This shocking news, that 360 million Christians were reportedly persecuted in 2021, would not be tolerated if the victim were any other group, especially Muslims; nor should it be. But when the genocide and persecution of Christians is pointed out, there is virtual silence; then the ever-present accusations of “Islamophobia” enable the abuse to continue unchallenged.
Of all the countries where Christians face the most persecution, Afghanistan is the worst, according to the organization….
Yet globalists are opening the doors of the West to multitudes of unvetted Afghan migrants, while Christians are virtually ignored.
Orbán has been sensible in desiring to protect his country’s Christian heritage in the face of profuse accusations of “Islamophobia.”
There is no other religion that attacks critics and is as hostile to disbelievers as Islam, in keeping with Islamic blasphemy laws and 1,400 years of violent Islamic conquest.
“Record-breaking 360 million Christians persecuted in 2021,” by John Cody, Remix News, January 20, 2022:
In 2021, almost 6,000 Christians were killed due to their religion. The number increased by 24 percent compared to the previous year, when less than 5,000 cases were recorded. Eight out of ten Christians killed were from Nigeria.
The number of closed, attacked, or destroyed churches has also increased by more than 600 cases. According to the organization, the number of detained Christians for religious reasons increased by 44%.
Although Nigeria featured the most Christians killed, outright persecution is the worst in Afghanistan, where the main cause is the growth in persecution is due to the Taliban following their takeover after President Joe Biden’s chaotic withdrawal from the country. In addition, radical Islamists have access to documents revealing those who converted to Christianity. It is believed that many murders go unreported. The Taliban kill identified men on the spot, rape Christian women or force them to marry. North Korea, Somalia, Libya, Yemen, Eritrea, and Nigeria follow Afghanistan on a sliding scale.
Often overlooked by the news media, Christians are the most persecuted of any group in the world. In recent years, a record number of attacks on Christians has also been recorded in Europe.
Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orbán has become one of the few European leaders that have become vocal about the topic, with his government hosting an annual summit on the topic of Christian persecution.
“Hungarians make up 0.2 percent of the world’s population. Does it make sense for such a small nation to stand up and act? Our answer is yes. And your presence, attention, encouragement and the fact that you are here today convinces us of this, not to mention the history of Christianity. The twelve apostles certainly represented a smaller proportion of humanity at their time than Hungarians today, yet we are all here,” Orbán said in 2019……
Doomer says
When it says 360 MILLION Christians persecuted, it means exactly that. Discrimination, killings, expulsion SPECIFICALLY, openly, because they believe Jesus was the Messiah.
Leftists lie and say: no, it was for ETHNIC reasons, or natural resources, or social reasons , or climate change.
REDPILL:”Knowledge is Power”
In standard history books they say AKBAR the Great ( 1556 – 1605) ,of the Mughal dynasty, probably India’s greatest ruler, was a MUSLIM.
Yes, he was for a long time.
The good thing about AKBAR was that he ultimately left Islam, of that there is no doubt,it appears in Robert Spencer’s “The History of Jihad”(2018).
When I place an ASTERISK at the end of a sentence,it means that Spencer (in the book )
has placed a Number at the end of the sentence
( meaning you can look at the back of the book and see the SOURCE,scholar, from where he got his information).
a) On page 237: it says Akbar abolished the JIZYA ( infidel tax in India).( * )
b) On page 237: Akbar BANNED the mention of MOHAMED in PUBLIC PRAYERS ( * )
c) In 1582 Akbar OFFICIALLY proclaimed his own new religion (Din Ilahi, Divine Religion) ,which REJECTED Mohamed (* ) (page 237)
( I read elsewhere it ONLY had……19 members )
d)(page 237) Akbar FORBADE: eating beef, and naming children with the name Mohamed,
and the building of NEW mosques, and the REPAIR of old mosques,
and no one was to PROSTRATE EXCEPT to Akbar the emperor. ( * )
e) (page 238) According to his son JAHANGIR,next emperor, in the end,little by little,Akbar became a Muslim before dying (* )
f) (pages 238- 239): In his MEMOIRS Jahangir says he KILLED the man,an ex-Mulsim scholar, ABUL FAZZEL,
who convinced Akbar that Mohammed was a con-man, the Quran fabrications ( * )
Infidel says
Akbar did not leave islam. It’s true that he founded a new sect called ‘Deen i Elahi’, which had only 40 followers, of which 39 were muslim. But his court continued to follow islamic law, and when he died, he recited the kalama, which muslims who know that they’re about to die are required to
gravenimage says
+1
revereridesagain says
Hungarians understand invasion and conquest and ideologically-rooted tyranny, having learned it from the Soviets. By bitter experience is not the most positive way to learn the nature of a mortal danger, but it is surely the most enduring.
