More glories of the new, diverse, multicultural Europe.
“Assaulted by Muslim youths while sharing the gospel: Robbed and knocked down on an open street,” translated from “Drapstruet av muslimske ungdommer mens han delte evangeliet: Ranet og slått ned på åpen gate,” by Johnny Myhr-Hansen, Norge Idag, November 28, 2019:
Roar Fløttum was preaching the gospel and was praying for the sick yesterday when four Muslim men assaulted him, robbed him and threatened to kill him if he did not convert to Islam.
Roar Fløttum tells Norge Idag that he had attended a prayer meeting in the church he belongs to in Trondheim. After the meeting, he usually goes around town to share the gospel and pray for the sick.
“I eventually came in contact with a group of four Muslim men. I asked if they wanted me to pray for them and they did. One had back pain. I prayed for him and he said he was about fifty percent better. I had to pray for him one more time and then he got along just fine, he said. I also had to pray for one of the others, and after two prayers he was also very good. They were so shocked that I believed in them. They were very credible in the way they responded,” Fløttum told Norge Idag.
– What happened after that?
“They wanted to take me to a friend who they said had injured his foot and was now waiting to be picked up to be taken to the emergency room. I trusted them and joined them. They took me to a backyard. They were very nice and I couldn’t believe they would deceive me,” says Fløttum.
He says that when they entered the backyard, they pushed him down a cellar staircase before hitting and kicking him in the face. He tried to protect himself, but did not strike them.
“They threatened to take my bank card and certificate, codes, mobile and apple ID. They held me hostage there for an hour as they pulled out the cards. They took about ten thousand kroner. While they kept me there, they threatened me and said they would kill me if I did not convert to Islam. They wanted me to say a few words in Arabic. I was scared and actually thought they were going to kill me because they said they had a knife and didn’t want witnesses,” says Fløttum….
Wellington says
Ah yes, the “no compulsion” rot by Mohammedans on display again.
No other major religion even remotely produces believers in scores who try to pull of this shit. And I think “shit” is the accurate term because Islam is full of it—to an overflowing amount—has been from the seventh century onward.
But I digress. Or do I?
Battle says
+1
mortimer says
NO COMPULSION? Mohammed did it, it is the SUNNA of Mohammed.
[Muhammad] said: “Woe to you Abu Sufyan, isn’t it time that you recognize that I am God’s apostle?” He [Sufyan] answered, “As to that I still have some doubt.” [Ibn Abbas] said to him [Sufyan], “Submit and testify that there is no God but Allah and that Muhammad is the apostle of God before you lose your head,” so he [Sufyan] did so.” – Tabari pt2,p.157; Ibn Kathir ‘Biography of the Prophet’ pt3,p.549
Muslims lie about FORCIBLE CONVERSION … ‘No compulsion’ to join Islam is yet another Muslim word-game: FORCIBLE CONVERSION is normative Islam, rather than an aberration.
Murad says
No compulsion’ to join Islam . . . is a good mantra to be cited by traitors.
gravenimage says
Grimly spot on about compulsion, Wellington. Muslims don’t consider this compulsion–after all, the victim always has the “choice” of refusing and dying.
Then there’s this:
While they kept me there, they threatened me and said they would kill me if I did not convert to Islam. They wanted me to say a few words in Arabic.
………………..
It is obvious that if these pious Muslims couldn’t get their victim to convert to Islam “voluntarily”, that they would try to trick him into saying those “few words in Arabic”, which were obviously the Shehada.
somehistory says
Exactly right. Like the moslim who tried to get me to say them. Once said, the person is considered a moslim and any attempts to proceed as usual for that one, meets the possibility of death for “apostasy.” Saying it no solution, no answer.
gravenimage says
When did this happen to you, Somehistory? So glad you were savvy enough to refuse. Did you know about the Shehada and its meaning at the time, or did the situation just feel wrong?
Wellington says
Good questions by gravenimage, somehistory. Would be interested in a little more detail should you be inclined to provide it (if not, that’s OK too).
Man, Islam has a ton of faults, sneakiness being one of them. There seems to be no end to the rot which is Mo’s creed.
somehistory says
g, and Wellington,
It was in August, 2001. I have written some before about the young moslim who lived in the same apartment complex as I and who taught at a madrassa down the road from there.
One evening in January, 2001, when I was parking my truck, he came strolling by and I said a greeting to him. I am a friendly person. He nodded and kept walking. He wore the little cap and long white shirt..robe?…and white pants.
At that time, I had engaged in many conversations with moslims…both male and female, but had never thought that they all *believed* the same, nor did I know of their desire to take over everywhere for islam. The females told of abuse by their fathers or husbands, and the men either pretended to be friendly, or refused to look at me or talk to me directly. Abuse happens in every kind of household, and I had met some men from India who were of two different “castes” and one never looked at me or spoke to me, while the other one did, even explaining why his friend wouldn’t. So, I was not fully cognizant of how moslim males think or believe. i hope this makes sense.
I had met several American women who had married moslim men and began to wear the full cover-up. They couldn’t tell me a whole lot about islam, and didn’t act like most of the born-moslim women I encountered.
Anyway, in August, I was moving, carrying some things to the rental truck, and the young moslim man strolled by. He stopped suddenly and asked me if I was moving, I said yes, and he apologized for not taking the time to “get to know” me. He remembered that I had spoken to him previously and said not many people were friendly to him there, that I had been different.
