My latest in PJ Media:
The indefatigable apologist for Islam Pope Francis on Monday issued yet another mea culpa to Muslims, saying: “A scene from The Song of Roland comes to me as a symbol, when the Christians defeat the Muslims and line them up in front of the baptismal font, with one holding a sword. And the Muslims had to choose between baptism or the sword. That is what we Christians did.”
Was it really? The Song of Roland is actually a work of fiction, a French epic poem loosely based on the Battle of Roncevaux Pass between Muslim invaders and Christian defenders in the year 778. As The History of Jihad From Muhammad to ISIS shows, in the eleventh century, three hundred years after the battle, The Song of Roland appeared, describing the heroism of Charlemagne’s nephew Roland, who is leading the rear guard of Charlemagne’s forces and is caught up in the Muslim ambush.
Roland has an oliphant, a horn made of an elephant’s tusk, which he can use to call for help, but he initially declines to do so, thinking it would be cowardly. Finally, Roland does blow his horn. Charlemagne, way ahead of the rear guard, nonetheless hears Roland’s horn and hurries back, but it is too late: Roland and his men are dead, and the Muslims victorious. Charlemagne, however, pursues and vanquishes the Muslims, and captures Saragossa.
Thus the legend. The Song of Roland was enormously popular and inculcated in the Christians who sang and celebrated it what came to be known (in the European Middle Ages) as knightly virtues: loyalty, courage, and perseverance, even in the face of overwhelming odds. These were virtues that would be needed if Europe was to hold out against the ever-advancing jihad.
But those days are long gone, and Europe is no longer holding out against the jihad. Now the pope is much more interested in defending Islam than Christianity. In September 2017, Pope Francis met in the Vatican with Dr. Muhammad bin Abdul Karim Al-Issa, the secretary-general of the Muslim World League (MWL), a group that has been linked to the financing of jihad terror. During the meeting, al-Issa thanked the pope for his “fair positions” on what he called the “false claims that link extremism and violence to Islam.”
There is much more. Read the rest here.
somehistory says
We all know it isn’t true, but even if Christians were violent as he says, how does that excuse what moslims do?
And, since it isn’t true, he and his moslim buddies and intimate lovers, must keep claiming that it is…because moslims follow an evil, demonic, filthy book and carry out mass murders, and family murders, and rapes on a daily basis world-wide. They need cover for all of their evil activities and the only way to get it, is to claim that another group…Christians…are just as bad or worse, even if this means using a fictional story to ‘prove’ it.
And they have in the pope, one who is willing to lie for them to the point that surely he cannot expect anyone to believe him. But, tomorrow, or next week or next month, there will be other lies emanating from his lips to support his lovers, his best ‘friends’ who will one day slit his throat if he does not officially convert to their way.
Lavéritétriomphera says
“We all know it isn’t true,”
https://www.google.fr/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&ved=2ahUKEwiqusD4hYrmAhXyyIUKHWoTBtQQFjABegQIARAJ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FSaxon_Wars&usg=AOvVaw3xRXoTjJskM5feHHv0T-As.
“but even if Christians were violent as he says, how does that excuse what moslims do?”
+1
The Christians were violent during the crusades, the religion wars, and the conquest of America …
somehistory says
True Christians are allowed to defend themselves and their families. Jesus told His apostles the would need to “buy a sword,” if they did not have one. But, He also said, “Those who live by the sword, will die by the sword,” and, “The one who tries to save his soul, will lose it, but the one losing his soul for my sake, will find it.”
If a Christian goes against what Christ commanded, then that is not true Christianity. The fact is, that some in the past believed they were doing as Jesus commanded, when in reality, many did things of which Christ did not, and does not, approve.
Christianity is not violent. There are no commands to go slaughtering, nor forcing others to become Christian, whether under actual threat, or implied threat.
Jesus preached and taught and gave the wonderful Sermon on the Mount, but He never chased after anyone to cause them to accept what He said. And, He certainly never hurt anyone, with or without a sword. In fact, he healed many, even the slave who had come to take Him away when He was arrested and Peter cut off the man’s ear. At that time, Jesus admonished Peter due to this having been wrong for Peter to do.