SKA says
Yes but also Hungary was conquered and ruled by the Ottomans so they had prior first hand knowledge of Islam’s oppression of Christians which in part explains their resistance to EU dictates that they admit the Muslim invaders in the guise of migrants.
somehistory says
++100
Infidel says
Except that Hungarians seem to be fans of the Ottomans, which is why Hungary is an ally of Turkey in most of Erdogan’s policies. In fact, Hungary is one of the few supporters Erdogan has within NATO, and Hungary also supported Azerbaijan against Armenia
somehistory says
because human governments are run by humans and all humans are imperfect, none will get it “right.”
There is a verse in Jeremiah which says that men can’t direct their own steps. If a man cannot walk straight, he cannot run a government and keep things straight.
I read a personal account of a man in South America, and in his country, he saw many bad things being done by the government. He decided that if he wanted to see better things, he would have to become involved; he ran and was elected.
He said that he tried his best to set things straight, but was thwarted at every turn by others who liked doing it all to their own benefit and the money profits they could have.
It’s the same everywhere.
bernie sanders is now saying that biden was getting things right until republicans got in the way and “obstructed.”
SKA says
That is all news to me. Strange and contradictory: excluding Muslim migrant but backing the “new” Türkiye!
Thank you for pointing that out.
ΣΑΒΒΑΤΟΓΕΝΝΗΜΕΝΟΣ says
in the not so far future the percecution of christians in the european countries will exceed every limit of the previous as muslims follow on to become the future majority of the european countries… the real percentage of muslims in european countries is neatly covered up by giving them nationality and counting them as original european citizens… in small countries with less population the muslims becoming a majority is already beyond turning point…
wherever the muslims become a majority they will exterminate christians just like they have done in muslim countries….
if not anywhere else, in france, christians are already being percecuted and terrorised in the manner of islamic countries already with attacks against christians soaring just because the french have in large number chosen anti islamist parties to vote for…. the terrorism in general was focused on france because it has the biggest military power in europe and resembles a threat to countries such as turkey that is behind worldwide terrorism…. there they even burned the majestic ultimate christian symbol that resembles catholisism in france, a symbol for all christians in france, the notre dame temple… a monument of christianity…. turkey has taken care that the other monumental temple of christianity for the orthodox has become a mosque, and many other archeological byzantine churches in turkey have also been turned into mosques… part of the terror…
percecution of christians will continue to rise and it will spread worldwide in the not so distant future since the globalist leaders of the west serve the same master with islam… the satan… and this is ofcourse where the interests coincide with islam….
somehistory says
I have no doubt that you are correct. Things are going to get worse. The Bible says it will get so bad, that everyone…every person…will be sure they are going to perish. And so many will.
born saturday says
it is a controversy though for a leader such as orban who has such good relations and support for turkey that is behind the most of the muslim migration in europe, to announce about the christian percecution… its almost as if the traditionally allied with hungary turkish had advised orban and hungary to follow an anti immigration policy to exclude them from the jihadist islamization….
hungary is a traditional supporter and ally of turkey in europe more than any other country of europe…
gravenimage says
It is apt to cite something that Hungary is doing right. This doesn’t mean that all of their policies are good.