Anyway, he offered to help me move my things. I said, “No, that’s okay.’ I don’t really want strangers going through my personal belongings. But, he insisted, ran inside my apartment and began carrying things out. First, he grabbed the bed and before long, had a bunch of stuff in the truck. I kept trying to get him to stop, but he wouldn’t.
Finally, he went to the living room and my tv sat on the floor…because I had already taken the stand it sat on to the truck. To get him to stop taking my stuff, I asked him about himself and he told me about the school where he taught the little boys all about islam. We spoke about that for a moment or two, and he said it was easy to become a moslim.
He said all you had to do was say the shehada…or whatever the word is…and because I am a person who has learned a few words in a dozen and more languages, I listened as he said it. He repeated it a few times and suggested I try pronouncing the words. Foolishly, I did make a small attempt at the first word…not thinking about what he had said about “becoming moslim by saying it,” but thankfully, I don’t usually get pronunciations correct (you should hear my Spanish or my French)…and finally, he gave up.
However, it must have been enough that I tried, or he was going to force the issue, because he turned to the tv on the floor and said, “You shouldn’t watch television. It’s bad.”
I said, “i don’t watch bad things. I’m careful.”
And then he said, “There aren’t any good things on.”
I said, “Well, I have a movie on tape and I’m going to watch that tonight as I rest.”
He said, “No! Movies are bad too.” Then, he picked up the vcr and headed for the door. I tried to stop him but he went straight to the truck.
I thought to myself that sooner or later he would have to go home and I could easily get it back out. Then, he returned and picked up the tv. Again, he ignored my requests to stop and took it to the truck.
When he returned and looked around, he saw that the apt was basically empty except for a small chair I had planned to sit in to watch the movie. He left then and didn’t return.
I went out to the truck a little later and found the vcr smashed on the floor of the truck. I fund the tv upside down, but it had landed on a stuffed chair and was not broken.
The nest month, 9/11 happened and I have often wondered if he was aware of the planning of it. I certainly am more aware of what islam is all about and what those few words in arabic mean to a person’s well-being.
Thanks to both of you for asking. Ignorance can get a person in all kinds of difficulties, esp if a person is too trusting of others and their motives. I’ve learned a whole lot about islam and moslims since that summer.
gravenimage says
Wow, Somehistory–*that* is disturbing. This Muslim’s aggressiveness and refusal to listen to you is troubling; his destroying your VCR and attempting to destroy your TV even worse. And your being alone with him in your apartment sounds as though this could have turned out even worse for you–glad it didn’t.
Wellington says
Echoing gravenimage, WOW!
Thanks for the narration. You know, somehistory, NEVER do I hear anything about Muslims that makes me think better of Islam. Even when Muslims engage in some apparently charitable endeavor for non-Muslims, they invariably have a hidden agenda underneath.
The more a sensible person learns about Islam, the more such a person must be suspicious of it, if not despising it. There seems to be no end to Islamic deceptions—fitting since Islam is one gigantic deception. I do allow for a Muslim here or there to do a really good deed for a non-Muslim without any agenda, but such Muslims are confused about their faith and betraying it so they are not reliable either.
somehistory says
Thanks, guys.
Experience is a good teacher if we pay attention. I didn’t have it nearly so bad as the young man who tried to help those who brutalized him, by any stretch. I’m just glad I found out what they are capable of and without being bruised and bloodied…or worse.
Perhaps this young man has also learned from his experience and can warn others as she should have been.
gravenimage says
I hope so. Somehistory.
william carr says
No doubt a good man but an incredibly naive man. Of course religious people especially Christians are terminally naive or they would not believe all that nonsense.
It is also worth noting that prayer has been demonstrated to have no effect whatsoever on peoples’ health
George Jarrold says
Jesus said that the children of light are not as worldly as those of darkness. You are wrong about prayer. Prayer can cure believers. You are not so how can it work for you? You cannot have what you do not believe exists or go to a place that you believe isn’t there.
Clayton Lee says
And who has demonstrated that?
somehistory says
By the scientific method some put so much “faith” in, one cannot *prove* God exists. (It is also impossible using this “method” to prove that He does not.)
But, your claim that Christians believe “nonsense” is total malarkey. Much of what Christians believe is written in history…confirmed by “science” as in archaeology…and much is also supported by the science of medicine.
And your very last sentence…is just so much misinformation as can be written about prayer. It has “been demonstrated” many times over, that prayer helps people who are ill and or depressed. Many studies have been done on prayer…by the scientific community…to find out if there is “power in prayer” to help people get over disease, illnesses, after operations, etc. and these have proven that prayer helps in these circumstances.
And although it would do no good to tell you…you of no faith and only mockery and misinformation… an untold number of Christians could relate the times they have had prayers answered.
This young man believed the hype that is currently abundant, that islam and moslims are carriers of peace instead of the true facts,…they carry the worst plague possible from satan,…and approached them to help.
ManchesterLad says
While I might agree with you somewhat, I think it important to point out that religious people often ‘choose’ to believe something, even though they know it can never be proved, it is a matter of faith to them. So in this case I don’t think they are being naive, and I would not choose to describe them as such.
Certainly I’d agree he seemed to be very naive – I’d suggest more of a leftist trait than strictly a religious one? However, the propaganda he receives 24/7 from the media would be telling him all the time that Muslims are peaceful (most of them are, of course) and it is racist to even consider whether he might be putting himself in danger.
