Here is a clear explication of an issue that has been enflamed by partisanship and hatred of the man in the White House. The President is pursuing the America-First agenda on which he campaigned. It should be the case that every President has America’s interests first in every situation, but that hasn’t been the case for many decades, until now. One reason why Trump so enrages the Left is because its globalist, socialist agenda was chugging along to full implementation without any serious interference from anyone until he came along.
“Turkey and the Kurds: It’s More Complicated Than You Think,” by Andrew C. McCarthy, National Review, October 10, 2019:
On Monday, President Trump announced that a contingent of fewer than 100 U.S. troops in Syria was being moved away from Kurdish-held territory on the border of Turkey. The move effectively green-lighted military operations by Turkey against the Kurds, which have now commenced. Some U.S. military officials went public with complaints about being “blindsided.” The policy cannot have been a surprise, though. The president has made no secret that he wants out of Syria, where we now have about 1,000 troops (down from over 2,000 last year). More broadly, he wants our forces out of the Middle East. He ran on that position. I’ve argued against his “endless wars” tropes, but his stance is popular. As for Syria specifically, many of the president’s advisers think we should stay, but he has not been persuaded.
The president’s announcement of the redeployment of the Syrian troops came on the heels of a phone conversation with Turkey’s President Recep Tayyip Erdogan. This, obviously, was a mistake, giving the appearance (and not for the first time) that Trump is taking cues from Ankara’s Islamist strongman. As has become rote, the inevitable criticism was followed by head-scratching tweets: The president vows to “totally destroy and obliterate the Economy of Turkey,” which “I’ve done before” (huh?), if Turkey takes any actions “that I, in my great and unmatched wisdom, consider to be off limits.” We can only sigh and say it will be interesting to see how the president backs up these haughty threats now that Erdogan has begun his invasion.
All that said, the president at least has a cogent position that is consistent with the Constitution and public opinion. He wants U.S. forces out of a conflict in which America’s interests have never been clear, and for which Congress has never approved military intervention. I find that sensible — no surprise, given that I have opposed intervention in Syria from the start (see, e.g., here, here, here, here, here, here, and here). The stridency of the counterarguments is matched only by their selectiveness in reciting relevant facts.
I thus respectfully dissent from our National Review editorial.
President Trump, it says, is “making a serious mistake” by moving our forces away from what is described as “Kurdish territory”; the resulting invasion by superior Turkish forces will “kill American allies” while “carving out a zone of dominance” that will serve further to “inflame and complicate” the region.
Where to begin? Perhaps with the basic fact that there is no Kurdish territory. There is Syrian territory on Turkey’s border that the Kurds are occupying — a situation that itself serves to “inflame and complicate” the region for reasons I shall come to. Ethnic Kurds do not have a state. They live in contiguous parts of Syria, Turkey, Iraq, and Iran. Most are integrated into these countries, but many are separatists.
The Kurds have been our allies against ISIS, but it is not for us that they have fought. They fight ISIS for themselves, with our help. They are seeking an autonomous zone and, ultimately, statehood. The editorial fails to note that the Kurds we have backed, led by the YPG (People’s Protection Units), are the Syrian branch of the PKK (the Kurdistan Worker’s Party) in Turkey. The PKK is a militant separatist organization with Marxist-Leninist roots. Although such informed observers as Michael Rubin contend that the PKK has “evolved,” it remains a formally designated foreign terrorist organization under U.S. law. While our government materially supports the PKK’s confederates, ordinary Americans have been prosecuted for materially supporting the PKK.
The PKK has a long history of conducting terrorist attacks, but their quarrel is not with us. So why has our government designated them as terrorists? Because they have been fighting an insurgent war against Turkey for over 30 years. Turkey remains our NATO ally, even though the Erdogan government is one of the more duplicitous and anti-Western actors in a region that teems with them — as I’ve detailed over the years (see, e.g., here, here, here, here, and in my 2012 book, Spring Fever). The Erdogan problem complicates but does not change the fact that Turkey is of great strategic significance to our security.
While it is a longer discussion, I would be open to considering the removal of both the PKK from the terrorist list and Turkey from NATO….
Oh yes, Turkey should absolutely be expelled from NATO. There is much more. Read the rest here.
