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Exposing the role that Islamic jihad theology and ideology play in the modern global conflicts

“Us and Them”: The Main Task of the West is Not to Defeat “Them” But to Find Itself

Dec 20, 2019 8:00 am By Alexander Maistrovoy

“The Government of a nation itself is usually found to be but the reflex of the individuals composing it.…For the nation is only an aggregate of individual conditions, and civilization itself is but a question of the personal improvement of the men, women, and children of whom society is composed,” the philosopher Samuel Smiles brilliantly wrote in the middle of the 19th century. In other words, the fate of a state or a whole civilization is determined not so much by its political system, but by the set of values and the attitude of its average citizen.

Now let’s look at the average young man of the West. The average millennial hates his/her own civilization’s values, and at same time naively believes in utopian theories. Leftist ideologies flourished in lush color. British Labour and American Democrats look like their predecessors in the same way the Turks of today look like the ancient Hellenes. Traditional spiritual and moral values are trampled into the dust; self-flagellation and ingratiation in the face of modern barbarians from the East turned into paranoia. Churches are turning into mosques. Christianity has given way to new fanatical quasi-religions: globalism, progressivism, the “fight against global warming” and the cult of sexual perversions. Islam, the rudimentary, archaic, patriarchal religion of the desert, has become the fetish of enlightened intellectuals.

The younger generation is completely disconnected from its national culture. Nearly half of 18-24-year-old Britons (45%) didn’t know that Nelson led the British to victory at the Battle of Trafalgar. Half of German teenagers do not know that Adolf Hitler was a dictator; only about half of the schoolchildren knew that West Germany was a democratic state.

83% of Americans polled failed a basic test on the American Revolution. According to the Belgian researchers Jan and Kurt Monten of the Catholic College of Limburg, “young people studying to become teachers know amazingly little about history. Many of them were unable to tell in which century the Second World War took place  and confused Zionism with Fascism.”

History is replaced by vulgar phantasmagoria. We read about the British nobility of the 18th century which practiced cannibalism; Italian Jews who committed ritual murders; attempts by British intelligence to turn Hitler into a woman; King Solomon who was Pharaoh of Egypt, Jesus who was King of Edessa; and the Vikings who worshiped Allah.

Destructive nihilism, avant-garde and anti-rationalism in all spheres of human activity have transformed the West, according to Ulrich Beck’s accurate expression, into a society of “substantial emptiness.” The European culture, rooted in ancient philosophy, the cult of experience, logic and reason of Locke, Spinoza and Descartes, the moral and ethical ideal of the Biblical prophets, is equated with the culture of the Berbers, Indians of South America and African tribes. No more “French culture.” No more “Swedish culture.” Oriana Fallaci noted with bitterness that the Somali migrants urinating on masterpieces of Florentine masters were the symbol of the new time.

God was replaced by exhibitionism, as a form of gaining unlimited happiness. The new rulers of thoughts praised schizophrenic thinking, overthrew “suffocating” logic, and declared as irrelevant the concepts of “good” and “evil,” “morality” and “immorality,” “truth” and “lie.” There are no more “boys” and “girls.” There is “Swedish “it” (“hen”); “ze”, as laid down by Oxford University; and the “third gender,” according to the German Constitutional Court. There are “pregnant transgender people” and 15 types of sexes, according to a Canadian Federation of Primary School Teachers of Ontario manual. Barbie is no longer a girl — it is a “gender neutral doll.”

Coevals of those who landed in Normandy 75 years ago locked themselves into “safe spaces” with coloring books, unable to endure the anguish of the election of the “bad president.” Like mushrooms after a rain, infantile subcultures have sprung: Bronies and Furry fandoms, Harry Potter fandom, etc. Universities have become their own parody. One graduate student published the article “The conceptual penis as a social construct” as a joke. This “Study” was greeted with enthusiasm.

Witchcraft, astrology, belief in Lizard People, aliens and the Satanic Temple have become part of the mass consciousness of not-long-ago rational nations. Nearly four in 10 Britons believe in ghosts, 22% believe in astrology, and 15% believe in fortune telling or Tarot. In 1951, only 7% of people believed in such things.

Before the elections in 2013, the National Geographic Channel sponsored a survey to check Which Presidential Candidate [Barack Obama or Mitt Romney] Would You Trust During An Alien Invasion?. 65% of respondents said that Obama would cope better with this task. Supporters of the “flat earth” theory and even cannibalism have emerged to help prevent global warming.

Disney announced that the new “Little Mermaid” will be a black actress. In Spain, Little Red Riding Hood and other classic works are banned because of “hidden sexism.” In Sweden, Astrid Lindgren’s fairy tale about Pippi Longstocking was burned because of “racism.” In the USA, Columbus Day renamed Indigenous Peoples Day.

Foucault’s vision of “transgression” — “the hysterical woman, the masturbating child, the Malthusian couple, and the perverse adult” – became a reality. Classical art in galleries was replaced by paintings with ugly figurines with punctured eyes and buried noses; drawings on asphalt and on bodies; architectural complexes turned inside out with “interiors” made out of sewer pipes and “DJ music.”

This world, according to Solzhenitsyn, was “disassembled to the state of a cemetery, where there is no life, but every single thing or any idea emits smell of decay.” With no foothold, no anchor, lodestar, or safety belt in the form of religious and moral values, modern man drifts, becoming an easy prey for totalitarian ideologies, sects, and banal frauds.

It is not surprising that there is an epidemic of depression among young people in the USA. Every sixth EU citizen has mental health problems, with the majority being in Western Europe.

Curiously, the collapse of the Soviet Union was the beginning of the end of Western democracy. It’s not so surprising.

Whether we like it or not, human societies traditionally have identified themselves according to a simple principle: “Us and Them.”

The presence of a strong and dangerous enemy facilitates the unity of a society, the formation of its spiritual values and prosperity. It happened in Athens during the wars with Persia and in Rome during the confrontation with Carthage. The republican values of the Romans reached their highest peak — they disappeared when the external enemy was crushed, and Rome went on to larceny and ruthless conquests.

We’ve witnessed the same course of action in the USA and in the West in general. It’s only in the face of the “Red Scare” that the democratic ideals of American society and its cohesion were extremely strong. Differences in the approach of the Democrats and Republicans basically disappeared: John F. Kennedy was as resolute as Ronald Reagan in his willingness to confront the Soviets. And even Jimmy Carter — a “soft-bodied” hypocrite — was forced to respond to the Kremlin’s aggression in Afghanistan, rallying the nation.

But the great and bitter paradox of our time is that the deadly threat not only did not disappear, but has become much more real. A new threat, Islam, is much more dangerous and poisonous than Soviet power and the Red Army with its tank armada. Soviet Communism was a product of Western itself, a continuation of Utopian communism, but Islam is alien and absolutely incompatible with Western values. Its main and supreme task is to destroy the West and include it in future Caliphate. It’s not about Iran or ISIL – it’s about Islam as a political-theological system. Their leaders, political and spiritual, don’t conceal their aim at all. Hear them. Sheikh Yusuf Qaradawi, the main preacher of the Muslim Brotherhood: “Constantinople was conquered in 1453 by a 23-year-old Ottoman named Muhammad ibn Murad, whom we call Muhammad the Conqueror. Now what remains is to conquer Rome.” Erdogan (a “big friend” of all American presidents) said that there is no Moderate Islam. Dr. Subhi Al-Yaziji, dean of Qur’anic studies at the Islamic University of Gaza, said that Muslims must “conquer Andalusia and the Vatican” after Palestine.

“The Qur’an is our constitution, the Prophet is our leader, Jihad is our path and death in the name of Allah is our goal.” So said Mohamed Morsi, who was supported by Obama. Believe them, they don’t lie!

The principle “Us and Them” didn’t disappear. However, our main task is not to defeat “them,” but to find ourselves. If “we” were able to do this, “they” would have no chance. “They” would return to their desert: vicious, soulless, fruitless ghosts of the gloomy past. And vice-versa: the society of “substantial emptiness” will inevitably be subjugated by Caliphate.

Alexander Maistrovoy is the author of “Agony of Hercules or a Farewell to Democracy (Notes of a Stranger),” available at Amazon and Barnes & Noble.

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Comments

  1. Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

    Dec 20, 2019 at 10:25 am

    Respectfully, I disagree with Alexander Maistrovoy’s approach here. Let me tell you why.

    First, his conclusion can be summed up with this:

    The principle “Us and Them” didn’t disappear. However, our main task is not to defeat “them,” but to find ourselves. If “we” were able to do this, “they” would have no chance. “They” would return to their desert: vicious, soulless, fruitless ghosts of the gloomy past.