If I’d been him I’d have been very embarrassed to admit the sequence of events leading up to the assault (his back was 50% better so I prayed again….).
Terry Gain says
No. Once again you have demonstrated why Islam isn’t a religion. Not even close. Recognition that Islam is a supremacist, totalitarian, conquest ideology – rather than a religion to be embraced and protected – is a necessary first step in equipping us to deal with this existential threat to our culture.
gravenimage says
Terry, you constantly insist that we ignore the fact that Islam is a religion by every definition of that word.
I don’t believe that we can fight Islam–or any other evil–by ignoring the proper definitions of reality.
It is not just Agnostics and Atheists who believe that embracing reality is important.
And it is obvious that the Founding Fathers were well aware of the evil of Islam–and of some other creeds–when the First Amendment was adopted. This Amendment was never intended to allow for cutting out human hearts or roasting infants in brass idols, or the savagery of Islam–no matter what some may pretend.
Terry Gain says
GI
Your claim that we can defeat Islam the same way that it was defeated by the Spanish reconquista is absurd. The Spanish fought Muslims conquerors who entered Spain as armed invaders.
Today’s Muslim conquerors are not regarded as invaders but legal immigrants. They have been armed with the legal right granted by people like you and Wellington to spread their seditionist “religion” through elections, propaganda and lawfare. No one is proposing that arms be taken up in America against these conquerors.
You and Wellington have no solution to this conquest. You aren’t even willing to declare that Islam is not a religion. My goodness, Obama got you half way to this point when he rightly pronounced that no religion condones killing. He was right for a change. An ideology that not only condones but commands killing for people exercising their right of conscience is the antithesis of a religion. Step up to the plate.
And no Wellington, we don’t need the Supreme Court to make this finding. We only need enough people to accept this reality about Islam and there will be overwhelmingly support for a sane immigration policy.
So GI, you and Wellington can continue to insist that these conquerors are just practicing their “religion”. You are their dream come true.
And no GI, the Founders would never have given Muslims First Amendment protection if they had given due regard to the issue. Show me where it was even considered. Why do you insist that the Founders created a Constitution with the seeds planted therein for the demise of what they created?
gravenimage says
Terry Gain wrote:
GI
Your claim that we can defeat Islam the same way that it was defeated by the Spanish reconquista is absurd. The Spanish fought Muslims conquerors who entered Spain as armed invaders.
……………………….
Actually, Terry, I did not specifically cite the Reconquista above, nor have I ever said that the main threat to the West from Muslims at this specific point in history is full-fledged military invasion–because we could obviously handily defeat any Muslim army.
But the idea that since the logistics differ somewhat that this means that we have to reject what Islam is and adopt a different approach that involves ignoring or somehow changing the definition of our languages makes no sense.
More:
Today’s Muslim conquerors are not regarded as invaders but legal immigrants. They have been armed with the legal right granted by people like you and Wellington to spread their seditionist “religion” through elections, propaganda and lawfare. No one is proposing that arms be taken up in America against these conquerors.
……………………….
This is, of course, absurd slander against Wellington and myself. I have applauded President Trump’s “Muslim ban”–under which Muslims coming into the US are down 90%–and advocated its being extended to include *all* Muslim nations. I have been staunchly against continued Muslim immigration, and have recommended deporting Jihadists being deported after serving their prison sentences. I have also advocated Muslims who have plotted Jihad or joined the Islamic State or other Muslim polities to be stripped of their citizenship.
I have also championed specific bans of Shari’ah law–the idea that Wellington and myself are *for* the imposition of Shari’ah law is obvious slander–and you *now* this.
Moreover, the idea that all Muslim infiltration of the West is legal is mistaken at best. Especially in Europe, much of the invasion is illegal.
To suggest that Wellington and I are *for* Muslims flooding into the US and the rest of the West is nothing but calumny.
More:
You and Wellington have no solution to this conquest. You aren’t even willing to declare that Islam is not a religion. My goodness, Obama got you half way to this point when he rightly pronounced that no religion condones killing. He was right for a change. An ideology that not only condones but commands killing for people exercising their right of conscience is the antithesis of a religion. Step up to the plate.
……………………….
Obama was, of course, *lying*. The implication that he was saying that Islam was violent and hence not a religion is ridiculous. Of course, he never once said that Islam was not a religion.
And the idea that declaring that Islam is not a religion is the least one can do if one opposes Jihad is simply untrue.
The Crusaders fought against Islam, Thomas Jefferson fought against Islam, Winston Churchill fought against Islam–yet they didn’t pretend that Islam is not a religion.
Robert Spencer also knows that Islam is an evil religion. Do you think that this brave man hasn’t “stepped up to the plate”, as well?
More:
And no Wellington, we don’t need the Supreme Court to make this finding. We only need enough people to accept this reality about Islam and there will be overwhelmingly support for a sane immigration policy.
……………………….
We are on our way to a sane immigration policy with Trump–and no, he never said that Islam was not a religion, either.
Besides–as I have noted–even if you were to convince Americans that Islam is something other than what it is, Islam would not magically cease to be a threat. Secular ideologies have the same protections under the First Amendment that religions do–one may hold any idea, no matter how repugnant, so long as they do not put any illegal aspect of those beliefs into action–i.e., one can be a Nazi, but cannot attack the country’s neighbors or commit genocide against the Jews; one can be a Communist, but cannot build a Gulag or try to liquidate “class enemies”.
