What is the source of dhimmitude — which in many ways paralyzes responses to Islam — in the West?
First a definition: “dhimmitude,” which was coined by the late Christian president of Lebanon, Bashir Gemayel, and popularized by writer Bat Ye’or, is a neologism based on the Arabic word, dhimmi — that is, a non-Muslim (generally a Christian or Jew) who falls under Islamic rule and, as a price for maintaining his religion, accepts an inferior social standing. Simply put, the dhimmi must know his or her place and never rock the boat, including by seeking equal rights with Muslims.
While this is the classic and original manifestation of dhimmitude, a new and unprecedented form has arisen in the West: in the Muslim world, where might naturally makes right, Muslim majorities impose an inferior status onto non-Muslim minorities; but in the West, it is the West itself — or at least homegrown elements — that in certain fields impose an inferior status on a non-Muslim majority.
The question becomes, Why? Why would a stronger civilization impose the unjust and supremacist stipulations of a weaker, hostile civilization, onto itself, and thereby paralyze itself against that same hostile civilization?
The answer is evident in the words of an ancient strategy: “The enemy of my enemy is my friend.” The Western elements that are forever protecting and empowering Islam, and which operate under various names — “Liberals,” “Leftists,” “Marxists,” “Progressives,” “Social Justice Warriors,” etc. — ultimately care little about Islam; rather, Islam is for them a tool to combat their real and much closer enemy: Christianity, and the mores and civilization borne of it and culminating in the West.
This is evident everywhere and in a myriad of forms. Most recently, the British government “refused to say whether telling people about the Christian faith could be a hate crime.” Lord Pearson of Rannoch, a UKIP peer, asked the House of Lords if they would “confirm unequivocally that a Christian who says that Jesus is the only son of the one true God cannot be arrested for hate crime or any other offence, however much it may offend a Muslim or anyone of any other religion?” Government spokesperson Baroness Vere of Norbiton responded by equivocating, saying that the legal definition of “hate crime” has been the same for the past 10 years.
But as Pearson explained in a later interview, the current definition of “hate crime” is subjective and revolves around whether the “victim” feels offended — thus leaving the door wide open to charging those who proclaim Christ and the Trinity of committing a hate crime, especially vis-à-vis Muslims, who adamantly object to the claim, as Pearson himself acknowledged: “Certainly the stricter Muslims do feel offended by Christianity and our belief in Jesus being the only Son of the one true God.”
Pearson also pointed to a double standard in how “hate crimes” are applied: “You can say what you like about the Virgin Birth, the miracles and the Resurrection of Jesus Christ, but as soon as you say ‘come on, is Islam really the religion of peace that it claims to be,’ all hell breaks loose.”
Indeed, and there is a reason for that: unlike Islam — which many Western elite feel no (direct) connection to and thus no threat therefrom — Christianity is the faith of their forefathers; it is ever present in their societies, judging them — and they hate it for it. But rather than seek to suppress it openly, they operate indirectly, including by propping up always angry and easily “offended” Muslims against it, while they play the role of “impartial” secularist or progressive — people who will make themselves (meaning others, notably Christians) walk on eggshells lest the “feelings” of the “other” are hurt.
From here one understands why liberals and progressives who forever whine against any vestige of traditional (“oppressive”) Christianity habitually make common cause with Islam — despite the latter’s truly oppressive qualities. Feminists denounce the Christian “patriarchy” — but say little against the Muslim treatment of women as chattel; homosexuals denounce Christian bakeries — but say little against the Muslim execution of homosexuals; multiculturalists denounce Christians who refuse to suppress their faith, including by banning Christmas phrases and images, to accommodate the religious sensibilities of Muslim minorities — but say little against the entrenched and open Muslim persecution of Christians.
From here one understands the ultimate reason why domineering Western elements are imposing the unjust and stifling effects of dhimmitude on and thus making the West weak and vulnerable: “The enemy [Islam] of my enemy [Christianity] is my friend.” As this most recent example from the UK shows, Muslims are now even being used to make the central claim of Christianity — which the progressive elite especially despise hearing as it convicts their godless lifestyle — a “hate crime.”
Pete says
So true..But it is still not the entire picture.
Here’s the U.Ns resolution 16/18. I think it should be requires reading..
Actually..I think a lot of things the U.N does should be required reading.
http://www2.ohchr.org/english/bodies/hrcouncil/docs/16session/A.HRC.RES.16.18_en.pdf
Here are some questions we all should ask:
1. Why import unskilled labour?
In general it makes absolute no sense that a country willingly would import people without any useful skills. The only reason should be to protect people from true percecution. Each country has lots of unskilled workers and these workers must now compete with unskilled workers from other countries – in their own country. This can’t – in any way – create harmony, especially when there are a vast differences in culture and upbringing. How can one reconsile two opposite worldviews?
One which were taught that you have the freedom to speak your mind and choose you own destiny, with one that promotes a totalitarian ideology, which will guide you from birth to death?
The two can’t and will never be compatible, so the only option is to force it down the throaths of the most docile group of people….
There is yet another aspect. Voters…Several studies shows that emigrants have a tendency to vote for candiates, that support emigration and a strong social security package – this strengthens the possibiblity for (re)-election.
I’m not living in the U.S., but whats happening there is something thats been going on for years in Europe. It’s a constant battle uphill and the freedom of speech is constantly under attack from liberal twats and the never ending feminist movement…
Germany will now begin to import 220.000 emigrants every year and it is definately not to enrich the country. They will do this inspite a growing resistance from the population. The end result is that Merkel and her party will continue to govern.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/765919/Angela-Merkel-Germany-European-Migrant-Crisis-12-million
Before the import of a’hmm exotic people started in the UK – a person such as Sadiq Khan wouldn’t even have been considered for mayor.
