“We should reserve punishments for them like the ones they have in Islamic states. We cannot spare the enemies of our religion and people who are hampering our freedom. They have become accustomed to free accommodation in prison, with free food and all the services for free.”
What else does Shermurov Togai want the way they have it in Islamic states?
“Uzbekistan: Imam Proposes Death Penalty for Radical Muslims,” Eurasianet.org, November 30, 2017 (thanks to The Religion of Peace):
A prominent imam in Uzbekistan has caused a stink by taking to social media to propose restoring the death penalty for supporters of the Islamic State militant group and the banned Islamist political party Hizb ut-Tahrir.
“We should reserve punishments for them like the ones they have in Islamic states,” Shermurov Togai, a well-known imam in Tashkent, said in a Facebook status update that has since been deleted. “We cannot spare the enemies of our religion and people who are hampering our freedom. They have become accustomed to free accommodation in prison, with free food and all the services for free.”
The tenor of the remarks reflects a marginally increased tolerance for outspoken views in Uzbekistan that has been ushered in under the rule of President Shavkay Mirziyoyev. Back in the days of the late president, Islam Karimov, religious figures like Togai typically avoided making public pronouncements of sensitive issues and spoke only to support the leader’s policies.
Togai said that he was motivated in his remarks by a desire to see peace and stability prevail in Uzbekistan.
“I remember the early 1990s, when the Soviet Union collapsed and racketeering and mafia began to flourish in Uzbekistan. In those days, Islam Karimov introduced capital punishment and these things disappeared, and criminality and stealing cars came to an end,” Togai told EurasiaNet.org. “Well, I thought if we brought in the death penalty for people who have gone astray and joined Hizb ut-Tahrir and the Islamic State, then maybe the number of people in those groups would stop growing.”
Togai said he was moved to delete his original Facebook posting because of the wave of critical comments posted under his remarks.
“They insulted me with swearwords,” he said. “Particularly internet users sympathizing with radical Islamists, most of whom live abroad.”…
TopDrifter says
Sounds good to me…
TopDrifter
Frank Anderson says
Glenn Campbell in True Grit: “Fewer horses; Fewer horse thieves.”
Angry.zionist says
Don’t get your “values” from
Hollyscam .. a cesspool
Of dhimmitude and cultural Marxism (demokkkraf culture).
Frank Anderson says
Angry, Hollywood 40 and 50 years ago was a lot different. To the extent it is not, using some of its good “one-liners” to poke in the eyes of the massively evil in charge today serves the cause of justice. John Wayne and, I am pretty sure, Glen Campbell (not sure whether 1 “n” or 2) were almost certainly true and dedicated patriots. The possibility exists that “fewer imams; fewer jihadis”. Would be interesting to find out.
Oliver says
My opinion of John Wayne.
He was a patriot in Movies
In WW2 he did not serve in the military, although numerous actors did
Same for Korea.
In the Nam war, none (I don’t know how many he had) sons served.
But in the movie, “The Green Berets”, he had some good “patriotic” lines.
My view, he was as phony as a 75 cent U.S. coin
Frank Anderson says
Oliver, you may know things I don’t. You may be entirely correct. But if a good line from a good and generally well-known movie is required to reflect anything other than a good way to attack, undermine and insult a bunch of unpatriotic liars, too much is being required of the line. I don’t care if Wayne or anyone else lived with any particular devotion or activity. I did not serve in Vietnam. My lungs were near worthless back then and still limit me now. My heart has never been anything to brag about. I signed for the draft, never claimed a 2S deferment, and sure did not run off to Canada to hide, as one of our former and very popular presidents did. I was here every minute, openly and available to be drafted. If the order had come, I would have appeared. It didn’t. I knew I could not begin to meet the physical requirements. But whether John Wayne was a patriot has nothing to do with the application of a line to illustrate a point.