PRCS says
See also this Caroline Glick article:
Trump did not betray the Kurds
https://www.israelhayom.com/opinions/trump-did-not-betray-the-kurds/
mortimer says
Yes, PRCS, but in Israel, the IDF reservists have begged their government to send them to help Kurdistan defend itself.
Ernie says
Thank you for mentioning Mortimer . I think it might be very interesting for many Jihad Watch readers to read the Jerusalem Post these days ………..
John Kendall says
Bring our troops home. We now have Mexican troops helping to protect our border. How embarrassing. A country not protecting its borders will not b a country for very long.
Ernie says
Many Israeli citizens don’t agree at all with Caroline Glick , PRCS .
Winston says
NATO Turkey is still in Northern Cyprus.
mortimer says
Exactly, and Turkey shows no signs of leaving Cyprus … if anything, they will officially annex it under Erdogan.
SAFI says
And what has Trump (or any other US Administration) done about it? (Or NATO’s burreaucracy for that matter… other than wash their hands and try not to upset the Turks)
Ernie says
A painful and a good question ………..because we know the answer SAFI . So what to expect for the future………? More of the same….? I’m not very optimistic………..
gravenimage says
Turkey should have been kicked out of NATO when they invaded Cyprus–if not sooner. They are no allies of ours.
Brian Hoff says
The Greece invade first. Turkey only act to protect the Muslim on the Island.
Ernie says
” Brian Hoff “, you must be very gullible believing turkish propaganda . No wonder after so much inbreeding in your family . I pity you !
Ernie says
Brian Hoff , do you wonder how I know your parents are/were very closely related….? Well , I’m a clairvoyant , a sorcerer , and jinns tell me all your secrets….HAHAHA !
Angemon says
“Turkey only act to protect the Muslim on the Island.”
“Protect” from what? And how? By occupying and occupying a foreign nation and kicking out around 80% of its inhabitants? No, to be short and blunt, Turkey invaded, occupied, pillaged and ethnically cleansed a portion of Cyprus. If it really wanted to “protect muslims” they would ave evacuated them to Turkish soil. But I’ll be sure to use this “protect coreligionists” excuse the next time you whine on about Israel and alleged “occupation” – “Israel only act to protect Jews on the land, just like you said of Turkey and Cyprus”…
Angemon says
Ups, “invading and occupying”, not “occupying and occupying” 🙂
Ernie says
hear hear , Gravenimage !
Infidel says
I don’t disagree, but the problem w/ that would have been that Turkey would have then become an ally/protege of the Soviets – something that the US and NATO wanted to avoid. And having done nothing on Cyprus then, they don’t have much of a leg to stand on now, if they brought it up.
But yeah, they could logically part ways w/ Turkey given that the latter is trying to create its own Islamic bloc, as well as its targeting the Kurds for another genocide (after the one Saddam did years ago)
medforth says
German Soccer Club St.Pauli: Ultras demand dismissal of Sahin
A statement of solidarity for the Turkish military by football pro Cenk Sahin has sparked dismay at second division FC St. Pauli and protests among the fans. The 25-year-old Left Wing welcomed the Turks’ Syria offensive on Instagram. “The FC St. Pauli clearly distances itself from the post and the content, because it is incompatible with the values of the club.The club has already talked to the player and works internally on the subject.As long as the internal work-up is not completed, FC St. Pauli will not comment on that, never again war! “, wrote the club on Friday on his homepage. Sahin had posted in Turkish: “We are on the side of our heroic military and armies, our prayers are with you!” Attached is the name of the military operation. The Pauli-Ultras then demand the separation from the professional. “It is not the first linguistic and media slippage of Sahin in this issue, in the past he expressed himself pronationalist, loyal to the regime and contemptible about the dying of the Kurdish population,” write fans and demand: “For us Ultras is therefore certain that Cenk Sahin is no longer in the jersey of FC Sankt Pauli We are calling on the club to fire Cenk Sahin today, Friday 11 October! ”
More:
https://searchlight-germany.blogspot.com/2019/10/german-soccer-club-stpauli-ultras.html
mortimer says
The so-called ‘heroic’ Turkish armies have shown themselves rather unheroic in the matter of rape, massacres and genocides. Turkish chauvinism and barbarism has made them hated even among Muslims.