Sweden, with PM Lõfven at point will continue to import – again – exotic unskilled people to strenghten the chance for re-election. This is the libt@arts policy to stay or regain power in all western countries – everthing wrapped nicely inside a cosy package called: Democracy, equality, diversity, mutual respect and co-operation.
Swedes are now encuraged to learn arabic due the ever growing arabic culture..Not that I would mind learning arabic, simply just to know, what they’re saying. You’ll get a reasonably good understanding with even a limited vocabulary.
http://www.friatider.se/alltfler-svenskar-b-rjar-prata-arabiska.
Nov 22nd 2016, there was this article in The Journal (Ireland):
http://www.thejournal.ie/readme/should-young-people-and-or-emigrants-have-right-to-vote-3089571-Nov2016
Best regards from Denmark.
b.a. freeman says
… i especially like the very last line on the last page: “[Adopted without a vote].” how apropos for muslims in the OIC and the crooks in the UN, both of which organizations are filled with liars, thieves, and murderers.
Freedom says
Precisely
And Point 5 is just as laughable as Yasser Arafat receiving the Nobel Peace prize.
Not the actual content but the sincerity of it’s deliverer.
D'Arcy McGreer says
Amen!!!
Paul N Silas says
Pure truth, Come quickly Lord.
christianblood says
(..The question becomes, Why? Why would a stronger civilization impose the unjust and supremacist stipulations of a weaker, hostile civilization, onto itself, and thereby paralyze itself against that same hostile civilization?
The answer is evident in the words of an ancient strategy: “The enemy of my enemy is my friend.” The Western elements that are forever protecting and empowering Islam, and which operate under various names — “Liberals,” “Leftists,” “Marxists,” “Progressives,” “Social Justice Warriors,” etc. — ultimately care little about Islam; rather, Islam is for them a tool to combat their real and much closer enemy: Christianity, and the mores and civilization borne of it and culminating in the West..)
Liberalism and Islamism are the two sides of the same satanic coin. The two legs of the Anti-Christ! Hollywoodized Liberalism and ISISed Islamism are the two ends of One Satanic Spectrum!
Indiana Tom says
Liberalism and Islamism are the two sides of the same satanic coin. The two legs of the Anti-Christ! Hollywoodized Liberalism and ISISed Islamism are the two ends of One Satanic Spectrum!
Play both ends against the middle.
To manipulate two opposing sides of an argument, conflict, competition, etc., against one another for one’s own benefit or advantage.
christianblood says
Indiana Tom
From Good Point, Tom! As soon as people understand this, it easy to defeat them but so far, understanding is lacking in great deal.
Hosea 4:6
J D S says
God is shedding tears.
D'Arcy McGreer says
Amen!!!
john spielman says
Yup!
mortimer says
Protestants are the prime target of the Left, because the RCC is partly compromised by liberation theology and other neo-Marxist nonsense. As well, many (by no means all) in the RCC are in the thrall of the DHIMMI THEOLOGY of the absurd ‘Abrahamic religion’ fallacy which in effect subjugates both Jewish and Christian theologies to Islam.
Jihadi Justin Trudeau told a leading Canadian pastor that evangelical people are the worst part of Canadian society. One of his acolytes, Bernie Farber recently expressed his hatred of “Bible-thumping ultra conservative evangelicals”. This is a Jewish leader? He is a dhimmi.
Likely, Jihadi Justin is an apostate from Christianity. Justin the Apostate.
D'Arcy McGreer says
Thanks for the info. Did not know.
christianblood says
mortimer posted
(..Protestants are the prime target of the Left, because the RCC is partly compromised by liberation theology and other neo-Marxist nonsense. As well, many (by no means all) in the RCC are in the thrall of the DHIMMI THEOLOGY of the absurd ‘Abrahamic religion’ fallacy which in effect subjugates both Jewish and Christian theologies to Islam.
Jihadi Justin Trudeau told a leading Canadian pastor that evangelical people are the worst part of Canadian society. One of his acolytes, Bernie Farber recently expressed his hatred of “Bible-thumping ultra conservative evangelicals”. This is a Jewish leader? He is a dhimmi. Likely, Jihadi Justin is an apostate from Christianity. Justin the Apostate..)
Very true and very excellently put and very well-said, Mortimer!
gravenimage says
Wait–I thought that Chistianblood was fine with Evangelical Christians being persecuted in Russia? He’s said that they should be prevented from preaching and jailed if they do not comply.
christianblood says
gravenimage
I never said such a thing.
I have great respect for the Evangelical Christians, for Baptists and Pentecostals. Their only problem is that they are ‘first generation’ faiths! If you know what I mean by that but I do admire their conservatism and their Biblical stand. Sadly some (Evangelicals) are liberalizing these days.
Lydia Church says
That is the only kind there is. God has children, but He has no grandchildren.
I don’t know what was said, but I know what Jesus said, we are to preach to every creature and share the gospel with them, and that is what we should do, we should not comply with any contradictory laws, whether they want to punish us for that or not. See Matthew 28. We need a conservative and Biblical stand if we are to profess to be Christians. The liberalizing in the sense of falling away is predicted in the Bible for the end times,which we see going on all around us.
revereridesagain says
Why is believing supernaturalist nonsense becoming a requirement for being an effective fighter against the supernaturalist nonsense of Islam? I participate in an email group of 20 people, ALL atheists, all philosophically committed to actively opposing Islam. We are not liberals or leftists. Some have suffered threats and personal trials such as eviction for their activism. How many of you can find 20 people in your Unitarian, Presbyterian, Congregationalist, or Episcopalian church who exhibit similar dedication to bucking the “interfaith dialogue” scams of the Muslim Brotherhood front groups?