There are 3 points of Judaism that teach: 1)Wisdom is its own authority, not depending on who speaks it, where it is spoken or how it is delivered. 2)Wisdom is all around us, in the Bible and elsewhere. The challenge is to hear the wisdom, distinguish it from the error and deception that always come with it when humans are involved, and put the wisdom to work in our lives. 3)Ask every question repeatedly because the complete answer never appears in this lifetime. Each time a question is asked the tarnish of error and deception is reduced, but not eliminated. Wisdom has nothing to fear from questions. We will know the complete truth when we face God. Whether the writers, director or actors had any particular motivation in mind when making the movie is irrelevant to the wisdom of the statement and its application to other facts.
Oliver says
I typed a long winded reply.
I hit post. What happened to it?
Oliver says
Mr
Anderson,
I typed a long winded reply to your post
Lost or not posted for some reason.
Abbreviated version
I like the line.
I liked some of the lines in the movie “The Green Berets”.
My comment was against consider John Wayne a leading patriot.
I know nothing about Glen Campbell’s political views.
My favorite, and I think best response for political views, of someone in the public eye, was Elvis Presley when he was discharged from the army. The short version
He was asked for his views on the Nam war. He replied, hebis an entertainer.
In my opimoon, singers, actors. athletes, talk show hosts (excluding political shows, like Limbaugh) should do the same.
My views
Frank Anderson says
We agree that entertainers should not be considered authorities. But I urge that wisdom can appear from surprising, totally unexpected sources, even as evil as Hitler, even as examples of what not to do. Focusing on sources instead of wisdom easily leads away from wisdom and deeply into error. Making connections between a nearly 50 year old movie line with a current story to illustrate the possible consequences is not an endorsement of any source to me. Peace be with you.
Oliver says
To Frank Anderson,
I typed a reply to your post about Rabbis and islam.
Like another reply to you, not printed
But to your point, Rabbis and Islam.
Jews lived in Muslim majority and controlled countries for hundreds of years
In the cases of Iraq, about 2, 500 years, and in Iran, over a thousand years at least
There was an acceptance of the Jews
Less anti-Semitism then in much of Christian Europe. And that has not abated.
In the November 29th issue of Honest Reporting ( section, “what I ‘m reading now”) is an article, a Russian Orthodox person (sorry, I didn’t take down bis title) and a Russian government official are claiming (note, official also opening inquiry) into tne 1918 assassinations of the last Czar and his family. Saying it was a Jewish ritual murder.
Russia, Poland and other Eastern European countries were awash with anti Semites. Many still are.
Poland had a “nationalist” rally, with numerous signs with such words of warmth ( sarcasm) as Jews get out. ( source, one of the following quite revently. Honest Reporting, or Jerusalem Post, or Israel Today, or JTA).
Although now, in the Muslim majority countries, few Jews remain
But Europe is headed same direction
Frank Anderson says
Oliver, I don’t know if you saw another note that I posted a few days ago. I did not know anything worth knowing about modern Judaism until 1993, when a Jewish friend invited me to a Saturday service. I was amazed at what I did not know and appreciated the greatness and volume of wisdom I learned. I have studied the history of WWI and II intensely since spending 12 years in military school. After my introduction to real, undistorted, modern Jewish teaching I have wondered why about half of Jews in Germany simply did not get the message that Hitler and the Nazis wanted them either out or dead. It seems to me history is repeating because of clear “violation” of Jorge Santayana’s statement, “Those who cannot remember. . .”
The same hard heads who stayed in or too close to Nazi Germany for the most part died. Now it appears, to my extreme disappointment and sadness, a new generation of hard heads refuse to even consider the institutional lying of islam, and take great insult at anyone who dares to raise the issue. I do not see where I have any reason to trouble with my presence a community that seems (in the majority) determined to destroy itself.
A friend and honored Rabbi of over 20 years could not get past the tolerable treatment of Jews hundreds of years ago to see what is intended for them now. This is one of those St Francis issues, “To accept the things I cannot change,” and move on. Yes, I have Jewish friends, Mormon friends. Baptist friends, Catholic friends, Presbyterian friends, Episcopal friends. . . I try to learn every chance I get because that is my only hope of improving the present. I have seen enough to conclude that God is here, and hope that we are all his Children.