In exactly the same way as a Muslim can be Muslim, but cannot wage violent Jihad or impose Shari’ah. We need to enforce the laws we do have, rather than change our laws for Muslims.
More:
So GI, you and Wellington can continue to insist that these conquerors are just practicing their “religion”. You are their dream come true.
……………………….
The idea that Muslims are thrilled to have the savagery of their creed exposed *simply makes no sense*. Were that true, then Jihadists would be applauding Robert Spencer rather than smearing him and threatening his life.
Worse, your implication that Wellington and I are *for* violent Jihad is nothing but calumny–you *know* this is not true.
I think your hobbyhorse about changing the meaning of our languages is silly and pointless, but I would *never* imply that it is pro-Jihad, because it clearly is not.
More:
And no GI, the Founders would never have given Muslims First Amendment protection if they had given due regard to the issue. Show me where it was even considered. Why do you insist that the Founders created a Constitution with the seeds planted therein for the demise of what they created?
……………………….
I know you have implied that he Founders were ignorant morons, who wouldn’t have been so “foolish” as to create the Constitution and Bill of Rights if they weren’t such naive stooges, but this is simply not borne out.
The Founders were well aware of Islam and the depredations of the Barbary Pirates by the time the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, including the First Amendment were adopted.
And as early as his Notes on the State of Virginia, Jefferson made it clear that he understood the difference between holding religious beliefs and acting on those beliefs that are injurious to others:
“…our rulers can have authority over such natural rights only as we have submitted to them. The rights of conscience we never submitted, we could not submit. We are answerable for them to our God. The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.”
Then, were it the case that the Constitution is the problem, then surely we would be far *worse* off than are nations lacking this supposedly suicidal document–but this is simply not the case. In fact, protecting freedom of speech is actually a *good* thing in that it allows us to tell the truth about Islam–whatever you might believe.
Wellington says
Terry: You can disagree with me as much as you want but you should not make a statement that is demonstrably false on its face, to wit, that I (and gravenimage) “have no solution” to the iniquity which is Islam. Oh yes we do and that is to describe Islam as an evil religion.
Yeah, I get it that you think Islam is not a religion, which no judiciary in the West or any dictionary would be supportive of you in this claim, but please don’t aver that people like myself and gravenimage “have no solution.” Yes we do. You may not like our solution but it is disingenuous of you to assert that we “have no solution.”
Finally, respecting the Founders not giving Islam First Amendment protection, I would direct you to Thomas Jefferson’s First Inaugural Address (March 4, 1801) in which he stated, “If there be any among us who would wish to dissolve this Union or to change its republican form, let them stand undisturbed as monuments of the safety with which error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it.”
Or is Jefferson not good enough for you either, not “enough” of a Founding Father?
Your turn.
Terry Gain says
GI
It seems that with your last sentence you are arguing that the Founders did not consider Islam to be an ideology protected by the First Amendment.
If there was any reference to Islam by the Founders I assume you would have posted it by now.
As for Wellington .
” Finally, respecting the Founders not giving Islam First Amendment protection, I would direct you to Thomas Jefferson’s First Inaugural Address (March 4, 1801) in which he stated, “If there be any among us who would wish to dissolve this Union or to change its republican form, let them stand undisturbed as monuments of the safety with which error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it.”
Seriously, Wellington. Where is the reference to Islam by Jefferson? Where is the proof that any of the Founders understood Islam any better than Barack Obama or Hillary Clinton? And since when can Islam be combatted if it is off limits as a religion. Or are you unaware as to why it is protected?
Wellington says
Terry Gain: Both Thomas Jefferson and John Adams had some idea of Islam’s nature (though not as much as John Quincy Adams did). In any case, since Marxism and Nazism didn’t even exist, unlike Islam, when Jefferson made the statement I quoted you, I guess you would also conclude that he and other Founding Fathers would have not asserted that these two secular totalitarian ideologies should be extended First Amendment protection too.
You’re all over the place with unsupported assumptions as well as having a definition of religion that no dictionary I know of would support. And again I ask you, where is it written that a religion cannot be evil? The Old Testament has references to many ancient religions like those of Mesopotamia and Egypt. These are characterized as false and wicked religions rather than not being religions at all. You live in high theory land on this issue of religion and it is actually detrimental to dealing with Islam most effectively, which should be extended First Amendment protection, just as Marxism and Nazism are, but accurately described as a menace to liberty, equality under the law and, in general, a gigantic iniquity. Were this to happen the corner of corners will have been turned and thereafter Islam would be looked upon as legal but also a pariah in league with other pariahs that are protected by the First Amendment like Neo-Nazism, anarchism, Satanism, the KKK, et al.
But you’re not going to get any of this. Nope, not at all. And good luck convincing American judges or judges of other Western nations that Islam is not a religion. Ditto for art historians, sociologists, historians, philosophers (Bertrand Russell in his History of Western Philosophy has an entire chapter on Islamic philosophy, which he pretty much thought was second rate, and in his The Theory and Practice of Bolshevism he maintains that Islam is the one major religion which is totalitarian in structure and ideology and this is why Russell compared it to Marxism and fascism), and scores of others in sundry other professions. Your “Islam is not a religion” is a loser right out of the gate and is going nowhere. Wise up.
gravenimage says
Terry Gain wrote:
GI
It seems that with your last sentence you are arguing that the Founders did not consider Islam to be an ideology protected by the First Amendment.