Freedom says
You ask ……..
Why is believing supernaturalist nonsense becoming a requirement for being an effective fighter against the supernaturalist nonsense of Islam?
Though I consider the turn of phrase you use …” supernaturalist nonsense ” as an intentional ( and unnecessary) insult to Christians, it nonetheless deserves an answer.
One big part of the answer lies in a factor that both Christianity and Islam have in common ……….. bigotry !
In a far broader sense it’s a common factor in any person that has an idea and an ego.
While Christianity no longer tortures or puts people to death for not believing in THEIR God as Islam still does, Christianity still looks down on non-believers in the same manner as Islam does (albeit not to the same extreme ). Christianity just happens to be located on the less violent end of the bigotry spectrum. Though it may not be to the same extent as Islam, it none the less considers non-believers far beneath them.
You may be the enemy of their enemy BUT you will NEVER be their friend in the manner as their fellow co-religionist will be. Just as they will never be your friends as your co-atheist will be.
But that’s the beauty of the growing resistance (though painfully slow) against the Global jihad. The recognition of a threat so dire, that distinct groups of people that are bigoted (even if only slightly) toward each other band together to oppose such a threat for the greater good of mankind.
Indiana Tom says
While Christianity no longer tortures or puts people to death for not believing in THEIR God as Islam still does,
The New Testament does not endorse torture or put people to death for not believing in THEIR God.
Islam does endorse torture or put people to death for not believing in THEIR God.
christianblood says
Indiana Tom
islam cannot compared to Christianity or to any other religion but atheists and feminists don’t acknowledge that. Their hate for Christianity has blinded their judgment.
Lydia Church says
No true Christian ever tortured anyone for not believing in Christianity.
The Bible does not sanction that.
Some fools may choose to do it, and they may claim to be Christians at the same time, but that does not mean they are. In fact, it means that they are not.
To be a Christian you need to also follow the ways of Jesus, or you don’t qualify.
Jesus said to love your enemies. He said that the world will know we are His disciples by our LOVE for one another. He said that if we love HIM, we will keep His commandments. (And no, that is not legalism. That is what the Lord Jesus Himself said!)
Bottom line: If you are torturing others for not believing Christianity, you are NOT a Christian, I don’t care what you or anyone else says. That is NOT the way of the Lord. Punishments for various things do come at various times but WE are not in the position to dole them out. We are called to judge, but not condemn and punish in that way, and of course I don’t refer to criminal punishments by the law, which don’t deal with religion anyway.
Carolyne says
As an Atheist, I can assure you I do not hate Christianity. Not believing in a supernatural being does not mean that we hate those who do. That is nonsense.
You may believe what you will, but the thing upon which I insist is that you not try to force it on me. That’s all. That’s the sum total.
Lydia Church says
No, you are the bigot.
There is a chasm between the saints and the sinners.
We are not supposed to be ‘arrogant’ about it of course, Jesus saved us, we did not save ourselves.
Freedom says
Far be it that a proselytizing zealot would recognize bias or bigotry in themselves.
Their very nature precludes them from doing so.
gravenimage says
revereridesagain wrote:
Why is believing supernaturalist nonsense becoming a requirement for being an effective fighter against the supernaturalist nonsense of Islam?
…………………………
revererideesagain, no one says you have to be religious to fight against Jihad–why do you think that Raymond Ibrahim is saying that? He is not.
He is saying that it is a problem that professing Christ is treated as a virtual “hate crime”. Surely that is an issue whether one is Christian or not?
Islam also violently targets Atheists and Agnostics. That is an issue for all Anti-Jihadists, whether they are Agnostic or Atheist or not.
Robert Spencer–a devout Christian–regularly reports on Muslims targeting Atheists. Hugh Fitzgerald–an Atheist–regularly reports on people of faith being targeted.
The fact is that Islam hates and oppresses *all* non-Muslims. Sneering at your fellow Anti-Jihadists makes no sense.
christianblood says
Jay Boo posted
(..All Atheists are not committed to actively opposing Islam as revereridesagain would have us believe just as all Christians don’t. In fact a simple internet search shows that most Atheist websites are narcissistic expressions lashing out at Christianity while leaving Islam untouched..)
Very well-said, Jay Boo!
Lydia Church says
It’s the non supernaturalist stuff that is nonsense.
StellaSaidSo says
Most atheists never go to ‘atheist web-sites’. they are too busy getting on with their lives. Those who do are a self-selected minority, most of whom do not represent anyone but themselves.
StellaSaidSo says
I would have phrased the question less provocatively, revereridesagain, but it is nevertheless a fair question. To represent the current contest with Islam as primarily a contest between Islam and Christianity is to overlook the vast numbers of people who, while professing no faith, are equally opposed to Islam’s predatory agenda. ALL people of the beleaguered ‘dar al-Harb’ have a stake in this. Atheism is not a threat to the success of the counter-jihad. But the dhimmi attitudes of some Christians surely are.
Carolyne says
Read “Jay Boo’s” post once again and tell me it is not hateful against non-Christians. Very unchristian, in fact. I think some of you would feed me to the lions if any were available.
D'Arcy McGreer says
I have always been a Christian of the Protestant variety. I have to agree with you the Church (Protestant) is by a large silent as they are so very silent on many issues except abuse by pastors. But, I have not heard atheists except prominent one like Christopher Hitchens speak against the Muslim faith.
