesus said “Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the the Son and the Holy Spirit.” [N.K.J.V] That is “name” not “names.” In conclusion the many apologists and propagandists for Islam for Islam who make the claim that Christians and Muslims believe in and worship the same God are make an untrue and outright false claim. For the God of Christianity, Christians and the Bible is not the god of Islam Muslims and the Koran.
There is the Christian internet site which replies the many different claims made by the imams and mullahs as well as the other apologists for Islam. It’s http://www.answering-islam.org
Trick_or_Treat says
In one word, two capital letters and a punctuation mark: NO ! And anybody who is capable of reading, and has two braincells to their name, should be clearly able to comprehend that.
Just tonight I was reading one of the very latest You Tube posts by ‘The Watchman On The Wall 88’ [aka Chad] in which he both poses and polls the question: “Do you believe that the ‘Great Falling Away’ has already begun?”. Most certainly it has! And it has been happening on an ever increasing scale of apostasy for some time now, just as clearly as has the rest of the incremental ‘birth pangs’ of the times, as has been analogized in the Gospels. And heresy and doctrines of demons are now running running rife also – and not only that, but now developing ‘creative’ new tangents and branches that just make you shake your head.
mortimer says
ALLAH is not the same god as JEHOVAH, since Allah does not know that JEHOVAH is his ETERNAL name.
The divine name of Jehovah appears in the OT 6823 times, but not a single time in the Koran. Did the author of the Koran not know God’s eternal name? It appears that the author of the Koran had not read the Bible and did not know what was in it. The author of the Koran was thus not a Jew or Christian, since they would understand the meaning of the Tetragrammaton name of Jehovah. Thus, the author of the Koran was a human and not divine.
Exodus 3:15,16: 15 And God said moreover unto Moses: ‘Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel: The LORD, the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath sent me unto you; this is My NAME FOR EVER, and this is My memorial unto all generations.
Exodus3.15 I am who I am. Eternal name.
Isaiah 43 I am YHWH the only savior of the world
Isaiah 42 I am YHWH that is my name I will not give my glory to another.
Deut 18 Every prophet must come in the name of YHWH
Mohammed never mentioned the eternal divine name of Jehovah, therefore he came in the name of another, different god … not in the name of Jehovah. Therefore, the Bible identifies Mohammed as a false prophet.
J D S says
Anyone with any sense st all can see that the angel that supposedly visited muhammad was not the angel Gabriel and not from God….Satan himself is a fallen angel….hmmmmm! Something to think about.
mortimer says
Muslims do not accept the Athanasian Creed (q.v. https://www.ccel.org/creeds/athanasian.creed.html), so they do not worship the ‘same’ god as in this historic and still-official creed of the Christian church.
To say that Allah is the same deity as the Holy Trinity worshipped by Christians is an insult to our intelligence.
The Koran in many places rejects Christian theology … so Muslims are trying to reject Christian and Jewish theology and then claim that the deity is the same. They want to eat their cake and have it.
This is the typical, irrational DUALISTIC APPROACH of Islam … or the ISLAMIC bait-and-switch. Allah claims to be the same deity, but then denounces the deity that he is supposed to be in the original texts of the OT and NT.
Mohammed claims to be a prophet in the Hebrew lineage, but he has no Hebrew lineage and Mohammed has none of the characteristics associated with a Hebrew prophet, not even a Hebrew name. Mohammed and the Koran get every Bible story they quote wrong in several details. This shows that Allah and Mohammed had never read the Bible.
Jedothek says
Robert is mistaken. Christians and Muslims worship the same God. To see this we have to distinguish essential from non-essential attributes. Imagine that two people have been talking about Abraham Lincoln for an hour. They have discussed the Civil War, the emancipation proclamation, the debates with Douglas. Then one of them mentions Lincoln’s son. “Wait a minute,” the other says, “Lincoln had no son.”
“Yes he did” is the reply.
Now, at this point, are they talking about two different men? No, they are disagreeing about the SAME man.
Apply this to God. A good definition spells out the essence of something. The word ‘God’ has been defined as “the one Supreme Being, the creator and ruler of the universe.” This is what Christians and Muslims generally mean when they use the word God or Allah. It follows that other attributes ( trinity, the Incarnation etc.) are non-essential attributes. Therefore Christians and Muslims are not worshiping different Gods, they are disagreeing about the SAME God. (This is not a relativist statement. At least one set of religious assertions must be false.)
mortimer says
They are not the same deities merely because someone CLAIMS they are the same. There must be SUBSTANTIAL COHERENCE to prove they are the same. THERE IS SUBSTANTIAL DIFFERENCES between Allah and Jehovah. To start with, they even have different names. The Koran’s claim of sameness is merely an empty claim that cannot be substantiated.