………………….
No–my saying that freedom of speech is a good thing is *not* somehow claiming that Islam is not a religion. This is nonsense.
Our being able to speak out against the evils of Islam or any other creed is a good thing in and of itself.
More:
If there was any reference to Islam by the Founders I assume you would have posted it by now.
………………….
This is *ridiculous*, I have not only posted about this, but you *have replied*. Pretending that the Founders were either ignorant about Islam or did not consider it a religion is absurd. In his notes for the Constitution of Virginia, Jefferson cites John Locke’s 1689 “Letter on Toleration”:
“(He) says neither Pagan nor Mahometan (Muslim) nor Jew ought to be excluded from the civil rights of the commonwealth because of his religion.”
He then notes in The Virginia Statute for Religious Freedom:
“Our civil rights have no dependence on our religious opinions.”
But claiming that this or the First Amendment allows Muslims to impose brutal Shari’ah law on us or wage violent Jihad against us–things you have also asserted–is *not* correct.
More:
As for Wellington .
” Finally, respecting the Founders not giving Islam First Amendment protection, I would direct you to Thomas Jefferson’s First Inaugural Address (March 4, 1801) in which he stated, “If there be any among us who would wish to dissolve this Union or to change its republican form, let them stand undisturbed as monuments of the safety with which error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it.”
Seriously, Wellington. Where is the reference to Islam by Jefferson?
………………….
Of course, this is not about Islam, nor was it intended to be. This is about our freedoms allowing dissent.
More:
Where is the proof that any of the Founders understood Islam any better than Barack Obama or Hillary Clinton? And since when can Islam be combatted if it is off limits as a religion. Or are you unaware as to why it is protected?
………………….
Yes–John Adams and Thomas Jefferson understood the savagery of Islam. The diplomat for the Barbary Pirates in London made clear that Islam teaches violence against unbelievers. Hillary Clinton never said any such thing, despite what you may imply.
Then, pretending that we did not fight Islam as the Barbary Pirates is simply not the case–in fact, our actions led to the defeat of the pirates and shipping being free in the Mediterranean Sea for the first time in *a thousand years*. This was a profoundly good thing.
As for Barack Hussein Obama, he attended Mosque and Qur’anic school for most of his childhood, The implication that he was a naif when it came to Islam is implausible. More likely his apologia for Islam was Taqiyya.
And good people fought Islam for *centuries* while acknowledging that it is an evil religion–at Poitiers, in the Holy Land, at Lepanto, at the gates of Vienna, as well as the Barbary Pirates. The idea that anyone who considered Islam a religion would be incapable of raising a finger against it is *obviously* false.
Considering Islam to be “off limits” is a product of “political correctness”, and is of *very* recent vintage. It has nothing to with acknowledging that Islam is a religion.
Then, the claim you have made that the First Amendment *prohibits* any criticism of Islam or any other religion is *quite* mistaken. In fact, our freedoms enable us to criticize Islam or any other creed.
Then, the claim you have made that the First Amendment prevents *anything* that would prevent the practice of any aspect of Islam under law–even of legalizing Jihad terror–is obviously *not* the case.
And I note that you have not pulled back from the claim that Wellington and I are pro-Jihad. which is just sickening calumny. I didn’t think that you would stoop so low. Sadly, I was mistaken.
Murad says
Roar Fløttum Attitudes and trust or distrust, hate and love, and other human emotions and feelings, start developing to maturity only through a bitter , hard process. That process which may take decades will make you / us assess everything: schools, professors, treasonous rulers, . . . etc, the right way. and will give you stubbornness to hold on to and defend what you have arrived at as facts. In other words : principles.
Decent people know that if we abandon our principles, or we don’t have any, as we have become over the last 70 + years, then chaos will rule followed by corpses.
Then you will abandon all that rubbish naivete of the humanitarianism, the supposedly more sublime principles than Judeo-Christian principle. And “humanitarianism, diversity, multiculti, and the other craps, the religion of “democracies”, To prove that they were sublime they started to invite Somalis, Sudanese, Pakistanis, Turks, Eritreans, (muslims from every corner of the earth) , the eternal enemies of Jews and Christians, to prove that they, by their humanity, can live magically in peace with the deadly enemy.
Now Roar Fløttum will realize why Israel is hated so much and it does not matter what plan for peace they offer to muslims, they will never accept. And have never accepted.
Either you must crush them under your knees or they will be at your throat.
When Europe suffers enough will they sympathize with the Jews instead of the eternal oppressors.
gravenimage says
Being kind and decent does not mean having to throw out common sense as Roar Fløttum did. It is possible to be a good person while eschewing willful naïveté. In fact, it is not possible to do real wide-ranging good in the world unless you also understand the threat of those intending evil.
Murad says
Image, very good realistic ideas. We have to learn a lesson from:
“No good deed goes unpunished.” Proverbs and wise sayings are as essential to humans as are the laws of physics.
gravenimage says
Agreed Murad.
Battle says
“About ten thousand kroner” is protection money Roar Flottam was forced to pay.
ntesdorf says
Roar Flottam was forced to pay the Jizzyah.