StellaSaidSo says
I have been involved with the counter-jihad movement over a period of years and on two continents. Most of my colleagues are atheists, several are ex-Muslims, others are Christians. What we have in common is our commitment to saving our children’s future from the predations of Islam. No religious belief is necessary in order to be effective in such a fight. Christians who think that all atheists are leftists need to disabuse themselves of this ludicrous notion immediately, and stop bagging people who stand with them against the greatest threat our civilisation has ever faced. It is not atheists who are compromising our cause by engaging in Muslim Brotherhood-sponsored ‘Interfaith Dialogue’ talk-fests with so-called ‘Brothers in Abraham’, or accepting large sums of money to ‘facilitate’ ‘re-settlement’ of ‘refugees’, or removing crosses and pews from churches so as not to ‘offend’ Muslims. Think how much more effective we could be if there weren’t so many Christians singing from the enemy’s hymnbook.
gravenimage says
True, Stella.
There are dhimmis among Christians, Jews, and Atheists.
There are also brave Anti-Jihadists among all these groups. Let’s stick together.
Mark Swan says
Absolutely gravenimage and StellaSaidSo—Islam has its enablers amongst all the above,
and contempt for all the above.
christianblood says
StellaSaidSo
It is my observation that most atheists and agnostics are leftists who are eager to criticize and discredit Christianity while considering islamist as victims.
StellaSaidSo says
You have assumed that most atheists are like the few atheists that you have encountered, who also happen to be leftists. While it is certainly true that many leftists are atheists, it should not be assumed that all (or even most) atheists are leftists. The vast majority of atheists are ordinary people who simply don’t believe in god/s, but have no issue with those who do. And, on the basis of my experience, I am willing to bet that most atheists would willingly stand alongside Christians in any battle against the vile ideology of Islam. In fact, many atheists are very active in the counter-jihad movement, and some – especially those who are ex-Muslims – risk their lives to speak out. I suggest that you pay more attention to what atheists like Ayaan Hirsi Ali and Douglas Murray have to say, and less on what you are hearing from the loony left.
StellaSaidSo says
Furthermore, christianblood, there are many Christians who consider Muslims as ‘victims’, including the Pope.
Lydia Church says
The pope is not a Christian.
There is a thing called ‘wolves in sheep’s clothing’ in the Bible, Jesus warned about it.
I am glad there are others on here fighting jihad, atheists or not. Again, we can unite in other ways and cooperate for a common cause of course but just want to distinguish that Christians cannot spiritually unite with those from other faiths because that is against our faith; endorsing what is contrary to Christianity, like an interfaith prayer and that sort of thing.
I am glad you are here and you seem very nice.
I must confess that most atheists I have met do come across as angry and hostile to Christianity, I never met the sort you speak of, not that I doubt they exist, it just must be pretty rare.
: D
christianblood says
StellaSaidSo says
(..Furthermore, christianblood, there are many Christians who consider Muslims as ‘victims’, including the Pope..)
You are right. They are drunk with Hollywoodized Liberalism!
gravenimage says
Not all Atheists or Agnostics are anti-Christian–this is calumny. There are many here who stand with Christians against Jihad.
On another matter, I doubt very much that the pope was heavily influenced by Hollywood.
Lydia Church says
And the churches have sold out to the enemy also, it’s part of the plot in all of this. It is true Christians who are standing up against it and not doing all of this brown nosing.
I do agree, I don’t care if you are a Christian or not, I’m glad there are Atheists on here who are fighting against jihad, if you are against that kind of evil that is good, and I feel that these types are all welcomed on here openly. Only that one writer had made the assumption that you had to be religious to fight jihad, or that we on this site felt that way, but no one ever said that. But on top of that he goes and insults us by calling belief in the supernatural ‘nonsense.’ And then they wonder why the offense?!
Anyway there is evidence of the supernatural in many ways both good and bad and that is a long list. I will just mention demon possession as one example. The supernatural world is real, but that is another tangent I won’t get any deeper into on here.
PATRICIA FRANCES KOENIG says
The GLOBALISTS (Freemasons), who control the media, governments, and legal systems, are promoting Islam in order to weaken Christianity…and promote their One World Government.
gravenimage says
The idea that the Freemasons control everything is just silly. Moreover, many Freemasons are themselves Christian–certainly, most of the Founding Fathers were.
christianblood says
gravenimage posted
(..The idea that the Freemasons control everything is just silly. Moreover, many Freemasons are themselves Christian–certainly, most of the Founding Fathers were..)
You are right. Freemasons are fraternal (mystical) organization whose main purpose is, in their words, to make “good men even better” through mystical and universal moral and spiritual instructions.
gravenimage says
Thanks for the reply, Christianblood.
Lydia Church says
See reply below.
Lydia Church says
No, freemasons are not Christian because they believe in all religions. They are occult in nature. You can’t make men ‘better’ without the saving gospel.
christianblood says
Lydia Church
Many Freemasons are Christians who joined that fraternity to get higher practical mystical experiential teachings concerning morality and spirituality which they cannot (unfortunately) get in the church these days.
(..In fact, though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you the elementary truths of God’s word all over again. You need milk, not solid food! Anyone who lives on milk, being still an infant, is not acquainted with the teaching about righteousness. But solid food is for the mature, who by constant use have trained themselves to distinguish good from evil.Therefore let us move beyond the elementary teachings about Christ and be taken forward to maturity, (Hebrews 5:12-6:1).
Have a great day, Lydia Church!
Carolyne says
Sorry, Christianblood, but that milk nd food analogy is really silly. How about a child make mud pies and actually eat them but grown men don’t,makes as much sense. Fighting the evil Islam is not achieved by nonsensical ideas about milk and meat. It is only foughtand perhaps defeated by real persons bearing real arms and who understand the nature of the enemy
Billy Chickens says
Just last week after watching one of Jordan Peterson’s videos I read a few of the comments. One person commented that they were “disappointed” that Peterson was a Christian, their thought being that since Peterson is exceptionally brilliant he would naturally never be a Christian.