    My response to that is, the biggest part of finding yourself is knowing what you want. And so good people of Europe and America need to ask themselves, do we want free speech? equality? and justice for all? Do we want to be a nation that allows religious freedom? or do we want to be a brutal theocracy like so many islamic nations? We “find ourselves” in great measure by actively protecting that which we value, I think we can agree on that much. That’s where I find Maistrovoy’s conclusion too passive sounding and naive, as if we should be more engaged in a kind of philosophical “finding ourselves” over real life solutions to jihad. Now, I’m not saying that’s necessarily what he meant, but it wouldn’t have hurt if he’d brought his conclusion to a pragmatic result. Imagine this at a high school football game:

    Cheerleaders: What do we Want!!!?

    Spectators: To Win!!

    Cheerleaders: And how do we want it?!!

    Spectators: By finding ourselves!

    Naw, I don’t think so. Winning that game comes with hard physical work, intelligent action, and planning. And that’s what we need to do against islam, be vigilant, smart, and hard working. I wish that’s what Maistrovoy had said, it would have made his thesis so much more inspiring and practical in a helpful way, rather than vague and uncertain like so much of what he criticized. Don’t get me wrong, I see the good intent in what he wrote, but I think his ending is too disingenuous and passive sounding for my taste. Let’s not forget, people are dying here, getting raped, our culture(s) destroyed for islam. I got an idea, let’s find ourselves by doing the obvious good thing and defeat islam in our nations, how’s that for an idea? We shouldn’t have to find ourselves before we stop the evils of islam, we know it’s wrong already and we must be practical minded in its destruction, with new anti-sharia laws, immigration control, by reaffirming of our founding principles, and by not allowing islam to corrupt our values and culture for islam. That’s how we “find ourselves,” by protecting what we got.

    • paul 316 says

      Dec 20, 2019 at 10:34 am

      +100

    • yiyoya says

      Dec 20, 2019 at 12:23 pm

      Knowing what you want? Well, the vast majority, 90% at least, of the professional intellectuals in Western universities, most crucially the philosophers (the current progeny of Kant, Hegel, Heidegger, Schopenhauer, Nietzsche, Comte, et al.), but also the intellectuals in the humanities, know exactly what they want, and what they want is to humiliate, castigate, denigrate, and ultimately destroy the philosophical foundation of Western Civilization. These modern, contemporary intellectuals are not simply IRRATIONAL (Islam is irrational) but ANTI-RATIONAL. They are not simply naive irrationalists, but cognizant, anti-rationalists, woke nihilists.

      What Alexander Maistrovoy unfortunately fails to do is to define his terms, and that is a crucial failure. What is the precise definition of what is meant by “Western Civilization”, philosophically and intellectually? What is the essence of the Western approach to life as opposed to the Eastern approach to life? What exactly is it that we are trying to rescue and preserve when we say “Western Civilization”? This Maistrovoy fails to define. Is an idea, philosophy, religion, or ideology truly “Western” just because it originated with someone born in the West? Is an idea truly “Eastern” because it originated with someone in the East? Is the philosophy of Schopenhauer or Hegel, “Western” simply because they were Germans living in Germany when they formulated their ideas? Is the Japan of today truly “Eastern” or is the Japan of today actually more “Western” than the Sweden of today? Israel is in the Middle-East, but could it be that the Israel of today is actually more “Western” than the Germany of today? Is Communism really a “Western” idea simply because it geographically originated in the West, is Communism really “Western”, or is Communism, philosophically speaking, just a rehash of Eastern ideas? The philosophy of Schopenhauer is in fact just a rehash of Eastern religion with a veneer, a cover-up, of secular pretensions, and so is Communism. Until one clearly defines what ideas are “Western” and what ideas are “Eastern” there can be no successful discussion of the conflict between East and West.

      What happens when philosophically and intellectually, unwittingly and unknowingly to rank and file, non-intellectual Westerners, the West slowly crumbles and becomes the East? Because that is exactly what the professional intellectual class, the philosophers and the professors, the intellectual priesthood of the West, have been doing to the West for the past two and a half-centuries. Of course, Western ideas don’t disappear overnight, but the ongoing decay of the West is nothing new, it’s been going on for two centuries, sometimes the decay goes into remission, sometimes it breaks out in full force, but it’s been there for a very long time.

      “the fate of a state or a whole civilization is determined not so much by its political system, but by the set of values and the attitude of its average citizen.”,

      And the set of values and the attitude of the average, rank and file citizen, the ideas and convictions in their minds, is ultimately determined by the philosophy, ideology, ideas, or religion disseminated by the professional priesthood of that civilization. So long as you have 90% of professors in American and Western universities teaching and preaching irrationality and anti-rationality, the West doesn’t stand a chance. It may take another century or two, but grain by grain, drop by drop, the philosophical foundation of the West is being eroded at the universities and the high schools. The only antidote, the only hope, is the introduction of a philosophy of reason, rationality, objectivity, logic, and science at the university level, from there the rational ideas, the rational values, attitude and approach to life, will trickle down from the ivory towers to everyone else.

      In Dinesh D’Souza’s book “The End of Racism” there is this brief, striking, fascinating, historical anecdote of when the Europeans first arrived in Tasmania: “Amazingly, Edgerton points out, Tasmanians could not take advantage of the ocean surrounding their island, because although they had once learned how to fish, they forgot or gave up the practice. Thus many Tasmanians perished of starvation despite the availability of a plentiful food source all around them.” Just as knowledge can be found, knowledge can be lost, and so too a civilization.

      • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

        Dec 20, 2019 at 1:54 pm

        You’re probably right, 90% of the “professional priesthood” does teach and preach irrationality and anti-rationality, they have already “found themselves” in their anti-freedom, anti-Western agenda.

        But my post was based on the reasonable assumption that Maistrovoy’s thesis was directed at those who were interested in confronting the islamic threat, and not to those who had already “found themselves” in their quest to destroy the West. So I built off that assumption and stated the obvious, that what we “good people” of Europe and America need to do is know what we want: Freedom? equality? justice? If yes, then we “find ourselves” by defending those principles. Of course one “finds their self” in many different ways, but we are talking about islam here, so naturally my claim is of limited scope as defined by the topic at hand. Maistrovoy doesn’t sound very practical minded to me about something that doesn’t require a lot of pondering or debate, not for good people who love freedom and see the obvious evils of islam. And frankly, I don’t care if Maistrovoy failed to “define his terms,” as you put it. How Maistrovoy tries to define “Western civilization” means little to me in face of the criminal aspects of islam. In short, it’s not about “definitions,” it’s about doing the right thing for ones country and fellow citizens. I almost get the impression you are subtly trying to defend his position, and that if Maistrovoy had only tweaked his views a little more then we could all get back to “finding ourselves” in earnest. No, not for me. We find ourselves by defending our way of life, our freedoms, and our culture from islam. Cuz after all, that’s Maistrovoy’s central concern here, right?– islam, with the hope they return to their desert: vicious, soulless, fruitless ghosts of the gloomy past. So let’s keep it real, dump the definitions and let’s do what needs to be done regarding islam, the task is clear for we who love freedom over religious barbarity. If we do that we set the best example for what’s good and right for our nation, and who knows, maybe some of those misguided leftists will find themselves in our good example. They sure as hell aren’t going to be persuaded by our griping about the decline of Western civilization, that’s for sure. But they might be persuaded by our steadfast determination for freedom and peace against the tyrannies of a barbaric creed.

        Thanks for your thoughtful and intelligent response, seriously.

  2. mortimer says

    Dec 20, 2019 at 10:36 am

    Yes, agree that the teaching of history is important in forming good citizens, but whose version of history?

    We live in a post-modernist world in which academics have denied objectivity. Modern Leftards at the universities, in fact, agree with Benito Mussolini who said:

    “Everything I have said and done in these last years is relativism by intuition. If relativism signifies CONTEMPT for FIXED CATEGORIES and men who claim to be the bearers of an OBJECTIVE, immortal truth…then there is nothing more RELATIVISTIC than FASCIST attitudes and activity…. [T]he modern relativist infers that everybody has the right to CREATE FOR HIMSELF his own ideology and to attempt to ENFORCE IT with all the energy of which he is capable.”

    Source: [Mussolini, Diuturna, pp. 374-377, cited in Henry Veatch, Rational Man, 1962, p. 41].

    Post-modernist Western academics in general and several, leading Dem politicians that we see are actually in agreement with what Mussolini preached.