Steven Dawson says
EXACTLY !
gravenimage says
Norway: Muslims rob, beat Christian evangelist, threaten to kill him unless he converts to Islam
………………………..
And the victim was a man who had prayed with them for their health and showed concern over a man going to the hospital–in fact, the cynical attackers used this as a ruse to get the victim to come with them.
God, I hate Islam.
Wellington says
So fitting that a ruse was used by these Muslims, gravenimage, since Islam in its entirety is a ruse.
gravenimage says
Grimly true, Wellington.
PRCS says
The guy is an idiot.
1. How is it he didn’t know that Muslims hate ‘unbelievers’ and/or that his prayers mean only insult to them.
2. He actually believed praying for two of them had–incrementally–in the space of what, a few minutes–improved their back pain.C’mon.
He didn’t deserve to be assaulted by them, of course–but good grief–how about a little common sense.
St. Ferdinand III says
Most Christian Churches including the CC preach that Pisslam is Love and they are our ‘Brothers’. He is childish and ignorant, brainwashed by his own Church.
Imagine if the reverse were true – how much coverage would the Fake News Media give against ‘Christian Fascism’, if a group of pissed off Nuns or Monks beat the crap out of a Muhammadan?
PRCS says
Was laughing at the thought of Nuns and Monks beating the crap out of someone.
Scott Carlson says
Most are Ignorant because most of us aren’t educating them or because they’re in denial. It’s hard for most non-Muslims to fathom the idea that such totalitarian ideology exists. A person has to literally go through a grieving process because the reality of Islam is just that sinister. Sadly, that’s exactly what gives Islam the power it needs to spread and conquer.
Smith Nerida says
If I said what I know about Islam in my church, Id probably get kicked out for being so hateful, + they wouldnt believe it for 1 minute.
gravenimage says
Terrible but unsurprising, Smith.
Carol the 1st says
It’s like a hive mentality. Supposedly they selflessly serve the Queen Bee Allah and his Border Collie Moe. Allah itself is too deep and inscrutable to care one way or another (saves menial explanations). When a stray bee that fancies itself an individual and servant of a benevolent god offers benevolence it’s seen as puerile payola and the hive begins to buzz and do their thing. They then return to the hive and sleep soundly.
Tina says
BDS
https://www.change.org/p/oslo-city-council-oslo-should-not-go-from-peace-to-boycott
This petition is for all of us.
Can you sign and share it please.
Thanks.
No power for the islam.
gravenimage says
Signed!
R Russell says
Father forgive them, they don’t know what they are doing
gravenimage says
I think these Muslims knew *exactly* what they were doing.
Scott Carlson says
You’re right.
Clifford Fodor says
Every plant which my heavenly Father has not planted shall be rooted up. (Matthew 15:13)
Scott Carlson says
They will exploit you for your compassion. Good luck with that.
PRCS says
Oh, yes, they surely will.
gravenimage says
Yes–Muslims have been doing this for decades now–especially since 9/11.
Kepha says
Testing. I haven’t been able to post in recent months.
marc says
More often your comments are blocked by akismet, and we “release” them manually each day, meaning there will be a delay, you have only a couple stuck right now, i will release them.
You can contact https://akismet.com/contact/ and ask them, they will probably fix it for you, they did for GI previously.
Select “I think Akismet is catching my comments by mistake”
You are the only active commenter currently being caught like this.
Terry. gain says
Marc
I have switched from Google to DuckDuckGo as my search engine because I always get a disconnection and an Aw Snap message when I use Google or Chrome. When I use DDG I have to type my email and name every time, even though I have clicked the Remember Me box.
I would be most thankful if you could fix this as it will make it easier for me to comment and in particular to reply to the eloquent and cogent posts of Wellington and Graven Image.
Thank you for all that you do to keep this wonderful site running.
marc says
@Terry. gain if you want your details remembered, you need to allow cookies, that’s something you control in the browser, and I have no control over.
I understand why people might block them, and they should on some sites, but I just don’t abuse them, or the javascript we use. read more here https://blog.malwarebytes.com/101/2018/01/cookies-should-i-worry-about-them/
gravenimage says
Yes–contacting them directly worked for me, Kepha–with some guidance from Marc..
gravenimage says
Kepha and Terry Gain, I hope you both are able to get your posting issues cleared up. I know how frustrating this can be.
Kepha Hor says
Obviously, the assailants felt threatened. I’m sure that’s what the oh-so sensitive and understanding MSM will say.
PRCS says
Or offended.
Or intimidated.
Infidel says
And Muslim countries have the gall to be outraged when outraged Norwegians burn Quran(s).
PRCS says
Not only outraged.
They’re demanding that Norway prosecute them.
Their were several similar instances (some in which ‘unbelievers’ were murdered for blaspheming the faith or insulting The Prophetduring during the height of Iraq and Afghan operations.
And don’t forget the Danish cartoon riots.
gravenimage says
Yes–both Pakistan and Iran are demanding persecution of “blasphemy”. Norway arresting the guy who bbq’d the Qur’an was not enough crushing of freedom of speech for them.
PRCS says
True enough.
James says
If these countries want to have large immigrant populations, they should plan, not first come first serve. But be selective in order to benefit the country receiving, not the mobs of migrants pouring and committing rape, terror and crime. Just having a bleeding heart is no policy for successful immigration.