Actually the comment was a question – “Is anyone else disappointed that Peterson is a Christian?”
Lydia Church says
That’s because they are stupid.
Ibrahim itace muhammed says
Raymond Ibrahim, you are descending so Low telling lies. No western government Will consider christianity as offensive to muslims. what they are saying stop hate propagandas against muslims that Will lead to genocide on Muslims.
you are wrong about the concept of dhimmi. It is from the root “dhimma(burden or responsibility) “.Technically, in sharia, It is the responsibility of Islamic state to Protect non-muslim citizens from all forms of harm. The holy prophet muhammad said Allah Will be angry with any one Who oppresses dhimmis. only those who are wealthy among dhimmis pay jizya as consideration for such protection, while wealthy muslims pay zakkat .The poor among dhimmi are entitled to social security like poor muslims. so, what is the problem ?
MFritz says
Please do not feed the Soros-troll! This is a fake!
LeftisruiningCanada says
If Ibrahim were being paid to be a troll, he would post much more often, and keep conversations going much longer than he does.
I’m wondering why you don’t want people to reach out and interact with a muslim, since he may never get to hear any opposing ideas apart from on here.
CogitoErgoSum says
Ibrahim, is there a word for the money that Muslims give to poor Christians and Jews who are unable to find work and support their family? I’m thinking It would be the opposite of Jizya …. a sort of welfare (or social security) for those who live on the fringes of society. What’s the Muslim word for that? Is there such a word for such a thing? Do you have any examples of such a thing being practiced by Muslims through history …. like maybe in Turkey during the early 1900’s? …….. or maybe by ISIS while they were in control in Iraq? …. by Muslims in Pakistan ……. Nigeria ….. Saudi Arabi or anywhere in the world at any time? I’m sure Muslims must have coined a word for it just as they coined the words dhimmi and jizya. Can you tell me what that word is?
Peter says
It’s called
SFA
CogitoErgoSum says
SFA?
Ibrahim itace muhammed says
Cogitoergosum, take note that Islamic system of government is welfare oriented ,which includes provide social security from Baitul mal(public treasury). such instances of poviding social security to poor citizens Who include dhimmis can be found in siyar (stories)one of which caliph Umar ordered wages to be assigned to a poor jew Who reported to him the his business has grounded and became poor.This has been the case throughout periods of muslim rules in all parts of the world. can you cite any muslim empire or caliphate when such social security packages were denied to poor dhimmis ?
LeftisruiningCanada says
Don’t you want to talk about Helen Ellerbe anymore Ibrahim?
What about the Talmud?
Carolyne says
I believe that the barbaric purpose of sacrificing animals in the street is to provide the meat to the poor. Before someone jumps down my throat, let me say I find this practice abhorrent and I find Islam abhorrent.
gravenimage says
Actually, Carolyne, the savage bloodletting of Eid Ad Adha is primarily to provide meat for the “Eid of Sacrifice”.
If there is any left over, Muslims are supposed to donate the meat to poor Muslims–but it is not the purpose of the slaughter.
gravenimage says
The repulsive Ibrahim itace muhammed wrote:
Raymond Ibrahim, you are descending so Low telling lies. No western government Will consider christianity as offensive to muslims. what they are saying stop hate propagandas against muslims that Will lead to genocide on Muslims.
…………………………………
The idea that professing Christ is a “propagandas against muslims” that will lead to genocide of them is simply grotesque calumny.
And it is Ibrahim itace muhammed who has said previously that all Infidels who fail to submit to Islam deserve to be killed, and that he looks forward to taking part in the genocide of the Jews.
So this here his nothing but projection–certainly, nothing Raymond Ibrahim is saying.
More:
you are wrong about the concept of dhimmi. It is from the root “dhimma(burden or responsibility) “.Technically, in sharia, It is the responsibility of Islamic state to Protect non-muslim citizens from all forms of harm.
…………………………………
In other words, if dhimmis pay the Jizya, they *may* be protected from Muslims murdering them. The ultimate protection racket. *Ugh*.
More:
The holy prophet muhammad said Allah Will be angry with any one Who oppresses dhimmis.
…………………………………
Considering that dhimmis are second class citizens who must always defer to Muslims, that they cannot worship openly, that they cannot publicly preach, that they may be kidnapped and forcibly converted to Islam, and if there is so much as a rumor that any member of the community has breached the dhimma that they can be mass slaughtered, the idea that this is not oppression is pretty sick.
Here’s the Pact of Umar, which lays out the humiliations of dhimmitude:
https://sourcebooks.fordham.edu/source/pact-umar.asp
only those who are wealthy among dhimmis pay jizya as consideration for such protection, while wealthy muslims pay zakkat .The poor among dhimmi are entitled to social security like poor muslims. so, what is the problem ?
…………………………………
This last is, of course, an utter lie. It is better off dhimmis who must pay the Jizya for poorer members, as well as their maintenance. If any dhimmis fail to pay Jizya, the whole community can be attacked, robbed, and murdered.
Moreover, it is clear from Islamic texts that the Jizya was meant to be crushing and humiliating, so that dhimmis would despair and convert to Islam. The idea that it is no different from Zakat is a lie. Muslims are not told to pay their taxes with “willing submission”.
Quran 9:29: “Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.”
Lydia Church says
It is the muslims going after the Christians, not vice versa, and yes, that bit is a plot since there are no hate propagandas against muslims, and they are already doing these things criminalizing Christanity.