One must always consider what Jesus said about our actions if we are attempting to live a Christian life…a life like the one Jesus led. We can only imitate Him, but that is what Christians are told to do. And, Jesus never…never…killed anyone, or commanded that someone be killed.
James Whitney says
Yes, indeed, self-defense is allowed in Christianity, but forced conversion is not part of sacred scripture. However, numerous verses calling for violence against non-believers can be found in the Qur’an and in other sacred texts of Islam, along with Shariah law. In particular, there are 164 Jihad versus that can be found in the Qur’an.
Lavéritétriomphera says
@somehistory,
Salutation,
In French history Charlemagne is portrayed as a great conqueror, and I learned the Song of Roland at school and knew this fascinating epic poem was warlike and therefore violent.
You weren’t in Galilee when Jesus walked. Therefore you do not know what he truly said.
In any case I made reference to the Catholic Church which is an institution. And peoples, some of which were helpless, have been persecuted by Christians taken as a whole. It was about saving their souls and of others, by destroying their body or by forcing them to convert to the “unadulterated” Christianity. To some extent one could think these tyrants showed their victims mercy from trying to avoid them being thrown into the burning fires of eternal hell, and the executors were right to defend themselves and their children against heresy!
Ask Jews, Cathars, Marguerite Porete, Giordano Bruno, Galileo Galilei, Native Americans, among others, what they think of this sentence: “Outside the Church no salvation”?
The pope wants to dialogue with Muslims but that does not mean he agrees with violence. He acknowledges that Christians have made mistakes but he does not want to say to Muslims their beliefs are wrong and breed violence. Maybe he would recognize that religions are man-made including Christianity (?).
Everything in its own time, after all the Greek word apocalypse means revelation https://www.google.fr/url?
À bientôt
somehistory says
Lavéritétriomphera
I believe the Bible writers wrote what Jesus said, and He even referenced their writings about Him when He spoke to them of their faith, and said that it was a blessing to them…but more so to us who “put faith in Him through your (their) words.”
I really don’t understand the person who believes secular history books tell the truth about things that happened long before they were born, but do not believe the Bible tells the truth about things that happened during the same time frame.
No, I was not in Galilee when Jesus was there. Neither were you there when the things you have put your trust in to be historic truth were happening.
God was guiding the writers of the Bible. Who guided the secular writers of history?
Perhaps it was their ethics, their integrity, their wish to put it down accurately for the others who would come afterward. Perhaps some of them could set aside their biases and their politics and their religions and write the truth.
If they could write with those things ‘guiding’ them, then so could the Bible writers write with those things…and our Creator’s Spirit… guiding them. This added guidance has much more weight than just the personal integrity and honesty of men who might still let their own feelings enter in to their writing of history happening around them. And the ones who came after, and wrote about times and things they had not experienced.
If a person…claiming to be Christian or not…slaughters others in order to force them to think as the one doing the harm thinks, then that person is not following Christ or doing as our Heavenly Father has commanded. “Do to others what you wish them to do to you.” No one wants to be forced to think as another thinks. There is loving persuasion, but that works without force, or the person doesn’t wish to be persuaded.
And this I already knew: the Greek word apocalypse means revelation”
Faith in our Creator and obeying His Laws are not “man-made.” Jesus was here to instruct us in the doing of His Father’s will…and so His teachings are not “man-made.”
There is the Bible and there are the churches (congregations). There are the Words from the Bible, the commands of Jesus and His Father, and there are the words and commandments of men. They are not the same. Jesus instructed us to know the difference.
I have attempted to learn French. I think it is a beautiful language and some of my father’s family were from France. I can read more of it than I can pronounce. I will master it one day.
Merci
somehistory says
Lavéritétriomphera
The Apostle Paul wrote “When those without Law, do the things of the Law….”
And the Bible makes it clear with more than one Scripture text, that God reads the heart and knows whether the person wishes to do good or bad and ‘rewards’ them accordingly. In a ‘church’ or out.
gravenimage says
Lavéritétriomphera, Jesus never preached violence.