Infidel says
This is absolutely true. One poster on Breitbart pointed out several Hungarian URLs that showed a general Hungarian hostility to the West, and affinity for Turkey. This is a general public opinion, not a unique policy of Orban. Not just that – Hungary is also one of the few active supporters of Beijing’s Belt/Road scam in Europe
I am one of those few genuinely unimpressed by that country
born saturday says
in fact, hungarians are fanatically pro turkish throughout their history as a free nation and orban only just recently met with erdogan on the most friendly and loving manner in turkey… just end of last year…. at a time when the sultan seemed more and more isolated… this country contradicts itself, not only by talking about percecution from islam but also by having a leading anti migration policy…
gravenimage says
Please see above.
somehistory says
Jesus Christ warned His disciples that they would be persecuted and that some would be murdered “on account of His Name.” Through those disciples, all other Christians have been warned of the persecution.
It’s good Mr. Orban has acknowledged this ongoing murdering and destruction of lives. That is a very good thing on his part.
The world turns a blind eye and for the simple reason that Jesus stated, “The world hates you as it has hated me.” He also said, “everyone putting faith in me will also be persecuted.”
Some of us get spit on, or have water hoses turned on us, or have dogs commanded to attack us, or even have guns drawn on us, while others face death and are slaughtered…for having faith in Christ.
The persecution and murders will continue until Christ returns and executes Justice.
john smith says
Somehistory, I am a bit baffled as to why our replies to a certain person were all taken down. Okay this persons posts seemed to indicate that he or she was extremely anti- Christian, and may well of been looking for a fight with one of us. Apart from that I’ve no idea, unless I missed something.
somehistory says
John,
I noticed last night that the comments had been deleted. Perhaps it was my fault. I was not meaning to have a *fight,* with him/her, but I did respond to many of the anti=Christian remarks made.
I noticed that at least one comment by that person was deleted from another thread, so perhaps something I didn’t see was posted and then it was all taken down.
john smith says
No it definitely wasn’t your fault Somehistory, I read all your posts and you responded in a most dignified manner.
I’ve noticed that muruna mural is back again. Yesterday he or she denied being a muslim and also didn’t mention a thing about muslims oppressing Christians. Yesterday it was only the evil Christians that were doing all the persecuting, even going so far as calling it a joke that Christians were being persecuted.
However today muruna mural is practicing a little bit more muruna, by stating, “India is a place where Hindus are being oppressed by both Christians and muslims.”
I didn’t think for a moment that he or she would admit to the fact that muslims were oppressors, but once again he or she is practicing muruna.
mural says
John,
I never denied that Christians are being oppressed by Muslims. Anyone who reads Jihad watch would know what is happening in Nigeria, Egypt and Pakistan.
What I was protesting was the fact that India was placed number nine in this list. And the numbers looked a bit fishy. I deny being a muslim because I am not one? Is that hard for you to comprehend?
somehistory says
Thank you very much, John. I greatly appreciate your feedback.
As I said, and it is true, as can be seen from my comments on threads about mozlums persecuting Hindus, that it hurts me to read of these things and that one day, those murdering, those luring and raping and killing, will face Divine Judgment, the same as those who rape, kidnap force*conversion* and murder Christians. A *victim* is a *victim,* whatever the belief; and a persecutor will face Judgment.
Anyone, and everyone, will have his heart examined by our Creator and if evil has been done, if evil is found, that person will face Judgment.
There are reports by others than this article that prove persecution of Christians is rampant in the entire world, and that Christians face more, and endure more, than any other group. That fact is well-documented.
john smith says
True Mural, you didn’t deny that Christians were being oppressed by muslims, on the other hand you didn’t admit that Christians were being oppressed by muslims either.
On the contrary, you called Christian persecution a joke.
After your posts yesterday I find it hard to believe that you’re not a muslim, and I’m sure you will have some difficulty trying convince Somehistory or Born Saturday of this.
For someone that claims that they are not anti-Christian, well I’m sorry, but your posts yesterday said otherwise.
gravenimage says
I doubt it had anything to do with you, Somehistory. If a post is deleted, any comments replying to it are also deleted.
mural says
I am not anti-christian. I am all for live and let live. What I am against is brainwashing and radicalising the converts. This happens frequently in India.