Carol the 1st says
Ban anyone of a theocratic mindset. Nothing but dead weight.
somehistory says
Memo to the pope: This young man, attempting to follow the example of Jesus in preaching, approached a group of your best buds…and just read what happened then.
This young man who was attempting to imitate Christ, was trying to help these moslims…your best buds…and they pretended that they had been helped by his prayers. Then, they lured him to a secluded place where they could assault him, rob him and try to force him to become moslim…he would then be one of your buds…and they had him as hostage for an hour…trying to force him to worship satan.
Now, pope, you want to read this and then get back to the public with your admonitions to be kind to these “strangers” and try to be “hospitable” to them and help them. But, what do you say to this young man who trusted your best buds?
Lydia Church says
Bull’s eye!!!
Target hit!!!
somehistory says
Thank you.
gravenimage says
+1
Steve's nephew says
The large churches around here with popular, well known pastors are serious about security. They have armed, plainclothes security guards present at every service. I used to think they were paranoid. But after learning more about Muslim violence, I totally understand.
Christ taught people to “turn the other cheek” when the Roman soldiers were in charge. I honestly wonder if he would use the same strategy if the Muslims were in charge.
Ren says
Islam, that bullshit should not exist.
Porky The Crusader (@PorkyCrusade) says
+10 billions
smoris says
Okay – these Muslims are rotten. No question. But just how dumb can a guy get? He followed these two “nice” Muslims? No wonder they are taking over. The average kumquat would be a bigger challenge than this guy. Where is it written that to be Christian and righteous you have to be stupid and a victim? Unless Christians put this kind of thinking back in the catacombs they will be there themselves. DUMB. If I were this stupid I would never report it.
somehistory says
Christians are admonished by Christ to ‘be wise and cautious” and also “innocent.” This young man took to heart the “innocent” part, but evidently he has believed the hype from many sources that say moslims are peaceful and just need help and understanding, and from the pope, that Christians are held guilty before Christ if we do not ‘help and “welcome” these murderous strangers.’
gravenimage says
Spot on, Somehistory.
PRCS says
I do agree!
PRCS says
Nov 30, 2019 at 10:43 pm
The guy is an idiot.
1. How is it he didn’t know that Muslims hate ‘unbelievers’ and/or that his prayers mean only insult to them.
2. He actually believed praying for two of them had–incrementally–in the space of what, a few minutes–improved their back pain.C’mon.
He didn’t deserve to be assaulted by them, of course–but good grief–how about a little common sense.
Mateen Elass says
Roar Fløttum’s problem was not that he wished to pray for healing for these Muslims, nor that he was willing to share the gospel with them. As a Christian, he was following the mandate of his Master, who told his disciples to act in these ways. His problem was his gullibility — though Jesus counseled his followers to be “wise as serpents but innocent as doves, Fløttum failed to understand that followers of the apostle of deceit are not like followers of the Way, Truth and Life. Witness his own words, “They were very nice and I couldn’t believe they would deceive me.”
It is not uncommon for Muslims to ask for prayer for healing from Christians, because they believe from their own Qur;an that Jesus was specially gifted with the capacity to heal. Though they won’t pray “in Jesus’ name”, they are happy to have Christians pray for them or their loved ones, hoping such prayers will help them. Fløttum probably believed that these four Muslim men were in that category, even as disbelievers in the gospel. Where he made his mistake was in trusting blindly in their niceness and going with them to pray for their “wounded friend.” At best, he should have said to them, “Bring him here and I will pray for him.”
As to the power of prayer to heal instantaneously, those who don’t believe in God may be excused for their doubt. There is no question that the Gospels and Book of Acts make clear that such healings commonly occurred in response to the prayers of Jesus and his followers. As a pastor, I have seen such healings in the context of my ministry as well. That Fløttum was willing to pray for these Muslims is a testament to his obedience to Jesus’ command that his followers should love their enemies. Some on this site may not believe or practice that, but such behavior can only help to make this world a better place.
Giacomo Latta says
Typical muslim meets usual Christian. Turns out bad for gullible Christian. Google it. Get 2,000,000,000 results.
somehistory says
One thing he should have questioned on the spot…even with all of the misinformation, hype and awful instructions for the ‘pope.’ was: Why would they be standing around if they had a friend and fellow moslim who had injured himself and needed to get to the emergency room?
When someone you know and care about needs an ER doctor, you don’t stand around having a conversation with a stranger. You get going to the hospital.
Obviously, this young man needs to read the news accounts and other information on Jihad Watch before he approaches another group…or even one…moslim.
FYI says
Meanwhile ilhan omar is seen praising allah in a catholic church 30 nov 2019
You Tube
ilhan omar praising allah in a catholic church.
Just so Dhimmiwit Christians know…
The koran CURSES Christians for believing in Jesus Christ k9:30
The koran denies Jesus Christ was even crucified,thus negating Christianity k4:171
The koran tells muslims not to believe in the Trinity which means that God’s Holy Spirit{one of the three}is denied.
islam has no “love thy neighbor”{the 2nd chief commandment of God lev19;18 is not found in islam as allah COMPLETELY MISSED IT}The Doctrine of hate al walaa wal baraa confirms that.
Christians are called “the worst of created beings”,alongside the Jews in koran 98v6{But wait!Isn’t Jesus JEWISH John 4 v 22?And Moses..}
allah’s greatest enemy is a MAN called Malik AL Amlak{“king of kings”}
Sahih Muslim vol 5 hadith # 5611:now who do these idiotic dhimmi christians think is being referred to here?Revs 19:16 of course..