Raluca says
As we all know very well the crusades were the answer to the cry for help from Christians persecuted in a Jerusalem occupied by the Ottomans, Need i say more? Of course were the Christians violent and thank God they decided to overlook the ” turn the other cheek” thingy. And pls. don’t bring this argument up again before you had a chance to read up on the crusades, the more sources the better.
gravenimage says
+1
Hugo says
I had a conversation wtih two Anglican priests a couple of weeks ago. They were completely convinced that Christianity was every bit as violent as Islam, and any criticism is based on racial hatred. At one point I asked them why they didnt convert they were so singing the praise of the beauty of Islam.
John soudas says
It’s time to arrest the pope for being an imposter
He is the anti christ that everyone had been talking about
DHazard says
Any comparison between the current ways Islam is practiced around the world and ANY other religion is automatically a ‘false equivalence’ fallacy. Besides, Christians have put aside almost everything that smug and murderous Muslims still embrace. And that’s across a surprisingly wide sample of Muhammad’s followers.
paul 316 says
the pope is out of his mind and continues to get involved in issues that lead to nowhere. He should address the pedophile ring in the church and stop the WRETCHED activities of the priests, bishops and cardinals… I’m waiting for hell to freeze over.
The Remorseless Headsman says
Pedophile ring in the church? I believe that to be one reason he so clearly embraces Islam. They seem to have a shared love for violating young boys. Mr. Bergoglio is on par with the antichrist. With the previous Pope resigning (nearly unheard of), something very wrong is going on with the Church hierarchy. Like the DC swamp, these vermin (yes, that includes YOU, Bergoglio) need to be identified and removed.
Giacomo Latta says
Supposedly when it is time to elect a pope no cardinal is allowed to ”run” for the office. That is to say, the pope is elected by other cardinals whether he likes it or not. What kind of cardinals would have voted for such a candidate as Francis? I suspect those who liked his ”what crisis of pedophilia in the Catholic Church?” approach.
Jean Terry says
That is bizarre! This pope is nothing like previous popes. He is a socialist.
Victory in Christ. says
There is something wrong with this Pope. It is as if he is doing an appeasement policies to islam.That will not work. islam will walk all over anyone who does that. Mo said to defeat the enemy by their own hand. Thank you Pope.
I have read that the Pope has commented that there should be one world ruler. If this is so and based on his other comments he is setting the stage for the false prophet to arise.
I have spoken to Catholics and they have privately told me this is not their Pope.
FYI says
“We Christians”?
Since when is Mr Bergoglio,the marxist,jesuit,pro-islam,pro-globalist judas pope a Christian?
He’s not even a Catholic!
His false teachings have been widely condemned within catholicism.
Neither the catholic nor protestant churches can be relied on anymore to preach the Gospel: i see the Church of England,another Christless organisation has decided to focus on the past History and the terrible christians of yore.
I’m not in any church Thank God:these blind guides,catholic or protestant are a disgrace.
The Gospel has the prophetic information I need…
somehistory says
Jesus said that we could recognize a person by their fruits..whether good or bad…just as we recognize a tree by its fruit. He also said there would be “wolves in sheep’s clothing,” and He told us how to recognize these. This pope is no Christian and doesn’t “speak” for anyone but himself. Those “leaders” of other denominations who are misleading their flocks, really only speak for themselves, and their flocks would do well to wake up, just as Catholics would do.
“Each one is tried by his own works,” and not that of another, says the Bible No one can speak for me but myself and no one gets my “reward” but me. And I’m not a part of any congregation…church…but rely on God’s Holy Spirit, the Bible’s direction and His Son’s promises to “be with me all the days” until this system of things is finished.
Wellington says
This pope is an utter disaster.
Alexios Comnenus says
Amen.
Kilauea says
Meathead: Dead from the neck up – Archie Bunker
tim gallagher says
If I thought, as this Pope apparently does, that Christianity is just as bloodthirsty and murderous as islam is, I’d leave Christianity and find some other religion or, maybe, give up on religion altogether. It’s a point Hugo makes (up above) about the Anglican ministers. However, I believe that Christianity is far more peaceful than Islam and I also believe strongly in the decent and hard-won values of western civilisation, which are the opposite of Islam’s barbarism. A lot of people in the western world have lost faith in our values. I’ve mentioned the violence of islam to a couple of people lately and they said, well, we’ve been just as bad. Total crap, of course. They seem to be very apologetic about the western world. Recently I mentioned to one person that Islam had slaughtered around 270 million people and 80 million in India alone and she just said, well, I wonder how many Muslims in India people of other religions had killed. There’s no getting through to many people. This Pope seems to be such a person. Well, maybe one day they’ll wake up.
mortimer says
The real message to us from the Chanson de Roland is that we should NOT consider Islam defeated until it is COMPLETELY ROUTED. They will not quit. Islam makes Muslims delusional.