The unfortunate fact is that Hindus have gone out of their way to accomodate the minorities. The Missionaries are using this generosity and poisoning the minds of the converts against Hindusim. I can provide a lot of evidence, but Jihad watch might come down and delete my comments again.
It is surprising that they deleted my post criticising the Open Door’s potrayal of India as one of the places where Christians are being oppressed.
Well, India is also a place where Hindus are being oppressed by both Christians and Muslims. Maybe, Jihadwatch wants to hide this fact?
Infidel says
You’re pretty right. There is that horrible story from this week of a girl in Tamil Nadu who committed suicide after being tortured by her school for not converting to Christianity
https://www.opindia.com/2022/01/tamil-nadu-girl-ends-life-after-school-pressurised-her-to-convert-to-christianity
It’s a bizarre definition where if one is not allowed to convert another person to one’s own religion, it’s considered ‘oppression’. My respect for Christians has been waning – both due to the Pope’s/Archbishop of Canterbury’s/Patriarch of Moscow’s kowtowing to islam, and then in India, Christian missionaries engaging in this type of bullying behavior. As someone once put it, “Dear Lord Jesus, save me from your followers”
john smith says
Mural,They are not true Christians if they oppress someone, but they are true muslims if they oppress someone.
somehistory says
I read that article. It pointed out that the “poor girl” had “attended the Christian School for five years.”
As I wrote, Christians who run schools have the right to say who attends. If she didn’t wish to convert, why did she not leave that school for a different one run by Hindus?
The school should be able to say if a non-Christian attends or not. It is only “alleged” that the school “tortured” her. If…IF…anyone there did actually “torture” her, then that person is not truly Christian and will be Judged for their deception and evil. IF it did happen.
She may have considered it “torture” that they were saying she must convert in order to continue living at the school and attending classes. Since we can’t ask her, it is all “alleged.”
Infidel says
Somehistory
On this story, I do blame the parents as well: in front of them, the school asked the girl to convert. Had I been the parent, I’d have ended the conversation there and yanked her out of the school
But beyond that, I disagree: if the school doesn’t want non-Christians there, they should explicitly state it in their admissions policy, rather than admit non-Christians and later try and force them to become Christians
As for the evidence, the statement that they recorded was while she was dying. Usually, dying declarations are considered legitimate evidence, since the person who’s dying has no reason to lie, since s/he has nothing to gain or lose by lying. And she was a minor -12, so it’s no use asking her: it’s her parents who should be made to account for why they sent her there. I saw an interview w/ her mom last night, where she claimed that they had requested from the school transcripts so that they could transfer her, but that the school had denied them that. And like I said, I sympathize w/ that girl, but not her parents
John Smith
That is the famous ‘No True Scotsman’ argument. Particularly when it’s Missionaries – people who dedicate their work to Christianity – who do all sorts of things – from re-branding and projecting Jesus Christ as a Hindu saint rather than a Jewish preacher from Roman era Palestine to punishing kids for wearing sacred Hindu gear, like sacred wrist-threads, forehead ’tilaks’ and so on
It’s true that Christianity has been reformed over the centuries to become a lot more moderate than it was during, say, the Thirty Year War, but when Christians do things like this and that too in the name of Christianity, there is little in the scriptures that can be used to demonstrate that what they are doing is un-Christian.
somehistory says
Infidel,
The account said the girl was :”unconscious.’ Perhaps that is not the word that we who speak English as a first language mean when we use it.
The parents should have taken her home if she and they did not want her to become Christian.
Christians are commanded…no excuses…to “preach” and “make disciples.” We are not commanded to attempt a forcing, or bribing …a.k.a. “rice Christians”…other pressures. and when someone says “no,” we are to take them at their word and leave.
In your statement to John, you said there was nothing in the Scriptures to say “this or that” is unChristian.
I have to disagree with you on that. If a person reads the Bible, and actually wants to understand the Commands of Jesus Christ about what to do, what not to do and how, it is clear what is “unChristian.”