gravenimage says
Thanks for that link, medforth.
tgusa says
The USA has a collective defense arrangement with Turkey. If the USA sides with the Kurds and that side begins winning and Turkey invokes that collective defense arrangement what does the USA do turn around and attack the Kurds? A very tangled web indeed.
mortimer says
Yes, tgusa … a contradictory situation. But a power vacuum and a freehand to Turkey to commit genocide is what is happening. Next, ISIS will come back and Turkey will have an excuse to liquidate all the Arabs regardless of what side they are on. Turkey is only exceeded by Germany and Pakistan in genocide during the 20th century.
Turkey has never acknowledged its genocides, so they are almost certain to repeat that behavior.
Infidel says
Tgusa, the US should just withdraw from NATO, so that it’s irrelevant whether or not Turkey gets expelled from NATO. After that, tell the EU and anyone else who wants the US to stay in Syria for the sake of the Kurds to put together an independent Kurdistan. After that, we can consider protecting them
gravenimage says
When Turkey invaded Cyprus in the 1970s, that *should* have gotten them kicked out of NATO.
owensgate says
There was a great opportunity to right the wrong Europeans did to the Middle East after the Ottoman Empire was defeated. The “wrong” was carving the M.E. up across Tribal lines, creating unworkable “Nation States”. What we SHOULD have done, with the power we had to do so, and without any UN say so, after Hussein was deposed, would have been to re-draw the borders of Iraq, i.e., “carve it up” into three States, giving Kurdistan a valid, recognized Nation, which could answer as such, to current Turkish adventurism. Even now, we have the power to establish a “Pax Americana” on the M.E., and the World could do nothing about it.
Rarely says
An isolationist policy in this shrinking World may be difficult to maintain. It’s tough going trying to exist in a bubble coming out with muscles flexed only when someone threatens economic interests.
Attempts to destabilize the World (such as 9/11 when “some people did something”) must be viewed some other way than “Don’t mess with Texas”. The ramifications of very, very justified retaliation should have been examined carefully and calmly. Knee jerk reactions won’t do the trick.
The World is now stuck with the results.
The bottom line, I suppose, is that the tribes in the Middle East will keep on with their infighting ad nauseum. The trick is how to keep from getting involved. This is particularly difficult while the Russians and Chinese extend their influence in the region.
Rob says
Forget NATO. What about a coalition of European states going in to protect the Kurds.
It’s much further from Washington to Damascus than Brussels to Damascus.
Ernie says
A coalition of European states going in to protect the Kurds…… If the European countries knew what’s good for themselves (and even out of sheer self-interest) they surely should do this Rob …. They should….But they won’t…………..
Lotus says
A good article from the Guardian newspaper criticising Trump for betraying the Kurds.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/oct/11/trump-deal-erdogan-lethal-consequences-ukraine-syria
gravenimage says
Lotus, I have mixed feelings about the US pullout from the Middle East and the situation with the Kurds, but citing Jonathan Freedland and the Guardian is a bit questionable.
Freedland has lauded the Muslim takeover of Britain:
“Census shows a changing of the guard in Britain”
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2012/dec/11/census-2011-england-wales
He has also fantasized about murdering a character clearly intended to be President Trump–he has a book out that he wrote, “To Kill the President”:
https://www.amazon.com/Kill-President-Most-Explosive-Thriller/dp/0007413726
(Jonathan Freedland writes thrillers under the pseudonym Sam Bourne).
Lotus says
Well GI, it is possible to agree with some of the things a person says and not others. Nothing wrong with that; in fact, it is a sign of a healthy public discourse. Only in totalitarian regimes are all people supposed to think monolithically in the same way.
The Kurds lost about 11,000 soldiers fighting Isis. Isis could not have been defeated without their help. Does that not entitle them to some consideration?
This Turkish incursion is going to destabilise the region, create a refugee crisis and give thousands of Isis fighters, currently being guarded by the Kurds, the opportunity to go free.
Why were no arrangements made to secure these fighters before giving the green light to Erdogan? It is typical of Trump that he ignores such important matters. He doesn’t do detail.