  3. mortimer says

    Dec 20, 2019 at 11:07 am

    Western Leftards never stopped believing in Trotsky and Stalin after the collapse of the USSR. They merely switched to a globalist form of socialism based on the victimology of racism. This ploy of the Left is preposterous, because in fact, we live in one of the most racially tolerant moments in all history.

    Western Leftards are promoting a GLOBALIST form of fascism … a new ideology never seen before. Fascism combines crony capitalism plus the appearance of socialism for those at the bottom of the pyramid.

    GLOBALIST FASCISM as promoted by Western Leftards is the problem. It is an irrational, superstitious cult of censorship and repression of discussion. Post-modern, globalist Leftism is truly an intolerant and devious cult and toy of pseudo-intellectual, power-hungry bureaucratic types.

    Pseudo-intellectuals are bull****ers who force the data into vise and then twist thought out of shape to conform to their counter-factual theories. Post-modern leftism is about the dictatorship of the new bureaucratic NOMENKLATURA.

    These post-modern Leftards want to become the new permanent Deep State.

  4. Infidel says

    Dec 20, 2019 at 11:55 am

    History is replaced by vulgar phantasmagoria. We read about the British nobility of the 18th century which practiced cannibalism; Italian Jews who committed ritual murders; attempts by British intelligence to turn Hitler into a woman; King Solomon who was Pharaoh of Egypt, Jesus who was King of Edessa; and the Vikings who worshiped Allah.

    This stuff is priceless. Like turning Hitler into a woman would have ended WWII or brought down his regime? Given the behavior of Vikings at the time, I wouldn’t blame people for thinking they worshiped allah. Although I dare say Norse mythology is a fun religion in its own right, and ought to be the alternative of Norwegians, Swedes, Danes and Finns who don’t want to be Christian

  5. Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

    Dec 20, 2019 at 12:06 pm

    No offense Leander, but I have to agree with Mortimer here. You are off topic in tone and tenor, you seem to be proselytizing about the “true” origins of Christianity. Granted, JW is very lenient and does allow for wildly diverging opinions, and sometimes a thread does go into uncharted territory because the discussion takes it that way. But your focus seems to be on the Christian Gospels with no bearing on this particular topic as started by Alexander Maistrovoy’s thesis. If you can even manage to stay on islam in general that would probably be deemed close enough, sometimes we all need to sound off but at least it’s about islam. So maybe your agenda would be better served in a general religious forum or a Christian one, it’s just a suggestion cuz I don’t officially speak for JW. I’m sure you’re a nice person, and I wouldn’t suggest you need psychiatric care just because you are a little off topic or misinformed, I only hope you can tighten things up a bit and stay in tune with the forum.

    Thanks! and no offense intended.

    • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

      Dec 20, 2019 at 12:08 pm

      Oops, double post. Spank me hard. lol

  6. Alexander Maistrovoy. says

    Dec 20, 2019 at 3:22 pm

    Dear Agostino,
    Fight of civilizations is not school football game. Nation or civilization that lost its own values has no chance to win battle. They would be crashed. all examples of history prove it and Rome empire – first of all. You should know exactly WHAT you try to defend. People will not die for homosexual marriages and global warming. But they will die for their motherland, religion, traditions and independence. Israels could win in Arab armies and Finns destroyed Red arm due to high moral spirit only.
    The moral of Muslims is much higher than that of Westerner people because they know what they want.
    Using your own comparison: players of team that think about disco tonight wouldn’t win game with team that crave victory.
    I wrote also that the European culture, rooted in ancient philosophy, the cult of experience, logic and reason of Locke, Spinoza and Descartes, the moral and ethical ideal of the Biblical prophets. if you throw those ideas to trash you would never win Islamic zombie. never.!

    • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

      Dec 20, 2019 at 7:43 pm

      You said,

      The moral of Muslims is much higher than that of Westerner people because they know what they want.

      There, thank you, I thought you were a shill for islam. The truth had to come out, that’s really what you want to say here, right? that muslims are the better people because they “know what they want.” Well, let me remind you, many serial killers and rapists know what they want too, but that doesn’t make them the better people. Values can be good or they can be bad, and muslims worship a religion with many bad values that terrorize humanity. It’s not just having “values” that matters, it’s having GOOD values that count. No, we are the better people in the West, as imperfect as we are, with our own human rights and laws founded on equality and justice for all. Islam is totalitarian for an ignorant demon and murdering prophet, and the teachings they offer are filled with unreasoned bigotry and hate against unbelievers. Let me make a suggestion, go “find” yourself, because clearly you are a lost soul if you think muslims are better people for their belief in islam. Islam contains morally retarded elements that are provoking mass murder and terror, for a demon god with the morals of a rabid pig. Nobody can be “better” person for believing in that.

      • Infidel says

        Dec 20, 2019 at 10:54 pm

        Agostino, Maistrovoy misspelt ‘morale’ as ‘moral’, and you pounce all over him? He is right: it’s not that Muslims are better people than us, but that they are more dedicated to their faith, and pursue it relentlessly, in a way that Christians and Jews have forgotten. He’s right that people won’t die for things like LGBTQ causes or Climate change, but they’ll happily fight for culture, faith and other attributes that mark a person’s identity.

        Yeah, Islam may be an evil and deluded religion, but it’s managed to imbibe in its followers blind loyalty to the cause. Unless it’s confronted w/ something just as determined, it’s chances are better than when it runs into a brick wall

        • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

          Dec 20, 2019 at 11:57 pm

          Agostino, Maistrovoy misspelt ‘morale’ as ‘moral’, and you pounce all over him?

          I don’t care if he’s talking “morals” or “morale,” it makes no difference to me. His meaning is clear, he’s trashing the West and telling us we need to “find ourselves” in order overcome islam. That’s a pile of sh*t, the burden is not on us to discover who we are, but to take good action against the crimes and bad intent of islam. The islamic threats are perfectly clear, we don’t need to go looking for a new “self” before we can see them. He’s trying to blame islam on our own cultural shortcomings, but islam existed long before America and modern Europe ever was.

          And how do you justify your remark, “it’s not that Muslims are better people than us, but that they are more dedicated to their faith, and pursue it relentlessly, in a way that Christians and Jews have forgotten.”?

          Well aren’t you the biggest religious judge in town tonight! declaring muslims as having a greater faith over everyone else. And just how do you determine that “superior” faith, by the number of heads they cut or girls they rape while screaming to their demon? What was your measuring criteria? please tell me. Amazing, I didn’t know that was possible. Do you use some kind of measuring cup for that? Did you take a vast survey? Your claim is groundless and without merit.

          Now, listen. In your last paragraph you said, “Islam may be an evil and deluded religion, but it’s managed to imbibe in its followers blind loyalty to the cause.” Now if that’s true then let me ask a fair question. Why must we go “find ourselves” in order to deal with an “evil and deluded religion”? Wouldn’t it make more sense to say they need to go find themselves? If we know it’s evil then we don’t need to go find ourselves to deal with it. This whole notion of us having to find ourselves is a diversion and an attempt to blame us for islam. Trust me, islam was killing and terrorizing before we were even born. Muslims need to go find themselves, we who love freedom and have eyes to see are already secure enough with our knowledge of islam.

          So you’re wrong in saying Maistrovoy is right, he’s foolishly wrong. And where he’s a little bit “right” it doesn’t matter. Because islam’s evil intent is clear enough already whether we’ve been “found” or not. Every culture that has ever existed has had its shortcomings. Our current shortcomings did not create islamic jihad, that’s 1400 years old.

          (Runs fingers through hair, throws head back, takes a sip of wine, and smiles at himself)

    • gravenimage says

      Dec 21, 2019 at 1:03 am

      Agostino, I don’t think that you and Alexander Maistrovoy are really all that far apart.

      I read what he is saying as *defending* the core values of the West, not trashing them. And he is *not* a shill for Islam. This isn’t true of any of the contributors to Jihad Watch.

      • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

        Dec 21, 2019 at 8:32 am

        I read what he is saying as *defending* the core values of the West, not trashing them. And he is *not* a shill for Islam. Graven

        Well you may have read it that way, but I don’t see where he said it. He’s just trashing the West with his hodgepodge collection of cultural oddities and inadequacies an then telling us we better go “find ourselves,” which is pretty darn close to telling us we should go “f*ck ourselves,” to me. Okay, let’s do this then, Graven, lets assemble all the relatives of the 9/11 victims and you can tell them the best thing to do about islam is that we go “find ourselves.” I bet you won’t make it to the parking lot without 2 pounds of spit on your face. Listen, there’s nothing wrong with any person or nation “finding their self,” but in the meantime let’s stick with tangible solutions to islam, like immigration control, and anti-sharia laws, and making sure they don’t weasel their psycho religion into our lives. This whole “soul searching” kind of solution to islam fails big for me, I’m angry at the suggestion. Maistrovoy is exonerating islam by shaming us, it’s like he vacuumed decades of Western culture for every deficiency he could find just so he could paint a picture of moral and intellectual depravity. Listen, you could deprive a rose of its beauty with the proper selection of adjectives. Maistrovoy has assembled a potpourri of barely related cultural tidbits spanning centuries to make us feel responsible for islamic jihad. If we could just find ourselves! ha! We aren’t lost, islam is!