I have had disagreements with many, many people who claimed to be Christain and found that the many who found fault with what I said, didn’t truly understand Jesus’s Words.
About the cross some wear….esp those with a little figure: God said not to make an image to “worship.”
when the Jews built the Temple during King Solomon’s days, they made “images” of bulls and other things to put inside the Temple. But, they didn’t worship these images. So images of creatures are okay, just not the worship thereof.
No one “has seen God,”…our Grand Creator, so it would be impossible to make an accurate image of Him.
Even though Christians were not given the Law, are not under the Law, the principles of the Law to the Jews should be followed by Christians.
I believe that if a person wears a cross to identify themselves as Christian, that is their own choice and since I am not the Judge Who will decide all things, I generally don’t say a word about it.
Each person must make their own choices as to how to worship or not to worship at all. Because each one will be Judged on what he does, and not on what someone else does or tells him to do.
Infidel says
Somehistory
I get your point. About the crosses w/ graven images on them, I’m not talking about the ones people wear to identify themselves as Christian: I’m talking about churches that have crosses w/ those statues on them, which congregations face and pray towards, even if not to. And w/ some exceptions, few religions actually have their adherents worshiping the statues themselves: in most cases, the idols represent one deity or another, but are not the deities themselves
On the girl being unconscious, I guess that if she was in great agony while making her final statements so that it was barely intelligible, one can argue that she wasn’t in a clear mind, but it’s still hard to make the case that she was lying. Like I said, I do fault her parents, and my sympathies towards that girl do not extend to her parents
I get it that Christianity is a missionary religion and that Christians are to preach and make disciples. My point below was that there are a lot of people who have no problems w/ that, but do have a problem w/ being asked to abandon other deities that they worshiped. And in the case of India, in the other article that I linked, the source of friction arose when new converts were asked to desecrate the idols of Hindu deities that they worshiped. It would have been different if they had either been asked to turn them over to Hindus who didn’t convert, or just leave them alone but not worship them
I do agree w/ you that everyone has to be free to make their own choices. However, my point was that there is a world of difference b/w Christians here in the West and Christian missionaries working in non-Christian countries
somehistory says
Infidel,
I agree that it seems out of step with the commands to the Jews about *idols* and *images,* for churches to have statues, etc. where people stand and face them with reverence.
I was told by someone a long time ago that it helped them *focus* on their prayers.
I don’t participate in that, even though I know we are “not under Law,” except the Law of Love that Jesus preached.
I do understand about being told one must give up what they have always looked to for support and comfort in order to be “saved,” or “approved.”
One must really *wish* to give up what they had always relied upon in order for it to be any real benefit anyway. If one doesn’t see the need, even if there is a need, then it will not benefit that one.
You may have read the Bible; I’m not sure how much you have. But, if so, perhaps you recall Jesus asking the “rich young ruler” to give up everything and follow Him.
The young man had a lot of material things and did not wish to give them up. So, he went away and Jesus was grieved, but did not run after him and insist.
Our Creator will look at each one as an individual and make His Judgments.
Jesus said that, “Whoever stumbles one of these little ones, it would be better for him to have a millstone tied around his neck and be tossed into the sea”….and He wasn’t just referring to little children.
Christians need to be very careful that their zeal does not cause them to lose compassion and understanding. Sadly, not all are careful and Christianity suffers in the minds of others who see and are hurt or angered.
Hank says
Jesus never said that you should brainwash, torture and kill anyone who does not convert to Christianity. That’s Islam. People who say they are Christian, but do the opposite of what Jesus teaches are then something else. They are putting Jesus in a bad light or are fake.
He said to “shake the dust of your feet”. Today, he would have said “wash your hands of any further responsibilities and leave”. Christianity offers a personal (free choice) faith and lifestyle in Jesus if a person feels called to it – and that’s it. No coercion, oppression whatsoever.
You choose whatever Truth you are called to put your faith in to guide your life, and then find out what that choice of Truth lead to in the afterlife, if you even believe in an afterlife.