No one really knows why the pope is so delusional, though. He is a Libtard without the ability to learn.
There will have to be a palace coup if the RCC is to get rid of him once and for all. He is causing a crisis his church.
It is urgent for the Curia to either bring the pope under their control or relieve him of his duties.
His services are no longer required.
gravenimage says
Pope Cites French Epic Poem to Prove Christianity Is as Violent as Islam
……………..
Well, this is insane. Firstly, the Chansons were some of the first secular literature in Europe–this was not intended to be an article of Christian faith.
Then, as noted, this work was written centuries after the events described, about a battle that took place in the dark ages.
Then, the Song of Roland was also popular entertainment–it was never intended to be history in the strictest sense. (For one thing, no soldier of the time would actually have been apt to have forborne to call for help out of an exaggerated sense of personal honor. But it certainly made for a ripping good story, as well as a romantic one).
But even ignoring all this, it is clear that the Muslims are the aggressors.
Then one further point, which is absolutely key here–the scene the pontiff describes of the forced conversions to Christianity takes place after the conquest of Saragossa (Zaragoza) by Charlemagne. But there is just one problem with this–it never happened. I don’t mean just this scene–the Franks never took the city.
The Franks did attack Saragossa in 778 AD–but soon withdrew after making no headway. In fact, the city would not be free from Muslim rule until 1118 AD–which was *after* the Song of Roland was composed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_Muslim_presence_in_the_Iberian_Peninsula
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zaragoza#Taifa_of_Zaragoza
So the Pope is convinced that Christianity is a bad as Islam over a scene dramatized in a work of fiction that never took place to begin with. What utter idiocy.
Savvy Kafir says
Thanks for the info, gravenimage! If only more people took the trouble to learn the facts! Especially popes, prime ministers, presidents, etc.
Carol the 1st says
And he judges his flock as idiotic as he himself.Therein lies the problem?
Lavéritétriomphera says
“The Franks did attack Saragossa in 778 AD–but soon withdrew after making no headway. In fact, the city would not be free from Muslim rule until 1118 AD–which was *after* the Song of Roland was composed.“.
It is possible there has been a confusion between the siege of Saragossa and the siege of Barcelona in 801.
gravenimage says
Thanks Savvy Kafir, Carol, and Lavéritétriomphera.
And Lavéritétriomphera, I doubt that the Pope was confusing Saragossa with Barcelona–more likely he just assumed that anything in the Song of Roland was intended to be factual.
Savvy Kafir says
Although I’m not Catholic, or a Christian, I remember being glad when this “progressive” was made pope. Especially when he adopted the name of my favorite saint — the nature-loving, animal-loving Saint Francis — the person closest to being an outright pantheist that we’re likely to see canonized by the Catholic church. But this pope has been a bitter disappointment. He is a poster boy for willfully ignorant, politically correct liberals. His ideas regarding Islam & Muslims are based entirely upon wishful thinking. I’m sure he’s a nice guy; but he is a real liability to the West.
Agostino Armo Pellegrini says
To me the pope is defending islam because he is a religious kingpin defending his racket, the religion racket, and islam is just enough of a religion to be called one. By defending islam he’s really defending Christianity too, because the latter religion has quite a few skeletons in their closet too. He knows if he takes the moral high road and condemns the violence in islam he’ll be inviting embarrassing criticisms of his own religious enterprise. And they have a lot to be embarrassed about, as most of us know, but I’ll skip the details. What’s important here for me is, can we place any credence in what the pope has to say about islam? I don’t think so. He has already made his stance clear with, I do not believe it is right to identify Islam with violence. This is not right or true, which is a rather astonishing claim to make in light of all the terror and murder we’re seeing for islam. By proclaiming such an obvious falsehood the pope is perpetuating the myth that islam is a “religion of peace.” He is a spearhead for the leftist narrative that says muslims are victims and that we are racist “islamophobes” because we won’t stay quiet about their dangerous creed and the violence it causes. And for that we must be punished, our neighborhoods should be sacrificed to their enclaves, our welfare should be stretched to breaking, our kids and women raped for the sake of multiculturalism, our prisons filled with more terror on our streets, and our freedoms and nation(s) flushed down the toilet for islam’s violent superstition. We’re learning just how evil we are for being white and wanting to live free of religious barbarity. The left accuses us of being racist. But it’s the left who are supreme racists for using the predominant race of muslims as the linchpin excuse to ignore our valid concerns about the violence in islam. It’s not a race issue, but the left has made it a race issue. A racist is one who uses race as the basis for discrimination, and that’s what they do to us by dragging our legitimate argument into the gutter of racial differences when it should be up in the light of reason and good moral sense.