        • gravenimage says

          Dec 21, 2019 at 4:02 pm

          Agostino Armo Pellegrini wrote:

          I read what he is saying as *defending* the core values of the West, not trashing them. And he is *not* a shill for Islam. Graven

          Well you may have read it that way, but I don’t see where he said it. He’s just trashing the West with his hodgepodge collection of cultural oddities and inadequacies an then telling us we better go “find ourselves,” which is pretty darn close to telling us we should go “f*ck ourselves,” to me.
          …………………………..

          Agostino, I think we face two main problems–the threat of Islam itself, of course and most obviously. But we have many times the military capability of any Muslim nation, and Muslims were not in the West in any numbers until quite recently. What has changed?

          Again, two things–firstly, that most in the West *still* don’t recognize Islam as a threat, and that we (the collective we) have not been up for staunchly defending our values–in some cases we take those values for granted or even scorn them.

          I don’t think that recognizing this problem is saying “f*ck you” to the West. Other contributors to Jihad Watch besides Alexander Maistrovoy have noted this issue, including Robert Spencer and Hugh Fitzgerald. Many posters here have done the same, including myself.

          I am *certainly* not saying “f*ck the West”–I consider the West the best, most enlightened societies not just in the world, but in the history of the world. I *want* us to maintain our civilized cultures. The West is not flawless, of course, but it is the best man has produced, and seeing it fall–especially to the savagery of Islam–would be the greatest of catastrophes. I also am not sure that any other part of Dar-al-Harb could survive if the West falls–with all of our denial, we are still the greatest bulwark against Islam.

          Alexander Maistrovoy has been contributing to Jihad Watch for almost four years now. If his message were really to exonerate Islam and to f*ck the West, I think Robert Spencer would have noticed that. He certainly would not agree with any such stance. You can read the rest of Mr. Maistrovoy’s work and decide for yourself:

          https://www.jihadwatch.org/author/alexander-maistrovoy

          More:

          Okay, let’s do this then, Graven, lets assemble all the relatives of the 9/11 victims and you can tell them the best thing to do about islam is that we go “find ourselves.” I bet you won’t make it to the parking lot without 2 pounds of spit on your face. Listen, there’s nothing wrong with any person or nation “finding their self,” but in the meantime let’s stick with tangible solutions to islam, like immigration control, and anti-sharia laws, and making sure they don’t weasel their psycho religion into our lives.
          …………………………..

          Agostino, I agree with your suggestions. But if we don’t know that Islam is evil, and don’t know that our own civilized societies are in peril–or, worse, don’t even acknowledge that they are of value and are worth saving–then we will never do what needs to be done to preserve our values.

          More:

          This whole “soul searching” kind of solution to islam fails big for me, I’m angry at the suggestion. Maistrovoy is exonerating islam by shaming us, it’s like he vacuumed decades of Western culture for every deficiency he could find just so he could paint a picture of moral and intellectual depravity. Listen, you could deprive a rose of its beauty with the proper selection of adjectives. Maistrovoy has assembled a potpourri of barely related cultural tidbits spanning centuries to make us feel responsible for islamic jihad. If we could just find ourselves! ha! We aren’t lost, islam is!
          …………………………..

          Agostino, I just don’t see it that way. When the Founding Fathers in America fought the revolution against Britain, they did not just focus on things like troop movements and supply lines–they also thought long and hard about what it was they wanted freedom from–and, even more salient–what it was they wanted to build if they won that freedom. This was not pointless naval gazing–it fired the passion to hold fast during the long fight.

          We did much the same during the fight against Fascism and Communism.

          Alexander Maistrovoy personally faced this, himself–having been born in the USSR.

          I don’t just think about what I hate about Islam, although God knows the list is long and hideous. I also realize what we have fought for and built as a culture, how hard won and fragile these values can be, and how *very much* worth preserving.

        • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

          Dec 21, 2019 at 5:22 pm

          Hello Graven,

          But if we don’t know that Islam is evil, and don’t know that our own civilized societies are in peril–or, worse, don’t even acknowledge that they are of value and are worth saving–then we will never do what needs to be done to preserve our values.

          That’s true, but what you just described there is the education of others about islam, and that’s a good strategy to have. That’s why I love JW, that’s what they are doing.

          But Maistrovoy’s essay wasn’t simply about the need to educate about islam, that would have been fine. No, his complaint about the West ran from the “lizard People” to ghosts to astrology… What the hell does any of that have to do with muslims mass raping girls or cutting heads for allah? He seems to be trying too hard to remind us just how lost and confused we are in the West concerning Disney’s “little Mermaid” and “Pippi Longstocking” in Sweden. Really? What the hell does that have to do with keeping islam out of our classrooms and politics? protecting our planes from muslim terrorists? or keeping our kids safe at music concerts? I find Maistrovoy’s sophistry a little too tailored for us feeling guilty about our cultural foibles, and not enough concern for the violence in islam that is blatant and severe. And then the cherry on top is when he says, we don’t have to defeat them, we only need to find ourselves!

          His whole argument is weak and fallacious.

          When you are threatened by a real world problem you should consider all possible solutions and grant each one the appropriate sense of measure. I guarantee you, Pippi Longstocking and the Little Mermaid rank low on the list of things to worry about regarding islam. Yes, let’s always be open minded about “finding ourselves,” and it’s good to reevaluate these things. But this cannot be our sole strategy against islam, and I believe it’s wrong to say it is. I guarantee you muslims aren’t going to run from any cultural improvements we might conjure, they will run because we actively stood against their evil islamic jihad right now, today. Remember, they believe their islam is superior to every other religion, and their god is superior to every other god. We could be the best, most well adjusted culture in history and they would still conquer us for allah if they could. “Finding ourselves” need go no further than knowing that.

          Thanks Graven, you really made sense with that post. You made me have to think, and believe me, that’s not easy for a dummy like me:)

    • Pal says

      Dec 21, 2019 at 3:20 pm

      Just a few remarks on an impression that I find traces of formative factors originating from (Soviet) Russian patterns of propaganda (incl its anti-Westernism). As if Alexander Maistrovoy has most probably lived there for at least 2-3 decades. No, he is not an anti-Western one, however maybe involuntarily, instinctively, he resorts on such ways.

      “Fight for own civilizations”. It is difficult to say nations, peoples exactly fight for their own civilization when they execute some fight or war as mentioned. They usually fight for other passions.
      “Roman Empire” demise is rather a protracted fatigue (during final centuries) after draining exhaustion than “not knowing what is being defended”.
      Hatred against “homosexuals and against global warming” (not that they should be prioritized) is also a daily mantra from Russian screens, pages, mouths.
      Civilisational “moral/e of Muslims” is in no way higher than the moral/e of the common Western people, and especially of their Conviction. Muslim fighters and spearheading is at moments and at places quite dangerous, indeed. But it is more relevant that in common Muslims are lower-levels and cowards. As B. Lewis says it, they always think they (their civilisation is) are something higher (cf Quran 3:110, at least), but they are constantly engulfed in the embarrassment they don’t know how to prove it. It is their sort of inferiority complex that from time to time explodes, here and there, achieving regretfully some successes, from time to time.
      Author writes as a by-stander and a critic of the West. He is sort of blaming the Westerners to search & re-find their own identity and to change instead of primarily point his pen against the Muslims – for them to be the ones to be primarily blamed, deterred and pressed to change.

      • gravenimage says

        Dec 21, 2019 at 4:25 pm

        Again, I do not find Alexander Maistrovoy to be anti-Western. Just look at his body of work, both here at Jihad Watch and for many other publications.

      • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

        Dec 21, 2019 at 5:51 pm

        Author writes as a by-stander and a critic of the West. He is sort of blaming the Westerners to search & re-find their own identity and to change instead of primarily point his pen against the Muslims – for them to be the ones to be primarily blamed, deterred and pressed to change.–Pal

        Thanks Pal, you get it. I’d be perfectly willing to accept that the West does bear some responsibility for the problem of islam, after all, we let them in. But the suggestion that all we need do is “find ourselves” and they will run back to the desert is not a real world solution to the imminent dangers of islam. Does Maistrovoy imagine millions of shrieking muslims running back to the desert because we fixed the Lizard People and Pippi Longstocking? or any other cultural oddities we might have? I mean, that doesn’t even make a good metaphor for hope, cuz it’s so darn implausible.