“If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet.” Matthew 10:14
somehistory says
Hank
You are absolutely correct.
Infidel says
john smith
If a post is taken down, all the child posts that come under that umbrella go down as well. That’s probably what happened
mural says
@ Infidel. that was the exact link that I had posted to show that the oppression is not a one way street as claimed.
I am not even mentioning the blatant hypocrocy of Crypto-christians unsurping jobs reserved for OBC’s , the reservation in Minority colleges, the cultural appropriation of Hindu customs and what not.
But all of this is OK. What is not ok is bringing a law against conversion via bribery.’
Infidel says
Mural
I regularly have duels in Breitbart on this. Posters there seem to think that it’s a right of Christians to convert anybody and everybody. Not to mention that ironically for a site whose founder was Jewish, there are plenty of anti-Semites there
born saturday says
and for murali
f*** your quran, f*** your ramadan, f*** your mohamed, f*** your alah, f*** the birthday of alah, f*** your hadiths and all your holy books and f*** your sharia and your jihad…
thats what we are all doing in here, get used to it, issue a death fatva and go and choke back to the s***thole country you came from…. choke there in the s***t while i read and write about your satanic religion…
mural says
Well. f** you too and your stupid religion.
Michael Casmer says
Inquision prisioners would have the hay in their cells changed every day. some people would blashpheme in order to be put in an Inquision cell.
gravenimage says
Record-breaking 360 million Christians persecuted in 2021, Hungarian prime minister one of few to speak out
……………….
Good for Orbán for speaking out. That there are so few others is shameful.
OLD GUY says
When you allow the enemy to infiltrate your country, you have lost the battle. The Islamic migration invasion is well on its way around the world. Muslims already hold political office in many countries including the U.S. This process will continue until they dominate the world with their radical dictatorship religion of power. The woke won’t think this is so great when they feel the whip on their back. We need to stop the migration of this evil now.
murali says
@ Infidel.
Posters there seem to think that it’s a right of Christians to convert anybody and everybody
Yes. I fail to see the difference between this group and Islam. Only the means differ. The ends are the same.
Why do Hindus not have problems with Jains or Buddhists or Sikhs or Shintos or Jews. Well, all these religions mind their own business and truly believe in ‘live and let live’.
Infidel says
Mural
I do see a difference, in that Hindus and other non-Christians can live pretty happily in Christian countries such as the US and practice their faith freely: I’ve lived here in the US since 1992 and only twice been asked by missionaries whether I was interested (when I said no, that was the end of the conversation). That’s true only for a few muslim countries, such as Oman and the Emirates
Also, show me Christians doing anything similar to ‘love jihad’ – pretending to be Hindus, eloping w/ Hindu girls (particularly minors) and later forcibly converting them. All the interfaith marriages I’ve read or heard about b/w Hindus and Christians have gone off happily, w/o either spouse trying to con or convert the other. Otoh, inter-faith marriages involving muslims usually have a sordid end
The real root of the problem in all these is the First Commandment: “I am the Lord thy God,
Thou shalt have no other gods before me, Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image”. No issues w/ the first part, the third part is a joke, given that many crosses include a statue of Christ pinned on to it, but the second part is the poison pill. There have been several schools of thought in India for adding Christ to the line-up of deities, but it’s the second part of the First commandment that kills any hopes for a deal
Given all that, I’m pretty impressed that the Jews exist so well w/ people of other faiths – not just Christains and muslims, but also Hindus, Buddhists, Daoists and others. It’s why I part ways w/ those who do a blanket condemnation of all ‘Abrahamics’
mural says
Infidel,
I made that point about there being no difference from the Indian context. Both want to increase the numbers. Only the means differ.
I agree. If the Christians over here are similar to what you experienced over there, then that would have been the best. Unfortunately, that is not the case. Also, the fact that you do not experience this over there does not mean people do not want to convert heathers in India. Cos most of the missionary funding in India comes from abroad. US could be one of the major donors.