Frankly, I don’t respect the pope anymore. I think he’s irrelevant and outmoded, yet dangerous, kinda like an old rusty nail that has no real functional use but can give you tetanus if you step on it. I’m sure the pope has great kindness and love in him for others, but I can’t respect a man who is willfully blind to truths that are so important to humanity’s well-being. If the pope truly does love people then he should not ignore reality when that reality has dangers that need to be dealt with. And that’s what the left does, they ignore reality for votes, money, and power. I guess the pope is no different.
gravenimage says
Other pontiffs have not done this.
Raluca Voda says
Agostino caro: Islam is not a religion, it is a CULT! There is a simple test to prove it: Try to convert, openly, to Christianity or another real religion and see if you get to stay alive!
As for the pope: He is just as bad for the catholic church as was Torquemada with the inquisition. Correct me if i am wrong: Aren’t the pope and Torquemada Jesuits?
Gabriel Rizkallah says
I think Pope Francis is doing a disservice to the Catholic Church and to Christianity as a whole with his false rapprochement with Islam.
Thomas Richard says
A wolf in sheep’s clothing……
Marigold says
Why does he do this?
Richard Courtemanche says
The pope’s infallibility that never was. Benedict is doing a good job at abandoning his flock.
Richard Courtemanche says
Francis I mean
Ecosse1314 says
To be fair as much as he is a disaster Franky has had no infallible teachings promulgated “ex cathedra”.
s says
we will loose our nation because of name-calling….
Raluca Voda says
There is a difference between calling names and calling a spade a spade (no offense intended, bro). Check on Albert Camus see how he used to define PC!
Agostino Armo Pellegrini says
At a minimum the pope should make a blanket condemnation of all violence for religion. Instead of shaming his own religion’s past mistakes to excuse islam he’d do better to assert the right of all people to peacefully pursue their own path to god. But the left loves to lie for islam, calling it peaceful when it’s a miracle of bigotry and violence. There’s no limit to how far they will go to protect the ideology that wants us dead or enslaved, and I’m sure Tommy Robinson knows what I’m talking about. His own government has treated him worse than they do the terrorists on welfare, I actually believe they were hoping he’d get a shiv in the ribs while in prison. The left wants to destroy America like they have Europe, and the pope is a member of that evil fraternity. The Vatican is flirting with the devil by shilling for islam. And I firmly believe their lack of moral courage and dedication to truth will only hasten their demise into obscurity. In the end their fable (yeah, I said it, I don’t care if you attack me) will be on the shelf with all the other gods of history that fell out of fashion. The foundation of Christianity is as morally dubious as islams. The Christian god sacrificed his own son, allegedly, like a goat on a bloody altar. A tad kooky when you think about it, if god is so powerful and moral then why must he compel the death of an innocent person before he can forgive the rest of us? Crazy. That’s something you’d expect from the muslim god, a sort of warped sense of morality and justice that belongs in the trash bin of confused thinking.
To sum, the pope himself runs a crazy business founded on myth and distorted morality, it’s an organized superstition that has been violent and morally misguided in much the same way as islam, it’s only a matter of degree. And that’s why the pope can’t be honest about islam, because people who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones.
(Wow, I bet I’m going to get spanked by some Xians,lol)
Ecosse1314 says
Your punishment preferences are of no interest to most of this forum.
Agostino Armo Pellegrini says
Speak for yourself, lol.