  7. Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

    Dec 20, 2019 at 6:49 pm

    Alexander Maistrovoy is wrong.

    It seems that Alexander Maistrovoy wants us to solve the problem of islam in the West by “finding ourselves.” But this puts the onus on us, as if we gotta be the ones to do some soul searching before we can challenge the islamic threat effectively. I find that a rather ineffectual approach to islamic jihad that seems to put the blame on us to change, not muslims. We don’t have to discover who we are to stop bank robbery, for example, we already know it’s wrong and we must employ good law enforcement tactics to combat it. Likewise, we don’t need to discover a “new self” to understand that FGM is wrong, and murderous homophobia, and terrorism for religion, and mass rape by muslim men, or dangerous enclaves that consume our neighborhoods, or sharia that threatens to undermine our legal system and culture for islam… no, we who value freedom and equality and justice have no need to do any soul searching to battle islam. We only need to do what any good, moral person would do when their nation and people are threatened by an alien creed and people. Granted the details of any defense must be worked out and will differ as time progresses. But I’m almost irked by the suggestion that we good people of the West must change, or discover, or become something else in lieu of practical/commonsense action against islam. Of course much of what Maistrovoy said is true regarding the West’s struggling identity and decline (due in great part to islam, I’ll mention). But to offer up as the most effective means of battling islam is that we “find ourselves” strikes me as almost complicit in the decline he criticizes. I guarantee you, if islam is ever effectively challenged in the West, it won’t be by those sitting in the corner finding their self. It will be because good people like Spencer and Geller and Wilders actively engaged others with their factual teachings, and because of all the other good citizens who proactively confronted the evils of islam. If anyone needs to “find” their self then I’d say it’s the muslims who bow to a dirty demon and psycho prophet, not rational thinking atheists like myself who only want to live without religious bigotry and murder up my a$$. Trust me, I’ve already found myself regarding islam, and so have the millions of other souls that see islam for what it truly is. Maistrovoy wasn’t appealing to leftists in his thesis, he was appealing to those seeking a solution to islam in the West as his concluding remarks make clear, and what he offered is no more effective than doing nothing, just sit, be patient, and find ourselves! Sorry, not me!

    >>>Muslims, go find yourself, and spare us all that suffering and death.

    • yiyoya says

      Dec 21, 2019 at 8:02 am

      With all due respect Agostino, Alexander Maistrovoy is right. The fundamental problem is not Islam, the invasion of Islam and Muslims into the West is only a symptom of the underlying disease, that’s what Maistrovoy and I were both trying to point out. The underlying disease, the underlying cause of the rise and spread of the cancer of Islam into the body of the West is the philosophical and cultural HIV of irrational and anti-rational ideas that more and more individuals in the West are taught in the schools and have come to accept as true; moral relativism, skepticism, nihilism, socialism, cultural relativism, globalism, feminism, identity politics which is tribalism by another name, climate change, transgenderism, homosexualism, etc.. That cultural, philosophical HIV, sometimes becomes full-blown cultural AIDS and sometimes it goes back into remission. WW2 is an example of when the irrationalism broke out into full blown AIDS, Hitler and Mussolini defeated, the irrationalism went back into remission. Then came the counterculture of the 1960s, the drugs, the insane, anti-rational, music of Jimi Hendrix, The Doors, and the Hippies, then things became quiet again, Reagan came along in the 80s. Now once again the irrationality and decay is back in full force. The underlying HIV or Herpes has burst out again, and the patient is sick again.

      Imagine doctors trying to fight Kaposi’s Sarcoma or Pneumonia in an AIDS patient in the early 1980s when the doctors knew nothing of the existence of HIV and AIDS, they operate, they give the patient a long course of antibiotics, the patient bounces back, his healthy again, the patient goes home, he’s fine for a while, and then no sooner do we celebrate, and the patient is sick again, and back in the hospital closer to death. Wash, rinse, repeat, until the patient finally dies. The doctors (you are one of those doctors) are at a complete loss as to why they couldn’t save the patient by fighting the symptoms. How could they save the patient when they were only treating the opportunistic diseases that could only take over the body of the patient because there was another more fundamental disease killing the patient that they were not treating? That is precisely the relationship between Islam and the disintegration of the West. In an earlier era, in the era of Teddy Roosevelt and Winston Churchill, when the cultural and philosophical immune system of the West was much healthier, the cancer of Islam could not invade and grow in the body of the West.

      You cannot defeat an opportunistic disease, Islam, when there is a more fundamental disease, the nihilism, self-hatred, and irrationality taught at the schools of the West, cultural and philosophical AIDS, which is what is allowing the cancer of Islam to invade and takeover. That is what Alexander Maistrovoy and I are trying to point out. We’ve met the AIDS patient dying of an opportunistic disease, and that patient is the West.

      • Alexander Maistrovoy. says

        Dec 21, 2019 at 10:29 am

        Thank you, yiyoya! it’s exactly my approach!
        In my book i wrote the same:
        “The truth is that Islam doesn’t represent a slightest threat to democracy or any other system in general. But there is one strong reservation: such system should reach a certain maturity in economic, political, and spiritual matters; it should be stable and should rest on a solid foundation. Stable political systems with a high self-esteem, as enlightened monarchies of the Victorian era or the United States’ democracy in the recent past, felt no fear, no piety, and even no interest toward Islam.
        …It is inconceivable to imagine that Locke and Hume, Helvetius and Montesquieu, Tocqueville and Mill, Franklin and Jefferson, Madison and Humboldt could seriously discuss the “Islamic threat” to their societies (only if in a narrow sense of safety). Islam is a deadly threat not to a thriving, energetic civilization, but to a dying, decaying society, and that’s where the true root of the problem lies. A strong, healthy tree won’t ever suffer from a nearby anthill. But a moldering, withered, rotten, hollow tree can become an easy prey for ants that will destroy it in a few months.
        Thank you again

        • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

          Dec 21, 2019 at 2:38 pm

          “The truth is that Islam doesn’t represent a slightest threat to democracy or any other system in general. –Maistrovoy

          That’s a bald faced lie. Islam is antithetical to our democracy, our free speech, religious freedom, and human rights in general.

          You say that Islam is a deadly threat not to a thriving, energetic civilization, but to a dying, decaying society, and that’s where the true root of the problem lies. And that’s a false statement. Islam is a threat to any civilization that values peace and freedom from religious intimidation and murder. If that were true–that islam were peaceful–then islam would be welcomed like any other religion. But islam has a 1400 year history of jihad for allah, millions have been murdered and we see the mass suffering it causes every day. Muslim nations are sh*tholes, suffering the consequences of trying to live for an outmoded and retarded religion that worships an ignorant demon and fake prophet who murdered. Trust me, that’s a threat to any civilized people, even those that need to go “find themselves.”

      • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

        Dec 21, 2019 at 11:35 am

        Hello, yiyoya,

        You said, In an earlier era, in the era of Teddy Roosevelt and Winston Churchill, when the cultural and philosophical immune system of the West was much healthier, the cancer of Islam could not invade and grow in the body of the West.

        I’m curious about the criteria you used to determine the “the cultural and philosophical immune system of the West was much healthier…” In what way was our immune system much healthier? Did Jim Crow give us some kind of immunity from muslims and islam? and was that really our “healthy” period? What was different back then that islam didn’t have nearly the chance it has today? I suggest that it wasn’t that we were healthier, it’s because those factors that caused mass migration among muslims did not exist then. Migration restrictions in Arab countries after the Arab Spring and the war in Syria are recent, and those are two major causes of muslim migration of today, just as examples.

        See how irrational you sound? Your argument is without rational foundation.

        You seem to be wanting to create this whole theory that it’s not islam’s fault for being islam, it’s more that we got too many globalists and “isms” and too much irrationality in the world. And I suppose there’s some truth in all that, but what I find so offensive is the absurd suggestion of Maistrovoy’s that we don’t have to defeat “them,” but to find ourselves. What a silly thing to say, what an absurd conclusion. As if “finding oneself” shouldn’t also include sensible actions against those that threaten us. Better he should have said,

        “A good way in finding ourselves is by defending what we value and love most, our freedoms, our families, our nation, and that’s why we must actively confront islamic jihad in every area of life. With those good actions we reaffirm who we are as people and the values we love. In short, we find ourselves in our own good actions.”