I do want to highlight one fact: In many southern states, Church wants a written letter stating that the kids of folks who marry christians should follow christianity. This is very similar to what Islam is doing. So, when given an opportunity. the church can show its fangs. I have no idea how prevalent this is. But this practice is followed.
Agree when it comes to the Judaism. Its Non-missionary stance definitely helps. Yes. the first commandment will ensure there is no deal.
gravenimage says
mural wrote:
In many southern states, Church wants a written letter stating that the kids of folks who marry christians should follow christianity. This is very similar to what Islam is doing.
………………….
What church would this be? Besides, no Christian church runs the Indian government. Even if some church asked someone to sign such a letter, its contents could not be enforced, either in India or the US or any other place.
Really, mural’s only purpose here appears to be to distract from Muslim persecution of Christians. Muslims also persecute Hindus. Does he have a problem with this? Not so he says…
somehistory says
Yer. I was born, grew up, and lived in the South…been to a lot of churches…never seen or heard of any trying to make a person sign a letter that they have to raise kids in a certain way.
There are a lot of people who marry out of their faith and it is some times a problem if they have kids…questions about how the kids will be taught about God…which religion, etc. Christians naturally want the children to be raised to know Christ.
But, that is the business of the family. Christians don’t have “fangs.”
This article was about the persecution of Christians and this is happening to Christians more than any other group or religion. And mozlums are the main persecutors…there are others…but mozlums predominate as persecutors.
But, mural is focused on what Christians are **supposedly** doing to Hindus, comparing Christians wanting to help people find Christ, to what mozlums do…to everyone that disagrees..
Infidel says
I think Mural was talking about South India, not southern states in the US. It seems to be a more recent phenomenon
To be fair to Mural, he did acknowledge muslim excesses against both Christians and Hindus, but the point he was making in this story was that India was accused of persecuting Christians, and his point was that the persecution was certainly not one way. In fact, if Christians were being persecuted, the number of Christians in India would be going down. On the contrary, they have been increasing in big numbers in 4 states in India due to aggressive proselytization
gravenimage says
Could be, Infidel. But no Christian churches in India set policy there, either.
john smith says
Absolutely Gravenimage. mural’s only purpose here is to distract from muslm persecution of Christians.
For someone who claims they are not anti-Christian, then just take a look at what his response was to Born Saturday after making such a claim. It says, “Well. f… you too and your stupid religion”. This is not just an attack on Born Saturday it’s an attack on Christianity.
Murali says
@ John,
They are not true Christians if they oppress someone, but they are true muslims if they oppress someone.
Well, who is to decide if someone is a ‘true’ christian or not. Would the church be held guilty if they are doing the oppression. Am I to conclude that the clergy are not ‘True’ christians?
However, I agree with your latter point. That is very much in the teachings of Islam.
gravenimage says
Islam *teaches* oppression. Christianity does not.
mural says
Well., the fact that Christianity does not teach oppression does not mean some followers of Christianity are not oppressive?
gravenimage says
There are Christians who act counter to the teachings of their faith, just as there are Muslims who do so.
KMurray says
Oh yeah…so right. As one Christian pundit wrote: “There are some Christians who act as if they were baptized in lemon juice.”
I Pray to the Lord that I am not among them today. 😇
mural says
For someone who claims they are not anti-Christian, then just take a look at what his response was to Born Saturday after making such a claim. It says, “Well. f… you too and your stupid religion”. This is not just an attack on Born Saturday it’s an attack on Christianity.
John. Welcome to free speech. Born yesterday ranted and raved. I replied something that he could understand in his own language.
mural says
@ John,
Also, One can still think a religion is stupid and not be against those adherents following their beliefs (as long as they do not run rough shod over my beliefs).
I do think certain practices in Hinduism are stupid in their beliefs/tenets. Would that make me anti-Hindu?
gravenimage says
Actually, personal attacks on posters are frowned on here. It is in fact one of the few ways to get banned.
mural says
Graven Image wrote :
Even if some church asked someone to sign such a letter, its contents could not be enforced, either in India or the US or any other place.