Logically and Theologically,allah{“The BEST of deceivers” k3:54} cannot possibly be the same as the Christian God:yet we have mr bergoglio{or “pope” francis} and his clergy promoting this lie openly.
These dhimmi christians are an absolute disgrace:they allow such evil into their{now morally bankrupt,Christless}Churches
islam,its god alllh{“the BEST of deceivers” k3:54} and its “prophet” represent antichrist:Did the dhimmi xtians fail to read their own Bibles??
somehistory says
More and more some who claim to be Christian are inviting in moslims to read from their filthy book of evil from satan the devil. How do they sleep at night?
More and more, moslims are slaughtering Christians who are unarmed and sleeping in their beds and the world, even the part that claims to be Christian, takes no note. Much like Jesus said about, ” In the days of Noah, the people were eating, drinking, marrying and being given in marriage…and they took no note, until the flood came and swept them all away.” He continued, “This is how it will be in the Days of the Son of Man.”
In one instance, moslims are invading…not asking, not being invited, just forcing their way in and taking over, murdering, getting things set up in their way of filthy evil…by hook or crook; and in another instance, they are being invited in to take over and have things their way in filthy evil.
Shame on those inviting evil in so as to eat and drink at the “table with demons.”
gravenimage says
Muslims would now consider this Church to be a Mosque.
somehistory says
Absolutely.
Angemon says
Pretty much the same MO as with the martyrs of Cordoba…
https://libro.uca.edu/martyrs/cm2.htm
somehistory says
Thanks for that. +100
gravenimage says
None of this should surprise us.
And you are right–Roar Fløttum may still be in danger from these Mohammedans.
OLD GUY says
Same old muslim shit. Don’t say anything negative about islam they will be offended to no end. But they think they can say or do anything they want against any one not islamic. Their leaders are portraying an image of strength and power to their followers, buy it is a false image. Their power is only there because the western world is allowing them it. There will come a point when that will stop and the Islamic State of power will be destroyed again as in the past.
James Lincoln says
Roar Fløttum was partly a victim of the PC culture of Norway.
If he had been born and raised in a country like Poland, I doubt that he would have been that naïve…
ManchesterLad says
Quite right, it is the stupid, incredulously naive left that is the real enemy of western civilisation.
They are totally convinced by their own propaganda that they [the leftists] are our superiors who known the only way to utopia.
They have been conditioned to look down on sensible people who understand the problems of Islam in the west (racists, they call us) and they will constantly deny reality. Even against overwhelming evidence (which they will never consider) they hold their beliefs and will not waver in their insistence that they are ‘moral’.
We should not really blame the Muslims themselves, they just don’t operate to the same moral standards as us. Blame the left for bringing them in, pandering to them, and letting them know our culture is ready for the taking.
Kepha says
I respect Bro Roar Flottum. He obeyed Christ’s mandate, was brave about it, and can only be censured for a foolhardiness born of charity. My prayer for him is that he quickly recovers from his injuries, and continues to live out Philippians 1:27-29. My own sharing the Gospel with Muslims has been in my own home, in shared office space, or with visitors in church. Just be as wise as a serpent next time, Bro Roar!
I’m not sure he was a victim of Norway’s PeeCee culture. By openly witnessing to Muslims and confessing that Christ is the only way of salvation, he shows that he probably is a member of some dissenting free church rather than either the state-sponsored brand of Lutheranism or post-Vatican II RC (perhaps the witness of men like Bp. Ole Hallesby is extinct in the Norwegian Lutheran Church of today). In this sense, he was probably already dissenting against the general consensus in to many formerly Christian European countries. If he chose to be civil with Musims and work for their conversion rather than shout “rahgead!” or seek violence against them, he was only being a fundamentalist Christian of the proper kind.
Ive noted before that missions-minded Evangelicals have been humbly grateful in recent times at being caught flatfooted by an unprecedented opennes to the Gospel on the part of Muslims. While there is persecution, and there are modern martyrs, I pray that these cracks in Islam continue to grow. I similarly pray for cracks in the evolutionary materialist consensus of the post-Christian West.
Carol the 1st says
Wishing a caterpillar may convert to a butterfly quickly so we can fly out of this mess may not be good judgment. Taking note of your side is G.K. Chesterton (an amusing man who’s considered the greatest and most prolific writer of the 20th century):
“The Christian ideal has not been tried and found wanting. It has been found difficult; and left untried.”
G.K. Chesterton considered humor the highest seriousness – It is not the opposite of “funny”; the opposite of “funny” is “not funny”. He’d likely have found our Islam situation quite sobering.
John says
>>They were very nice and I couldn’t believe they would deceive me,” says Fløttum.<< Why are so many people in Europe still so naive that they believe Muslims will not deceive them?
Peter says
Sweden has fallen. No more immigrants
gravenimage says
This happened in Norway, Peter–but I take your point.
Trevor Williams says
You know this could explain the behaviour of the Prime Minister of Canada. At one time in his life he did recite the Shahada, to be fair I don’t think he said it with the intention of converting & only intended to be polite, but if just saying the words means he’s a Muslim in the eyes of Muslims then he has a problem. Maybe he DID mean it, & that would explain SOOOO much.