Compare with this statement: I claim that Allah, the Flying Spaghetti Monster and Tezcatlipoca (the Aztec god of night) and Cthulhu the Bat-Winged Squid God are ‘really’ the god.
This above empty claim cannot be proved. Nor can the Koranic claim that Allah is Jehovah. Allah is an impostor … as much an impostor as someone who steals another person’s ID in order to abuse their credit.
Allah is an IMPOSTOR abusing the credit of Jehovah.
Jedothek says
mortimer says, “To start with, they even have different names.” This is a perfect example of the confusion that I was trying to clear up. What something is called is certainly a nonessential attribute. By consulting names, you could prove that pumas are not cougars.
“The Koran’s claim of sameness is merely an empty claim that cannot be substantiated.”
There are at least two possibilities here.
I. (The possibility that I was not assuming): One might take “Allah” to mean “the entity that spoke to Muhammad.” This might be
A. Jehovah
B. A devil
C. A hallucination, or
D. Nothing, i.e., Muhammad made it up, or
E. Something else
I do not know which of these is true. I was assuming
II. A theological (rather than experiential ) definition: e.g., “the one Supreme Being, the creator and ruler of the universe.” I take this as more useful because we shall never be sure what if anything spoke to Muhammad.
As for the examples mortimer cites, Flying Spaghetti Monster etc., I do not know how to define the terms, but none of them sounds like the creator of the universe (even in theory).
To sum up: I say that Allah and Jehovah are the same by definitions that can be inferred from religious literature; I do not know who spoke to Muhammad.
CRUSADER says
Worlds Apart
==========
Jay Smith :
What is the Christian message to Muslims?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=IhV-qDWf4p0
TruthWFree says
The allah god is Satan…do some study and learn more about his revelations. The quran is supposed to be the allah god’s revelations to Muhammad. We know what Jesus said and did in the Gospels. We also know what the allah god supposedly said in the Quran. These are not human observations. The allah god is Satan. You are deceived just like all the other Muslims.
FYI says
I’m afraid not.
Christians and muslims do NOT worship the same God.
al LAH is an Arab god and very,very different to the Judeo-Christian God.
The Commandment system found in Judaism and Christianity{the 2 chief commandments of LOVE GOD,LOVE OTHERS plus the Exodus 20 ‘ten’ is violated by the koran which PERMITS murder k2:191,adultery with enslaved women k4:24 etc
The Bible {Gospel+Torah}teaches OBEDIENCE to God’s commandments.
The koran teaches DISOBEDIENCE to God’s commandments.
See for yourself:if the koran teaches its ok to violate God’s Commandments and the OPPOSITE to the 2nd chief commandment that defeats the purpose of the Torah and id in DEFIANCE of God’s Laws.
If allah was the SAME as the Biblical God then the LAW would be the SAME and obeyed.
It isn’t in islam.
There is no Golden Rule in islam:k5:51 allah tells his muslims NOT to love their infidel neighbors
Thus the 2nd chief commandment of Lev 19:18 is violated in islam.
Allah’s criterion of k4:82:if errors can be found in allah’s perfect book then the koran cannot come from God{i.e since allah is perfect and his koran is perfect then any errors would show allah to be imperfect,false and thus he cannot be the real God}
But the koran IS riddled with errors and incongruities{logical,theological,scientific and even in the Arabic language itself}:of course islamic apologists work hard to deny this{usually by pathetically trying to fiddle the Arabic}
The fact that islam does NOT conform to God’s Laws means islam and allah are NOT the SAME as the Judeo-Christian God.
CRUSADER says
As a pastor in Malaysia ?? pointed out:
“ISLAM IS REALLY A POLITICAL IDEOLOGY THAT USES RELIGION TO PROTECT AND SUPPORT IT… without the protection of religion it likely would not even survive!”
=================================
Weird to see that Malaysian flag by the way:
As if the USA ?? flag got superimposed by Islam ☪️
CRUSADER says
Now you know the rest of the story about STRIPES OF GLORY ~
The USA flag has some historical basis of support for the East India Company and therefore that flag got reflected into the Continental Congress flag (of many). The EIC flag derived from the red and white striped flag from he eminent history of the Hindu-izing Majapahit empire….