I never said that this is legal and could be enforced, Did I? Missionaries target the poor and the uneducated not folks who have gone to UC Berkeley. If these folks were given a letter head from the church , they are more than likely to believe that this is official
###
Really, mural’s only purpose here appears to be to distract from Muslim persecution of Christians. Muslims also persecute Hindus. Does he have a problem with this? Not so he says…
You are generally well-informed and fair. However, you do not seem to have read the points I have made and have arrived at this weird conclusion. Where have I said that I do not have problem with Muslims persecuting Hindus/ Can you point this out?
I have a problem with Muslims persecuting Hindus, Christians persecuting Hindus and with Hindus persecuting Christians or Muslims just for the heck of it. I am against all persecution.
gravenimage says
mural wrote:
I never said that this is legal and could be enforced, Did I? Missionaries target the poor and the uneducated not folks who have gone to UC Berkeley.
…………..,.,
Really this is hilarious. I am a UC Berkeley graduate, and Christian preachers from many different denominations are enormously common here. There are also large numbers of churches, synagogues, and–yes–Hindu temples here. Also Buddhist temples.
The idea that only ignorant people are Christian is in fact entirely mistaken.
I’m glad to hear that your are against persecution–but considering peaceful preaching to be persecution is in fact mistaken. People should not have to be “protected” from hearing new ideas.
Again, though, more hijacking of this thread.
mural says
Graven Image wrote :
Even if some church asked someone to sign such a letter, its contents could not be enforced, either in India or the US or any other place.
I never said that this is legal and could be enforced, Did I? Missionaries target the poor and the uneducated not folks who have gone to UC Berkeley. If these folks were given a letter head from the church , they are more than likely to believe that this is official
###
Really, mural’s only purpose here appears to be to distract from Muslim persecution of Christians. Muslims also persecute Hindus. Does he have a problem with this? Not so he says…
You are generally well-informed and fair. However, you do not seem to have read the points I have made and have arrived at this weird conclusion. Where have I said that I do not have problem with Muslims persecuting Hindus/ Can you point this out?
I have a problem with Muslims persecuting Hindus, Christians persecuting Hindus and with Hindus persecuting Christians or Muslims .
gravenimage says
Now mural is just spamming the same post multiple times–good grief.
john smith says
Gravenimage, I didn’t respond to mural tonight because at the moment I have much more important things to deal with. I have nothing against mural on personal level and I actually believe in his heart he may well be a very nice person, but unfortunately a really uninformed one. My problem is with him is that he tries to compare Christianity with islam. He is under the illusion that Christians are as evil as muslims, that Christians persecute muslims, the same way that muslims persecute Christians. This is the lie that he has chosen to accept.
There is no doubt in my mind that mural is practicing muruna, but I really hope he continues to visit this site, and maybe one day he will understand that we have nothing against muslims, nothing whatsoever, and maybe one day he will realize just how truly evil islam is.
SKA says
John Smith: Forgive me but what precisely is “murana?”
john smith says
SKA
As you are probably know, lying cheating and deceiving play a major role in islam. Many people have heard of taqiyya, but there are another five forms of deception, each playing a specific part in fooling the infidel. They are taqiyya, kitman, tawriya, muruna, taysir, and darura.
Now muruna is what some call the chameleon deception, a muslim will try to blend in with us infidels by pretending they are one of us, but they will stab you in the back at the first opportunity. A classic example of muruna were the 9/ll highjackers.The night before they highjacked the planes they were drinking alcohol, they visited strip clubs they were pretending they were not muslims. They were practicing muruna. Anything goes as long as it furthers the way of islam.
I do I have explained it in away you can understand.
SKA says
Dear John Smith:
Thank you very much for your explanation! It seems Islam is so adept at various forms of deception that it has developed multiple names for deceptive practices mhch as the Inuit developed multiple names for different types of snow and ice!
john smith says
SKA
The next time I try to explain to someone just how important deception is in islam, I will remember this comparison with the inuit words for snow.
Thank you this excellent analogy.
SKA says
John Smith:
You are welcome!
SKA