        Nope, apparently you don’t agree with that, better we should blame ourselves and tidy up our “isms” and that will make muslims return to their desert: vicious, soulless, fruitless ghosts of the gloomy past as Maistrovoy said. lol, nope, muslims aren’t going to wait patiently while we find ourselves. They will kill us, and then take our lands.

        • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

          Dec 21, 2019 at 12:31 pm

          Yiyoya,

          Go tell a raped Christian in the Middle East they need to go find their self and they need to discover who they really are. Go tell a motherless child whose parents were killed by ISIS they need to get all those “isms” out of their life, isms they probably don’t even understand or heard of. All these problems you guys are pushing as the reason islam is in the West is of no real consequence in other nations where muslims are terrorizing the most. What’s your excuse for islam in THOSE nations? Face it, islam is a parasite that will exploit any culture’s weaknesses. The West could be exemplary in morals and action, and islam would be no less evil or threatening.

      • gravenimage says

        Dec 21, 2019 at 4:27 pm

        Good post, yiyoya.

    • yiyoya says

      Dec 21, 2019 at 8:35 am

      Upon re-reading your post, I think I may have skipped over your statement that you are a rational atheist. If you are an atheist may I recommend to you Objectivist philosopher Leonard Peikoff’s books “The Ominous Parallels: The End of Freedom in America” and “The D.I.M. Hypothesis: Why the Lights of the West Are Going Out” ? That is if you’re not anti-Ayn Rand and her philosophy of Objectivism.

      In both books Leonard Peikoff powerfully demonstrates the role of philosophy (religion is an early form, a precursor, of philosophy) in determining the trajectory, of a culture, a nation, and all of human history.

      There is an essay of his you might find interesting, it’s available to read online, “Religion Versus America” or you can listen to it on Youtube, google it, give it a try.

      • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

        Dec 21, 2019 at 3:44 pm

        Leonard Peikoff powerfully demonstrates the role of philosophy (religion is an early form, a precursor, of philosophy) in determining the trajectory, of a culture, a nation, and all of human history.–yiyoya

        Of course philosophy plays a role in determining the trajectory of a culture… as does the collective consciousness and the will to survive. But if we resign ourselves to a life of philosophical “finding ourselves” in the face of every threat that comes along we won’t survive long. Maistrovoy says that if we find ourselves then “they” will return to the desert. But finding our self can only mean one thing as it pertains to islam: that is, we make it perfectly clear to muslims that we won’t tolerate their jihad and sharia in our nations. Our philosophical soul searching need not encompass anything more than that. You guys have the problem of islam all wrapped up in some overwrought philosophy of self discovery and rebirth on a cultural level, you are over intellectualizing and coming to the wrong conclusion. We DO have to defeat islam, and we do that by actively engaging the threat wherever it arises. And I say with great confidence that what we’ll “find” is a renewed love of country and appreciation for the freedoms so many have fought and died for, among other good things, like an environment less conducive to religious bigotry and violence. Can Maistrovoy think of any better result than that?

  8. gravenimage says

    Dec 20, 2019 at 10:29 pm

    “Us and Them”: The Main Task of the West is Not to Defeat “Them” But to Find Itself
    …………………….

    Good article–I generally agree with Alexander Maistrovoy.

    We have to focus mot just on what we oppose, but what we value and defend.

    • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

      Dec 21, 2019 at 12:17 am

      Good article–I generally agree with Alexander Maistrovoy.

      We have to focus mot just on what we oppose, but what we value and defend.
      ————————–
      Graven, he didn’t say that, I did. He thinks we should go “find ourselves,” I’m the one that said we must defend what we value. You basically took my words and put ’em in his mouth. Here’s what he said,

      However, our main task is not to defeat “them,” but to find ourselves. If “we” were able to do this, “they” would have no chance. “They” would return to their desert: vicious, soulless, fruitless ghosts of the gloomy past.

      In other words, let’s not actually try and confront muslims’ jihad aggression proactively, let’s just embark on a whole new mission of self discovery. ha! That’s worse than calling islam a religion of peace!

      • gravenimage says

        Dec 21, 2019 at 12:54 am

        Agostino, thank you for your reply.

        If you check the timestamps on my posts, you will see I replied to the story above in general before later replying to comments from other posters–this is what I usually do. I had not read your comments when I posted this.

        This is how I interpreted what Alexander Maistrovoy had to say–whether we both read his article the same way is another story.

  9. Alexander Maistrovoy. says

    Dec 21, 2019 at 7:37 am

    I don’t know who is this man – Agostino Armo Pellegrini but he he uses disgusting methods: pervert and rewrite obvious things. He makes me a supporter of Islam. Perfectly! I am well acquainted with this tactic from the Soviet past. Same can be said about his stile: “trashing the West” “pile of sh*t” and using typos.
    This reminds me a lot Soviet propaganda. Great, tovarish Pellegrini!
    Pity to see such persons on such respectable forum.

    • yiyoya says

      Dec 21, 2019 at 11:01 am

      In my humble opinion Mr. Pellegrini has simply misunderstood what you are trying to say, that’s all. He is allowing his anger to cloud his analysis and assessment of your article. It occurs to me that maybe his strong and angry protestation might possibly be due to having lost a loved on 9/11, or during some other Jihad attack.

      Vulgarity and anger aside, he does have an intelligent and even pithy way of writing, he doesn’t sound stupid or malicious, but intelligent and sincere, with time and calmness, he might change his assessment of your article.

      • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

        Dec 21, 2019 at 12:21 pm

        Well thank you, yiyoya, for the nice things you said about me, I am sincere, though I’ve never thought I was that intelligent. But really there’s no need to apologize for me, I understood him quite well. You can’t convince me that “finding ourselves” is the best course against islam. Taken at face value, that’s a really stupid thing to say. If the contributor Maistrovoy had even qualified or expanded on that then maybe it would have been more palatable. Frankly, I took it as an insult. To say that we don’t have to “defeat” them and that we gotta go find ourselves is siding with the enemy. Maistrovoy is trying to promote a philosophy of passivity and self-blame regarding islam. I don’t buy it. I know we aren’t perfect, but that’s no excuse to refrain from confronting islam as pragmatically as possible. Yes, by all means, let’s “find ourselves” as every culture and nation should. But when it comes to protecting our families and nation(s) from islam let’s not be idiots and make that our sole defense against islam. Contrary to what Maistrovoy said, we MUST defeat islam, and we do it by actively confronting the threat wherever it may arise. We can best “find ourselves’ in our own good actions of defending our families and nation against islam. To say we don’t have to defeat them is the very opposite of the truth, and that’s what I find so offensive.

        I hope that made at least some sense to you guys, I know you’re both way WAY above my intellectual ability here.

      • gravenimage says

        Dec 21, 2019 at 4:36 pm

        Mr. Maistrovoy, I agree with yiyoya. I think Agostino Armo Pellegrini has misunderstood the points you were making.

        He actually has a long history of posting here, and is definitely an Anti-Jihadist.

        • Alexander Maistrovoy says

          Dec 22, 2019 at 4:58 am

          Thank you, Grave!

          Now I will try to relate to this dispute without excess emotions.

          I think there are a lot of people with good intentions but narrow-minded. They are not able apriori to see the problem as a whole. they focus only on the consequences of the disease, and not on the disease itself. We have many such people – mainly in settlements. they are undoubtedly good people, they say the right thing, but they don’t understand that they are isolated, and their ideas will never be accepted because the majority of the population is already deadly infected with multicultural conceptions. (Although perhaps less so than in the USA or Canada).
          Who will ban sharia law? the very western elite that deliberately promote them. Who will expel Muslims? Those who invite them? Who will defend women, girls and children against muslim rapers? Thouse who defend the rapers themself?

          Why ihere are NO problems at all with Muslims and islam in the Czech Republic, Poland, Hungary? Answer is ovious. because the dominant majority of people here, according to Milos Zeman and Viktor Orban, believe in “Judeo-Christian values.” If in the USA, GB, Sweden, Canada there would be the same majority and the same leaders, Muslims would remain where they should be – behind the border fences. But peoples such as Agostino are unable to understand basic things, they can’t see roots of evel. They remind me “true communists” who sincerely believed that the main reason of all problems in the USSR was due to imperialism.

    • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

      Dec 21, 2019 at 12:42 pm

      He makes me a supporter of Islam.

      Bingo! See, you’re a shill for islam. You aren’t for JW, you’re merely obfuscating your anti-West, pro-islam sentiments. And trust me, your insults don’t offend me. I’ve been a pesky little troll on the internet for 20 years, my skin is a mile thick. Have a nice day, and thanks for your thoughts.