Well…more information was found with this:
Have you ever wondered about how the red, white, blue and yellow Malaysian flag that represents our country came to be?
Long before it was known as the Jalur Gemilang, “stripes of glory”, our flag was simply known as Bendera Malaysia, and was derived from the flag of the Federation of Malaya, which design originally had 11 stripes alternately in blue and white, a red canton, and a five-pointed star and crescent moon in yellow before a few amendments were made to it.
The design by Mohamed Hamzah, a Johor Public Works Department architect, was one of the three shortlisted designs for the new Federation of Malaya flag and was selected as the winner from polls by The Malay Mail on November 29, 1949. His design was inspired by the Johor flag, which was his home state as well as incorporating the religious heritage through the Uthmaniyyah star and moon, and Nusantara heritage through the incorporation of the stripes from the Getih-Getah Samudera, which comes from the Majapahit empire.
After several amendments were made to the original design, the final design had 11 horizontal stripes alternately red and white in colour, the uppermost stripe being red, having a blue quarter with a crescent and 11-pointed star in yellow superimposed to represent the states in the Federation of Malaya.
The flag was flown for the first time on May 19, 1950 at the Palace of the Sultan of Selangor and was attended by all the Malay rulers representing their respective states and officers to King George VI. Later, when the Federation of Malaya, Sabah, Sarawak and Singapore formed Malaysia, all the Malay rulers and Governors agreed in a Conference of Rulers meeting that the flag of Malaysia must follow the design of the Federation of Malaya flag but with some amendments. The flag added three more stripes and points on the star to represent the 14 states in the Malaysian Federation and was first flown on September 16, 1963.
Although Singapore left Malaysia in 1965, the design of the flag was not amended and the 14 stripes and 14-pointed stars now represent the 13 states in the federation and the Federal States, consisting of the Federal State of Kuala Lumpur, Labuan and Putrajaya. Despite his priceless contribution to the country, Mohamed did not receive recognition during his lifetime as he concealed his identity as the designer of the flag until it was uncovered in 2005, 12 years after his death in 1993 at the age of 75.
But how did the name for our flag came about? The idea to give a formal name to Bendera Malaysia came from Datuk Hashim Mat Dris in 1995, who then forwarded the proposal to then Prime Minister Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamed, who accepted the proposal. A committee was then established in the same year and they presented their suggestions to the Cabinet but they were all shot down prior to July 9, 1997, where the Cabinet agreed to name our flag, Jalur Gemilang.
The name Jalur Gemilang was suggested by Md Redzuan Tumin, who was asked by his director-general Datuk Kamarul Baharin Buyong to suggest a name for the flag that was then forwarded to the Flag of Malaysia Naming Committee of which Kamarul was a member after the Cabinet shot down the three more names that were shortlisted. The then-Muzium Negara director of research said that he was struck by inspiration when he was in his room and was examining the multi-coloured design of the flag when it occurred to him that it could be called Stripes of Glory in English, and he translated that into Jalur Gemilang.
Md Redzuan did not know that his idea was chosen until after he heard a song entitled Jalur Gemilang playing on the radio. His suspicion that his suggestion was selected was confirmed by Kamarul who later gave him a congratulatory call. Then, on August 31, 1997 to celebrate our 40th Merdeka, Tun Dr Mahathir announced that our flag with 14 horizontal stripes alternately in red and white, a crescent moon and 14-pointed star in yellow and a blue canton was officially named Jalur Gemilang.
Artikel Penuh
https://www.malaysianupdate.my/2017/08/the-story-behind-bendera-malaysia-jalur/ | Malaysian Update – Berita Terkini Untuk Anda
Lydia Church says
Jedothek is mistaken.
Lydia Church says
They are NOT THE SAME GOD.
It doesn’t matter what anyone else ‘says,’ it matters what God said.
Anyone who contradicts Him is wrong, plain and simple.
Some common areas of confusion I will clear up below:
1. Yes, there is only one God, and it is the God of Christianity, of the Bible.
All other claims of being ‘god’ are false. There are other beings behind deities, and these entities are demons. So it’s not that there are ‘many’ gods.