But we will evangelize anyway.
And to answer the question from yesterday to Andy, even if muslims did invade all of the West, what would we do then? We will never convert to islam, and we will keep living out our faith as Christians, and the rest will do whatever it is that they do, be it Crusades or what have you, that’s what. And that question was in fact an admission that a threat would be posed to all non muslims in that case. What if we turned that question around? What if we said Christianity will invade all muslim lands, and what will the muslims all do then? What does that imply?
Ibrahim itace muhammed says
Raymond Ibrahim, you are descending so Low telling lies. No western government Will consider christianity as offensive to muslims. what they are saying is stop hate propagandas against muslims that has the tendency of leading to genocide on Muslims.
you are wrong about the concept of dhimmi. It is from the root “dhimma(burden or responsibility) “.Technically, in sharia, It is the responsibility of Islamic state to Protect non-muslim citizens from all forms of harm. The holy prophet muhammad said Allah Will be angry with any one Who oppresses dhimmis. only those who are wealthy,not poor, among dhimmis pay jizya as consideration for such protection, while wealthy muslims pay zakkat .The poor among dhimmi are entitled to social security like poor muslims. so, what is the problem ?
The issue of oppressed second class non-muslim citizens never happened in muslim world unlike Christian colonisation where they considered the conquered like animals repatriating their resources to imperial Headquarters to enjoy leaving the conquered in complete deprivation. Has Raymond Ibrahim adverted his attention to the history of those cruel colonisations by Christian West ?
MFritz says
Please do not feed the Soros-troll! This is a fake!
CogitoErgoSum says
Oh, I enjoy Ibrahim’s contributions to the discussion. I’m sure he is a fine representative of the best and brightest Islam has to offer. Let’s give him a chance to prove it.
faraway says
I’ve noticed that “the best and brightest Islam has to offer” become apostates.That’s why the average IQ of muslims is constantly falling.
Of course centuries of inbreeding,the head-banging prayer ritual, the deadening indoctrination from birth and blasphemy laws which forbid any philosophical enquiry do not help much either.
gravenimage says
Ibrahim itace muhammed is not a fake, MFritz. Haven’t you seen his Facebook page?
https://www.facebook.com/people/Ibrahim-Itace-Muhammed/100008365110176
He is a Nigerian Muslim. I’m not sure why you don’t believe Muslims are like this. Everything he says is Islamic.
LeftisruiningCanada says
Agreed. And even if he is a fake or whatever, the interaction is good for everybody concerned.
Peter says
I must agree
Utter foolishness is an affliction best ignored
gravenimage says
Peter, I actually think Muslim apologists like Ibrahim itace muhammed offer an important glimpse into the diseased Muslim mindset. Jihad Watch’s Marc Louis agrees.
Mark Swan says
I agree gravenimage
Lydia Church says
True Christians help the poor.
The question is; do muslim countries help its poor Christian citizens with welfare?
Sharyati says
Does the pact of Umar say so Ibrahim?
common sense says
The political left is the most dangerous threat to all of western civilization.
https://youtu.be/kYmTFL9nbRQ
Mark Swan says
History records that America was founded on biblical principles and Judeo-Christian beliefs and moral values. So far no offer of a better way has shown itself as effective.
In the last 50 years, these biblical values have come under persistent attack in our increasingly secular culture. Secular views claim that “blessings” enjoyed by the West did not come from God, but are just a matter of “luck”—being in the right place at the right time. For many people in modern Western societies, God is simply not in the picture and His ways are no longer relevant.
Today, few people are “connecting the dots” between turning away from God and the declining influence and growing troubles in our modern Western nations. However, some have been sounding warnings.
More than 25 years ago, prominent theologian Carl Henry saw the connection between the rejection of Judeo-Christian moral values and rising rates of social problems. He noted that “American society is being penetrated as never before by alien religious influences that the West unhesitatingly once called pagan”—propelling us toward a “cultural Armageddon” (Twilight of a Great Civilization, pp. 174–175).
Nearly a decade later, Judge Robert Bork documented the dangerous direction of these same social trends in his book, Slouching Towards Gomorrah: Modern Liberalism and American Decline. Congress rejected Judge Bork’s nomination to the U.S. Supreme Court because the conservative values he espoused were out of step with the liberalizing, anti-Christian trend developing in America.
Similarly, researcher Jim Nelson Black noted in his book When Nations Die the parallel between trends in America and the visible symptoms of decline during the demise of Ancient Rome, Carthage and other historical empires: the rise of lawlessness, loss of economic discipline, weakening of cultural foundations, increasing materialism, decay of religious belief, rise of immorality and the devaluing of human life—all of which are happening today in the Western world.
About the same time, Harvard professor Samuel Huntington stated in his book The Clash of Civilizations that the age of Western dominance is “ending” and “the fading of the West” reflects “a civilization in decline” (pp. 81–91).
More recently, author and presidential advisor Patrick Buchanan has noted: “The America we grew up in is gone. The unity and common purpose we had when we could together pledge allegiance to a flag that stood for ‘one nation, under God, indivisible’ is gone… America is disintegrating… What once united us is dissolving. And this is true of Western civilization” (Suicide of a Superpower: Will America Survive to 2025?, pp. 6–7).
There is a saying we can not have our cake and eat it too—if we reject the values we were founded on,
then, we better find something else quick that can guide us.
gravenimage says
Good post, Mark.
Mark Swan says
Thank you gravenimage,
I have read a great many more good posts from you.
gravenimage says
🙂
LeftisruiningCanada says
Thanks for the mention of several interesting sounding books there Mark.