      • gravenimage says

        Dec 21, 2019 at 4:40 pm

        Agostino, Alexander Maistrovoy saying that you are characterizing him as a supporter of Islam *does not* mean that he accepts your considering him as a shill for Islam.

        Why do you think Jihad Watch would feature articles from shills for Islam? You may disagree with his approach in the article above, but claiming that this author is pro-Jihad is–with all respect–just absurd.

        • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

          Dec 21, 2019 at 6:29 pm

          claiming that this author is pro-Jihad is–with all respect–just absurd.

          It’s not absurd when his own words suggest otherwise. Maybe I’ve gotten myself too whipped up over this. It’s just that the more I thought about what he said the angrier I got. Maistrovoy spent a lot of words criticizing what he considers irrationality in the West, everything from Disney Characters to astrology. But his solution to islam is no more rational than what he criticized. Trust me, muslims aren’t going to go running back to the desert because we found ourselves, they would kill us no matter where we’re at in our moral or cultural growth. Maistrovoy’s solution to islam is hopelessly unreal, totally undefined beyond the vague need to “find ourselves,” and is rather dangerous in that it promotes passivity in response to islamic jihad. I’m for real world solutions, and I find Maistrovoy’s approach dangerously weak and apologetic to islam. It’s not my intention to offend anyone. I’m just speaking out against something I think is dumb and irrational, certainly Maistrovoy can appreciate that.

        • gravenimage says

          Dec 22, 2019 at 12:36 am

          Agostino, I don’;t believe we can defend ourselves against Islam if we don’t know what we stand for.

          And I don’t think that there is anything passive about defending our values.

          But you can, of course, disagree–I was not in any way implying that you cannot.

  10. Alexander Maistrovoy. says

    Dec 21, 2019 at 2:23 pm

    no problem, you remain pesky little troll

  11. Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

    Dec 22, 2019 at 5:16 am

    And I don’t think that there is anything passive about defending our values.–Graven

    Of course not, but it is passive to say that we don’t have to defeat them, and that’s what Maistrovoy said. And as long as I’m here, why would muslims run back to the desert simply because we “found ourselves” and changed? If they are so amazed at our transformation, wouldn’t they be more likely to want to live among us? What would be so different after we “found ourselves” that muslims would want to flee from us? It’s an absurd visual, and totally insincere to say such a thing. Graven, you made no effort to rebut what I said, you simply restated the obvious. I’ll interpret that as meaning you agree with me, since I can’t believe you would put any stock in Maistrovoy’s conclusion that muslims would scurry back to the desert. His conclusion is vague, insincere, and hopelessly implausible, and if you agree with that then I feel you’re beyond reach, unless you can intelligently defend his position which I’m sure you won’t because no self respecting person would even try.

    Agostino, I don’;t believe we can defend ourselves against Islam if we don’t know what we stand for.

    Exactly, that’s stating the obvious. But if that’s Maistrovoy’s message here then why didn’t he just come out and tell us what he thought we stood for and offer intelligent ways to defend it? Instead he goes off on an anti-Western tirade to make the West look lost and confused, and then says we don’t have to defeat “them” but find ourselves–whatever that means! Maistrovoy is doing the exact opposite of your good statement, he’s clouding the issue with his rambling dissertation and an absurd conclusion that offers no tangible hope or solution. NUTS! And you defend that?

    • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

      Dec 22, 2019 at 5:34 am

      Graven, if you disagree with Maistrovoy then why don’t you just come out and say it? Who cares if he’s a JW sanctioned contributor, I’m sure Spencer doesn’t mind if we dare to think for ourselves. Why should we have to bow to someone else’s irrational assertions and claims? I’m confident I’m right about this, Maistrovoy’s offering was paltry and insincere in my opinion, and I’m not afraid to say it. If anyone wants to shut me up then you can do it with good argument. Haven’t seen it yet. The only thing Maistrovoy offered in return was ad hominem, a childish response that says everything. Yiyoya made a thoughtful try and was kind, but frankly, I wasn’t convinced. He’s with Maistrovoy on this one, but I don’t think he made their case.

  12. Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

    Dec 22, 2019 at 8:17 am

    My father had a favorite saying that he liked to use every chance he got, he’d say, “sh*t or get off the pot.” In other words, make up your mind. And my unsolicited advice to Maistrovoy is that he do the same, sh*t or get off the pot. Decide whether you are for the West and against islam, or vice versa. If the best he can do as a pro-Westerner is shame us into self-reform while islam murders and terrorizes under our noses then I think we’d be better off without him. It sounds like Maistrovoy doesn’t want us to defend what we know is good and right, like our freedoms, and our laws, and our neighborhoods, from islam. He wants us to go “find ourselves” and that’s it, muslims will leave. Apparently Maistrovoy is so convinced muslims will be intimidated by our new enlightened selves that they’ll run back to the desert like scared little bunnies! Gosh, that sounds a tad racist and insulting to me. As anti-muslim as I am, I would at least offer the small possibility that muslims would be inspired to stay and join us, but that’s just me.

    Listen, we could be the most enlightened and “found” people on the planet and that would still not be enough to deter muslims from destroying us for allah if they could. Telling us that we don’t have to defeat them and that all we gotta do is “find ourselves” is exactly what leftists and muslims want to hear. Cuz then there’s nothing but pie in the sky foolishness between our free lives and islamic tyranny. I can’t think of any worse advice than what Maistrovoy said here.

    • yiyoya says

      Dec 23, 2019 at 7:28 am

      “He wants us to go “find ourselves” and that’s it, muslims will leave. Apparently Maistrovoy is so convinced muslims will be intimidated by our new enlightened selves that they’ll run back to the desert like scared little bunnies!”

      Agostino what you are failing to understand is that “finding ourselves”, finding our Western values, embracing our Western values, becoming confident and certain that those values are superior than Islam and worth fighting for and defending against Islam, would by definition include and involve removing the Muslims from the West and stopping all Muslim immigration to the West, just like the Buddhists of Myanmar are doing today after 75 years of Muslim invasion and jihad in Myanmar. The Buddhists of Myanmar have finally “found themselves”, found their conviction, certainty, and confidence that Islam is wrong and evil, and must be removed from their country. Don’t you understand that the very idea of removing the Muslims from the West and stopping Muslim immigration to the West, the very idea of despising and rejecting Islam forcefully, is a philosophical idea and requires philosophical conviction, it requires “finding ourselves”, finding our Western values and conviction, confidence, and certainty that those Western values are worth fighting for. It is because we have “lost ourselves”, lost our philosophical conviction, confidence, and certainty in our Western way of life, that Muslim immigration and a Muslim invasion is allowed and encouraged in the West today.

      Not every Westerner has lost the philosophical conviction and confidence in Western values (reason, rationality, logic, science, individualism, individual rights, private property rights, capitalism), certainly you haven’t, but enough have “lost their Western selves”, enough of them in Sweden, Germany, France, England, have “lost themselves”. And this is what has made the Muslim invasion possible. In other words enough Westerners have become educated an indoctrinated in anti-Western values, such as moral relativism and multiculturalism, and enough of them have gained power, that they and their anti-Western philosophical ideas and convictions have opened to door to the Muslim invasion of the West. You don’t seem to fully grasp the power of philosophy, the full implication of ideas, and that it is ideas that are the motivation of human actions or inactions.

      “History is determined by men’s philosophical convictions. It is philosophy that brought the world to its present state, and it is only philosophy that can save it—a philosophy of reason, individualism and capitalism.” – Ayn Rand

      • Alexander Maistrovoy. says

        Dec 23, 2019 at 10:05 am

        Thank you, yiyoya, it’s exactly so! we have ceased to be adult men and women who are aware of their place in the world and their basic ideals. We turned into capricious children, who even forgot about the INSTINCT OF SELF-PRESERVATION, let alone ideals. We need to become mature, self-sufficient people again.

      • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

        Dec 23, 2019 at 10:29 am

        Please note everyone:Maistrovoy and yiyoya are still wrong
        ————————————————-

        finding our Western values…would by definition include and involve removing the Muslims from the West–yiyoya

        Yiyoya, what you said there is not what Maistrovoy said, you’re the one talking about “removing muslims.” If that’s what he meant then why didn’t he just say, “let’s kick the b*stards out!” And further, why must “finding ourselves” necessarily mean removing anyone? Maybe our new-found enlightened selves would produce a more unified solution that is easier than trying to remove millions of people from our nation(s), it’s at least a possibility, right?