2. There can be numerous ways to define something, but if that something is an absolute, then only one of those ways can be correct. Take the simple absolute truth statement: 2+2=4. Some may come with other answers such as 1, 3, 5, etc. Now 2+2 does exist, and there is only one such statement and one correct answer to it. And the answer only equals 4. Other answers are wrong and do not define the answer to 2 + 2. So just because other religions exist that refer to a ‘god,’ does not mean that they apply to THE God. He has only one way to define Himself, and it is found in the pages of the Bible. To claim that other attempts to define Him are mistaken but naive at best is one thing, (they are wrong but demonicly influenced), but it is another to follow after them. Since we know the koran falsely describes God (since, for one of hundreds of items, He DOES have a Son), then why not just dump the koran in the trash and go with the Book that truly defines the Lord??? The Bible! There may be endless books that make a claim on defining God, but they are wrong. He defines Himself and books that contradict the Bible are false about God and do not define Him.
3. Then there is the issue of ‘can we really know’? There are many out there who claim that we can’t really know for certainty if any book defines God, or if God exists, etc. How can these Christians be so sure? Etc. From an outside perspective, such as an agnostic or something, they just don’t know. They at least are being honest and I will give them that. But Christians ought to know that God is only defined by the Bible. For one thing, all the books contradict each other, so at most one can be true. The Bible has endless proofs of how it is verifiable. It is a self verifying book. Some examples are: fulfilled prophecy, archeological evidence, outlines in the Bible of the model of salvation thousands of years before Christ (Jews leaving Egypt, etc.), typologies of Christ (Joseph, most of the famous types in the OT), events being fulfilled to the day (crucifixion and passover, pentecost feast and day of pentecost, etc.), and when you seek, the Holy Spirit leads you and you find even more proof, such as the things talked about in the Bible like the baptism of the Holy Spirit, gifts thereof and other supernatural evidence. God’s signature and fingerprint are on the Bible, and only on the Bible. That is how we know and anyone can know if they seek.
Lydia Church says
And to refute his argument in a nutshell:
If two men are talking about the same guy, and the guy does have a son, and one says he does and the other says he doesn’t, then the one who says he doesn’t is wrong. He can’t have a son and not have a son at the same time. So we go on the one man’s testimony about the guy and not the other man’s who says he doesn’t, so it’s just that simple. Throw out the koran, period.
CRUSADER says
Capital idea. Throw the darned Koran out!
Also, look to the possibility that the spread of dread by Islam
is a test for humanity, as with so many such times Biblically,
this is becoming our challenge to our own beliefs — making us
who cherish life and liberty to look in the mirror, how can we best
RESIST this devilish incursion? Where do we falter, ourselves?
Not so much : How have we gone out of favor by God, with God…
But this : How has God gone out of favor with us, by us?
gravenimage says
Jedothek, with all respect, the conception of God and Allah are *nothing* alike. For you to consider these existential differences to be “non-essential” is quite mistaken.
CRUSADER says
They are as different as perhaps the difference between the two flags of the USA and modern Malaysia.
At first there may seem a similarity, and upon study, there is some cross over — but over all, they clearly have distinctly different histories, makeup, and application, reverence, and allegiance !
Diane Harvey says
“Christians and Muslims worship the same God because the Catholic Church’s Second Vatican Council says so”
Ya know, the same group that says, “No, we’re not touching the little boys. Honest, we’re not.”
b.a. freeman says
OK, Diane, were the only christians in the world catholics, U might have a point, but even then, there’s a matter of magnitude involved. some child-molesters – let’s say a few thousand for the sake of argument – were smart enough to pull off pretending to be christians in order to get access to perhaps a few hundred thousand (cheez, let’s make it a few million or more) boys whom they could then rape, but those guys are pikers; that’s all across the planet over a period of many decades, while in just one country of the ummah – afghanistan – it is likely that *millions* of little boys are regularly raped *today* and every day. furthermore, these rapes have been going on since the pirate cult first arrived there, most likely because the perps were raped when they were little boys. horny gang-bangers who can’t find any muslim women to “marry” (or rather, get paid by the woman’s father to take her off his hands) or infidel women whom they can rape have nowhere else to turn for sexual release other than defenseless children (e.g., the rape addressed by sfc charles martland). similar to the way most wife-beaters learned the practice by watching their fathers beat their mothers, most child abusers were usually abused as children. this filthy practice is *FAR* more widespread in areas controlled by the pirate cult than even the worst western organization.