St. Manuel II Palaiologos says
The reason why the left hates Christianity is that Christianity tells them that they are not allowed to do whatever they want to without consequences.
The left wants to be free to do whatever they want, and allow everyone to do whatever they want. Christianity says human freedom needs to be restrained because of our inherently imperfect and fallible nature.
Destroying Christianity is the necessary step to make a world that, leftists believe, will enable them to do whatever they want to without consequence.
gravenimage says
If the Left really wanted people to be able to do whatever they wanted, they would have an issue with Christianity.
Mark Swan says
That is a good way to say that gravenimage.
gravenimage says
Glad you knew what I meant despite my typo, Mark. 🙂
gravenimage says
Sorry, I meant to say, “they would not have an issue with Christianity”.
CogitoErgoSum says
If being a Christian is deemed to be reprehensible, then not everyone can do what they want without some sort of consequence. The Left has its own religion and those who do not follow it are cast into hell as demons.
LeftisruiningCanada says
Agreed St. Manuel II Palaiologos.
Our sinful nature hates being reminded of God’s law, and strives against it in every area of life.
That’s what it means for the devil to be our spiritual father.
We rebel, like father like sons and daughters.
eduardo odraude says
Excellent from Ibrahim, as ever.
WorkingClassPost says
Islam is against all non-muslims, including agnostics, atheists and each and every religion on earth, but we do well to remember that muhamed was explicitly and particularly anti-Christ in his words and deeds, and also that Christians have been clearly warned of this resurgent evil and that these would be difficult days.
Christianity is undeniably under threat from all sides, but also from within, and by far the most egregious foe are the many Christian ‘leaders’ who have abandoned the faithful.
StellaSaidSo says
The main reason that the Left despises Christianity is simply that Christianity is a rival ideology. The actual content of a rival ideology is secondary; Communism allows for no competing loyalties. All ‘worship’ must be directed towards the State. Hence ‘cult of personality’ becomes a defining feature of the Communist dictatorship as the ‘leader’ (in the case of North Korea, the ‘dear leader’) is endowed with god-like status.
Islam offers totalitarianism, with a built-in god. The Left doesn’t care for the god, but it likes the totalitarianism. The alliance between Islam and the Left derives not from antipathy toward Christianity, but from the shared long-term goal of world domination under a totalitarian system. Islam dreams of a global caliphate, the Left dreams of a global socialist utopia. Equally opportunistic, they are willing to use each other in order to hasten the social and economic destruction which necessarily precedes the imposition of any brand of ‘new world order’. Having achieved this, their alliance would cease, and the battle for ‘supreme leadership’ of a subjugated world – a world in which no diversity of opinion or belief is tolerated – would commence. We are up against a formidable enemy. We have no hope of defeating it if we persist in squabbling amongst ourselves.
StellaSaidSo says
PS I meant to add –
Good post, WCP. Especially re ‘the most egregious foe’.
gravenimage says
Good article from Raymond Ibrahim.
RodSerling says
I think Raymond assumes that non-religious people in the West are a much larger and more influential segment of the population than they actually are. Certainly some of the leftists in question are non-religious, but most are from extreme segments of the left-wing who are religious to some extent (primarily Christians and Jews). Their main enemy is the West, and their main goal is to destroy it and replace it with a multicultural paradise. These left-wing Christians do attack traditional Christianity, but they also attack atheism. They also attack science, rationality, “colonialism,” “white people,” “patriarchy,” capitalism, the traditional family unit, heterosexuals, and many other elements and aspects of the West. They see the West in much the same way many Palestinians see Israel: As a terrible unjust entity that must removed. The main way they are destroying the West, aside from their extensive propaganda efforts in our educational and political systems, is through mass immigration of non-Westerners (especially Muslims)* into the West. To keep this method of erosion going unopposed, they use the accusation of racism/bigotry against anyone who dissents from it. Most of the left-wing leaders have entered into a kind of social and political bargain with Muslims, whereby they enable and run interference for Muslims in exchange for political support. They both work toward their common goal of destroying the West, though these leftists ignore or neglect that they would likely be destroyed later on when they are no longer needed by Muslims. Indeed, even if Muslims didn’t outright destroy them, their destruction would occur anyway as a side effect of the implementation of sharia. At best, most Muslims see non-Muslims as temporary dhimmis, who will eventually be forced to either embrace Islam or death, as per Islam’s end times scenario.
*I.e., the group whose members are (a) on average the most hostile toward the West, (b) very likely to vote for left-wing parties that are hostile toward the West.
gravenimage says
Lots of good points.
Peter says
The worldwide sexual abuse of children by the RC clergy (and other Christian entities) and it’s defense of the perpetrators by shuffling them to other dioceses where they often commit the same heinous crimes and are shipped to yet another area where they often reoffend and the outright denials and perverse cover-ups of those crimes by the church hierarchy has done nothing to garner any form of respect for the image of Christianity
CogitoErgoSum says
Where in Christian teaching does it say that such things are allowable?
Peter says
CES
Is that intentionally non sequitur or is that a bong next to you?
CogitoErgoSum says
If you see a bong next to me then I suspect you are the one who is on drugs. You are saying the actions of the clergy reflect badly on the image of Christianity. I would say it reflects badly on the image of the clergy but not upon the image of Christianity ……. unless you know very little about Christianity ….. because Christianity does NOT teach that abuse of children is a good thing. I don’t see the non-sequitur in my comment.