Oliver says
I replied to this and it also disappeared
Will try again tomorrow
Frank Anderson says
Oliver, I sincerely hope that we are far more in agreement than disagreement. Many of the Jewish friends I had over 20 years ago have died. I would do nothing to dishonor their memory or the great friendship they extended to me. My life is far better for knowing them and learning from them. Peace in the most expansive and comprehensive meaning imaginable be with you always.
Oliver says
Mr
Anderson,
We basically are PN THE SAME PAGE.
I am, and have been since 12 or so a political conservative
I don’t agree with all conservative view points, and can even find good in Bill Clinton
Not Hillary, however.
gravenimage says
Oliver, I’m afraid that your idea that Jews were accepted in Dar-al-Islam is quite mistaken. Few Muslim countries have any surviving Jews today.
Frank Anderson says
GI, the idea of acceptance of Jews in Islamic controlled countries hundreds of years ago is not and never has been mine. Such “tolerance” is contrary to the teachings of islam and is totally irrelevant to current events. It comes from an honored friend and Rabbi, who served the same congregation for about 25 years, a near record. He refused to consider any question of his view that he obtained in Rabbinical school of the “religion of peace” from a muslim professor. This refusal contradicts the Jewish teaching, illustrated at Page 711, Doubter’s Meditation, in the Gates of Prayer as used in congregations in the early and middle 1990’s. “Cherish your doubts; for doubt is the handmaiden of truth. It is the acid which eat away at the false. Let no one fear for the truth, for each time it is tested it will come through clearer, brighter and sharper. . .” Try as I would to discuss the question, I got nowhere, and concluded that I should not trouble his closed mind. I attempted to discuss the issue with 2 other Rabbi’s locally and received the same general response. “There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.” I am sure you have read several times how this failure of discussion has saddened me.
Oliver says
To Graven,
I was unclear. Jews lived in Muslim majority countries in relative harmony UNTIL MAY 1948, when the State Of Israel was established
Then Most (I think Morocco is the only or one of the few) expelled the Jews
A few weeks ago, a leading Israeli politician (I think the Ambassador to the Useless Nations, but not sure) delivered a great speech, “Where Are The Jews “. He used statistics on the Arab Muslim nations of the number of Jews before Israel came into being, and now
This was in response to the Palestinian garbage
Almost all good will ended in 1948
gravenimage says
Oliver wrote:
To Graven,
I was unclear. Jews lived in Muslim majority countries in relative harmony UNTIL MAY 1948, when the State Of Israel was established
Then Most (I think Morocco is the only or one of the few) expelled the Jews
A few weeks ago, a leading Israeli politician (I think the Ambassador to the Useless Nations, but not sure) delivered a great speech, “Where Are The Jews “. He used statistics on the Arab Muslim nations of the number of Jews before Israel came into being, and now
This was in response to the Palestinian garbage
Almost all good will ended in 1948
……………………….
Oliver, I’m afraid your idea that the Muslim world was overflowing with good will towards Jews before those “filthy Infidels” dared to found the state of Israel is *much mistaken*.
I think you were trying to say that Morocco did not expel Jews, and this is technically true. But after the founding of Israel, there were riots and massacres of Jews and 18,000 Jews fled to Israel. There are no more than a couple of thousand Jews surviving in Morocco today.
And what about before this? There was a massacre of Jews in Morocco in 1912. There was a huge massacre in Iraq in the 1940s know as the Farhud.
Brave teen-ageed Jewish girl Sol Hachuel was beheaded in Tangiers in the early 19th century for refusing to convert to Islam.
In the Middle Ages, Jewish scholar Maimonides wrote about the terrible persecution of Jews by Muslims.
I could go on citing *tens of thousands* of cases of oppression and slaughter of Jews by Muslims, dating all the way back to the days of the “Prophet”.