but i’m just a voice on the internet, so don’t take my word for it; *CHECK FOR YOURSELF*. if i’m right, U need to know so that U can help fight the evil. if i’m a lying white-supremacist nazi kluxer, then U need to know so that U can help warn the world about me and my ilk. if, OTOH, U decide to spread the word that anti-islam kuffar are lying white-supremacist nazi kluxers – *without* checking – then U are guilty of stirring up a mob without knowing if U are correct. and if U decide to just walk away and ignore everything about islam, U won’t be able to say that U weren’t warned when the ummah puts your neck on the chopping block.
b.a. freeman says
oops – forgot to add that besides the far greater number of children abused, we need to note that most of these abuses see *NOTHING* wrong with the practice. instead of the golden rule, islam has the rule that he who has the gold (or better yet, the *POWER*) is the one who makes the rules.
b.a. freeman says
sigh … “these abuseRs,” not “these abuses.”
gravenimage says
+1
CogitoErgoSum says
All I know is that for me to believe that the Muslim god called Allah is the same as the Christian God (consisting of Father, Son and Holy Spirit) I have to accept the idea that my God is a liar. Sorry, I’m not going to do that. The God in whom I trust is not a liar.
CRUSADER says
“Wholly Different:
Why I Chose Biblical Values Over Islamic Values”
Book by Nonie Darwish
TruthWFree says
Read it…Good book….good ex Muslim author. One of my heroes including Robert Spencer.
gravenimage says
+1
TruthWFree says
I consider the allah god of Islam to be Satan after 18 years of study of Islam since 9/11/2001 and Robert Spencer’s writings have been a large part of that education. I personally have to go no further than the allah god denying Jesus’ divinity and death on the cross as they are lies against the eye withnessed Gospels written 600 plus years before the Quran. Muhammad had no witnesses to his revelations and performed no miracles. The allah god also says he has no sons and exhorts Muslims to fight and subjugate Jesus’ followers in Quran Sura 9-29. Jesus said He is the ONLY WAY to the Father (God) and backed his words up with eye witnessed miracles and His rising from the dead. Muhammad upon his first claimed vision thought he was possessed by a demon and tried to kill himself (The Truth About Muhammad by Robert Spencer). Then there were the Satanic verses where the allah god tells Muhammad that Satan fooled him in agreeing to other gods with the Meccans., (Salmon Rushdie “Satanic Verses”). The allah god lies against the Gospels in which Jesus says that “Satan is the father of all lies” (John 8:44), plus the fact that Islam is a recipe for eternal fighting among mankind, I cannot conclude otherwise that Islam was revealed to Muhammad by Satan.
CRUSADER says
Have you listened to Jay Smith or Tom Holland on the topic of Mohamhead’s “existence”?
Erwin Lutzer and Steve Miller wrote from studying many such influences …
as cited such as Spencer, Durie, Ye ‘or, Lewis, McCarthy, Wagner, Zwemer
…coming to conclusions about Islam:
“Cross in the SHADOW of the Crescent”
Michael Copeland says
When Islamic State destroyed the tomb of St Elian they explained that it was dedicated to a god other than Allah.
James says
If I remember, in Luther’s view grace was given by God, it could not be earned by man or purchased with indulgences. Salvation was a gift, God did not have to give it to us. Of course I susppose he would not give salvation to people who had no faith or rejected God. So in a way the free will of christians does not guarantee salvation, which is the free gift of God, unearned by man.
tim gallagher says
Islam and Christianity are complete opposites. But, hang on, Islam and its idea of what god might be like, is dedicated to annihilating (and by violent means) all the other religions, including Christianity. All the other religions have to submit to islam. How can they possibly be products of the same god when one of the religions is demanding that the other religion be destroyed and everyone fall into line with Islam? Christianity has loving and peaceful ideals, Islam endorses hatred and murderous violence. Complete opposites. They can’t possibly have the same God unless that God has some type of completely split personality.
gravenimage says
Do Christians and Muslims Worship the Same God? Absolutely Not. Here’s Why.
…………….
Fine piece from Robert Spencer.
Adam says
Islam, submission. Like communism and socialism, it only exists through endless oppression and cruelty. It makes men slaves or tyrants, it hates life and worships death.
God, the creator, the same as these fools profess, I don’t think so.