One of the valid criticisms of Trump is that he is erratic. He lurches from one policy decision to another, never planning things properly or consulting with allies or even with the experts in his own administration.
He has a seat-of-the-pants approach to policy-making which is alarming for someone in his position.
Infidel says
I dunno about PKK, but I want to see all those international bureaucrats so enamored by the Kurds to put together a plan to create an actual Kurdistan! Let them twist the arms of Baghdad, Damascus, Teheran and Ankara into ceding territory to Kurdistan – just like they did to Belgrade on the question of Kosovo. Once there’s an independent Kurdistan, we can consider whether to put troops there, away from their families
Lotus says
Isis rebel fighters see the Turkish incursion as a godsend. The Kurds currently hold several thousand fighters and their dependents. Those fighters are already seeking to escape. How is this good news for us?
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/turkey-syria-trump-invasion-latest-kurds-mistake-military-a9151796.html
Lotus says
Another article rightly critical of Trump.
Robert, you have benefited many with your clear analysis of the dangers of Islam, but I think you’ve made a wrong call by supporting Trump here.
Even you must acknowledge that Trump’s tweets are borderline delusional. The Kurds did not help us at Normandy??? They also were not assisting during the American War of Independence, the rascals.
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/trump-turkey-syria-isis-invasion-tal-abyad-sdf-kurdish-ukraine-a9151146.html
Lotus says
Robert Emerson, a British security analyst, observed “it is quite bizarre that the Americans, the British and other western allies built up this very effective Kurdish force against Isis, and all this can be dismantled by Trump acting on a whim. The scenario we have to consider is that Isis will be back and Syria will again become a source of terrorism in the region and beyond including Europe.”
Terry Gain says
I am astounded that there is so much support for such an obviously bad decision. If the goal is to have not even one U.S. soldier killed rather than secure peace then why not just disband the military.
Ernie says
+1
Theo Prinse says
Even Geert Wilders of the Dutch anti islam Freedom Party just like Pentagon, John Bolton, Mike Pompeo rejects fascist Erdogan murderous invasion of Kurdish homeland under opression of the Turkish Ottoman empire and reshaped by the British. Wilders, the Flemish Vlaams Belang and others in Europe wants to throw Tuyrkey out of Nato ! Trump turns out betraying courageous Kurdish fighters who destroyed ISIS created by Obama with huge human sacrifice, Trump will easily betray Israel. Trump only wants to do this for his abject electoral opportunism and because he thinks his voters will believe that he can save Erdogan otherwise Erdogan will estrange from Nato and turn to Russia’s S-400 threatening the stealth of the F-35. Robert Spencer, Caroline Glick, Noony Darwish, Andrew Bostom produce ‘the Kurds didnt help us in Normandy’ rubbish. Trump wasnt in Normandy either and never in the army. Dhimmy Trump doesnt fight islam. Not in Pakistan nor anywhere else.
Lotus says
Trump was a Vietnam draft-dodger. As with many sons of wealthy families, the attitude was that wars are fine, as long as other people’s sons (from low-income families) are doing the dying.
And he calls himself a patriot. What a hypocrite!
I have to stop writing now, because I have a bone spur in my heel. 🙂
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2019/05/28/is-it-time-talk-about-donald-trumps-draft-dodging/
Theo Prinse says
?
Ernie says
I like your comment Theo !
Theo Prinse says
Thank you Hopefully Trump will come to his senses
Giacomo Latta says
I would like the POTUS’s ”destroy and obliterate the Economy of Turkey” if it didn’t ring of the ”red line in the sand” of a previous president.
Lotus says
An article by Robert Fisk, a veteran Middle East journalist who really knows his stuff. Not surprisingly therefore, he is critical of the Orange One.
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/trump-erdogan-syria-turkey-kurds-isis-bombing-a9153116.html
Terry Gain says
https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2019/oct/11/us-deploying-3000-troops-advanced-equipment-saudi-/
So much for bringing all the troops home from the Muddled East. So why did President Trump give Erdogan free reign to massacre the Kurds? Was he giving him rope with which to hang himself?
One of the problems with being an uncritical supporter of President Trump is that eventually he will make you look like a fool.
Lotus says
+1.