If you want more information, check out Andrew Bostom’s fine and horrifying book, “The Legacy of Islamic Antisemitism”:
https://www.amazon.com/Legacy-Islamic-Antisemitism-Sacred-History/dp/1591025540
Frank Anderson says
GI, thank you for your note. Please permit me to add that the Nazis encouraged Jews to emigrate to “Palestine” at the same time they were dealing, through none other than Adolf Eichmann, with the “Palestinians”. The British appointed and designated “Grand Mufti of Jerusalem” openly collaborated with Hitler and wanted to bring mass murder to kill as many Jews as possible-all this before 1948. On History, National Geographic or AHC, there runs from time to time a series called Hitler’s Conspirators. Episode 9 addresses the Grand Mufti and his efforts. Best wishes to you always.
George says
Too funny! Muslims executing Muslims just for practicing their faith as Mohammed the prophet did. I can see internecine warfare as Wahhabis flock to Uzbekistan to aid their brothers. The same thing will happen all over the world, as activist orthodox Islam moves to the Islamic states that aren’t sufficiently enamored with international jihad.
mortimer says
Sounds like Shermurov Togai wants to reform Islam by using Islam to execute traditional Muslims.
How do you think that will play out if the traditional (jihadist) Muslims take over and use those rules against Shermurov Togai???
Santa Voorhees says
They kill each other, yet we expect them to integrate into western society…..
That aside, I think the imam is right. If we don’t execute radical imams, radical imams will execute us. That’s how it works sadly.
gravenimage says
Uzbekistan: “Moderate” imam calls for executing “radical” imams
……………………
What could be more “moderate” than that?
God, I hate Islam.
duh swami says
Takfir anyone? how is the ‘moderate’ going to explain his moderation to Allah when the time comes?
LeftisruiningCanada says
Within the islamic culture, speaking death to ones opponents is normal.
Within an ex-soviet dictatorship, speaking death to ones opponents is normal.
The one thing that Uzbekistan, and numerous other police state countries, have done fairly well is keep a lid on their deranged brethren. They’ve done pretty well at keeping the crazies out, by being perhaps as crazy in their own way. Do we like police state abuses? No. But do we not also have to admit that the raging islamic hordes seem to be uncontrollable in any other way?
I think we do.
It’s the same when we read about how the Chinese (or Myanmar) are trying to suppress their islamic problems in Xinjiang (and elsewhere). Few of us probably agree with the heavy handed power of the State being used, since we mostly value actual Freedom, nor agree with the reasons that motivate the Chinese to act as they do.
And yet, it is hard to blame them. Probably they are too harsh. Perhaps we have been too soft.
And i’m a Christian Libertarian, before anyone thinks i’m a fan of State power over the individual.
Voytek Gagalka says
If “moderate” imam is so “un-moderate,” can you imagine what non-moderate imam would call for? Actually, we don’t have to imagine that at all: it is current reality in the world at large where non-moderate imams, we are taught by “experts” on Islam from Pope Francis to Frau Merkel, “hijacked peaceful religion of Islam.”
Max Publius says
Sounds like a reasonable demand. Generally, imams are the scum that drives the engine of Islamoevil, but just as it was some “moderate nazis” who attempted to assassinate Hitler, sometimes insiders get some sense and have the capacity to take necessary action.
Lord-Lestat says
May be a bit off topic but also very interesting.. Leftist German printing company refuses a job of a member of the German AFD political party.
Typical racism and fascism!
https://www.facebook.com/Druckdiscount24/posts/1746999615345094
gravenimage says
Disgusting.
Rob says
Question: when does a friendly moderate Muslim become an Islamic terrorist?
Answer: when he takes all of the Koran and the way of Mohammed seriously.
https://www.facebook.com/robert.callow2?fref=ts
peter says
Since there can only be evil men who could be Imams regardless of whatever color they come in their demise can only be good to the rest of the world!