Blind guides Robert
KP says
When it comes to the topic of the existence of free will, the Muslims have it right and the Christians have it wrong. Most scientists including Albert Einstein did not or do not believe in free will. All you believers in free will should go to the website and read the book “Breaking the Illusion of Free Will for the Betterment of Humankind” by Trick Slattery. .Maybe it will wake some of you up.
gravenimage says
So does KP believe that it is fine that Muslims are slaughtering people in the name of their foul deity because they lack the free will to do otherwise?
And how can reading anything “wake us up” if we lack free will to begin with? Surely we have no control over our belief in free will one way or the another.
Trick Slatterly urging us to abandon the belief in free will is an odd one–if there is no free will, we would have no control over what we choose to believe, and no agency to change those beliefs–or to purchase his witless book.
And we *certainly* would not be able to oppose the horrors of Jihad and Shari’ah, since they are ordained by the vicious “Allah” to begin with. This is urging us to surrender. No thanks.
Jennifer King says
In the Name of God or in the Name of Allah?
Qur’an 43:84 It is He Who is Ilah, God in the heavens and on the earth.
Qur’an 6:3 And He is Allah in the heavens and on the earth.
Ibn Abbas: He is the One who is called Allah in the heavens and on the earth.
To translate the name of Allah as God in English is completely wrong.
God is always Ilah, Ar Rahman in Arabic, the Qur’an and Islamic law.
The English translation of Allah is always ‘the god’.
The Shahada, the pledge of faith for Islam:
La ilaha ill-Allah, there is no god but Allah.
The sentence comprises a denial and an affirmation.
Negation: ‘La ilah’ negates all forms of god or God.
Affirmation: ‘illAllah’ affirms that there is only Allah.
In other words before you can say ‘I believe in Allah’ (illa Allah) you have to reject or disbelieve in any other god or God (La illaha).
Question 179 Islam Q&A http://www.islam-qa.com
Questions 114, 6703, 11819, 20239, 20815
Truth Triumps says
Now Religions are Quite Old. Now it is to Make Assessment looking at the Practical Effect. Something like Identifying the Tree seeing the Fruit.
God shown by Christianity shows own Might by Performing Miracles.
Islam teaches No God but Allah. This itself shows both are Not Same. Besides Allah’s Might is Exhibited by Fans, by Butchering Innocents Labeling Inferior Creatures.
Debates are uncalled for; is it not?
Jon Rowe says
George Washington & Thomas Jefferson claimed to worship the same God that Muslims worship. (Evidence available on request.) Though, maybe they weren’t really “Christians.”
gravenimage says
Thomas Jefferson took a strong stand against Islam, no matter what you appear to believe.
Rivers says
For anyone who might be interested, there are also several good articles about the “same God heresy” on the website Facing Islam.
http://www.facingislam.blogspot.com
Linda Rivera says
It’s BLASPHEMY to claim that the cruel Muslim death god is the same as the HOLY ONE, our Glorious, Majestic Creator who is PURE, HOLY and ABSOLUTELY GOOD.
Who will dare to Slander and MASSIVELY INSULT God in such a horrific way?
Truth Triumps says
Religions are 2 Categories. God Worshiping Religions and No God but ,,,,Region. This itself shows God and Allah are not same. Besides None of the God Worshiping Religions teach, God committed an Irreparable Error of creating Lot of Humans as Inferior Creatures and thereby they are to be Butchered.
Thus the Comparison is Irrelevant.
STJOHNOFGRAFTON says
Quoting from GotQuestions.org: A better question is:
“Do Christians and Muslims both have a correct understanding of who God is?”
To this question, the answer is definitely no. Because of crucial differences between the Christian and Muslim concepts of God.
The two faiths cannot both be true.
The biblical God alone addresses and solves the problem of sin by giving His Son.
“For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son” (John 3:16-18).
Jim says
You are correct when you say that Christians and Muslims do not worship the same God. The most obvious proof of this is that Christians consider Jesus Christ to be God in the flesh, and the Son of God. Muslims consider Jesus Christ to be merely a prophet, and not even as great a prophet as Muhammad.
Jesus said that the devil came to kill, steal, and destroy, while He came to give life, and life more abundantly. Muslims are taught to kill, steal, and destroy, while Christians are taught to love their enemies. There isn’t much that is more clear than that.
gravenimage says
I think even more salient is that Islam preaches rape and murder, and Christianity the opposite.
Trouble says
The father, son, and Holy Spirit born in Bethlehem came six hundred years before and is without question not a “ moon” god. To suggest that it is would be blasphemy and heresy of the highest order.