Lavéritétriomphera says
And peoples, some of “which” were helpless, Church was not sure these peoples were persons with human rights (and a soul) https://www.google.fr/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&ved=2ahUKEwi58bi36ormAhUKz4UKHQBeCL8QFjABegQIAxAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FValladolid_debate&usg=AOvVaw25xKKLwxsJZlXLXcvPSczn.
Lavéritétriomphera says
@somehistory,
Bonjour,
Beliefs are a matter of faith, history is a human science. The historical science advances further every day and sheds light on religions and beliefs.
I respect beliefs and believers when they are respectable, therefore I do not agree with forced conversions, rapes, honor Killings, sharia, animal sacrifices, slavery, psychopath religious leaders …
I do not have the infused science, and I can be wrong but I believe The cosmic laws are the same for everyone, in all situations and all times and I agree with a Christian, a Buddhist, an Atheist, a follower of Confucius who say: “do not do to others what you do not want done to yourself”.
The pope is doing his job, he knows the ones who do not eat humble pie are doomed and he also knows, and it is not just a purely theoretical view, the knights’s spirit has not dead and that the crusades were violent.
La grammaire française n’est pas facile pour un anglophone, cependant beaucoup de mots anglais proviennent du français. Cependant « l’intelligence » de la langue de Shakespeare est différente de la nôtre, car nous sommes des latins, des fils de Rome proches des espagnols, des italiens avec qui nous partageons une même culture.
J’ignore si vous êtes américain, mais j’apprécie les USA.
Peace upon you, your family and your country.
À bientôt
Carol the 1st says
We’re always trying to figure out the underlying benevolence of our daddy figures. We like to ascribe motives to them that best comfort us – whether real or imagined. The Chinese put their chips on the money trail when it comes to who will win out – ideals or materialism. BTW has the Vatican ever NOT resisted the opening of its books to serious scrutiny? Probably lots of muslim money in those coffers.
And will this supposedly benign pope and his duplicitous cohorts from al Azhar save the wretchedly violent Christian flock from nuclear self-immolation? And by then will there even be enough Christians left to save!? Have the pope and al Azhar figured out an inspiring musical score to which they can set their excruciatingly-slow saga? Do we accept foxes guarding our chicken coops? The pope doesn’t KNOW the future nor how his actions will affect it so perhaps his implied ethical ambitions should be more humbly connected to the here and now. Obfuscating what Islam has once again pushed in our faces hardly seems the mark of a great man. He even high-fives Angela Merkel. So what’s another raped and bloodied innocent sheep to such as these? Something to be called NOT innocent?
Lavéritétriomphera says
The pope is a man with his own qualities and shortcomings and he is right when he says the Christians have been violent.
As far I am concerned I believe religions are man-made and they need to be challenged, the blasphemy law should be abolished all over the Earth.
Raluca Voda says
Tell the abolishing stuff to a mullah or ayatola
Raluca Voda says
“La grammaire française n’est pas facile pour un anglophone” est une proposition très arrogante. Cependat beaucoup de mot anglais provient directement de la langue latine (environs 60%!) and il y’a aussi des mots français en anglais, c’est tout. Enfin, les latins, les fils de Rome, les espagnols, les italiens, les danois, les roumaines, et oui, les anglais et les americains de provenience européene partagent la même culture: Judeo-Christianity.
The crusades were a cry for help, alas they did not do a very good job, otherwise Christians today would not be the most persecuted religion WORLDWIDE? It is the pope’s job to defend the Christians and appeasement (see the eve of WWII) is not the answer. BTW, if you are not prepared to be violent in a war, why fight? And BTW, if islam had its druthers you would not be permitted to write here, how is that for a argument against the meek?
Carolyne says
If the Pope is into poetry, here’s one I recommend he read. While not about Catholicism, it is about religion, specifically the nonsense of it:
“Whose love is given over well,
Shall look on Helen’s face in hell,
Whilst those whose love love is thin and wise,
Shall view John Knox in Paradise.
I don’t think looking on dead religious figures would be very entertaining.i.e. Saints. One of the more ridiculous saints, Katherine of Sienna is a saint because she wore as a wedding ring the foreskin cut off during Christ’s circumcision. If that isn’t silly, tell me what is.