Peter says
CES
You say ” I would say it reflects badly on the image of the clergy but NOT upon the image of Christianity”
If you seriously can see no connection between the two then I have nothing further to say to you, the reason being …… see my reply to
MFritz Jan 16, 2018 at 1:38 pm
CogitoErgoSum says
I don’t happen to think that what every Christian does, (whether lay or clergy) is a reflection of Christianity. Likewise, I don’t think that what every Muslim does is a reflection of Islam. I look at what the religion itself teaches. It might be good to encourage others to think about that. That’s what I think ….. and oh yeah, labeling someone a troll and not speaking to them is quite effective ….. in kindergarten. And since you are not speaking to me any more, I guess I never will understand the meaning of that SFA comment you volunteered for Ibrahim Itace Muhammad.
gravenimage says
Peter, there is no doubt that this has been an ugly scandal in the Catholic Church.
But CogitoErgoSum is quite right–Christianity does not teach this. Do you believe that Jesus taught the abuse of children? You are quite mistaken.
LeftisruiningCanada says
Not distinguishing between people’s behavior and the belief system they pledge allegiance to, is a fundamental mistake.
That’s why most people are willing to condemn islam unreservedly, while being open to seeing individual muslims on their own merits and actions.
It is also why condemning islam is NOT the same thing as condemning all muslims. This is something that the Left and the media have a very hard time accepting. The cry of “racism” when anyone criticizes islam is a sure sign of this inability to make distinctions.
Don’t be like them!
Lydia Church says
Now the picture is coming into focus here!
Exactly, that is the plan.
And I have news for them: They can get as offended as they like, that is their right.
But I will preach the Bible all I want, and that is my right!
And when they do succeed in their goals of persecution, I will be honored to suffer and go to prison for my obedience and faith in Jesus… just like it says in Revelation!
Lydia Church says
P.S.
There are some Christian news sites also that are okay and have stories like this (okay meaning I don’t endorse all I see there in the sense of many things but in general you can get something out of it).
There is the Christian Post and Christian News Network. Just today on the first of these was an article about persecuting Christians in Bolivia for up to 12 years in prison simply for evangelizing, what we are called to do by Jesus in Matthew 28, and which I will continue to do no matter the laws in that place.
Eric jones says
I find that Christian preachers spend more time condemning someone for having a beer of buying a lottery ticket than they condemn aggressive Islam.
Eric
StellaSaidSo says
Likewise, Eric. They are also quick to reject any criticism of Islam or Muslims as racism, bigotry, ‘Islamophobia’ etc. Unfortunately, too many Christian ‘leaders’ have bought into the ‘Interfaith Dialogue’ circus, not realising that they are being conned by the Muslim Brotherhood. And too many churches have received generous financial inducements for their co-operation in the ‘resettlement’ of ‘refugees’.
Tas Walker says
In case you were wondering, the picture at the top is of Baroness Vere of Norbiton.
Freedom says
What is her connection to this thread?
Ian Marshall says
Lord Pearson is a sharp lad. I follow him in Hansard – he`s always asking awkward Qs but sadly getting shifty answers most of the time.
patriotliz says
BINGO! This is the Islamo-Leftist alliance to bring down Christianity and Western Civilization which was explored by David Horowitz in his book “Unholy Alliance” in 2004 and by Melanie Philips book “Londonistan” in 2006–“The…progressives on the British Left, for whom human rights have replaced Christianity as the religion of a godless society, have formed a jaw-dropping axis w/ militant, fundamentalist Islamism. These two revolutionary camps have put their very sizable differences to one side so that each can use the other to advance their goal, which is the destruction of Western society and its foundation values.” That’s why Leftists enforce Sharia blasphemy laws against criticism Islam.
But do the Progressive Marxist Leftist dhimmis really think they will be left standing (w/ their heads still attached to their shoulders) after Islam takes over w/ it’s vast historical experience of centuries of imperialistic conquests of non-Muslim lands? I don’t think so. Ultimately it will have to take an uprising of nationalists, if they are brave enough, to confront both enemies of freedom–Leftist commies and IslamoNazis. What have they got to lose, but their chains? It starts w/ the risk of going to jail like Paul Golding and Jayda Franson of Britain First just for speaking out. https://www.britainfirst.org/
UNCLE VLADDI says
This is why liberals hate Christianity and love islam: Christianity is all about free-will choice, while islam is all about slavery to “unknown and unknowable” allah. In Christianity, if and when something goes right, all praise is to God, but if and when it goes wrong, it’s all the fallible humans’ fault, and they are obliged to feel guilt and correct their behavior. In islam, there is no free-will choice, because whatever happened, good or bad, the human didn’t do it, the allah made them do it, and in fact, they didn’t do it at all, as: only the allah did it! The Judeo-Christian God exhorts people to improve them selves, while allah is the muslims’ #1 “we have no free will” alibi to excuse their own criminal desires and actions.
Beyond that, terrorism works!
Libertine “liberal” criminals Submit to their fears BY proudly ignoring them!
So they’re always willing TO GO ALONG (with criminals’ main lie that they’re all really ever only fellow victims) TO GET ALONG (with all the other scary, lying criminals)!
Further, immoral relativists are also nihilists – they stand for nothing, so will fall for anything!
So to them, being angry at (“hateful” towards) criminals is now the most vile sin, while pitying (“tolerating”) them all as “fellow victims,” is to be deemed the highest moral virtue, these days!
So much so, that the only advice we hear from “our” hypocrite governments, their pet media, and the corporazi globalist banksters who own them all, seems to invariably be:
“Anyone who doesn’t automatically pity all criminals as fellow victims should be hated!”
Which is why hurting the feelings of criminals by accusing them of their crimes, is now a “hateful” crime itself!
CAPISCE?
More, here:
http://unclevladdi.blogspot.ca/2018/01/the-problem-of-mental-illness-solved.html
Njoi!
😉