        And incidentally, are we the only culture with astrology? with cartoon characters? witchcraft and other unconventional or “weird” beliefs? No, of course not. You can make any culture look “lost” if you focus only on the bad or weird. And that’s what Maistrovoy’s doing here, portraying our culture as so immoral and “lost” that we don’t need to “defeat” islam, just find ourselves and muslims will go back to the desert. Do you think muslims are going to be so impressed by our new-found selves they’ll run away in shame? They don’t even appreciate our democracy and human rights now that’s superior, do you really think they’ll appreciate us more if we improve? No, they’ll hate us just as much for their demon, probably more.

        Listen, the only thing that needs to change regarding islam is the attitude of the leftists and globalist appeasers who have aligned themselves with the islamic agenda. But that doesn’t require a cultural wide fix, that’s just them admitting what you and I already know. And yes, no doubt there still are some stupid people living in denial about islam. But we don’t need to make astrology, or aliens, or Pippi Longstocking part of that curriculum. Just tell ’em to go read JW or some of Spencer’s books like I did, like The History of Jihad for example. These leftist enemies of ours don’t need to find themselves, yiyoya, they need to find out about islam. In fact, leftists already think they found themselves in their alliance with islam, telling them to go “find themselves” is like telling a drunk to find sobriety in a bottle of booze.

        You offered this quote by Rand,

        “History is determined by men’s philosophical convictions. It is philosophy that brought the world to its present state, and it is only philosophy that can save it—a philosophy of reason, individualism and capitalism.” – Ayn Rand

        I’ve got one too,

        “Keep things simple and practical so that an activity that fuels you doesn’t become this massive, daunting obligation. Your self-care activity doesn’t need to be yet another thing that lingers on your to-do list.”― Melissa Steginus, Self Care at Work: How to Reduce Stress, Boost Productivity, and Do More of What Matters

        • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

          Dec 23, 2019 at 11:15 am

          One final note yiyoya,

          I very much resent the absurd suggestion that our best strategy against islam is that we “find ourselves.” It’s so ridiculously vague and unhelpful I’m surprised it got past the censors. In this forum “them” means muslims and their islam. Maistsrovoy has the problem of islam tied to everything from Disney to astrology to ghosts to cannibalism, none of which bears any close resemblance to the jihad threat of islam. Yes, by all means, let’s become more rational and “find ourselves” in every way possible. But to suggest that a vague and ill-defined idea like “finding our self” is the best course against the imminent threat of islam is foolish to the point of insane. His message is that we’re too irrational and confused as a culture, but I assure you, if we don’t actively confront the islamic threat now we won’t have a culture. This should not be an era of introspection and self-improvement regarding islam. It needs to be an era of education about islam, with a massive cultural wide effort to do something about it.

  13. Alexander Maistrovoy says

    Dec 22, 2019 at 10:04 am

    O, my God, here is an example of irrational malignity that does not heed at logic at all. there is no any differences between such people and Antifa . discussions is pointless with him. meaningless malice is his only weapon

    • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

      Dec 22, 2019 at 10:59 am

      That’s not a rebuttal Maistrovoy, that’s an insult. If you had anything to offer you would have said it right here and now, you could have put me to shame with your high intellect. But nope, all you got is insults. Have a nice day, and I hope you “find” yourself real soon.

  14. Alexander Maistrovoy. says

    Dec 23, 2019 at 4:37 am

    Exactly, Henry!
    What we see today is unprecedentedly fast and powerful degradation of Western society! it’s a kind of suicidal syndrome. in my book I compared it with the mass suicide of whales and dolphins and Jamie Glazov quoted me in his book “Jihadist Psychopath”.
    I agree with you completely: “Humanity has been developing only thanks to the constant struggle to overcome the challenges of nature and life and survive. This is the only driving force of the human civilization.” Wars and confrontations strengthen the spiritual values of nations. There is an universal phenomenon. There are few happy exception like Switzerland, but as they say, to live like in Switzerland you have to be Swiss.. And see: every citizen serves in the army there, although this is a neutral country.
    The collapse of the modern West is such powerful and horrifying that it will destroy itself even without the any help of Islam or anyone else. Islam – “barbaric, murderous, medieval cult” (exactly!) – will simply help him make this suicide faster although more painful. (In Israel, this would also happen without Iran, Hizballah, HAMAS and others “nice guys”. A bitter paradox …)
    It is a pity that a great civilization went crazy in just one generation.
    Thank you, Henry, for your comment!

    • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

      Dec 24, 2019 at 10:34 am

      What we see today is unprecedentedly fast and powerful degradation of Western society! –Maistrovoy

      Yes, in great part because of islam and their leftist allies–their mass rape of our people, their conquering enclaves, the homophobia and antisemitism, the FGM, their terror against innocents, the religious intimidation and all the other garbage that typically comes with islam. Muslims don’t come with a love for freedom in their hearts, they come with an unyielding dedication to allah’s totalitarian religion. We “find ourselves” by focusing on all that, not the Satanic Temple, not the Lizard People, or the “flat earthers.” Let them be who they are, Maistrovoy, they aren’t killing us for their beliefs–muslims are.

      Wars and confrontations strengthen the spiritual values of nations.

      Who says? You?

      Let me ask, did Hitler’s wars strengthen the “spiritual values” of Germans? Did they become better people for it? No, I suggest the very opposite, they were demoralized morally and humiliated for the holocaust nightmare and destruction they caused. Killing and terror for war does not make a good source of spiritual growth for nations, I say. If anything it causes a deterioration of spiritual values because people are forced to live the intrinsic hate and bloody actions that always come with war. You are not a wise man Maistrovoy, not in my opinion.

      The collapse of the modern West is such powerful and horrifying that it will destroy itself even without the any help of Islam or anyone else. Islam – “barbaric, murderous, medieval cult” (exactly!) – will simply help him make this suicide faster…

      Maistrovoy, even if we agreed that you are right in saying that, do you really feel that it’s good advice to say we don’t have to “defeat them” and that we must merely “find ourselves”? To me that’s like saying we are “stupid and lost” and that the best way to fix it is by acting more “stupid and lost.” You are way too big with your criticisms but way short on solutions. It’s too simple and vague to tell us to go “find ourselves” in face of a real world threat like islam, as if our best hope is to try and morph centuries of cultural development into something else. Nuts! I agree that there’s too much stupidity and irrationality in the world, I grant you that. But your method of dealing with the threat of islam is no less stupid and irrational than what you criticize, and worse it exonerates islam and puts the entire blame on us. I find that offensive. You could have cleared this whole thing up with one intelligent paragraph. Haven’t seen it yet.

      • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

        Dec 24, 2019 at 11:17 am

        And one more thing Maistrovoy, it doesn’t bother me at all that you’re in here. I’m big on free speech, and if Spencer wants to invite pro-islamic contributors then maybe that’s a good thing. It gives us a chance to confront head on the ridiculous ideas of muslim supporters who think we’re to blame and promote islam as something we don’t have to defeat. Granted, I’m not the brightest bulb on the porch, but I’m still going to argue against your pro-islam stance. Personally, I welcome your ideas as silly as they are, gives me/us a chance to expose their folly. It’s not personal to me and I don’t hate you. On some level I think you meant well, but one could say the same about a parent that “chastises” their child with a stick until they die. And that’s what you seem to be doing, chastising the West into submission for islam while exonerating them. You may have meant well, but you’re beating us to death with your bad ideas.

        • Agostino Armo Pellegrini says

          Dec 26, 2019 at 11:16 am

          Once the West finds or rather restores the lost roots it’ll be able to self-clean itself of the islamic scourge, by default.–Henry

          But what does that mean? to say the West, “will be able to self-clean itself of the islamic scourge, by default.” You offer nothing by way of specifics here, just a vague, nondescript suggestion that we will “self clean” after we “find” ourselves. What will be different in the future that will make us more able to clean ourselves of islam? and what does that cleansing look like? I can see you trying to help a child standing on the tracks, the train is coming and you say, “You really need to find yourself.” ha! No, just tell ’em to get off the tracks!

          Maistrovoy is unequivocally trying to blame the West for islamic jihad. He’s placing the blame on everything from Disney characters to astrology to the Lizard People, but none of that is encouraging islamic jihad. We tackle islamic jihad by putting the blame where it belongs, on islam and the muslims who promote and kill for it. If you want to “find yourself” then have a good time. But don’t look too long, you may lose your head before you find what you’re looking for.

  15. Alexander Maistrovoy. says

    Dec 23, 2019 at 12:08 pm

    i’m little bit surprised that my comments (for example, my answer to Henry) which are wrote about 8-9 hours ago, are not published
    thank you
    Alex Maistrovoy

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